I know I have posted this topic before, but I was waiting for some cars to come out before we bought. I think now, my dad is serious because he keeps bugging me about it and my dad wont ever talk about cars because then I nag him to get a new one

We need a RELIABLE car which will easily go past 100-150k without pouring money into it. He wants this to be his last car and since it is, I convinced him to spend the extra money to get a decent car.

Here are the choices boys.

1 - 2002 Acura 3.2 TL Type S -- Underbody Spoilers -- Rear Spoiler -- Navigation -- Wood steering wheel

2 - 2002 Infinity I35 -- Side steps and spoiler -- Navigation -- Premium Package

3 -- 2002 Acura 3.5 RL -- Navigation

4 -- 2002 Lexus ES300 -- Options unknown right now


I like the RL but I think the TL is a better buy.

 

okay, personally, I'd be choosing between the infiniti and the acura tl-s ..

I'd ditch the RL because it's just an overstated and overpriced TL that just plain earns no respect. although I did see how amazingly it looked like a BMW 740 from the backend today.. both happened to be black and both happen to have that silver trunk edge.. and both have the front hood grooves.. amazing how similar they looked. I can't get over how "old" it looks and how underpowered it is. Only in this current model year did it get an engine to match the base TL and on top of that .. it uses more displacement to get there! If people think the TL doesn't have personality, the RL has even less.

The lexus ES would be a nice choice but its the most basic of ESes and like any other toyota production, any option that gets put on will tax you an arm for. Nice car .. but well.. ho hum. .. lots of people have ES es at least here in miami.

now, the infiniti, thats something to consider I'm a little biased to infiniti because of their Q45. these people make pretty darn nice machines and if the I35 has real wood inside it .. heh .. heh .. furthermore, its no longer the old I30 and now it has more pep however, the downside is .. its more stately than aggressive. amazing how nissan pulls it off. ... I guess its because they really style and design their cars to be quite different. can we afford the new Q here?

the tl-s .. much more aggressive .. despite complaints of non-aggression from many. but a tl-s with a body kit is plenty mean looking with that new front end in my opinion. but then the tl rings of the typical complaints we already have about it .. especially fake wood .

interestingly, it should also be the least priced option in your list... hey .. more money for mods right?

bottom line: I35 for stately TL-S for attention what matters more to you?

 

If you decide on the RL then wait for the new design.. i think its due out pretty soon

 

Any of the cars you mentioned meet the only criteria you provided - reliability. You and your father need to figure out what -you- want from the car. If you're looking for performance than either the I35 or TL-S are your only real options. If you're looking for understated luxury than the Lexus and RL are good choices. If resale is important you'll do better with Acura and Lexus. It all depends on what you're looking for. And appearance wise, it's a big swing from a TL-S with the body kit and spoiler to the sedate appearance of the RL. Also, if you're looking for performance you should get the I35 with the sport package.

 

This is a biased poll given that all of us drive Acuras. Post the same poll on the Lexus and Infiniti chat sites and your results will be skewed towards the site you posted.

 

Well considering the ES 300 has 180,000 miles and still runs like new, still looks like new and no pesky quality problems I would have to recommend it on experience. The ES has a proven track record but is a Luxery car, for something more sporting look elsewhere but I guess it is where his priorities are at.

The I30/35 is NOT a sports sedan btw.

 

For reliability, I'd say get the ES since Toyotas run forever and you literally have to kill them for it to die. Can't say how long the TL will run since it's faily new compared to the ES. The Infiniti/Nissan have nasty "fix" costs to them. If something breaks, for some reason they cost a lot, don' know why. But ask yourself, what is high on your priority list. Ofcourse the TLS will outperform all of them IMO, but the Lexus will give you the most luxury and "smoothness".

 

I would never get the ES300 'cauze it's just an overpriced Camry V6... It's underpower and I don't like the styling... The TL-S would be my choice since it's best bang for the buck! I would never want to get any Lexus V6 but those Lexus V8s (GS/SC430) are nice....

 

Man I can't believe what you just said. Listen to you...what do you think you drive? Man, those Lexus guys would have a field day on your comment. Not trying to knock you, but based on your comment, sorry to be the one to break the news to ya, you have an overpriced Accord V6.

 

For reliabilty I don't think you can go wrong with any but the ES300 has the edge. The current RL is not worth the money it costs and won't be a real player until it gets RWD and a V8. From my personal tastes (luxury/sport) I would go with either the TL-S or the I35. If you want a luxrious, isolated, QUIET car that gets you places in a pleasant manner then get the ES300. The G35 should be out within the next 5 months too...

