deandorsey

filled up with 100 octane today. cost $60 to fill it, i think it was worth it. i would say a 15-20% sotp increase, and the engine sounds awsome too!

SergeTL02

Hey..where do you get 100 octaine??

Bitium

some gas stations offer 100 or more octane. An airport has octane well over 100 for air planes. Find an small airport and if they have a pump

SergeTL02

LOL... Jet fuel for the TLS .. Makes perfect sence to me.

Bitium

All you need is some wings.

iatacs19

Citgo has it, they call it racing fuel. i think it should clean the engine rather well. =)

RUF87

Be careful using aircraft fuel!

It's been a number of years since I delt with it. But aircraft fuel is has a different rule for measuring octane. And some of the additives may be harmful to some car's injectors and or seals.

Please have someone who is more up to date on this check it out for you.

As for me, there used to be a place called SuperFuels in the Dallas area, but with the decline in the number of American Muscle cars on the streets they've left too I think. But when I would tank up with their "leaded" 105 octane in my 64 SS, I could advance my timing to take full advantage of my V8s power. And it would easily pull an extra 600RPM without banging out. 7800RPM in a V8 boys, and the sound that a V8 makes at that RPM is way, how do you younger guys say, phat or something like that.

RUF

daverman

100 octane aviation fuel is not Jet Fuel, it's avgas; it's known as 100LL (Low Lead) gas. Jet Fuel is closer to turpentine than gasoline.

Don't put avgas in your car! It's leaded, and it'll destroy your catalytic converter.

Fiddler

I believe racetracks/dragstrips also provide 100+ octane

RAdams

Interesting that you felt a power increase. Honda's PGM-FI system is incapable of "detecting" fuel with a higher octane rating. The only way you'd be able to take advantage of the additional octane is to advance the ignition timing which, again, the ECU will not do because of the fuel you use. It can, however, detect detonation through the knock sensor which usually results from using fuel with too low of an octane rating.

Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong here.

tgif

We had it in S. Cal. it is 105 octane available in 76. It cost $4.98/gallon

2001TL4KCdude

You do not need anything higher than a 91 Octane.

VTEC Animal

Yup, you're right dude.... anything beyond 91 octane is a waste of money... Some places like parts of CA sell 92 instead of 91 but they've been switching down to 91, costs went down a little, my performance didn't.

moomaster_99

The manual says to use AT LEAST 91....anytime you have a high compression level...like the TYPE-S..10.5:1
Higher octane will produce benefits.

RAdams

The manual says AT LEAST 91 because you CAN use anything higher. If it said use 91 period, I'd be SOL since all the stations around here sell 87, 89 or 93.

thaitea

Weren't there a discussion on fuel octane that says if you are putting higher octane than what is recommended then you're just burning money? Higher octane don't mean higher performance.

I found this on autopia.com...check it out:

Many people believe that “premium” gas is the best gas. Not true. Premium simply means “premium price” for higher octane. Octane is a simple measurement for a gasoline’s ability to resist engine knock, a rattling or pinging sound that results from premature ignition of the compressed fuel-air mixture in one or more cylinders.

Most gas stations offer three octane grades: regular (usually 87 octane), mid-grade (usually 89 octane) and premium (usually 92 or 93). The ratings must be posted on bright yellow stickers on each gasoline pump. The misnomer about octane is that the higher the rating, the better or more smoothly your car will run. In fact, premium gas can be bad for your engine if it was not designed to run at a high-octane level.

Although it may seem that the term “premium” or “high octane” implies that more energy is available, premium gas does not produce more energy than regular or mid-grade fuel. The octane grades are designed to accommodate engines with different compression ratios. High compression engines, found in most performance cars, require a fuel that burns efficiently at a higher temperature. That’s what premium fuel does, it burns hot under high compression. In a normal engine, premium fuel does not burn completely, resulting in excess carbon build-up and carbon fouling of the spark plugs. The end result is a less efficient engine that requires tune-ups more frequently. Oh, yeah, did I mention it also wastes money?

The only time you might need to switch to a higher octane fuel is if your car engine knocks when you use the recommended fuel. This happens to a small percentage of cars. Check your owner’s manual to determine the right octane level for your car. Regular octane is recommended for most cars. However, some cars with high compression engines, like sports cars and certain luxury cars, need mid-grade or premium gasoline to prevent knock.

FTM-1

ACURA sent me a E-mail last week that said.
ACURA Tech Tip your TL is designed to run on 91 octane anything higher is wasting money. Now the owners manual says use 91 octane or higher. So the stations I go to sell 93 Octane & thats what I get This is most common type of premium fuel that you will find. Most station have 87 Octane REGULAR , MID GRADE at 89+ Octane then it jumps to 93 Octane PREMIUM.Some have lower than 93 but not many. Sunoco sells 94 Octane as its Premium. So your just wasting money buying anything higher.

iatacs19

it all makes sense about wasting money etc, but the fact is that there is no octane 91. so you have to get 93 like it or not since 89 won't be enough.

Hey Casey

You obviously haven't been around these parts since most of the stations around here offer 91.

iatacs19

i have never seen 91 in the southeast. i have seen 94 when i was in college in upstate NY. well, if 91 were available then it would make sense to get 91 instead of 93 or 94.

2001TL4KCdude

Dude, Fill 1/2 your tank with 89 and 1/2 with 93
(89+93)/2 = 91 Octane
I use to do that before they had 91 in Southern Kansas

FTM-1

Here in the Mid Atlanic or Northeast most stations have 93octane. I am not sure but some stations have lower Premium than 93. It might be Shell & Exxon ,Amoco has 93 Sunoco has 94. Here in town Premium gas is $2.00 & over. I don't get it here I get it about 70 miles away in Souhthen MD. $1.49.

