Now Taking Deposits for Modulo A grille
01-10-2012, 10:28 PM
#601
Everything in the red HAD to be dremel'd off. The excess material removed is quite large. Without this trimming, the grille would not even sit on the bumper. It looked like it it was in the same accident as mr. stak ( I LOVE YOU mr. stak) It was that skewed/off centered. None of the screws/snaps lined up without trimming as well. Even now after all that trimming. the right side of the grille is not flush yet. I'm not sure how much more trimming can be done now since its already down to the grille base itself.
Looks like ed did me a favour and posted the grille review already. Gracias senor
Looks like ed did me a favour and posted the grille review already. Gracias senor
hahah
01-11-2012, 12:34 AM
#605
01-11-2012, 10:06 AM
#607
The following users liked this post:
VortexBlueTSX (01-12-2012)
01-11-2012, 05:02 PM
#611
I'm the leader of the vortex crew... I can make an exception and let you in... just this once though...
01-12-2012, 08:49 AM
#612
Burning Brakes
I guess I have no choice but to agree to that hahahaa
01-12-2012, 01:24 PM
#613
To address previous posts:
Soul crushing? Heartbreak? I know it took a while but was the wait really warranting suicidal thoughts and prescription drugs to cope with? Given the ration of sh!t I'd been given over the last few months I'd say A) I should get much more credit for not just walking off the project, and B) I could expect some feedback. All he needed to do was post his review in this long ass thread for the benefit for all who've been following it.
Anyway, we all know you don't/won't/CAN'T stop the bashing so I am not surprised to get a little more from your direction. This is getting a little abusive though. I think you can stop now.
The mold is fine, it is the finished areas that need extra work. It's like a cast metal part...the dimensions are off until you do some machining. The amount of machining needed to get the part fitting perfect is going to vary a bit from car to car. With Ed's car we saw there was a significant amount of finish work needing to be done. 90% of the work I did before I shipped yours, actually! But yes, a fiberglass part with intricate fitment areas such as this will require a little extra work.
Mr NC if you ground all that off (1-2cm ??) I can explain why the bottom gap is too big...that lip on the bottom of the grille is supposed to fit inside the groove in the bumper and hold it tight against it. Maybe you needed to trim 1/8" off, but any more than that is going to make the grill fit improperly.
hell yeah, the very first time when i installed it i was crushed and pissed off to a point where i almost wanted to return it.
This is true. I had to do some serious damage control with Ed...it worked out good in the end though
Moral of the story...if you aren't able to do some of the custom work, aftermarket parts aren't always going to be easy to install or specifically straightforward.
Yeah the mesh does need this. Sorry we could not include that service.
I suspect there might be some additional work that can be done to make this right...or better (if too much work has not been done already). Then again if you mess with it too much you might sink yourself. We did do our best...I am not sure if the CMOD part is out yet, or if it will come out. We have seen their work and honestly, this is better, in general.
I'd have preferred to tighten this up myself but it ended up being the best we could do. All in all we are ok with it.
I have to take some exception to this piece of commentary. The JDP parts are fiberglass with a black gel-coating on them. Ours are the same construction actually (not FRP: fiber reinforced plastic). The reason the JDP part feels thicker and heavier is because it needs to be a much more sturdy part. It is a part in constant danger of being smashed, grounded out, and damaged. The grille is out of harm as compared to the lip, and actually needs to be a lot thinner to fit the way it does. If you look how it goes into place, some tight areas need to fit together, and making a thick heavy part is going to create issues. This comment makes our part seem like it isn't made as well, when if we made it the same way as a lip it would not fit well at all.
Subjective...but understood. We considered changing it but I thought the grille looked good this way. We could have changed it and chose not to. Both ways are not bad.
I guess this is positive
Truth be told I never thought the TSX shield looked that bad...the TL one was way worse to me.
Eh, not really...it is a realistic view of something that you are taking for what you can see. I would have much preferred to help you sort out some of the talking points when you we in the middle of dealing with it. Why don't people call when they have comments or questions???
To address a comment made with regard to the tabs holding the mesh...they might seem whatever they seem to you...this was a difficult part of the process and getting something secure that will hold the mesh yet make it so you could get it on and off easily was a challenge and consumed 2 of the 11 months being repeatedly referred to.