 

actually, the Accord V6 has a 3.0 L engine and the TL has a 3.2 L engine....so that's bigger difference than a change in styling. The ES300 has a 3.0 L engine like the Camry but it does have 14 more HP.

 

Yah but the TL is an overpriced Accord, the RL an overpriced TL, the I30 an overpriced Maxima lol

 

Ok so a new RL with navi is like 46k
New Q ship with navi 54k
I say go for a last gen Q Ship
VERY NICE cars -- look for a low mileage one...



He could save a bundle -- cuz the resale isnt as good due to the new model -- and since he's keeping it resale wont matter for him....
The only disadvantage I can see is it uses 9 CD's for the navi...
but other than that...
u can get an 01 with like 5-9k miles for around 45k
Sweeet V8 & RWD

 

Actually u may even be able to find some leftover 2001 Q ships and get a great deal



Performance and luxury with distinctive styling.
Base Price (MSRP) $48,895
As Tested (MSRP) $51,120

Infiniti's Q45 looks like a thoroughbred and boasts performance to match. This is a performance luxury sedan that delivers instant throttle response and excellent handling.

As Infiniti's luxury flagship, the Q45 has to be good. It competes with the elite: Mercedes-Benz, BMW, Jaguar, Audi, Cadillac, Lexus. The people who make these cars and the people who buy them are serious about their luxury cars. Arguably, no one is fighting this battle harder than Infiniti. Infiniti has to build a top-quality performance luxury sedan, then try and sell it without the instant cachet of a brand name like Mercedes or BMW. So, like the brilliant sedans offered by those premium brands, Infiniti's Q45 is powerful, quiet, roomy and comfortable. What separates the Q45 from those other vehicles is its performance, handling and distinctive styling.

First launched 10 years ago, the Q45 has undergone refinements ever since. This year, active head restraints have been added to the front seats for improved safety. Amenities have been enhanced for more convenience and the first tune-up isn't due for 100,000 miles. The styling was revised last year.

Model Lineup
Two models are available: Q45 and Q45t. They both come with powerful 4.1-liter V8s and firm, luxurious leather interiors.

Q45 retails for $48,895. It comes fully loaded. Among the few options available: heated front seats ($420), two-tone paint ($500), a six-disc CD changer ($718), rear spoiler ($529) and painted splash guards ($109).

Q45t comes with an electronically modulated suspension and 17-inch wheels and tires and retails for $50,595.

Walkaround
Infiniti's Q45 does not have the classic luxury-car appearance of a Mercedes, BMW or Lexus, nor does it have the aggressive styling of the Cadillac STS. Instead, the Q45 has an elegant look that is distinctive and stallion sleek with a long, sloping nose, a thin roof line and steeply raked rear glass. It conveys a look of luxury and performance. A strong character line separates the upper flanks from the lower and there's plenty of chrome to set it off. Five-spoke 17-inch alloy wheels give the Q45t an aggressive appearance.

Styling changes introduced last year gave the Q45 a slightly different look. The grille and the headlights were redesigned. High-intensity discharge headlights feature Xenon gas bulbs and crystalline lenses. A power glass sunroof with sunshade replaces the previous full metal type. At the rear, the combination lamps were revised.

Interior Features
Prestige cars traditionally offer a lap-of-luxury interior environment. The Q45 cleaves hard and fast to the traditional approach. What isn't covered in leather is covered in wood. The leather is some of the best in the business: buttery soft and perfectly stitched. It comes in three tasteful colors, beige, stone beige and black.

The front bucket seats are comfortable. The power front seats adjust in 10 directions and have power lumbar supports. Occupants sit relatively low in the car, though not uncomfortably low, providing a sense of security, a feeling of being surrounded by body structure. Visibility is good. Overall comfort is good. This car is as much at home lazing around town as it is devouring miles of Interstate. It's a nice place to be.

A two-position memory switch remembers pre-set positions for the seats and outside mirrors. An eight-speaker Bose sound system provides entertainment; and the HomeLink transmitter system opens gates and garage doors and turns on the lights in your home.

Q45 comes standard with a vast array of features that are essential in this class: power tilt/telescope steering, cruise control, speed-sensitive wipers, timed rear window defroster, dual vanity mirrors, power windows, locks, and trunk and fuel door. Separate climate controls for the rear seats help ensure passengers in back are comfortable.

The round dash-mounted analog clock is back after a two year absence and we're glad to see it. The classically styled clock was a signature item in the original Q45 and Q45 enthusiasts cried when it disappeared.

