RL vs. E
06-02-2008, 01:27 PM
#1
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RL vs. E
Rarely post here but got a guy who looked at the RL... even drove the thing. Basically he said the car didn't do it for him... seemed slow off the line and sluggish speeding up. He loved the technology and the way the car looked and felt inside but he said the car did it but it didn't do it for him. He knows about the great price of the car but still probably won't buy. I thought it was interesting to hear it from someone else.
06-02-2008, 02:09 PM
#3
Originally Posted by lumpulus
The car is fantastic off the line and it "speeds up" nicely.
There was somehting wrong with the RL, or he was just letting you down easy.
There was somehting wrong with the RL, or he was just letting you down easy.
06-05-2008, 09:27 AM
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Originally Posted by lumpulus
The car is fantastic off the line and it "speeds up" nicely.
There was somehting wrong with the RL, or he was just letting you down easy.
There was somehting wrong with the RL, or he was just letting you down easy.
06-05-2008, 09:42 AM
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Originally Posted by fstshrk
No it does not. I have an 08 RL that I purchased 7 months ago. I think the transmission is simply unbearable when compared to the any of the automatics in the BMW and Mercedes line.
https://acurazine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=5692
The car is powerful enough for sure, I think the main fault lies with the automatic tranny.
The RL is fine when driven pedal to the metal, but the part throttle applications are where it fails when compared to some of the other cars in its class.
I still like mine, but the tranny lets this car down.
06-05-2008, 10:04 AM
#6
Go Big Blue!
I'll weigh in here too.
I agree the AT and how/when it shifts is most of the problem for most of the people.
As far as the customer saying it's sluggish, well that's one persons opinion. Looking at the numbers you'd have to conclude it's got more power than most in the 6cyl sedan class (including the E).
I agree the AT and how/when it shifts is most of the problem for most of the people.
As far as the customer saying it's sluggish, well that's one persons opinion. Looking at the numbers you'd have to conclude it's got more power than most in the 6cyl sedan class (including the E).
06-05-2008, 12:26 PM
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Yeah the AT isn't that great compared to other similar cars.
I personally don't find my RL to be sluggish but then again, I don't need super incredible acceleration in my daily driving seeing as premium gas costs $1.40 per litre here and the RL is a guzzler. I have yet to be in ANY situation where the acceleration of the RL was an issue and prevented me from doing something I needed to do like change lanes, merge, etc.
I personally don't find my RL to be sluggish but then again, I don't need super incredible acceleration in my daily driving seeing as premium gas costs $1.40 per litre here and the RL is a guzzler. I have yet to be in ANY situation where the acceleration of the RL was an issue and prevented me from doing something I needed to do like change lanes, merge, etc.
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06-05-2008, 12:41 PM
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Originally Posted by SpicyMikey
I'll weigh in here too.
I agree the AT and how/when it shifts is most of the problem for most of the people.
As far as the customer saying it's sluggish, well that's one persons opinion. Looking at the numbers you'd have to conclude it's got more power than most in the 6cyl sedan class (including the E).
I agree the AT and how/when it shifts is most of the problem for most of the people.
As far as the customer saying it's sluggish, well that's one persons opinion. Looking at the numbers you'd have to conclude it's got more power than most in the 6cyl sedan class (including the E).
06-05-2008, 01:26 PM
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I don't think the transmission is at fault as much as Honda (whoa, wait, lemme finish), remember this car is geared towards the less sporty people...so it's to be as smooth as possible...now the fact that it doesn't auto-downshift could be a reason that they want it to stay absolutely smooth, and in fact, knowing the RL, depending on the speed you take the curve, it may downshift and you may not noticed.
I have noticed in the TL that it will downshift from fifth to fourth on some curves depending on my speed, the thing is, that downshift is very hard to notice due to the fact that it doesn't make much difference at the speed i'm going. So it just may not be downshifting enough...
Again, i think it's more of the way Honda geared it to who they thought it would cater too.
I have noticed in the TL that it will downshift from fifth to fourth on some curves depending on my speed, the thing is, that downshift is very hard to notice due to the fact that it doesn't make much difference at the speed i'm going. So it just may not be downshifting enough...
Again, i think it's more of the way Honda geared it to who they thought it would cater too.
06-05-2008, 02:01 PM
#10
Originally Posted by fstshrk
No it does not. I have an 08 RL that I purchased 7 months ago. I think the transmission is simply unbearable when compared to the any of the automatics in the BMW and Mercedes line.
I recently test drove the new Audi A5, it's manumatic mode felt more sluggish than the RL auto mode. There is always going to be preference between cars ultimately.
