Chris3k2

Just joined the forum yesterday after reading over posts/threads as a guest. Not sure if this is the right spot to introduce myself but the s2k forum I was at had a introduction thread and i couldn't find one here so sorry if this is wrong spot. All this is new to me as far as modding the tsx. Hope I can help contribute in the future and vice versa. I'm from Columbia South Carolina, so give me a shout out if your in the SC. Oh and I really hope the aftermarket support gets better. The TSX is such a fun and great car to drive but i must say i'm a little disappointed at the lack of support. Well cheers to everybody and hope i make some great new friends.

isshinryu30

Welcome and let me knowing need wheels or hood I'm on nc

chaqui74

Welcome...

ed_423

welcome, pic of s2k? i love those!

Chris3k2

Yea no problem. Let me see if I can dig some up. Thanks for the welcome everybody. Also what's the most beneficial mod I can do for the 2nd gen. I guess for performance. Really itching to buy something! Lol. I'm leaning to get the CT-E intake first.

Chris3k2

Oh and I've got a GAP, and lifetime powertrain warranty. Nothing currently available will void the warranty will it?

Grigio09

iTrader: (1)

Welcome.. pics of the s2k?

mrstak

iTrader: (1)

welcome! pics of s2k AND tsx...

if u get a rear sway bar...heard that helps a lot. people have said it's the best bang for the buck mod to date. ct-e icebox is mucho dinero but it looks and sounds good if you can do it.

Chris3k2

Yeah. The rer sway bar sounds good too. It's a lot different taking corners in the tsx than it was in the s2k. Lol.

ceb

Virtually any mod may cause warranty issues.

Aftermarket intakes and suspension changes are the most common items to cause unwarranted warranty problems that nonetheless cause you major headaches.

Electrical mods are the things that will cause the most actual warranty problems.

Much depends on your dealership and your relationship with them.

Chris3k2

well as far as some of the intakes and suspension, those would be fairly easy to go back to stock if something were to happen correct? I haven't really come across too many tsx parts that would be more permanent right now or at least with what i'm wanting to get for it at this moment. Biggest things i'm looking at are the intake and suspension upgrades and maybe a new pair of shoes

mmafighta

intakes and coils are non issues regarding warranty.

ceb

Are you willing to go on record that you will pay for any issues that the OP has if he installs an aftermarket suspension and an intake?

$5000 should cover most issues. Please send it to me and I'll hang on to it for the duration of the warranty or until the OP sells his car.

You cannot say it is a "non-issue" unless you are willing to put your money where your mouth is.

You know nothing about the OP or his/her dealer - you don't even know if the OP is a he or a she. Even if his/her dealer is cool, what happens if he/she breaks down a few thousand miles from home? I doubt that the OP will carry along the OE suspension and intake and swap it on the side of the road while waiting for AAA.

Both intakes and suspensions can cause warranty issues. The OP needs to assess the risks and decide if he/she wants to accept the possible problems - you cannot make that decision for the OP.

I harp on warranty issues because some people fail to consider the unintended consequences of their mods - combined with dismissive statements about possible problems from random internet guys who do not have to bear the financial brunt of their "no problemo man, just mod that car."

Chris3k2

thanks for everybody's input. I'm a guy by the way lol. Yeah i understand the risks involved that's why i was trying to get some input. I don't necessary have a problem with a issue coming up from an aftermarket mod just more the fact that i've paid for it and it would already be voided, but i'm so eager to mod it out though. I'm so torn. lol

ceb

No single mod would "void" a warranty, but a dealer can easily argue that a particular mod caused a related system to fail - thereby allowing them to refuse warranty service on that failure.

You should also look very closely at what you bought. There is no such thing as a lifetime powertrain warranty from any legit warranty company unless it is accompanied by onerous requirements such as having all servicing done at the selling dealer.

Intake mods are very easily tied to powertrain issues by dealers so you need to determine is the increased sound (and a possible reduction in performance) is worth risking your warranty.

savclaude

welcome

Chris3k2

It was from an acura dealership like 2 minutes away from house. I'll have to get the warranty paper for the power train warranty and look closer at it. But i know i'm required to get the scheduled maintenance and oil changes done in order for it to stay in effect and the oil changes can be from the acura dealership or if from another place then i have to call some number and make sure it gets documented.