RE the mounting tabs with the holes for the clips. The clip holes that go on the bumper are all placed properly but if the grille is not fitted to the bumper correctly they won't line up. This is the area in red you indicated that needs to be eased a bit. As far are the tabs on the core support, they are not all drilled as well as we would like and we are going to stop drilling those out in the future for people to make their own holes there for improved fitment.
And one last thing I gotta say.
I never treated anyone bad, poorly, like a jerk, refused to refund, etc. I never made excuses. I never avoided phone calls, ignored emails, or any of that. I always freely admitted when I was under-performing and gave justifications for delays other times. I have been constantly in communication via email or phone with all of our customers all the time (despite the fact that nobody here seemed to want to actually reach out to us for info). How is it exactly that I treated other people that offended you so bad that you won't buy a part you want? Or is it just a matter of principle and you have no faith that the dozens of testimonials we have on our website are valid?
http://www.heeltoeauto.com/testimonials.php
I am sorry, if you want to label us this or that because of one project that nobody else is touching for this cult market I say your claims are warranted but certainly not true. We don't "treat" people any way that we would not want to be treated. At some point I am going to expect that people will get over this and see the truth that, we made a mistake last year and took on too much work. We still followed through to our word.
Irrefutable.
Thats fine, and i appreciate marcus' work and all,
but im just surprised noones commented on the soul crushing irony of waiting around a year for the grille and then seeing marcus comment on someone else's 2 week timeframe
Call me a dick if you want but thats just how i see it
but im just surprised noones commented on the soul crushing irony of waiting around a year for the grille and then seeing marcus comment on someone else's 2 week timeframe
Call me a dick if you want but thats just how i see it
Anyway, we all know you don't/won't/CAN'T stop the bashing so I am not surprised to get a little more from your direction. This is getting a little abusive though. I think you can stop now.
Originally Posted by Mr. NC & ed w ed in red and Mr Heeltoe in blue
The mold is fine, it is the finished areas that need extra work. It's like a cast metal part...the dimensions are off until you do some machining. The amount of machining needed to get the part fitting perfect is going to vary a bit from car to car. With Ed's car we saw there was a significant amount of finish work needing to be done. 90% of the work I did before I shipped yours, actually! But yes, a fiberglass part with intricate fitment areas such as this will require a little extra work.
Mr NC if you ground all that off (1-2cm ??) I can explain why the bottom gap is too big...that lip on the bottom of the grille is supposed to fit inside the groove in the bumper and hold it tight against it. Maybe you needed to trim 1/8" off, but any more than that is going to make the grill fit improperly.
hell yeah, the very first time when i installed it i was crushed and pissed off to a point where i almost wanted to return it.
This is true. I had to do some serious damage control with Ed...it worked out good in the end though
Moral of the story...if you aren't able to do some of the custom work, aftermarket parts aren't always going to be easy to install or specifically straightforward.Yeah the mesh does need this. Sorry we could not include that service.
I suspect there might be some additional work that can be done to make this right...or better (if too much work has not been done already). Then again if you mess with it too much you might sink yourself. We did do our best...I am not sure if the CMOD part is out yet, or if it will come out. We have seen their work and honestly, this is better, in general.
I'd have preferred to tighten this up myself but it ended up being the best we could do. All in all we are ok with it.
I have to take some exception to this piece of commentary. The JDP parts are fiberglass with a black gel-coating on them. Ours are the same construction actually (not FRP: fiber reinforced plastic). The reason the JDP part feels thicker and heavier is because it needs to be a much more sturdy part. It is a part in constant danger of being smashed, grounded out, and damaged. The grille is out of harm as compared to the lip, and actually needs to be a lot thinner to fit the way it does. If you look how it goes into place, some tight areas need to fit together, and making a thick heavy part is going to create issues. This comment makes our part seem like it isn't made as well, when if we made it the same way as a lip it would not fit well at all.
Subjective...but understood. We considered changing it but I thought the grille looked good this way. We could have changed it and chose not to. Both ways are not bad.
I guess this is positive
Truth be told I never thought the TSX shield looked that bad...the TL one was way worse to me.
Eh, not really...it is a realistic view of something that you are taking for what you can see. I would have much preferred to help you sort out some of the talking points when you we in the middle of dealing with it. Why don't people call when they have comments or questions???
