tgif

Why the drivers of these cars are always think their car is faster? Last night, I was doing OT at work and then had dinner with my wife. It was around 9:30 p.m. There is a YELLOW Mustang next to me. It is a new car (the dealer paper still on the license frame). When the light turn green, he just floored the car. At a moment I was thinking to kill this car, but after a long day of work. And my wife is in the car. I figured out myself this is not worth it.

pjonkheer1

If that Mustang was a GT with a manual tranny you probably would have lost pretty badly. Now, I am not a huge fan of Mustangs or anything, but that car has 260bhp, 302 ft-lbs of torque, and only weighs 3200 pounds. The TLS cannot compare with those specs...

If that yellow Mustang was an automatic, then a close race is very likely.

tgif

I don't see any GT mark on the car. I believed it is just a regular GT.

pjonkheer1

Well either it's a GT or not. The GT emblem only shows up on the side of the car.

TommyBoiSxty9

Also on the rear bumper/valancey thing --
V6's Say MUSTANG (molded in the plastic)
GT's
MUSTANG GT

pjonkheer1

Oh yeah, I forgot about that.

Thanks.

Sleeper_RENAMED

Hummmm. My previous car was '93 Mustang Lx automatic. It was basically stock and would run 13.5's consistantly with not so great street tires (Bridgestone RE940s???). I had pulleys, K&N aair filter, removed the air silencer, flowmaster exhaust, 3.73 rear end, redline synthetic lubricants, and advanced the timing. So why do Mustang owners think their cars are fast? Mine was. I could pretty much dust anything on the roud with that car. Except for the occasional late model Vette, Porshe, etc.

bigman

Just to clear a few things up. The GT mustang and the v6 foo 99 and up both just say Mustang on the back bumper. The GT says gt on the right hand side of the trunk. I don't think the Type-S can hang with a stock Manual stang GT 99 and up, unless it had some major mods. Auto maybe with mods. Although i have seen some 14.5 seconds 1/4 times. After our fourth gear though, don't even bother.

Mike

While that's the truth on paper anything can happen on the street.

thephantom

Well put!!

pjonkheer1

I agree with this in most cases. I am not a big fan of paper numbers. However, in this case there is no competition. Hell, the manual transmission alone makes this car that much faster than the TLS.

Sleeper_RENAMED

Well put...but out of context. I believe I answered TGIFs question. I guess I could of listed all the cars I have beaten. Most people dont believe anything unless its on paper. As an owner of both a Mustang and a TL I would consider my opinion to be fairly objective. But still an opinion none the less. I cant really speak for the new Mustangs. I easily walked away from all the new Mustangs I raced except for the new Cobra, which was surprisingly fast.

Please dont get me wrong. The are plenty of good reasons why I now drive a TL instead of a Mustang.

tea elle

I'm more confused by the fact that anyone is buying a Ford to begin with. Have you been inside a Mustang? Unbelievably cheap materials. And, has anyone ever actually owned a Ford that didn't have problems?

I don't know, I guess some Americans just have to buy American cars. Blind faith.

Mike

I agree w/you, however, I raced my friends s2000 and beat him 3 out of 4 times. My car wasn't faster, he was just an average driver. I wasn't stock and I love my headers.
He ate humble pie that night.

SoundSpeed

People seem to forget sometimes that the outcome of a race has a lot to do with driver skill.

Sleeper_RENAMED

Good questions and point taken. There is another question that could be asked. Have you ever owned a Ford? A lot of times you get what you pay for, dont you think? Its not like the Mustang is an expensive car. At least it used to not be expensive. No doubt that Mustangs are built with inexpensive materials but so are all cars that I know of that cost ~$20,000. You would be hard pressed to convince me that in 1993 that there was another car that gave you more performance per dollar. The Mustang never claimed to be a luxury car.

The truth be told my Mustang was an incredibly tough car. I ragged the hell out that car for 6 years (I got it when I was 18) and the car still runs problem free with over 100,000 miles. I know because one of my friends bought it. Maybe mine was the exception rather than the rule. Anyway I hate to be defensive. I just thought it was ironic that you mentioned blind faith. I try to base my decisions and opinions on my experiences.

Sleeper_RENAMED

One more thing. Why think me American? I Japanese living in San Diego. j/k

Sleeper_RENAMED

One more one more thing. The driver is definately a primary variable in determining the outcome of a street race. However, the original question was refering to cars not drivers.

Atomix

GT auto takes any stock TL....or TL-S, simply put. If you want to talk about major rape....Think GM F-Body . For $28K you can be sitting in a Chevy Camaro SS, powered by a very close relative of the Corvette engine. That's the best price/performance deal out there right now, and it has a 6-speed manual, right now . Think of it as the closest thing we'll see to the muscle car era for quite some time.