Also do you not believe any of the intakes offer and performance increases? Sorry if i misunderstood what you were saying.

ceb

Please share particulars of your warranty if in fact it gives you "lifetime" coverage. What is covered?

An intake by itself does nothing except make noise. That extra noise makes you think that it is producing more power but all the dyno runs will show either no gains or actual losses.

When an intake is used in conjunction with other mods, it can give you very modest gains but the gains are not commensurate with the costs. Lighter wheels/tires will give you more "power" than an aftermarket intake.

Think of it this way - regardless of the amount of air you suck into an engine, the amount acually entering the engine is limited to the metal bits that the intake is bolted on to. It is the old "fat straw" theory. A fat straw will allow you to suck up more soda from your McDonald's cup and a thin straw will limit how much soda you get.

If you tape a this straw to a thick straw, then you are still limited to the throughput of the thin straw.

Air going into the engine is limited by the narrowest bit of plumbing between the outside air and the inner bits of the engine.

Years ago - prior to manufacturers understanding emission controls (i.e. prior to the mid-90's) and incorporating them into the engine design - intakes were often the limiting factor by design. Since then, manufacturers have spend millions (dare I say billions?) in improving airflow into the engine and no fly-by-night company can design a generic intake that will be more efficient.

odus

iTrader: (1)

yea mods wont void your warranty thats actually not possible a claim can be denied that is it. and they have to prove with out a resonable doubt that the part that is broken is from that aftermarket part. now if change something that part is no longer under warranty cause they didn't put it there. if he had an s2k im sure hes not scared to do stuff to his car.

ceb

This thread just proves that very few people understand warranty provisions.

It is very easy to say "the dealer has to prove..." but the reality is if the dealer says "we won't cover this repair this fault because you modified xyz" (and Honda backs them up) then you are screwed.

While most manufacturers specifically call out suspension and ECU mods as causing warranty problems, Honda/Acura merely says "The warranties in this booklet do
not cover:
• The failure of any part or accessory due to:
– Abuse, misuse, accidental damage, or acts of nature.
– Improper installation or maintenance.
– A low fluid level or the use of a fluid other than specified by Acura.
– The installation of any part that is not equal to the original in quality of materials or workmanship.
This is the only portion that falls under the Magnusson-Moss Warranty Act
– The use of the vehicle in competition or racing events.
• Any installed part or accessory that fails because it was not designed to fit that year and model of Acura automobile.
If my 2012 V6 wheels cause a failure then I'm on the hook
• Any vehicle with an odometer that has been altered so it is impossible to determine the actual mileage.
• Any failure caused by modifying the vehicle, or by installing accessories not authorized by Acura.
And this covers the CAI and the suspension.

The bottom line is that unless you are using a direct replacement part that is substantially similar to the OE part, then it is your responsibility to show that the replacement part didn't cause the failure. The distinction is in the "substantially similar" replacement part - any performance part is, by definition, not substantially similar - is the only part that falls under the MM Act.

This means that replacing the Bosch or Osram lightbulb with the equivalent Sylvania part is fine - replacing that bulb with the "high performance, HID xenon look, bright blue, off road use only" bulb from Autozone may cause you issues. If the Sylvania bulb causes a failure, then the manufacturer must prove that the bulb caused the failure, but if the dealer says that the "blue wonder xenon look special" caused the failure, then you have to show that it didn't.

All this with the usual caveat - even if the dealer improperly denies you warranty coverage based on that Sylvania bulb, then you're still out of luck as your choices are to pay for the repair and take the dealer to court or mediation, or let the car sit in a dealer's lot while the case goes to court.

Choose your mods carefully and be mentally and fiscally prepared to pay for any problems that your mods cause.

odus

iTrader: (1)

your information is still wrong

Mr. NC

Welcome to the forums.

Enjoy your stay.

Chris3k2

Well I have no problem showing the warranty and I'm not dumb either. I understand that a lot of people who claim to have lifetime warranties often are limited and can be pretty specific. As far as the mods to a car I've never been lucky enough to get a Dyno reading b4 or after putting the performance parts on a car so I can't make any claims but it's also a hobby, and while it can be an expensive one it's still fun to me.

And besides, as long as you manage your money correctly then I see no problem buying goodies for something you enjoy. It's no different than people who collect trading cards, stamps, and etc. if you ask me. But to each their own.

Thanks for the warm welcome everybody

ceb

Thanks. I think many here would be interested in a lifetime powertrain warranty that doesn't come with too many "gotchas."

