Maybe someone can sanity check my reasoning. Back in mid-December, I purchased a 2003 TL Sport with just 117K miles. Pulling the carfax, the one owner vehicle had been regularly serviced at a local Atlanta Acura dealership. Driving it around, the car shifted smooth, no engine noise, and was just clean. I felt pretty confident I had a decent car here (I'm learning that during this time Honda had some issues with their transmissions across their entire product lines, but I digress). But you pay your money and take your chances.

So, I drove this car for a couple of weeks, others drove it as well, it drove PERFECTLY.

Yesterday, I am in a large parking lot giving my daughter an introduction to the car and letting her drive it around the parking lot. We're in D5 auto, and we never got above 25 mph. About to swap drivers, and the car clearly has a cerebral hemorrhage:

- CEL on.
- VSA warning on (triangle)
- D5 flashing
- and, the speedometer no longer works

Now, I suppose this is the inevitable transmission issue plaguing these cars, but the engineer in me just has a card time believing that ALL of this happened as soon as we put the car in park. It has been shifting smoothly, and I know what to "feel" when a car is not shifting properly, but this smells like a sensor failed, wiring, etc.

I managed to get the car home with manual shifting, and I'll likely take it to a shop I trust this week. Sure would like to know your thoughts and maybe some basic things to check.

thanks

 

Its been said so many times before and should be easy to find in many of the tranny failure posts. Your most likely looking at a rebuild or AV6 swap as your trans is at the end of its life. It is possible to extend it alittle longer with a 3x3 drain refill and checking your solenoids for sludge. Also checking the resistance and seeing if they click with battery voltage will help to see if thats an issue. Other than that theres nothing else you can do. Once these trans exhibit all the signs you described its pretty much game over.

 

As soon as I posted, I found similar reports. My expectation of a failing automatic would be odd behavior - slow shifting, down shifting, etc. Not an instant off condition.

oh well, live and learn.

 

I wouldn't jump to conclusions too quickly. How does the fluid look? Can you have the codes pulled?

 

first make sure the battery is fully charged- then proceed using SS mode if needed to get to any parts store
ask for a code reading- its FREE and a batt and charging system test- also free
get back to us with the codes, codes are CLUES not a diagnosis in themselves

It takes a knowledgeable about our car person 30 minutes of driving the TL for any trans problems to show up, not something you will find on your own short drives
slow driving in parking lot- old battery that sat a while until car was sold.. low batt voltage or problem with the alt output and it will throw false codes-
can even put it in a protection mode and wont go over 3000rpm

the usual trans failure includes flashing D5 light on dash under hard throttle in 2nd gear
Does the fluid look or smell burnt?
Dealer service rarely does any trans fluid changes- its stupid but true

ask the acura dealer (not carfax) to run the VIN for recalls are done and if trans was ever replaced
Or look under hood at top of trans- any bolt heads with blue paint on them indicate warranty replaced unit- there are many of them around

Drain 3 ounces of atf- easy diy! and send to blackstone labs with 20$- see internet,, for mass spectrograph reading of fluid and a report detailing if there are bad things in it- like clutch material

 

Usually, I jump to the worst conclusion possible. The fact that it was instant off AND I can still manually shift AND no speedo leads me to think it's not the overall system... The D5 light is flashing as soon as the engine starts - but I'm not stuck in second. Very curious.

I checked the ATF fluid - looks very clean and doesn't smell bad at all. Then again, I normally don't drive an automatic. The level was a little low.

Pulling the codes is a most excellent idea - sarcasm directed at me. I'll be taking it by my local Honda shop today and will know more then.

 

It's likely just a speed sensor failure. Honda has always had a few parts in their vehicles that are known to just go bad. Window regulators, ignition switches, and speed sensors are high on the list.

The D5 flashing indicates that there is a fault/failure inside of the automatic transmission system somewhere.

Sometimes if the computer detects a fault in the transmission, even if it's as minor as a speed sensor, it can trigger limp mode.

 

Getting the codes read will definitely help with the diagnosis. The speedometer going dead would point more toward a bad speed sensor rather than a completely dead transmission, but the code(s) will hopefully tell the story.

