I've noticed most people in the forums seem to compare the RL to the M35, GS, BMW 5 or MB-E.... but I don't see a lot of talk about the A6.

Although I would say I like the looks and interior of the A6 above all others.. I didn't even test drive one secondary to my brother-in-laws horror stories about his previous generation A6.

Did anyone seriously consider the A6...and if so, what made you decide against it? Guess I'm looking for some real world insight into the car... more than just the reviews in car magazines and online.

I just happened to see a used 2005 A6 on a lot today, and it has me curious. I'm considering a test drive just.

 

Here is the article about A6, 4.2.
http://www.caranddriver.com/comparis...m45-sport.html

 

This review did not compare RL vs A6.
I would take RL over A6.

 

I considered the A6 but quickly discounted it when I read of its higher than normal maintenance needs. None of the reviews I read spoke well of reliability.

 

Agreed. I also looked at and test drove the A6 but there are just too many Audi maintenance nightmares out there (including a few close friends) that caused it to drop out of contention. That, plus the cost difference for an equivalently loaded car.

 

Audi builds cars that feel good and drive very well.
However, I do not like their ergonomics and the German reliability is terrible, especially in this age of quality control and design.
I will not buy a German car until reliability becomes better than Jananese ( Acura and Lexus).

 

I agree with everyone on the board. I removed the A6 from consideration once I learned about their reliability issues.

 

My granddad has a 99 Audi A6 which is about at 100k. Its a very nice car and he had the extanted warranty for problems and stuff. It was the first car when I ever saw the auto shift feature. When I was a little boy he would let me shift he would say "up" and "down" I loved that car when I was little for that reason. He said hes had a few things go wrong but he said the warranty. So I think the A6 is a great car just get the warranty and let your 11 son or grandson shift it for you.

 

I agree the Audi interiors are awesome, everything seems perfectly positioned for the driver and passengers.

Actually the 05 and 06 Audi A6 rate higher than the RL in consumer reports. The RL is reccomended and the A6 is Highly reccomended. Both are good cars but there probably is a reason why the A6 was selected as World car of the year in 2005.

I like my friends RL. Its seems nice but i think in the end i would lean towards the A6. I would make sure and drive both if i was you and check out some Audi forums as well to get a well rounded view from both owners.

 

My wife and I test drove the 4.2L A6 when we were looking at the RL, GS 350 and others. It was very comfortable but visability was not as good and we felt the ability to "place" the car accurately on the road was not as good as the RL. It drove like a German car; we have owned Mercedes and BMW in the past - it is very direct and tight but it didn't seem to have the "personality" we were looking for in the way it drove. The reliability stories on the web also put us off although I have several friends with earlier A6s (2000-2004) who rave about it. In the end, we liked the RL better because it felt more comfortable to us and open and we liked the driving feel of the RL.

 

Acura, Infiniti etc are very nice, reliable and semi-fun cars.


I had a black Audi 4000 back in the 80's, then a new Legend, then a black 2000 A6 2.7t, now an Infiniti M35X.

Audi's are wonderful cars, when they are on the road! They are also very reliable. You can rely on the fact that:

- Your O2 sensors will be replaced every couple of years.
- You MAF sensors will be replaced in the years your O2 sensors aren't.
- Your transmission will have to be overhauled - twice.
- Your CEL will come on every 9 months or so.
- Your electric [INSERT ACCESORY NAME HERE] will break every 9 months or so.
- Your fuel system will need a new [SOMETHING] annually.

Very reliable

You can also rely on the fact that when she's running right, you car:

- Will make you smile every day
- Will be fun to drive the first, second and 1,000 th time you get behind the wheel
- Will carve up the roads with precision.

My Acura almost never was in the shop other than the 30, 60, 90, 120 and 150k service. It was very nice to drive. My Infiniti won't need much service. It too is very nice to drive.

Two very different animals. I'll keep my Japanese appliance, uhh - I mean car, for the next 10 years - then buy another black hot as hell Audi

SC

 

Do people really take Consumer Reports' reviews and surveys seriously? Does an appliance magazine really know about cars? And they send surveys only to their subscribers. Doesn't that make the sample kind of narrow?

 

I have had several Audis. My previous car was a 2003 A6 2.7t. Great car, with only one non-maintenance visit required in 54k miles (which was a broken control arm as a result of me driving the car so hard). I actually had a 2007 A6 4.2 at the dealer that I ordered the way I wanted it. When it came down to dollars and cents, the A6 was signficantly more expensive even before the $11k discount on the RL.

Looking back though, I should have gotten the A6. The RL is not me, and I really dislike it. I am currently considering working something up on the new A5 or S5.

The SH-AWD system sucks in comparison to quattro.