Buying mods for the pleasure of buying mods is perfectly fine (how many black shoes does my wife really need?) as long as you weigh the benefits against the possible downsides.

drivedata

ed also has a gap so he can probably speak on that

Chris3k2

Finally got some pictures. Here's the link to the photo gallery thread where you should be able to view them.

https://acurazine.com/forums/2g-tsx-photograph-gallery-144/chris3k2-2009-tsx-6-speed-859572/

Chris3k2

oh and thanks drivedata for the heads up. i'll definitely ask ed about it.

ed_423

haha he was making fun of me, a gap in my grille

drivedata

indeed

ceb

So, OP, please tell us a bit more about that lifetime powertrain warranty

Who issues it?
How much was it?
What does it cover?
What are the maintenance requirements?
What are the exclusions?

Chris3k2

well i posted some pics on my instagram of it. If it's too hard to read i'll write it out in a post when i get some time. just let me know.

http://web.stagram.com/n/chris3k2/

ceb

Ahh, Warranty Forever.

The warranty requires you to have all maintenance completed at the selling dealer. If you can't get it done there, then WF will have to pre-authorize the maintenance prior to having it done.

WF is a scam that is intended to pad the bottom line of the selling dealer. WF has a reputation for finding ways of denying warranty claims.

Make sure that you keep a perfect record of all maintenance done and make sure it is done at the selling dealer.

If done somewhere else, keep a seamless log of who you spoke with at MF, when you spoke with them and what they said. For any claim you'll have to prove that every single bit of required maintenance was done. One missing piece of documentation will get your claim denied. Good luck.

Chris3k2

Yeah. I plan to. The dealer is like 1 min from my house. It is what it is. No changing it now. I really don't expect anything to happen but it's nice having that piece of mind especially since I didn't have to pay for.

ceb

Correct. Those plans are usually given as incentives at no cost. That usually the dealer to charge a bit of a premium (a couple of hundred $) for the car and guarantees them a steady customer flow in their service department - the bread and butter of a dealership.

The WF coverage generally costs a dealer between $300 and $500. Between the slightly higher price for the car and the service profite, they have that covered by the time your second A1 service rolls around. Dealers that do MF generally do not have the cheapest prices but will not be far out of line from the other dealers.

Remember that the first time you skip a service or decide to do "just an oil change" instead of a service you've kissed your WF warranty goodbye. You also do NOT have the option to do services yourself (as you have with the manufacturer's warranty.)

WF sounds good on paper but is really only good for the non-enthusiast who would normally get their cars serviced at dealerships and keeps their cars until they fall apart.

Do you see yourself rigidly following the manufacturer's service requirements 10 years down the road? If so, then you've probably spent an extra $5000 on servicing - probably more than enough to pay for any covered repair.

Remember that Acuras are generally very reliable cars and the first 40k or 5 years are covered. Given that servicing is required between 5 and 7k miles, you'll have somewhere between 6 and 8 services done while still under warranty and the WF doesn't kick in until the regular warranty is over.

Also, read the contract very carefully regarding mods. Many of these types of contracts will require the use of OE replacement parts only and a simple use of a non OE lightbulb could void that contract quickly.

Chris3k2

Yeah i'm pretty aware of the consequences of not following everything to a "T" After i've finished financing the car is when i really plan to do some more serious mod (although any mod can be serious) and that's why i'm trying to find something that is easy to put back to stock with minimal hassle but if things don't work it then it's no biggie. It's just life so i'll enjoy mines anyway i please, making mistakes or not. lol. I really do appreciate your advice and warnings though.

MrOtocinclus

Looks like ceb's done it again.

Chris3k2, welcome and enjoy the car. Silver's a nice color, too.

ceb

Yes, Welcome and silver is a great color. I wish the wagon came in silver.

ceb

And that is exactly what they are banking on - the manufacturer does the warranty up to 50k miles (or 4 years) and by that time you've either sold the car, have missed a minor service or two or have modded the car. After that they no longer have to pay for anything.

TSXKid2010

Welcome! I have a lot of family up in Columbia actually!

S2k, Ceb's just trying to make sure everyone on the forums are completely aware of the consequences of modding your car; it's at your own risk.

That being said, there isn't much aftermarket support for the TSX! But, as our community grows with people like you, hopefully it'll start to expand!