The following was taken from today's edition of the DealersEdge Newsletter. The testing firm (AMCI) is the same company that established the performance figures for the TL/CL Type-S for Acura.

Performance claims of new Nissan being questioned

Nissan Motor Company's ultra-luxurious new Infiniti Q-45 sedan is being questioned. Nissan claims the sedan can go from 0-to-60 mph in 5.9 seconds but some auto magazines and testing firms have questioned that claim.

Senior analyst with AMCI Inc., Jim Wangers has stated that their firm has conducted exclusive tests on the vehicle and it comes nowhere close to 5.9 seconds. Wangers added that it is almost a full second off the time Nissan says it can go.

The hype of the Nissan's acceleration is just another advertising tool to get consumers to purchase their product. Nissan is not the only one who has used this strategy to get the consumers to buy. Mazda admitted the 2001 Miata produced just 142 horsepower, compared to their advertisements claims of 155 horsepower. Ford too has been sited. They recalled their 1999 SVT Mustang Cobra after tests showed it didn’t achieve a promised 320 horsepower.

Speed is not the only issue at hand. Ford went as far to question Toyota's claim that its full-size Sequoia SUV had more cargo space then the Expedition.

 

When I test drove the Q45 I felt that it was definitely slower than the TLS... there is also a tremendous lag when you initially step on the gas, similar to older Mercedes which leaves you with a crappy feeling. Definitely futuristic but much less luxurious than the LS430.

 

In Motor Trend's "Luxuroius Maxiumus" Comparison, they also stated that the Q45's engine felt like it was not producing 340hp. They said it might be cause its an all new engine without the final ECU settings

 

This also makes you wonder about the new Maxima and Altima.

 

Nissan some how has over-rated several models' HP. It's not the first time they ever did it. Take 300ZX(Fairlady) for example: Nissan rated the N/A version(300ZX and 300ZX 2+2)at 222HP. However, several articles questioned about the HP output as they are not performing as claimed. And many professional drivers stated that although smooth and rev-happy, the engine should be making(and actually performine like one)around 200HP instead of claimed 222HP.

I think HP figures shown by Nissan are in "PS" instead of "HP", PS is slightly less(though I am not sure about the actual calculation)than HP rating. My old 1993 240SX SE wasn't performing that well although everything feel right at hand. Though they rated it at 150hp, it actually feels about 10-15hp short.

P.S. The only vehicle from Nissan that's UNDER-rated would be Skyline GT-R/GT-R V-Spec.

Andy Kuo

 

What is "PS"? SAE (Society of Automotive Engineers) set the standard for measuring and advertising the power output of all vehicles sold in the US. There is no difference in rating between manufacturers.......Nissan lied to sell more cars.

Did they use a different unit of measurement for the claimed 0-60 time of 5.9 seconds? Perhaps that was 5.9 lunar seconds

 

Eitherway it still is a slick looking car. The interior and those headlights really stand out.

 

So, is the I35 going to have 260 hp?

 

I have no doubt that since the TL-S is rated at 260, the I35 will be rated at least 265 Horsepower. By the same marketing team, er, engineers...

Nissan's horsepower rating discrepancies have been discussed at length here and on CarAndDriver.com/RoadandTrack.com.

People are starting to wonder (as has been stated here) how these more powerful and lighter cars lose handily to less powerful heavier cars.

When the 225 horsepower TL came out it was the class leader UNTIL the I30 came out shortly thereafter. It seems as though the method for rating the I30 was strap the class leader on the dyno and add two to HP and Torque.

They sure did go a lot farther with the new Q though.

 

This what I HAVE BEEN SAYING ALL ALONG!

DO u believe me now!?!?!?!

 

Who cares? I didn't buy the TL-S because of the listed HP. It is a fast car that is a great deal. Bottom line. Who did buy a TL-S because of the claimed HP? I hope no one.

 

You may not buy it for the HP rating, but some people do. Plus, the HP rating (and the torque figure) plus the vehicle weight is a good way to estimate the quickness of the car short of a test drive.

Same thing with all the other ratings. Basicall, manufacturers should not lie about the vehicle specs. "Bottom line." Consumers need to be properly informed.

 

If the manufacture had claim the wrong hp on the car. It is "false advertising." It is a violation of federal law and state law.

I sure by the Type S because of the HP rating. Otherwise I would just buy a regular TL and save some money.

 

I knew it!! I drove my firends new Q and it definetly had the lagging that was described before. IT just does not accelerate as well as the lexus or for that matter the TLS. The car looks really good and all, but for that much money.. I just get the Benz.