To address a comment made with regard to the tabs holding the mesh...they might seem whatever they seem to you...this was a difficult part of the process and getting something secure that will hold the mesh yet make it so you could get it on and off easily was a challenge and consumed 2 of the 11 months being repeatedly referred to.
RE the mounting tabs with the holes for the clips. The clip holes that go on the bumper are all placed properly but if the grille is not fitted to the bumper correctly they won't line up. This is the area in red you indicated that needs to be eased a bit. As far are the tabs on the core support, they are not all drilled as well as we would like and we are going to stop drilling those out in the future for people to make their own holes there for improved fitment.
And one last thing I gotta say.
Originally Posted by TSXkid2010
And also the way he treated the people who ordered. While they were waiting for the grille, with their deposits in, and excuses. Just the way heeltoe handled it, that alone is the only reason I'm not waiting by the door for my HT grille to come in. That's honesty.
http://www.heeltoeauto.com/testimonials.php
I am sorry, if you want to label us this or that because of one project that nobody else is touching for this cult market I say your claims are warranted but certainly not true. We don't "treat" people any way that we would not want to be treated. At some point I am going to expect that people will get over this and see the truth that, we made a mistake last year and took on too much work. We still followed through to our word.
Irrefutable.
01-13-2012, 10:40 AM
#614
Developer & Car Fan
Grill looks awesome now that its real. May put it on the wish list for the Spring. Though after that whole UR fiasco i'm hesitant.
Funny thing about this "long drama" is the actual dates.
03-01-2010 — Marcus announces that'd he like to make the grill if people are interested.
03-23-2010 — First deposit is sent in as people continue to bitch about pre-cost for R&D of a unique part
10-29-2011 — First grill delivered to customer, after R&D issues, backlog, test-fitting and other misc. things.
It still took less than the average of 2 years for R&D of a production part. Now if Marcus (HeelToe) was building this one part for Ed and it took that long i'd be shocked but of course they wanted it to be production quality under the "ATLP" brand. For those that sent a deposit, you can bitch a little due in part to money being tied up. Yet the others that just bitched for sport, pathetic.
As a business owner and creator I know first-hand what goes into releasing a shipping product and all the sleepless nights it includes. Not even including physical goods which would of course take more money and time. Why isn't anyone bitching at the vendor HT worked with on this? Maybe they were slow and busy?
Just saying.
Matt
Funny thing about this "long drama" is the actual dates.
03-01-2010 — Marcus announces that'd he like to make the grill if people are interested.
03-23-2010 — First deposit is sent in as people continue to bitch about pre-cost for R&D of a unique part
10-29-2011 — First grill delivered to customer, after R&D issues, backlog, test-fitting and other misc. things.
It still took less than the average of 2 years for R&D of a production part. Now if Marcus (HeelToe) was building this one part for Ed and it took that long i'd be shocked but of course they wanted it to be production quality under the "ATLP" brand. For those that sent a deposit, you can bitch a little due in part to money being tied up. Yet the others that just bitched for sport, pathetic.
As a business owner and creator I know first-hand what goes into releasing a shipping product and all the sleepless nights it includes. Not even including physical goods which would of course take more money and time. Why isn't anyone bitching at the vendor HT worked with on this? Maybe they were slow and busy?
Just saying.
Matt
01-13-2012, 11:40 AM
#615
its not a sport. I'm interested in the part, and have been interested in the part for a while
I've e-mailed Marcus through atlp and inquired about it on my own
should we limit discussions to those who paid up front ?
maybe we can lock vendor threads for anyone without an order number.
@Marcus: yes I found it ironic, thank you for making a product for the community, grills delivered job's done
I've e-mailed Marcus through atlp and inquired about it on my own
should we limit discussions to those who paid up front ?
maybe we can lock vendor threads for anyone without an order number.
@Marcus: yes I found it ironic, thank you for making a product for the community, grills delivered job's done
Last edited by KillerG; 01-13-2012 at 11:42 AM.
01-17-2012, 12:49 PM
#616
I think there are two solutions:
1) We have a new project management system this year that will improve our performance.
2) People can stop complaining in forums where nothing gets done and start complaining to the source of the delay (in this case, me). Part of the reason this project lagged is because I wasn't getting blown up much on it and I don't frequent the forums that much when we get busy (most all year long).