06-05-2008, 02:42 PM
#11
AcurAdmirer
Brownchaos has it right. The RL is not aggressively tuned or geared, and that's for a reason.
It isn't intended to be a "performance luxury" car like, say, an Infinti or BMW. It is designed to feel luxurious, smooth and classy, not boy-racer. As such, it doesn't have aggressive throttle tip-in, nor does it have abrupt downshifts.
But - if you want to get aggressive, it's just a matter of getting into the throttle more than usual. And if you do it often, the transmission will adapt to your driving style and adjust the shift points and even the throttle response after awhile.
Throttle tip-in is a huge factor in how snappy a car feels, and it's a simple matter of programming the DBW mapping to make it more responsive. But if Acura did that, the whole character of the car would change, and a large part of the audience wouldn't like it.
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It isn't intended to be a "performance luxury" car like, say, an Infinti or BMW. It is designed to feel luxurious, smooth and classy, not boy-racer. As such, it doesn't have aggressive throttle tip-in, nor does it have abrupt downshifts.
But - if you want to get aggressive, it's just a matter of getting into the throttle more than usual. And if you do it often, the transmission will adapt to your driving style and adjust the shift points and even the throttle response after awhile.
Throttle tip-in is a huge factor in how snappy a car feels, and it's a simple matter of programming the DBW mapping to make it more responsive. But if Acura did that, the whole character of the car would change, and a large part of the audience wouldn't like it.
.
.
06-05-2008, 05:22 PM
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On this I would disagree. After all, the SH-AWD was touted for its dry road capabilities and the improved handling it would deliver and completely different from the 04 RL. The RL is not intended to be an M5 but I think it is supposed to appeal to the tech savvy person who likes to think differently but get some fast driving in sometimes.
I think many believe the TL feels like it has more 'umph' off the line than the RL does. You'd think with a 3.5 vs. 3.2 it would be the opposite.
I think many believe the TL feels like it has more 'umph' off the line than the RL does. You'd think with a 3.5 vs. 3.2 it would be the opposite.
Originally Posted by Mike_TX
It isn't intended to be a "performance luxury" car like, say, an Infinti or BMW. It is designed to feel luxurious, smooth and classy, not boy-racer. As such, it doesn't have aggressive throttle tip-in, nor does it have abrupt downshifts...
06-05-2008, 06:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Mike_TX
Throttle tip-in is a huge factor in how snappy a car feels, and it's a simple matter of programming the DBW mapping to make it more responsive. But if Acura did that, the whole character of the car would change, and a large part of the audience wouldn't like it.
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06-05-2008, 07:05 PM
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I see. is that why they are only selling only a few hundred a month?
Maybe if they had made the rest of the car including the suspension and the tranny match the awesome SH-AWD, they would have sold a lot more.
Maybe if they had made the rest of the car including the suspension and the tranny match the awesome SH-AWD, they would have sold a lot more.
Originally Posted by Mike_TX
Brownchaos has it right. The RL is not aggressively tuned or geared, and that's for a reason.
It isn't intended to be a "performance luxury" car like, say, an Infinti or BMW. It is designed to feel luxurious, smooth and classy, not boy-racer. As such, it doesn't have aggressive throttle tip-in, nor does it have abrupt downshifts.
But - if you want to get aggressive, it's just a matter of getting into the throttle more than usual. And if you do it often, the transmission will adapt to your driving style and adjust the shift points and even the throttle response after awhile.
Throttle tip-in is a huge factor in how snappy a car feels, and it's a simple matter of programming the DBW mapping to make it more responsive. But if Acura did that, the whole character of the car would change, and a large part of the audience wouldn't like it.
.
.
It isn't intended to be a "performance luxury" car like, say, an Infinti or BMW. It is designed to feel luxurious, smooth and classy, not boy-racer. As such, it doesn't have aggressive throttle tip-in, nor does it have abrupt downshifts.
But - if you want to get aggressive, it's just a matter of getting into the throttle more than usual. And if you do it often, the transmission will adapt to your driving style and adjust the shift points and even the throttle response after awhile.
Throttle tip-in is a huge factor in how snappy a car feels, and it's a simple matter of programming the DBW mapping to make it more responsive. But if Acura did that, the whole character of the car would change, and a large part of the audience wouldn't like it.
.
.
06-05-2008, 07:33 PM
#15
Torch & Pitchfork Posse
Originally Posted by fstshrk
I see. is that why they are only selling only a few hundred a month?
Maybe if they had made the rest of the car including the suspension and the tranny match the awesome SH-AWD, they would have sold a lot more.
