freebieman

I have a 99 TL with about 175k miles on it. My wife drives it and its been having problems starting. Yesterday it didn't start. No crank and No dash lights came on. I've searched and it seems that people with bad starters at least get dash lights on. It should have a good battery. Just got it replaced a month ago.

Also, if it does try and start up, it will take more than a few clicks before it fires up. Even so, it has a low idle-engine shaking- lower than what it should be. (I believe the normal idle is 1500 rpms or 750 rpms and its prob a 100-200 below) The oil level is low. Could that cause low idle??

I checked the air filter. Looks fine to me. Still pretty white with some dirt marks here and there, but its been a year since I replaced that.

I will get the starter checked tomorrow, but I would LOVE your input. You guys know your stuff

fsttyms1

have your battery and alternator tested. Make sure ALL grounds and battery connections are tight and corrosion free.

freebieman

ok I will have them tested as well. Thank you for that. But I have no idea what ground connections are? I will look for loose wires under the hood, but otherwise, I have no idea how to solve electrical problems. I looked for a DIY for this, to no avail.

Skirmich

Theres 2 Ground Points coming from you (-) Bettery Terminal

1- Goes directly on top of the AF Reservoir.
2- The other goes down into your transmission Housing.

Those two can start to corrode and Become weak Grounds making your electrical system un-stable.

01tl4tl

99s are well known for ignition switch-(back-part) failure,,even the one installed under recall wore out!

local parts stores carry it for under 50 bucks,,our diy section has full help
your local dealer can run the cars VIN and see if the recall was ever done

ground wires, beside the ones mentioned, will go from the frame or body to the engine/trans and are flimsy looking bare braided wire

any major name parts store will happily do a full electrical system test, and visual inspection too, if you ask for the extra help,,its their job! and the test are all FREE
You are not the first person needing some instruction from them

01tl4tl

never drive the TL low on oil!! fill it to the full level

normal warm idle ~750 in Drive
fluctuation often clogged egr system,,also worse on 99s ,needs cleanout every 75kmiles or less, will cause strange running probs, stalling,,
dirty IACV will mess with idle--it gets cleaned with throttle body off the car during egr cleaning
another 99 only recall was to clean that egr port/passage and install a smooth bore to lessen clogging-but it didnt help much
every TL made needs to do this service- and its not in any book for scheduled maitenance

freebieman

just went to autozone and they checked out the battery, alternator, and starter just by hooking up some machine to the battery. He said it was good. Now I parked at my friends place and the car wont start. It clicks once, and the dash lights are on, but it wont start. Im guessing its the ignition switch??? He mentioned that it could be the crank shaft sensor? or something like that?? Please help

freebieman

I found out that the thing that clicks once is a gold rectangular about 1 inch metal box piece in an unmarked black box to the left of the fuse box. It says, "12 V." I don't know if that helps or not.

Also, I looked around on this site and people have asked whether or not the green key symbol on the dash lit up. It was solid green.

thelastaspec

Ignition switches are known on the '99 to cause different electrical problems.

freebieman

Help! So, i replaced the ignition switch and tested it. Still didn't crank. I checked the ground wires that you mentioned Skirmich, "
Theres 2 Ground Points coming from you (-) Bettery Terminal

1- Goes directly on top of the AF Reservoir.
2- The other goes down into your transmission Housing.

Those two can start to corrode and Become weak Grounds making your electrical system un-stable."

#1 looked fine to me. #2 however, I dont know. The braided bare part that I could see was dirty and had one hair that was off to the side, but barely. Also, it was kind of a loose braid: it had play. Is that how its supposed to be?? Or is it supposed to be tightly wound together??? Otherwise it looked fine.

I checked a bunch of fuses, and they looked good. What relays/where is it located that I would need to check. Also, that square inch box with 12 V on it that I mentioned a few posts earlier, I took that out earlier and the battery was still connected. I put it back in afterwards, could that have messed anything up even more??

Oh and about the starter, when the guy tested it, he only used a machine that hooked up to the battery, and it said the starter was fine. Could that have been a misleading positive test?? Since he didn't use a voltmeter to test it??




__________________

01tl4tl

the small machine test of starter was: as you started engine it read how much draw it took-amps used to start car
normal range or not in normal range is what it knows

on the battery cables: where you can see wire at battery end, soak wire in cup of hot water with some baking soda added,,,will foam,,gets crud out (cable removed from batt of course)
If severe crud, the cable can be bad inside
did you have any issues of blue crud buildup on batt terminals in the past?

resistance is everything in electrical probs!