1) We have a new project management system this year that will improve our performance.
2) People can stop complaining in forums where nothing gets done and start complaining to the source of the delay (in this case, me). Part of the reason this project lagged is because I wasn't getting blown up much on it and I don't frequent the forums that much when we get busy (most all year long).
01-17-2012, 01:28 PM
#617
^lol, it even says in your sig to contact you directly. Some people on these forums aren't very good at resolving issues on their own.
01-20-2012, 02:18 PM
#619
You see me, I CU2
I will say 1 last piece on this.
In regards to askin you questions about install & such. I wouldn't have the chance to ask since I didn't see the fitment problems until the shop guys had the bumper off. Email would take too slow & long distance phone call is outta the question. You know what I mean?
The part about only shaving off 1/8" didn't know that either since this was pure trial & error in making it fit. If the grille came with some install instructions with general trimming & cutting that would go along way to helping alleviate the fitment issue.
In regards to askin you questions about install & such. I wouldn't have the chance to ask since I didn't see the fitment problems until the shop guys had the bumper off. Email would take too slow & long distance phone call is outta the question. You know what I mean?
The part about only shaving off 1/8" didn't know that either since this was pure trial & error in making it fit. If the grille came with some install instructions with general trimming & cutting that would go along way to helping alleviate the fitment issue.
01-20-2012, 02:27 PM
#620
Yeah I know, be we have gotten calls from people at the point of service. I don't expect you to do that all the time, but likewise I would have liked knowing before you posted. Just sayin. Maybe I could have given a bit more info for the post.
Yes instructions would be very good to add. I agree. I will work on that.
Yes instructions would be very good to add. I agree. I will work on that.
01-23-2013, 09:40 AM
#622
To address previous posts:
Soul crushing? Heartbreak? I know it took a while but was the wait really warranting suicidal thoughts and prescription drugs to cope with? Given the ration of sh!t I'd been given over the last few months I'd say A) I should get much more credit for not just walking off the project, and B) I could expect some feedback. All he needed to do was post his review in this long ass thread for the benefit for all who've been following it.
Anyway, we all know you don't/won't/CAN'T stop the bashing so I am not surprised to get a little more from your direction. This is getting a little abusive though. I think you can stop now.
To address a comment made with regard to the tabs holding the mesh...they might seem whatever they seem to you...this was a difficult part of the process and getting something secure that will hold the mesh yet make it so you could get it on and off easily was a challenge and consumed 2 of the 11 months being repeatedly referred to.
RE the mounting tabs with the holes for the clips. The clip holes that go on the bumper are all placed properly but if the grille is not fitted to the bumper correctly they won't line up. This is the area in red you indicated that needs to be eased a bit. As far are the tabs on the core support, they are not all drilled as well as we would like and we are going to stop drilling those out in the future for people to make their own holes there for improved fitment.
And one last thing I gotta say.
I never treated anyone bad, poorly, like a jerk, refused to refund, etc. I never made excuses. I never avoided phone calls, ignored emails, or any of that. I always freely admitted when I was under-performing and gave justifications for delays other times. I have been constantly in communication via email or phone with all of our customers all the time (despite the fact that nobody here seemed to want to actually reach out to us for info). How is it exactly that I treated other people that offended you so bad that you won't buy a part you want? Or is it just a matter of principle and you have no faith that the dozens of testimonials we have on our website are valid?
http://www.heeltoeauto.com/testimonials.php
I am sorry, if you want to label us this or that because of one project that nobody else is touching for this cult market I say your claims are warranted but certainly not true. We don't "treat" people any way that we would not want to be treated. At some point I am going to expect that people will get over this and see the truth that, we made a mistake last year and took on too much work. We still followed through to our word.
Irrefutable.
Soul crushing? Heartbreak? I know it took a while but was the wait really warranting suicidal thoughts and prescription drugs to cope with? Given the ration of sh!t I'd been given over the last few months I'd say A) I should get much more credit for not just walking off the project, and B) I could expect some feedback. All he needed to do was post his review in this long ass thread for the benefit for all who've been following it.
Anyway, we all know you don't/won't/CAN'T stop the bashing so I am not surprised to get a little more from your direction. This is getting a little abusive though. I think you can stop now.