Maybe if they had made the rest of the car including the suspension and the tranny match the awesome SH-AWD, they would have sold a lot more.
Although some do prefer more agressive throttle tip in, aggressive tranny gearing and even higher gear numbers....that has not been the primary concensus as to why the slow sales.
Pricepoint, lack of V8, even rear seat has been much more popular claims than the tranny and even suspension. However, the paramount issue is likley brand prestige.
I would bet the majority owners of MB and BMW could care less about the tranny tuning or even know how many gears, torque or performance metrics the cars have (except for typical enthusiasts). They buy if for the medallion on the hood. Acura, and particularly the RL cannot play that game.
So yes, very few spend the time and energy to appreciate the RL for what it is, AND what it was intended to be.
You posts have an underlying disappointing tone directed to the RL. The quips, perhaps, are fueled by some disappointment that th RL is not the car YOU want. If you need to slam the car and brand, perhaps you can take a sledgehammer to YOUR car and get over it.
I for one am VERY happy with the RL as it is. I like the refined tranny without throttle tip in jerkiness, endless gear hunting or neck snapping shifts. If I wanted that with lesser fuel efficiency, I would have bought Infinity. If I wanted Japanese luxo, I would have bought Lexus. If I wanted prestige I would have paid more for BMW or MB. But I bought the RL because it represented the balance of multiple car attributes that appeal to me and not due to ONE performance critieria or presitige moniker. I may be in the minority, but IMHO, there is nothing wrong or lacking with this car that would have made me buy it and gripe about it after the fact.
Call me Goldylocks, but I think the RL is 'just right'.
06-05-2008, 08:34 PM
#16
Three Wheelin'
Originally Posted by TampaRL
The RL's mismatch to the flagship market has been discussed in depth here over the few years this gen is now weathered.
Although some do prefer more agressive throttle tip in, aggressive tranny gearing and even higher gear numbers....that has not been the primary concensus as to why the slow sales.
Pricepoint, lack of V8, even rear seat has been much more popular claims than the tranny and even suspension. However, the paramount issue is likley brand prestige.
I would bet the majority owners of MB and BMW could care less about the tranny tuning or even know how many gears, torque or performance metrics the cars have (except for typical enthusiasts). They buy if for the medallion on the hood. Acura, and particularly the RL cannot play that game.
So yes, very few spend the time and energy to appreciate the RL for what it is, AND what it was intended to be.
You posts have an underlying disappointing tone directed to the RL. The quips, perhaps, are fueled by some disappointment that th RL is not the car YOU want. If you need to slam the car and brand, perhaps you can take a sledgehammer to YOUR car and get over it.
I for one am VERY happy with the RL as it is. I like the refined tranny without throttle tip in jerkiness, endless gear hunting or neck snapping shifts. If I wanted that with lesser fuel efficiency, I would have bought Infinity. If I wanted Japanese luxo, I would have bought Lexus. If I wanted prestige I would have paid more for BMW or MB. But I bought the RL because it represented the balance of multiple car attributes that appeal to me and not due to ONE performance critieria or presitige moniker. I may be in the minority, but IMHO, there is nothing wrong or lacking with this car that would have made me buy it and gripe about it after the fact.
Call me Goldylocks, but I think the RL is 'just right'.
Although some do prefer more agressive throttle tip in, aggressive tranny gearing and even higher gear numbers....that has not been the primary concensus as to why the slow sales.
Pricepoint, lack of V8, even rear seat has been much more popular claims than the tranny and even suspension. However, the paramount issue is likley brand prestige.
I would bet the majority owners of MB and BMW could care less about the tranny tuning or even know how many gears, torque or performance metrics the cars have (except for typical enthusiasts). They buy if for the medallion on the hood. Acura, and particularly the RL cannot play that game.
So yes, very few spend the time and energy to appreciate the RL for what it is, AND what it was intended to be.
You posts have an underlying disappointing tone directed to the RL. The quips, perhaps, are fueled by some disappointment that th RL is not the car YOU want. If you need to slam the car and brand, perhaps you can take a sledgehammer to YOUR car and get over it.
I for one am VERY happy with the RL as it is. I like the refined tranny without throttle tip in jerkiness, endless gear hunting or neck snapping shifts. If I wanted that with lesser fuel efficiency, I would have bought Infinity. If I wanted Japanese luxo, I would have bought Lexus. If I wanted prestige I would have paid more for BMW or MB. But I bought the RL because it represented the balance of multiple car attributes that appeal to me and not due to ONE performance critieria or presitige moniker. I may be in the minority, but IMHO, there is nothing wrong or lacking with this car that would have made me buy it and gripe about it after the fact.