For what it's worth, when the transmission died in my '03 TL-S at 85K miles, there were absolutely zero symptoms ahead of time. I parked the car in my driveway at night and then the next day, after driving it less than 10 miles, it started to show all the typical signs of failure, but I did manage to limp it home after a good number of stops along the way to shut the car off and re-start it after a few minutes of sitting. The speedometer did work the whole time though.

 

If the D5 light flashes as soon as you turn the key to position II that tells me theres an electrical fault.
You mentioned the speedometer doesn't work, Any sensor or solenoid that the ECU doesn't detect will make D5 flash and turn on the CEL.
More than likely the sensor is ok and its just a bad connection, Have a look at the wires and connection before buying anything.

 

dealer charges for any diagnostics or code reading
go to a parts store for a free reading then report here with codes
they are CLUES not a diagnosis in themselves

 

I agree with Erick on this one mainly because I had the exact same thing happen to my TL. Although it happened to my 99 its essentially the same as the 00-03 minus one gear. Anyway I had the D4 light flashing on as soon as the ignition was turned on. I thought it was a bad trans and needed rebuilt. I started looking for obvious things after I pulled the code P0753 which is a fault in the shift solenoid A circuit. The code P0753 came back immediately after I cleared the codes like 2 seconds after the ignition was turned back on again. I looked everywhere for the problem and researched day and night. It turned out to be the wire in the pcm connector under the middle console that went to the Shift Solenoid A was not connecting. I fixed it by unplugging and plugging the connector back in. Anyway during the entire time the code was lit my speedo did not work at all. After I fixed the wiring issue, the speedo magically worked again and no more D4 flashing. It is most likely an electrical problem causing your pcm to shut off the speedo. The speedo in these cars rarely fail because its based off the countershaft speed sensor. Find out your code and go from there. Hope this helps.

 

All - I really appreciate all of the feedback and suggestions. Finally got set up with the technician from the dealership to remove the alarm system. About 1/2 through with the removal (lot's of wire clipping up under the dash, re-splicing wires - hmmm I'm thinking), he said, "I have no idea who installed this, but it's just wrong. It's supposed to be tied into the starter circuit, not anything else."

According to him, he's seen this before on Acura's and inevitably, something gets hosed on the ECU/ECM that requires re-flashing of the unit. So, I'm hoping this stupid dealer anti-theft device is the source of my issues.

I have an appointment with the local Honda dealer to get it done. I'll happily gamble $110. I'll follow up later. I really want to like this car.

 

Bad solenoid valve.

Went to the dealer to have him remove his alarm system. The installer looked at it and shook his head. It had not been wired in correctly. I had warned him that the tranny was very unhappy, and he indicated that it might be due to the security system messing with the ECM.

Anyway, I was hopeful it wasn't toast. Took the car to Advanced Auto, read the codes - yeah, tranny not happy, I know that. Codes indicated a solenoid issue. The installer said if you can reset/flash the ecm it might correct it (a dealer only service). So, dropped it at the new Honda dealership 5 min from home, explained in detail what had happened, and prayed. At a minimum, I was looking at $100 for the flash work- fine.

Tech went through the wiring carefully - all well. Traced the issue to noted solenoid, replaced, changed tran fluid... and my car is well.

Now, fingers crossed I won't have to replace the transmission any time soon. I appreciate all the feedback, it's a nice daily driver.

 

make sure you finish the trans fluid change- they likely did only 3 qts
onto the newer stuff DW-1

There is an external atf filter you can replace too- always a good idea

chances are you have solved the problem and need only to enjoy the TL!

 

Well, so far so good. It's been 6 months and although the car feels a little weird in 3rd, there's been no major issues. I do not expect this car to be driven hard, but the short trips are the roughest.

 

Thanks - Always good having a thread that has a follow up.

 

did they change ALL the trans fluid? or just a simple drain and refill
with 3 qts DW-1

Its worth doing at least another 3 qt change of the 7.3 capacity. and a new external filter never hurt!

Whats it doing in 3rd?
an oil analysis will tell if the clutch is coming apart- that's our problem