01tl4tl

what happens if you try to jump start off another car?

freebieman

yes, there was plenty of whitish/blueish crud on the old battery. So, if I disconnect the battery cables, you want me to soak the wire end or ends that touch the battery directly? The ones that I tighten down to the battery terminals? Or the second grounding wire that I talked a lot about??

And after I do that is it safe to hook it back up while still wet to see if it fixed it?? Or do I need to wait awhile until it is dry?

I haven't jump started it, but I will try it. So, you pretty much ruled out the possibility of the starter being bad because it passed with that test, right?

And THANK YOU for all of your knowledge. You all are an invaluable resource. 01tl4tl you have helped me out in the past, and I don't know if I thanked you; thank you.

Other people's posts have mentioned the possibility of relays... could I take those out and go to the store to get them tested? If so, where are they and what do they look like? haha

freebieman

I tried jump starting the car and nothing happened.

freebieman

Also, I thought this was strange... I could not shift at all after pressing the brake pedal in without it on. Is that normal??

thelastaspec

seriously check out the ignition switch - its on recall.
the ignition switch can cause lots of wierd problems like dimming dashbord lights and intermittent starting.

also the TL has two fuse boxes one on the driver and one on the passensger side

freebieman

@thelastaspec In this thread, I mentioned that I already tried that: I have changed out the ignition switch and the car is still not starting... thats why I think its something else.

fsttyms1

When you turn the key to start the car do you have power to the radio? Headlights turn on?

freebieman

Yes, I have power to the headlights and windows and I'm guessing the radio too, but I honestly have not tried to turn it on. It would need the code definitely, since I have disconnected the battery twice. I will try that later today, when I go to the car. I'm going to try and do a loan a tool and get a multimeter and see if I can poke around to get some more info. I found this from
TLer trash on another thread
Going to see if that helps. Also, on one of my past threads I created a year ago: I was having problems with the neutral safety switch. Well, then I changed out the brake switch, and I'm really not sure if that was the problem, but the car worked, so I didn't do anymore. Maybe the Neutral safety switch has finally failed on me a year later, since my wife spilled some coffee in the gear shifter back then??

freebieman

Should I be able to shift out of park when I have everything connected but without the car running??

freebieman

Actually, Autozone won't let me borrow a multimeter, but I found out some more info.
My car will let me shift out of park.
The green key symbol lights up right when I turn the key to let power come on and the dashboard lights come on, but if I sit there for a few seconds without ever trying to crank the engine, the green key symbol disappears. And then I'll try to crank the engine and the green key symbol will never appear. Is that mean the immobilizer is bad??
If yes, is that an easy fix?

freebieman

I was looking at the fuses, and the igi or ig1 relay under the hood and I found a brown plug/piece/relay?? with a wire in it that is all gunked up. See the picture below (sorry about it being backwards/upside down.. all i have is my laptop to take pics with) and let me know if that's supposed to be gunky (it might be grease but i dont think it is). Also, any idea of what it is???

thelastaspec

a multimeter is really useful to have around and costs like 10 bucks somewhere on sale. If you get one get a digital one.


you can test lots of stuff including voltage, and if wires are continuous/broken

freebieman

Well, my car is fixed... for now. After taking out the starter and getting it tested at Autozone (where it passed), I still thought it could be the starter relay, from all of the threads I searched through. I looked on craigslist and found a 2000 tl being parted out, and i bought a starter for $25. Put it in and wham, it started the first time. So, it had to be the starter relay, which is attached to the starter in my car. Thanks everyone.

thelastaspec

Glad it worked out for you,
sorry i wasted your time suggesting the ignition switch

freebieman

no worries, i'd much rather get some response than none. even if it's, "Man, I have no idea what the solution is."

DrewZTL

A buddy of mine told me one time cause I was having start up problems myself....can't recall which, but something about the ignition....Honda has a recall on it. I'd check that too. Correct me if I'm wrong please.

TLer trash

One small clarification: the starter relay is in the underhood fuse panel. The part on the starter that cured your problem is the starter solenoid, and is typically serviced by replacing the starter as you did.

freebieman

ahhh thank you. I'm still a noob. From what I read, it appeared as though the two words (solenoid and relay) were interchangeable. So, I guess the starter solenoid was the problem.

01tl4tl

fuses protect wiring system from shorts, overvoltage event
relays control power from fuses to actual part
selenoids operate briefly on a burst of power- to extend and rotate the starter shaft for example

only 99s had the ign switch recall, but other years may suffer same prob

freebieman

thanks for that info 01tl. i love learning about cars