Call me Goldylocks, but I think the RL is 'just right'.
I could not have said it any better. I have not found a more perfect car then the RL. For me NOTHING else measure up. Because I do not like the looks of the new 09 I will be forced to compromise and find something else. My search has been nothing but disappointment.
06-05-2008, 08:53 PM
#17
Originally Posted by dwest1023
I could not have said it any better. I have not found a more perfect car then the RL. For me NOTHING else measure up. Because I do not like the looks of the new 09 I will be forced to compromise and find something else. My search has been nothing but disappointment.
06-05-2008, 08:55 PM
#18
Originally Posted by TampaRL
The RL's mismatch to the flagship market has been discussed in depth here over the few years this gen is now weathered.
Although some do prefer more agressive throttle tip in, aggressive tranny gearing and even higher gear numbers....that has not been the primary concensus as to why the slow sales.
Pricepoint, lack of V8, even rear seat has been much more popular claims than the tranny and even suspension. However, the paramount issue is likley brand prestige.
I would bet the majority owners of MB and BMW could care less about the tranny tuning or even know how many gears, torque or performance metrics the cars have (except for typical enthusiasts). They buy if for the medallion on the hood. Acura, and particularly the RL cannot play that game.
So yes, very few spend the time and energy to appreciate the RL for what it is, AND what it was intended to be.
You posts have an underlying disappointing tone directed to the RL. The quips, perhaps, are fueled by some disappointment that th RL is not the car YOU want. If you need to slam the car and brand, perhaps you can take a sledgehammer to YOUR car and get over it.
I for one am VERY happy with the RL as it is. I like the refined tranny without throttle tip in jerkiness, endless gear hunting or neck snapping shifts. If I wanted that with lesser fuel efficiency, I would have bought Infinity. If I wanted Japanese luxo, I would have bought Lexus. If I wanted prestige I would have paid more for BMW or MB. But I bought the RL because it represented the balance of multiple car attributes that appeal to me and not due to ONE performance critieria or presitige moniker. I may be in the minority, but IMHO, there is nothing wrong or lacking with this car that would have made me buy it and gripe about it after the fact.
Call me Goldylocks, but I think the RL is 'just right'.
Although some do prefer more agressive throttle tip in, aggressive tranny gearing and even higher gear numbers....that has not been the primary concensus as to why the slow sales.
Pricepoint, lack of V8, even rear seat has been much more popular claims than the tranny and even suspension. However, the paramount issue is likley brand prestige.
I would bet the majority owners of MB and BMW could care less about the tranny tuning or even know how many gears, torque or performance metrics the cars have (except for typical enthusiasts). They buy if for the medallion on the hood. Acura, and particularly the RL cannot play that game.
So yes, very few spend the time and energy to appreciate the RL for what it is, AND what it was intended to be.
You posts have an underlying disappointing tone directed to the RL. The quips, perhaps, are fueled by some disappointment that th RL is not the car YOU want. If you need to slam the car and brand, perhaps you can take a sledgehammer to YOUR car and get over it.
I for one am VERY happy with the RL as it is. I like the refined tranny without throttle tip in jerkiness, endless gear hunting or neck snapping shifts. If I wanted that with lesser fuel efficiency, I would have bought Infinity. If I wanted Japanese luxo, I would have bought Lexus. If I wanted prestige I would have paid more for BMW or MB. But I bought the RL because it represented the balance of multiple car attributes that appeal to me and not due to ONE performance critieria or presitige moniker. I may be in the minority, but IMHO, there is nothing wrong or lacking with this car that would have made me buy it and gripe about it after the fact.
Call me Goldylocks, but I think the RL is 'just right'.
06-05-2008, 09:39 PM
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I believe, in this country, I am still entitled to my opinion and so are you.
I still like my RL. I look at it as an 85% car. Acura could have done so much more to make it better but they basically stopped at 85%.
I am glad you like the car.
I still like my RL. I look at it as an 85% car. Acura could have done so much more to make it better but they basically stopped at 85%.
I am glad you like the car.
Originally Posted by TampaRL
The RL's mismatch to the flagship market has been discussed in depth here over the few years this gen is now weathered.
Although some do prefer more agressive throttle tip in, aggressive tranny gearing and even higher gear numbers....that has not been the primary concensus as to why the slow sales.
Pricepoint, lack of V8, even rear seat has been much more popular claims than the tranny and even suspension. However, the paramount issue is likley brand prestige.