Mr Hyde

Right now is true, but not for long. GM in their infinite wisdom has decided to discontinue the Camaro/Firebird, and I for one find that decision quite saddening as an automotive enthusiast; regardless of whether or not I would ever purchase one.

pjonkheer1

I have heard this as well. I for one would also be saddened if this ever happened. Would I ever buy a camaro/firebird? Probably not, but I am having a hard time believing this to be true. What does GM have to gain by discontinuing these two models? I can't think of anything. Maybe they let the rumor leak for promotional reasons. You never know what the marketing departments of these major companies are going to do. Anyone else??

Sleeper_RENAMED

Your right the LT1 Camaros came out in '93. They are (were) the best bang for the buck. I really think discontinuing the Camaro is a bad deal for consumers. One less car pushing the performance bar higher.

hunter001

GM is discontinuing the Camaro/Firebird twins for just 1 reason - Poor Sales. No car company can continue to sell a line of cars which lose money, and hope to stay in business for too long.

Incidentally, the sales of the Ford Mustang are way above (2 to 3 times more??) the combined sales of the Camaro/Firebird twins.

BB16

are buyin up all the Mustangs. 8 outta 10 I see on the road driven by female types. It's a hormonal thang. Gotta be blonde, with shades, a cell phone, and a daddy bought maid so your dorm room don't get messy. Dudes look weird in stangs...IMHO.

02 WDP/Ebony TL-S

thephantom

I agree. Stangs have become more of a chick car than a performance car. Not saying that the power isn't there but the image has changed.

Robbdogg

There is a God! I have not found a camaro/firebird remotely appealing since I was like 10.

seotaiji

At least I raced with my TLS and Mustang GT about 3 weeks ago, that was when I almost got a speed ticket.. of course I did beat him and police caught me when I beat him. Makes me such horrible day.. This guy looks young about 22 years old and I'm 23, and he makes that big sounds against my car.. I let him go first and I passed him at near 50mph... after 70 mph, i saw a police on my back.. that was worst case of driving.. policer officer came to me and I was going 60 to 70mph... and I asked him what about Mustang GT?? then he gave me a ticket of "Avoiding Highway Sign (in 35Mph road)," and told me that there is no points.. At least I'm happy... but losing my $60.00 dollars to DMV. Anyway Mustang GT 2002 driver was terrible.. if he was infront of me I would avoid ticket.
My friend droves Saleen Mustang 2000, such a nice car 19inch rim.. 4 seconds 60mph.. he got it for $50K, I 've driven it and it has one of the loudest sound on the engine.. and he has 410hp.. The car rock solid bottom line.. He wanted Corvette but Saleen Mustang is very few in US.

balbi

Hey before you attempt to race a mustang know how to tell a v6-from the v8.

Forget about badges and pay attention to the exhaust pipes. GT has dual exhaust vrs single for the 6.

A 4.6 LITER V-8 will beat you, an SVT, Cobra, Saleen, or Roush will kill you.

Nitro-C5

Why isn't there a kill section on this forum? This would be the perfect place for it.

Before you start bashing me (a new guy) let me just say that I absolutely love my TL-S and I've found that a majority of the people on this board are very knowledgable. With that said why are any of you trying to draw comparisons with Mustangs, Camaros, Firebirds and Corvettes? These cars are in a totally different class (not better different).

First of all there are VERY FEW stock muscles cars on the road today...VERY FEW, so all these numbers you guys are quoteing you can already through them out the window. If you pull even a modified TL-S up to the line against any of these car, in realistic real world situations you will probably lose 99% of the time. Enjoy the car for what it is, a fantastic BANG for you BUCK luxury car that has a good deal of umpuf...

One more thing when you mention that these cars are around $20,000, you fail to mention that if they took the cost difference bettween our cars (about $10,000) and put this in upgrades (which most of them do anyway) they would certainly embarass a TL-S.

1SICKLEX

And they can now build more dinasaurs , I meant SUV's........

GM will certainly bring the Camero/Firebird back, design them to be ugly, make them FWD and stuff that good ol 3.0 liter v-6 good for 200hp.....Just like the

Wimpala i meant Impala
Monte Carlo
Lumina

Chevy purists are not amused and I think it is horrific taking names of legendary cars and putting them on ugly BS.