To address a comment made with regard to the tabs holding the mesh...they might seem whatever they seem to you...this was a difficult part of the process and getting something secure that will hold the mesh yet make it so you could get it on and off easily was a challenge and consumed 2 of the 11 months being repeatedly referred to.
RE the mounting tabs with the holes for the clips. The clip holes that go on the bumper are all placed properly but if the grille is not fitted to the bumper correctly they won't line up. This is the area in red you indicated that needs to be eased a bit. As far are the tabs on the core support, they are not all drilled as well as we would like and we are going to stop drilling those out in the future for people to make their own holes there for improved fitment.
And one last thing I gotta say.
I never treated anyone bad, poorly, like a jerk, refused to refund, etc. I never made excuses. I never avoided phone calls, ignored emails, or any of that. I always freely admitted when I was under-performing and gave justifications for delays other times. I have been constantly in communication via email or phone with all of our customers all the time (despite the fact that nobody here seemed to want to actually reach out to us for info). How is it exactly that I treated other people that offended you so bad that you won't buy a part you want? Or is it just a matter of principle and you have no faith that the dozens of testimonials we have on our website are valid?
http://www.heeltoeauto.com/testimonials.php
I am sorry, if you want to label us this or that because of one project that nobody else is touching for this cult market I say your claims are warranted but certainly not true. We don't "treat" people any way that we would not want to be treated. At some point I am going to expect that people will get over this and see the truth that, we made a mistake last year and took on too much work. We still followed through to our word.
Irrefutable.
The old adage about "buy the seller, not the product" applies here.
Here, the vendor seems arrogant, has a "woe is me" attitude and nothing is his fault. I wouldn't buy from this vendor if he was the last vendor on earth - his posts are usually insulting and place blame on others.
If he doesn't have the ability to produce a top quality product then he shouldn't try. Quit moaning about how hard it is to do this right. Many vendors produce products that fit without modifications.
The following users liked this post:
VortexBlueTSX (01-23-2013)
02-04-2013, 11:51 AM
#623
Grill looks awesome now that its real. May put it on the wish list for the Spring. Though after that whole UR fiasco i'm hesitant.
Funny thing about this "long drama" is the actual dates.
03-01-2010 — Marcus announces that'd he like to make the grill if people are interested.
03-23-2010 — First deposit is sent in as people continue to bitch about pre-cost for R&D of a unique part
10-29-2011 — First grill delivered to customer, after R&D issues, backlog, test-fitting and other misc. things.
It still took less than the average of 2 years for R&D of a production part. Now if Marcus (HeelToe) was building this one part for Ed and it took that long i'd be shocked but of course they wanted it to be production quality under the "ATLP" brand. For those that sent a deposit, you can bitch a little due in part to money being tied up. Yet the others that just bitched for sport, pathetic.
As a business owner and creator I know first-hand what goes into releasing a shipping product and all the sleepless nights it includes. Not even including physical goods which would of course take more money and time. Why isn't anyone bitching at the vendor HT worked with on this? Maybe they were slow and busy?
Just saying.
Matt
Funny thing about this "long drama" is the actual dates.
03-01-2010 — Marcus announces that'd he like to make the grill if people are interested.
03-23-2010 — First deposit is sent in as people continue to bitch about pre-cost for R&D of a unique part
10-29-2011 — First grill delivered to customer, after R&D issues, backlog, test-fitting and other misc. things.
It still took less than the average of 2 years for R&D of a production part. Now if Marcus (HeelToe) was building this one part for Ed and it took that long i'd be shocked but of course they wanted it to be production quality under the "ATLP" brand. For those that sent a deposit, you can bitch a little due in part to money being tied up. Yet the others that just bitched for sport, pathetic.
As a business owner and creator I know first-hand what goes into releasing a shipping product and all the sleepless nights it includes. Not even including physical goods which would of course take more money and time. Why isn't anyone bitching at the vendor HT worked with on this? Maybe they were slow and busy?
Just saying.
Matt
For the record we did sell more grilles WITH instructions included and refined production methods. At the end of the day, one issue plagued this part and that was we did not have access to a car to leave with the fabricator for 2 weeks. That ended up costing us most of a year in trying to get it right. At the end of day, that killed it. Never again will we try to make a part like this without a car on hand.
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