I would bet the majority owners of MB and BMW could care less about the tranny tuning or even know how many gears, torque or performance metrics the cars have (except for typical enthusiasts). They buy if for the medallion on the hood. Acura, and particularly the RL cannot play that game.
So yes, very few spend the time and energy to appreciate the RL for what it is, AND what it was intended to be.
You posts have an underlying disappointing tone directed to the RL. The quips, perhaps, are fueled by some disappointment that th RL is not the car YOU want. If you need to slam the car and brand, perhaps you can take a sledgehammer to YOUR car and get over it.
I for one am VERY happy with the RL as it is. I like the refined tranny without throttle tip in jerkiness, endless gear hunting or neck snapping shifts. If I wanted that with lesser fuel efficiency, I would have bought Infinity. If I wanted Japanese luxo, I would have bought Lexus. If I wanted prestige I would have paid more for BMW or MB. But I bought the RL because it represented the balance of multiple car attributes that appeal to me and not due to ONE performance critieria or presitige moniker. I may be in the minority, but IMHO, there is nothing wrong or lacking with this car that would have made me buy it and gripe about it after the fact.
Call me Goldylocks, but I think the RL is 'just right'.
Although some do prefer more agressive throttle tip in, aggressive tranny gearing and even higher gear numbers....that has not been the primary concensus as to why the slow sales.
Pricepoint, lack of V8, even rear seat has been much more popular claims than the tranny and even suspension. However, the paramount issue is likley brand prestige.
I would bet the majority owners of MB and BMW could care less about the tranny tuning or even know how many gears, torque or performance metrics the cars have (except for typical enthusiasts). They buy if for the medallion on the hood. Acura, and particularly the RL cannot play that game.
So yes, very few spend the time and energy to appreciate the RL for what it is, AND what it was intended to be.
You posts have an underlying disappointing tone directed to the RL. The quips, perhaps, are fueled by some disappointment that th RL is not the car YOU want. If you need to slam the car and brand, perhaps you can take a sledgehammer to YOUR car and get over it.
I for one am VERY happy with the RL as it is. I like the refined tranny without throttle tip in jerkiness, endless gear hunting or neck snapping shifts. If I wanted that with lesser fuel efficiency, I would have bought Infinity. If I wanted Japanese luxo, I would have bought Lexus. If I wanted prestige I would have paid more for BMW or MB. But I bought the RL because it represented the balance of multiple car attributes that appeal to me and not due to ONE performance critieria or presitige moniker. I may be in the minority, but IMHO, there is nothing wrong or lacking with this car that would have made me buy it and gripe about it after the fact.
Call me Goldylocks, but I think the RL is 'just right'.
06-05-2008, 10:15 PM
#20
Originally Posted by fstshrk
I believe, in this country, I am still entitled to my opinion and so are you.
I still like my RL. I look at it as an 85% car. Acura could have done so much more to make it better but they basically stopped at 85%.
I am glad you like the car.
I still like my RL. I look at it as an 85% car. Acura could have done so much more to make it better but they basically stopped at 85%.
I am glad you like the car.
06-05-2008, 10:33 PM
#21
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Very simple. I did not want to drive the car as I would normally drive it with a car that had less than 100 miles on the clock.
Also, the dealer is located in a part of town where all the roads are flat. For some reason they don't put the car dealers on nice mountain pass roads
Also, the dealer is located in a part of town where all the roads are flat. For some reason they don't put the car dealers on nice mountain pass roads
Originally Posted by DoctorTuna
Everyone is entitled to opinion, I'll stop beating up on yours. But seriously, the transmission is such an integral, core part of the driving experience, how did you come into the RL if it didn't meet your standards?? I read numerous posts about ways to improve upon the minor nuances of the RL, some I agree, some I don't. This is to be expected of any vehicle. But for me an unsatisfactory transmission would be a deal breaker on such an expensive asset, especially since you've taken the time to very specifically elaborate on what you prefer. Either way, I think my entitlement to opinion has been satisfied. I hope what you get out of the RL overshadows your perceived transmission shortcomings.
06-06-2008, 10:23 AM
#22
Senior Moderator
No need to argue about tranny issues, we know that the tranny is one of the few weak links in this car. We've had this discussion in the past.
MY tranny issue is the lack of a six-speed tranny. That would fix much of the issue that fstshrk describes. In addition, perhaps there should be a "Sport" button to push to engage a more aggressive shift pattern, ala Ferrari. I wonder how much the second fix would cost, though.
MY tranny issue is the lack of a six-speed tranny. That would fix much of the issue that fstshrk describes. In addition, perhaps there should be a "Sport" button to push to engage a more aggressive shift pattern, ala Ferrari. I wonder how much the second fix would cost, though.