TUFF GONG

I agree on this one. There's a commercial out for the Chevy Impala right now in which the customers reminiscing his dads old Impala to the new Chevy Celebrity/Lumina whatever POS. WTF They got to be kidding me. The desperation to use the name to hype the 2002 "Impala" is more than obvious. Pretty pathetic really. IMO.

typeR

hey nitroC5...when talking classes most of us that look for runs ,dont so much look for cars in our category i.e. infinity i 35 or lexus es300,but rather of similar speed...though some cars on paper may appear faster. my experince has been ...either many under estimate our car... or most of these "on paper" cars drivers dont race very well...and in the case of 99+ mustang GT's ,honestly ,though i cant say the two i've had races with were sticks or auto, the room for error is greatest with a stick...my oppinion is lightly modded gt's 99+ v. moderatly modded type S will be close and mostly up to the driver...the reason's we like this car are two:
1. they offer one of the best challenges...
2. most GT owners go in thinking they'll anhilate us...when at best they just eek one out still providing (atleast me) MUCH satisfaction...

balbi

Hey Nitro Chill. By no means was I trying to bash you rather I was giving you helpful information.

I have been reading several threads here and I am amaized at the lack of knowledge when it come to other automobiles outside the Acura family.

Often times also when you guys are thinking you are racing someone that is not always the case.

your cars are nice, but don't confuse them with muscle cars,
but then again when you are 18 you think you know everything, like the guy who " thinks " he raced a Diablo.

Please like a Diblo would be interested and what kind of race would that be?? don't you agree??

One thing is obvious, people like their cars and tend to dismiss the ones they encounter as overpriced, ugly, cheaper, slower, etc etc.

typeR

nitro chill???sure you dont mean me ??? his post didnt seem too flame any one or thing...just that he under estimates his type S...guess he's been driving that vette on the bottle too much

Nitro-C5

Nitro Chill? Had me a little confused on that one. I don't recall bashing any car manufacutrers or individuals?!?

My point of the post was once again to help any import car owners to understand that when you pull up next to a traditional American muscle car ie. Mustang, Camaro and Firebird that 9 times out of 10 that these cars are not stock, so the "paper numbers" from the manufacturers and Road and Track mean nothing on the street. Right now a "heavily modified" TL-S will put out about 310-340 hp on the motor. A heavily modified muscle car will put out any where from 425 hp and up. Given they are rear wheel drive and lighter, the race would'nt be close.

Now... Will these car be worth more afterwards? NO! Will they ride better? NO! Will they have more maintence issues? YES! Can you comforatably car passangers? NO! Are they built as well? NO! Will they beat a TL-S from a street start to 60 and in the 1/4 mile? YES, almost everytime!

I love racing, all types, but especially on the roads. Will our cars beat most cars on the road? Yes, but will we consistantly beat traditional muscle cars? Not likely, and unfortunately we will never beat a Vette or Viper :p

bricot

Yep, I got rid of my '88 GT for this car, it was a hell of a lot faster.
I had it rebuilt with TRW pistons, roller rockers, Dart2 heads, underdrive pulleys, mass air kit, 3.73 rear end, police E-Prom, flow master exhaust, etc.

Sounds like we had a lot of the same stuff, I miss that power!
but I like the this ride as well.

I also agree with the change in body style they are a chick car, I suppose it did what Ford wanted and sold a bunch, but it lost a lot of muscle car fans.

Yet another car manufacture ruining a good name

TUFF GONG

Wow....I thought I was the only one getting a TL-S from a Mustang I still have my Mustang and will never get rid of it, too much money spent and too much fun to drive.

I have a '88 5.0 LX with, no resonator, K&N, Mass Air flow conversion, SVO headers, Bassani high-flow cat X-pipe, dynomax 2 1/2" cat back, 3:73 rear, koni adjustables, eibach, Megabyte JR rear control arms, polyurethane this and that, Kenny Brown extreme subframe connectors, underdrive pulleys, aluminum driveshaft, brace this and that, SVO HD radiator, MSD 6AL and a MSD timing retard module for the funnest item in the car....my N2O systems 75-125HP nitrous kit. (HP depends on the jets , plugs, etc.)
I still hop in for a blast now and then, just glad it's not my daily driver anymore.
A completely different car, can't be compared to no TL-S.

I don't really have any creaks and rattles in my TL-S but if and when they start, my remedy is to jump into the Stang. Better known as my FlexiFlyer

On the other hand, the new Mustangs don't appeal to me, gained weight and lost the small block Ahh well...

Closer

Is it just me???
Seems like the only mustangs I see at the track run either
13's or 15's. I have never seen a mustang run in the 14's.
Weird huh?

bricot

Road Trip! I need a fix

systek

at least until u hit 5k rpm....mmmmmmmmmm what a surge