The Q45 comes with dual front airbags and side air bags that deploy from the front seats and front seat belt pre-tensioners. There are pick-resistant door locks. If, somehow, the castle has been breached, the perpetrator will run up against the Infiniti Personalized Protection System that combines 60,000 possible key codes with a new, numerically random rolling code generated by the engine's computer each time the ignition is turned off.

Among the few options available is the Infiniti Communicator ($1599), which includes a cellular telephone and Global Positioning Satellite system. Two buttons in the overhead console contact the Infiniti Response Center, which will contact emergency road service or medical help. If the air bags deploy, the center is automatically notified.

A nice touch we liked is the Interior Light Logic feature. It turns the interior lights on very brightly in the open door for easy entry and exit without blasting the rest of the cabin with intense light. We also liked the pin light that bathes the center console and front door panels with soft light that makes finding and operating controls a bit easier.

Driving Impressions
The Q45 performs like a thoroughbred. Infiniti's 4.1-liter engine gives the Q45 stellar performance. Based on the same powerplant as the Infiniti Indy V8 used in the Indy Racing League cars, it generates 266 horsepower and 278 foot-pounds of torque. It features variable valve timing, which adjusts valve opening and closing according to engine speed and load. Variable valve timing is a key element in the engine's efficiency and is a proven technology.

Performance has always been an Infiniti trait and there's lots of power here. Although peak torque is at a relatively high 4000 rpm, there is usable torque low in the power range and that means great acceleration at lower speeds. Throttle response is instant, whether you're moving away from a stoplight, making a tight freeway merge or passing. The Q45 accelerates from 0-60 mph in the mid 7-second range. That's quick. It also delivers responsible fuel economy, netting an EPA rating of 17 mpg city/24 mpg highway.

This V8 is among the smoothest and most satisfying around today, easily holding its own with Lexus and BMW offerings and perhaps even a touch smoother and quieter than the Mercedes-Benz V8s. The Q45 has always been more of a driver's car than the Lexus LS 400 and that tradition continues. The V8 drives the rear wheels through a four-speed electronically controlled automatic transmission; smooth, precise shifts are based on speed and load. On the road, the feeling is of a seamless flow of power with no hesitation or jerkiness between shifts. A viscous limited-slip differential with traction control reduces wheelspin in slippery conditions.

The MacPherson strut front suspension was designed to provide good handling without compromising on that luxury car feel. In the rear, the Q45 has a multi-link arrangement designed to keep more tire contact patch on the road, and more patch means more grip. Anti-dive and anti-squat characteristics mean improved grip under hard braking and acceleration.

The Q45t (Touring Package) has a slightly more aggressive suspension tune for a sportier feel. Still, the ride quality is excellent.

This car always feels firmly planted. It's stable as a freight train in a straight line, controlled in turns. The Q45 feels very nimble for a large luxury car. Steering is razor sharp, quick and precise. The suspension is well damped, isolating occupants from poorly maintained road surfaces. But it doesn't float like some big luxury cars that use mushy suspensions to make up for poor chassis engineering. You won't have any trouble keeping up with BMWs in a Q.

Final Word
The Infiniti Q45 offers excellent performance and handling. It's a real driver's car. Yet it also delivers a well-damped ride, a comfortable driver's interior and a luxurious traveling experience. It can hold its own against the best world's luxury cars.

 

He's right....my dad used to have a 98 Q45, very nice...but not quite as nice as the VDP he has now (it's pictured in my sig).....now that's LUXURY

 

the RL is a dog;
the ES300 is lame;
the I35 is lamer;

TL-S is the way to go (my unbiased opinion), but don't get it in satin silver, b/c we're in the same neighborhood!

 

The point I want to make is the Accord V6 (I own one) is completely different than the TL-S in term of performances & looks even though they are built on the same chassis! The new Camry & ES300 look almost the same w/ a little different in hp... Also the ES is overpriced comparing to the TL or TL-S but I have to admit that it's quieter and smoother.... With the 3.2 engine, HID, 60hp difference, and other goodies, the TL-S is worth the $5K over the Accord EX V6 price!

 

Well said, this seems much more reasonable. I still disagree that the Lexus ES is an overpriced Camry. Maybe they are the same in many respects, but I don't think I would classify them in the same catagory. The ES is a very well made car IMO, yeah, overpriced but c'mon, it's a fine vehicle.

 

I guess all the choices are within the price range that your dad finds acceptable. I think he would be very happy and proud future Lexus ES300 owner. They are designed to please the older crowd. Its got the "Lexus" prestige name he'll be proud to to show to his contemporaries. ES300 is sprung for maximum comfort desired by older drivers. And lastly, reliability in a Lexus is unbeatable so he will be able to keep it for a long, long, time. Go for the Lexus.