06-06-2008, 11:49 AM
#23
Originally Posted by neuronbob
In addition, perhaps there should be a "Sport" button to push to engage a more aggressive shift pattern, ala Ferrari. I wonder how much the second fix would cost, though.
06-06-2008, 01:17 PM
#24
AcurAdmirer
Originally Posted by fstshrk
I see. is that why they are only selling only a few hundred a month?
Maybe if they had made the rest of the car including the suspension and the tranny match the awesome SH-AWD, they would have sold a lot more.
Maybe if they had made the rest of the car including the suspension and the tranny match the awesome SH-AWD, they would have sold a lot more.
YOU'D like it, but the target audience probably wouldn't.To put it in terms we can all understand, the RL is a Japanese Cadillac. That may hurt some people's feelings, but that's what it is. And theres nothing wrong with that. Take a well-mannered luxury sedan, make it a "better mousetrap" and it should sell well.
As we know (and have discussed to death), the reasons the RL isn't selling well have little to do with transmissions. But for those who can appreciate its qualities, it's a realy, really nice car.
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06-06-2008, 03:05 PM
#25
Originally Posted by db22
5 lines of code and a switch to change the address - $5.00/car. Many cars have a sport mode including a lot of Toyota's.
06-07-2008, 12:37 PM
#26
Proboscis-free zone
Interesting thread! I drove a 2007 TL loaner recently and was reminded of the delights of rapid throttle tip-in and aggressive gearing that caused me to fall in love with my former 2004 TL. That setup hauls serious butt even with a 5-speed AT, and gets 15-20% better mileage than the RL thanks to lighter weight and FWD. I do miss the sportiness and fuel economy of the TL, but not enough to switch back. The interior feels cramped, regardless of what Consumer Reports says.
I'm somewhere between fstshrk's 85% and Tampa's eloquent 100% defense of our sweet ride. I agree with Neuron that a "sport/economy" button would be great. However, judging from my experience with a Volvo 850 that had just that, I fear the button would stay firmly lodged in "sport" mode at the expense of better gas mileage.
Overall, I give the 2006 RL Tech a 90-95% and accept that getting to 100% would cost far more than I'm willing to pay.
Back to the original topic, I have not driven an E due to concerns about Chrysler quality. I do notice the stunning resemblance to the RL though!!
I also agree that the hideous 2009 RL is a non-starter. That dog won't hunt! Hoping for something much better in 2011.
I'm somewhere between fstshrk's 85% and Tampa's eloquent 100% defense of our sweet ride. I agree with Neuron that a "sport/economy" button would be great. However, judging from my experience with a Volvo 850 that had just that, I fear the button would stay firmly lodged in "sport" mode at the expense of better gas mileage.
Overall, I give the 2006 RL Tech a 90-95% and accept that getting to 100% would cost far more than I'm willing to pay.Back to the original topic, I have not driven an E due to concerns about Chrysler quality. I do notice the stunning resemblance to the RL though!!
I also agree that the hideous 2009 RL is a non-starter. That dog won't hunt! Hoping for something much better in 2011.
06-07-2008, 02:38 PM
#27
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FYI:
Latest J.D. Power Quality Study from the U.S.: Mercedes-Benz receives three awards for best product quality
Stuttgart - Mercedes-Benz is one of the most successful auto brands in this year’s customer survey conducted by U.S. market research institute J.D. Power. The Stuttgart car brand receives two gold awards for the highest vehicle quality in their respective market segments, and is also honoured for the world’s best production plant. This outstanding result is one outcome of the initiative launched by Mercedes-Benz to raise customer satisfaction and product quality.
In conducting the annual study, market researchers investigate the satisfaction of American customers with new vehicle purchases within the first 90 days, and evaluate the quality of both the concept and execution of the vehicle. Overall, Mercedes-Benz moved up one place against last year from fifth to fourth, and is the only vehicle brand with three models (CLK, E and S-Class) within the top ten passenger vehicles.
This year saw the E-Class and the CLK each receive gold J.D. Power Awards. According to the U.S. study, these models are the highest quality vehicles in their market segments. Furthermore, Mercedes’ Sindelfingen plant receives the Platinum Award, making it the assembly facility with the best delivered quality worldwide.
Latest J.D. Power Quality Study from the U.S.: Mercedes-Benz receives three awards for best product quality
Stuttgart - Mercedes-Benz is one of the most successful auto brands in this year’s customer survey conducted by U.S. market research institute J.D. Power. The Stuttgart car brand receives two gold awards for the highest vehicle quality in their respective market segments, and is also honoured for the world’s best production plant. This outstanding result is one outcome of the initiative launched by Mercedes-Benz to raise customer satisfaction and product quality.