 

I caught them in ANOTHER LIE just today!

They had an ad on the radio about the fly by wire technology used oin their throttle - that it works at the speed of light they said.

Well, I am a physicist and degtreed EE, and any first year student will tell you that the propagation velocity of an electrical signal through any capable is a fraction of the spped of light, or c. It is a function of the type, thickness, and prcximity of the dielectric.

Usually in the range of .6 to .8c.

I say we get a rope and settle this the way we did in the Old West.

Nissan has to do something to sell its butt ugliness.

 

That's cable, not capable!

I must be getting old - my fingers are all fouled up today.

 

Of course, this is all meaningless when one considers that the throttle valves have to respond at several orders of magnitude less than c. BMW M-series valves go closed-to-open in 120ms, if I recall.

 

So let me get this straight - are you guys saying that the 3.0L V6 in the Maxima is not "possibly the best V6 ever" like the commercial says?

 

Who cares? I would if I laid down money on a product that was intentionally misrepresented to boost sales.

Power output is a motivating factor for some buyers. Are there any good reasons to buy a Nissan? The quality of materials and workmanship is poor, they aren't known for reliability, the resale value is dismal (at best), the styling leaves a bit to be desired, and, and I personally have a problem buying a product from a company if I'm uncertain they will be in business for the duration of my warranty.

 

Road Rage;


"A man does not get old because he nears death; a man gets old because he can no longer see the false from the good."

Charles Bukowski (1920-1994), U.S. author and poet.

I don't think you're quite there yet.

 

Who cares? I would if I laid down money on a product that was intentionally misrepresented to boost sales.

Power output is a motivating factor for some buyers. Are there any good reasons to buy a Nissan? The quality of materials and workmanship is poor, they aren't known for reliability, the resale value is dismal (at best), the styling leaves a bit to be desired, and, and I personally have a problem buying a product from a company if I'm uncertain they will be in business for the duration of my warranty............



I see where chester is coming from. I like my Maxima because it is fast, fun, and affordable. I like the TL because it is fast, fun, and luxurious. I don't look at #'s, they mean NOTHING! Test driving a car shows how it really performs for YOU. They could tell me that my car has 150HP or 300HP, I would still buy it.

As for quality, I have had to take the TL for a faulty window regulator, noisey sunroof, leaking trunk seal, loose headlight housing, creaking driver's seat, and transmission complaints (that were not found by the dealer). On the Maxima, I have taken it in for one noise in the dash. Both cars have around 25,000 miles and the TL is mostly highway where the Maxima is mostly city driving. Who said Nissan's quality was bad? I visit Maxima.org and this site frequently and must say that the problems are expressed more here than there. I am not biased either. I had a '98 TL and a '96 Integra before these cars, but Acura has not impresses me lately.

Bash the Q45 all you want. Until the ugly grandfather (RL) gets a face lift, the Q will win no matter what the HP is.

 

Perhaps you should consider your own advice "think before you write". Educate yourself on the facts. The Nissan has a higher cost of ownership, higher warranty expense per vehicle (CPU), lower customer satisfaction scores, and lower resale value. Nissan is providing dealers with huge cash incentives to sell the cars, and in turn dealers are approving just about any deal that walks in the door. You're pleased with your Nissan product, and that's good. That's what new vehicle ownership is about.

Infiniti has been following in Acura's dust since the inception of both marques. In the past 3 years Acura has been reinventing itself. There are 2 vehicles in the line up still due for a revamp, and they will be as incredible as everthing else released lately.

First the new TL was introduced in 1999. Sales increased by 300%. The new CL was released in March 2000, and the Type-S was born. The introduction of the MDX came along about 6 months later, and it was subsequently named "Motor Trend SUV of the Year". Only 6 months later the TL receives a host of changes, and the Type-S variant is introduced. A few months later, along comes the RSX and RSX-S. The RL is just about to peer over the horizon, and it won't be a "facelift" as you've implied. Following the RL will be a new NSX that will strike fear in the hearts of every exotic car owner on the planet. Bookmark this, and tell me again in March of 2002 how the Q is so much better than the RL

So what has Nissan been up to since 1999?

 

I saw a Black Q45 on the Garden State PKWY yesterday. It blew right past me...outta nowhere...all I saw was the infinity symbol approaching my rear view and wham it was gone. Pretty sweet car!! It looks gigantic though...Just to keep my .. ah-um...manly hood...I was in my fiance's car at the time ... else I would've gave chase

 

Darla: Once again you display a depth of knowledge that warms the heart...I too am a Bukowski fan - even though a scientist I was a a big fan of creative writing.