MahaRaja

I never knew that

fahoumh

Shell has 91 octane....it's that Optimax Gold stuff

thaitea

91, 92, 93 octane. Big deal...very little difference and little difference in price. But why would you go out of your way to put 100+ octane at over 4 bucks a gallon if it doesn't do anything for your car. It's all in your head i tell ya! I pay 1.39 for premium 92 octane. There's no way I'm paying 4 bucks when it doesn't do anything.

Bitium

It turns out that heptane handles compression very poorly. Compress it just a little and it ignites spontaneously. Octane handles compression very well - you can compress it a lot and nothing happens. 87 octane gasoline is gasoline that contains 87% octane and 13% heptane (or some other combination of fuels that has the same performance of the 87/13 combination of octane/heptane). It spontaneously ignites at a given compression level, and can only be used in engines that do not exceed that compression ratio.

For more info in ocatane here you go:

http://www.acura-tl.com/forum/showth...ghlight=octane

RUF87

A couple of things that I noticed that haven't been addressed are:

1) Where you live makes a difference on what octane is needed. Elevation is a key factor. The higher the elevation the lower the octane needs to be.

2) With time engines tend to get carbon and or other type of build up on their valves and pistons. This can increase the compression ratio, depending on how much of course.


Also, if I understand the ECM funtion correctly, then using a higher octane may have a benefit for those who rev their engines up on a regular basis. Again this is assuming that I understood that the ECM optimized the "tuning" of the engine based on several factors including octane rating.

Since there is has been no testing of 91 verses 93 over a period of time, we may never have proof. But I will use 93, or the highest available due to the way I drive my car. Because in my case, lower octane will mean less performance. Why, 89 octane will cause the ECM to lower the "tuning" to compensated for the lower octane and I don't want that.

That said, I'm sure there is some point at which the ECM will no longer compensate for a higher octane. And what that is I don't know, but it will be different depending on where you live.

RUF

typeR

your close....ecm/pcm...ive heard that the only gains from an V-afc
is to lean out the mix at the top makes me wonder if the computer isnt leaning out the mix with the higher octane hense improved performance...i'll make you all a deal if you havent tried 100 dont say it doesnt work ...but if you have then tell us what you think

Bitium

I haven't try 100 in my TL, but I know it does not work so no need to try it. Happy.

daverman

I doubt it. Remember that it's the compression ratio that matters, not the absolute pressure. You can always lean out the gasoline mix to compensate for the lower air pressure.
When this happens, it's time to get a fuel system cleaner in your tank.
Sure there has In some parts of the US, gas stations sell 93 octane exclusively, while in other parts only 91 octane is sold. If the difference in performance is all that significant, all those 0-60 figures and fuel economy ratings that you find in auto magazines will mention the octane that they used to test. The fact that auto magazines neglect octane ratings in their test reports leads me to think that its effect is negligible.

This is turning into one of those "I wish it were true, so it must be true" arguments that keep people buying Slick 50 oil additives. Using a higher octane gasoline than the engine is optimized for does not improve performance. But if you want to drain your wallet into your fuel tank, well... it's your money

RUF87

Sorry, I disagree with that in part. While you can rejet your carb or retune your air/fuel, the altitude still makes a difference. Otherwise why do they sell gas that is 2-3 points less if all you have to do is rejet?

Perhaps someone who's been a drag racer in Colorado or so can help us out here.

RUF

daverman

Yes, the altitude makes a difference, and the way to compensate for it is to lean the mixture. That way, the fuel/air ratio will be maintained even when the air is less dense. Your engine will always lose power the higher you go (actually, what matters is your pressure altitude, that is your air pressure corrected for temperature). Octane ratings do not enter into the equation as the gas vapor is still compressed by the same ratio.

I assume that different gas manufacturers sell different octane gases at the premium end because it is more economical for them, or because they think that they are appealing to a particular consumer. It doesn't matter, since probably all modern car makers optimize their "premium" engines for 91 octane gas.

dougbert

I live in Denver and I can tell you that the altitude and temperature makes a huge difference!... When I got my car back in March, I was getting about 24mpg (and babying it a little); but then I started stomping on the gas more and my mpg went down to 22mpg. When the temperature went from the low 80's to the high 90's my performance went way downhill and my mpg dropped into the 18-19mpg range (and I was still driving the same way I always drive). Now that it's cooled off somewhat, I'm back up to 23-24mpg again.

Just my two cents/half a tidbit/bit of nonsense/whatever

RUF87

Daverman,

I'm not debating the point on compensating for "pressure".

And yes, as far as I know octane does come into the equation. Next time you are in Colorado take a close look at the octane ratings that they have there verses say Dallas. In Dallas you get 87, 89, and 93. In Denver you 85, 87 and 90. I was just in Colorado Springs and had my 4-Runner there. I usually run 89 in Dallas, but in Denver I ran 87 because you don't need as high of an octane at higher altitudes. That's what I remember anyway.

It has nothing to do with what octane sells the best. It has to do with what the consumers vehicles require to run properly. If anything, since you are in the mountains you are going up some real hills. Since climbing mountains puts more load on the engine where it is more susceptible to pre-detonation. and the cure for that is higher not lower octane. So why would they sell a lower octane where it is most likely to be needed?

Again, I do think it has a bearing, but I would like to hear from a mechanic or racer in a high altitude setting.

RUF