In conducting the annual study, market researchers investigate the satisfaction of American customers with new vehicle purchases within the first 90 days, and evaluate the quality of both the concept and execution of the vehicle. Overall, Mercedes-Benz moved up one place against last year from fifth to fourth, and is the only vehicle brand with three models (CLK, E and S-Class) within the top ten passenger vehicles.
This year saw the E-Class and the CLK each receive gold J.D. Power Awards. According to the U.S. study, these models are the highest quality vehicles in their market segments. Furthermore, Mercedes’ Sindelfingen plant receives the Platinum Award, making it the assembly facility with the best delivered quality worldwide.
Originally Posted by VOdoc
Back to the original topic, I have not driven an E due to concerns about Chrysler quality. I do notice the stunning resemblance to the RL though!!
06-07-2008, 05:06 PM
#28
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Originally Posted by CL6
FYI:
Latest J.D. Power Quality Study from the U.S.: Mercedes-Benz receives three awards for best product quality
...
This year saw the E-Class and the CLK each receive gold J.D. Power Awards. According to the U.S. study, these models are the highest quality vehicles in their market segments. Furthermore, Mercedes’ Sindelfingen plant receives the Platinum Award, making it the assembly facility with the best delivered quality worldwide.
Latest J.D. Power Quality Study from the U.S.: Mercedes-Benz receives three awards for best product quality
...
This year saw the E-Class and the CLK each receive gold J.D. Power Awards. According to the U.S. study, these models are the highest quality vehicles in their market segments. Furthermore, Mercedes’ Sindelfingen plant receives the Platinum Award, making it the assembly facility with the best delivered quality worldwide.
Who knew? I stand corrected. Might there be a Benz in my future??
06-07-2008, 06:02 PM
#29
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Originally Posted by CL6
FYI:
Latest J.D. Power Quality Study from the U.S.: Mercedes-Benz receives three awards for best product quality
Stuttgart - Mercedes-Benz is one of the most successful auto brands in this year’s customer survey conducted by U.S. market research institute J.D. Power. The Stuttgart car brand receives two gold awards for the highest vehicle quality in their respective market segments, and is also honoured for the world’s best production plant. This outstanding result is one outcome of the initiative launched by Mercedes-Benz to raise customer satisfaction and product quality.
In conducting the annual study, market researchers investigate the satisfaction of American customers with new vehicle purchases within the first 90 days, and evaluate the quality of both the concept and execution of the vehicle. Overall, Mercedes-Benz moved up one place against last year from fifth to fourth, and is the only vehicle brand with three models (CLK, E and S-Class) within the top ten passenger vehicles.
This year saw the E-Class and the CLK each receive gold J.D. Power Awards. According to the U.S. study, these models are the highest quality vehicles in their market segments. Furthermore, Mercedes’ Sindelfingen plant receives the Platinum Award, making it the assembly facility with the best delivered quality worldwide.
Latest J.D. Power Quality Study from the U.S.: Mercedes-Benz receives three awards for best product quality
Stuttgart - Mercedes-Benz is one of the most successful auto brands in this year’s customer survey conducted by U.S. market research institute J.D. Power. The Stuttgart car brand receives two gold awards for the highest vehicle quality in their respective market segments, and is also honoured for the world’s best production plant. This outstanding result is one outcome of the initiative launched by Mercedes-Benz to raise customer satisfaction and product quality.
In conducting the annual study, market researchers investigate the satisfaction of American customers with new vehicle purchases within the first 90 days, and evaluate the quality of both the concept and execution of the vehicle. Overall, Mercedes-Benz moved up one place against last year from fifth to fourth, and is the only vehicle brand with three models (CLK, E and S-Class) within the top ten passenger vehicles.
This year saw the E-Class and the CLK each receive gold J.D. Power Awards. According to the U.S. study, these models are the highest quality vehicles in their market segments. Furthermore, Mercedes’ Sindelfingen plant receives the Platinum Award, making it the assembly facility with the best delivered quality worldwide.
C/P:
For the third consecutive year, Porsche topped the survey with an impressive 87 flaws per 100 vehicles, followed by Infiniti (98), Lexus (99), Mercedes-Benz (104) and Toyota (104).
Although luxury brands generally had the fewest flaws in the survey, mainstream cars and trucks from Ford and General Motors also scored well. Mercury came in sixth with 109 flaws per 100 vehicles, beating Honda. Ford, with 112 flaws per 100 vehicles, was ranked higher than Jaguar, Audi, Cadillac, Acura and BMW.