Still, I find myself eyeing the prostate medication in the vitamin section, my fashion sense is going to hell (plainds and striped pants, and the black nylon socks in my dresser now outnumber my cotton sport socks! Am I becoming my Dad??!!!

 

New models since 1999 :

Maxima (222 now 255-maybe )
Frontier Supercharged
Xterra Supercharged, new Xterra (sport ute of the year as well)
Altima
Sentra V-spec
Pathfinder 3.5 L
Next year, new Z car

I am sure people will bash the cars listed above for something, but I think it is safe to say that BOTH companies are trying to make a name for themselves, but BOTH are competing in different price brackets. Acura is doing well, no doubt and I am happy about that - more performance cars . Nissan has come full circle as well and, like Acura, will continue to gain market share with new products. Oh, and what I put on the last post, "think before you write", was not supposed to go with that post. No harm intended. After all of this writing, I AM READY TO DRIVE!

 

Well, I enjoyed my Honda product=Acura and Nissan product=Infiniti. Both car manufactures are trying their best on gaining market share. Isn't that good? We don't want anyone that dominate the market and stop improving.

I admitted Acura is doing better than the Infiniti in terms of launching the new products and marketing. Well, Infiniti is trying and lets hope both of the manfactures are going to improved their products evry year.

 

Bottom line, they're all still trying to catch the Germans... J/K

I owned a 98 Maxima SE 5spd. and didn't have any trouble with the car. I drove it til about 18K miles and got rid of it for what I thought was gonna be a 328Ci (couldn't wait the additional 3 months) instead, I got a TL.

I have to admit, the TL has been in the shop for repairs more than any cars I've owned. All minor ones of course, but the fact is, the TL is not as perfect as some of you may think. I sure miss my 94 Legend. Not a squeak of a problem, even at 60K miles. Why oh why did Acura dump that line. Don't tell me that the RL is the Legend cuz I think the RL is bottom of the barrel in its class. BTW, I still don't know what the RL compares to.

On the other hand, I can't say much about the Q cuz I've never driven one.

I do think that Nissan, along with every car manuf. is doing a good job with new model releases, don't you just love competition. Heck, who knows, I may one day choose the Lexus GS430 over the BMW 540i...

 

Right on daverman!

Just lile those guys that live and die by the 0-60 and 1/4 mile time data. It's a rough indication and your results may vary. It's why some folks can't understand how I could hang with a M-Roadster or 911-C or have no chance at beating a GS400. Anythings possible. Just not always probable.

RUF

 

This is no discovery to me. If you do the math on the I30 with its power to weight ratio it should be faster than it is, and should be able to outaccelerate the TL-P. While the screwups with the Mustangs and Miatas were just that screwups, I wonder what Nissans explanation will be.

 

I think it's worth mentioning that, according to the 6/01 issue Automobile Magazine, Mazda contacted the owners of the 3500 "affected" Miatas and offered to buy them back regardless of mileage. Only 1 in 20 people took them up on the offer. The other 95% received a $500 refund from Mazda and were given free scheduled maintenance for the duration of the warranty.

They may have goofed up, but I think they did the right thing by taking care of their customers like this.

 

True Mazda did this but there is a HUGE difference in $$$$$$ and not sure if those owners will be too pleased considering there is competition (LS, S, a-8,7 etc) whereas the Miata really has no comp. except the new MR2.

 

Oh I'm not excusing any of their (Mazda, Ford or Infiniti) actions in ANY way, but at the VERY least Mazda fessed up to the problem and took action to make it right.

The general concensus seems to think that Infiniti bogusly inflated their hp figures to sell cars and that's just plain bad business.

 

Ford recalled all their 1999 Cobras, too and reworked the manifolds and exhausts (ouch, that's gotta be expensive). I wonder if Nissan will fess up and do anything here?

One of the Car mags (C+D, I think) mentioned that there seemed to be missing HP, and that the CPU might need a little work to get the full rated HP.

I wonder if anyone has run one on the dyno? Then again, the typical Q45 buyer doesn't strike me as the type to strap his car to a dyno.....

 

This is not true for last gen 300ZX (3rd gen before their demise).

An article (R&T?)was posted about the misclaims for the 2nd generation 300ZX's: at that the time the claim was 200HP, but actually it's 190.

 

That's nothing!!!

I hear that Nissans are actually Datsuns in disguise!!!

They're all a bunch of liars!!!