"As increasing technology and content go into these vehicles, they present challenges," said David Sargent, vice president of automotive research at J.D. Power. "So 6 percent is a good overall number that is in line with long-term trends."
Three-fourths of the 36 nameplates that participated in the annual survey improved in quality.
The bottom-ranked vehicles were Suzuki (152 problems per 100 vehicles), Saturn (157), Land Rover (161), Mini (163) and Jeep (167).
The survey is largely a measure of the quality of the components that go into a vehicle, as well as its assembly process.
This year's study was based on responses from 81,500 consumers.
Brands that fell below the average often had problems with the launches of new vehicles or with complex features in their vehicles.
Both Acura (119 flaws) and BMW (126 flaws) scored below average because of problems with high-tech electronic systems.
"Both have been leaders in developing and using new technology – BMW with i-Drive and Acura with voice recognition systems," Mr. Sargent said. "Both have had challenges with the technology."
06-07-2008, 06:46 PM
#30
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I know the transmission problems of the MDX didn't help Acura but this is still surprising as my CL has only needed its xenon ballast replaced... nothing else required. I wonder if an engine exploding is counted the same way a jammed CD player is.
06-08-2008, 04:05 PM
#31
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Originally Posted by AsianTL
Here is another report from J.D.Power Quality Study 3 years consecutive 06 to 08.
C/P:
For the third consecutive year, Porsche topped the survey with an impressive 87 flaws per 100 vehicles, followed by Infiniti (98), Lexus (99), Mercedes-Benz (104) and Toyota (104).
C/P:
For the third consecutive year, Porsche topped the survey with an impressive 87 flaws per 100 vehicles, followed by Infiniti (98), Lexus (99), Mercedes-Benz (104) and Toyota (104).
Read about it in an issue of Autoweek...
06-08-2008, 07:34 PM
#32
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I don't know about Porsche but MB suffered with Chrysler mainly because of the parts suppliers and everything got screwed up big time. Now that Chrysler was shed everything can be streamlined better. Also, when computers were introduced to design the cars the Germans weren't really up to snuff on the technology the way the Japanese were so that messed things up. MB may have hired people to help, they probably did, but they've been spending tons of cash to get quality up... and the Germans listened to the US complaints of their cars.
I would still rate the Acura higher (at least mine has been excellent) but eventually I think things will even out. The technology advantage the RL enjoys (it was groundbreaking when it came out) is not really there as much anymore so Acura will have to find other ways to sell their cars.
I would still rate the Acura higher (at least mine has been excellent) but eventually I think things will even out. The technology advantage the RL enjoys (it was groundbreaking when it came out) is not really there as much anymore so Acura will have to find other ways to sell their cars.
06-08-2008, 07:49 PM
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Originally Posted by CL6
I don't know about Porsche but MB suffered with Chrysler mainly because of the parts suppliers and everything got screwed up big time. Now that Chrysler was shed everything can be streamlined better. Also, when computers were introduced to design the cars the Germans weren't really up to snuff on the technology the way the Japanese were so that messed things up. MB may have hired people to help, they probably did, but they've been spending tons of cash to get quality up... and the Germans listened to the US complaints of their cars.
I would still rate the Acura higher (at least mine has been excellent) but eventually I think things will even out. The technology advantage the RL enjoys (it was groundbreaking when it came out) is not really there as much anymore so Acura will have to find other ways to sell their cars.
I would still rate the Acura higher (at least mine has been excellent) but eventually I think things will even out. The technology advantage the RL enjoys (it was groundbreaking when it came out) is not really there as much anymore so Acura will have to find other ways to sell their cars.
When I was in the market, I was comparing a new RL with a CPO E-class and it took me one day to decide to rule the E-class out, due to quality/reliability concerns.
06-08-2008, 09:37 PM
#34
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I agree I wouldn't buy a used E either. The GL runs up to 80k and just won SUV of the year again. The first ML was a POS. The current one is pretty good overall. MB also suffers more because of all the stuff they put in their cars from massaging seats to airmatic suspension. But you have to give them credit for having such a large product line-up. Acura's tiny number of products is bad mojo if you have to sell those cars for a living. MB really takes care of their salespeople (something Acura forgot how to do 2 years ago) and they do a great job retaining their leasing clients as well. They aren't the perfect car company but they were one of the very few who saw their sales increase last month over the previous year's May and they have Smart as well. Acura could never decide if they were sporty, luxury, or what. That's too bad. In 2004 they were a benchmark in technology and value. I think they lost it in 2006. At least, my paycheck lost it then.
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