 

Consumer Reports has a large facility specifically for Car Reviews. They buy their cars anonymously and accept no advertsing for it's publications. The car facility is a massive operation and is nothing like the divisions that test toasters- for example.

Why do people place a great deal of credence with CR? Their reviewers aren't wined and dined by the automotive industry. They aren't given a car by the auto industry to buzz around in for unlimited time. CR reviewers publisher doesn't accept tens of thousands of dollars each month for advertising.

Have you ever been suspect about a glowing article written about a BMW and there's a $50K fold out ad on the exact car next to it? Can you say collusion? Road & Track and Car & Driver magazine car reviewers aren't necessarily all corrupted, but it's easy to see how they could be.

CR gets feedback by it's readership on reliability. They do what I do and everyone should do - ask friends, neighbors, co-workers, a stranger on the street- how do you like the car? Any service issues? How long have you had it?

Hey someone, help me down off my high horse- I'm starting to sound a bit too preachy.

 

The quattro can't even vector torque between either wheel on an axle. In fact Audi is hoping to make torque vectoring available on the next generation of quattro - in other words, their playing catch up to Acura.

To be perfectly honest, "quattro" is an absolute bunch of marketing bullshit that Audi is riding on. There are plenty of AWD systems out there such as Nissan/Infiniti's ATTESA system, Mitsubishi's AWD system, and of course Honda/Acura's SH-AWd system that beat the pants of "quattro".

 

The A6 popped on and off the list. My mother-in-law once had an Audi, which was not reliable (I'm told). So my wife kept Audi off the list for the most part.

A good friend of mine has a 2000 A6, and it is very nice car with no maintenance issues. It is plenty roomy, well appointed, and stylish. It was expensive: right around $40K in 2000.

When I was car shopping there were some lightly used 2005 A6s at a partner dealership. I like looking at used cars to see how well they'll hold up. These 2 didn't look so good, with loose trim pieces around the center console, and an interior design that was not as nice as my friend's 2000 A6.

I will say that A6's do look good on the road, and their styling holds up pretty well. Their interiors are nice, and they make good use of their interior space (probably better than the RL).

In the end, I'm happy with the RL. It offered many things I wanted that weren't on the A6.

Rob144

 

"People" might. I certainly don't. I have no idea what they're looking for when the test and rate their cars but it's not what I'm looking for -- so we never agree on what's good and what's not good. I'm not saying they're wrong. Just not in sync with me.

 

Ummm, the SH-AWD is rated better than Quattro and it works better. I had a Quattro car, and you can definitely notice the difference between the cars.

 

I suspect your dislike of SH-AWD is more because you're used to the Quattro system in the Audi. That's OK, different people have different tastes based on what they've driven before.

The Audis look good and have great driving dynamics. However, you can't get away with doing the same dumb stuff in curves that you can with the RL because of SH-AWD. And trust me, I've done some DUMB stuff that should have landed me in the ditch in the name of testing the limits of this car. The A6 never made it onto my short list of cars because of what I had heard about reliability.

 

When CR or any other magazine has car reviews, they can never be trusted as objective because of advertising dollars or because they have an alterior motive or something....unless they give a glowing review to a Honda or Acura, in which case it's all legit.

 

I think it's interesting you say that because I definately notice the difference in the two awd systems. With quattro, the power distribution was seamless and unnoticeable. With the SH-AWD, I can feel the lag in power delivery between wheels. You can especially feel it when cornering and hitting something slick. I think the Acura electronic system is signficiantly slower in reaction than the mechanical quattro.

Should, in theory, the ability to be able to power each wheel individually be better? Sure, but in application I think it fails to meet the hype. This car, on similar tires with less tire wear, handles worse in snow than my 50k mile Audi A6. The Acura already has more rattles than I care to mention, more electrical gremlins in 3k miles than my Audi in over 50k. I drove my A6 through an absolute sleet storm at 80mph with complete control where others were doing 40 and going off the road. I picked up co-workers who drove SUV's in 2+ feet of snow when they couldn't get them going.

I see a lot of people questioning the Audi's, but not many people with first hand experience. The Audi is a more agressive car than the Acura, and perhaps part of my preference for the Audi is becuase it matches my driving style.

At any rate, if someone offered to buy my Acura for a reasonable amount, I'd be at the Audi dealer the same day.

I'm NOT saying the Acura is a bad car, but I do feel it is inferior, for my tastes and driving style, to the Audi.
Chuck

 

Sorry to hear that you had a lot of problems on your 06 RL.
If I were you, I would trade it in now and take a little loss rather than few years down the road and take a bigger loss when trade in.
For me, I am happy with my 07 RL. (Traded in 04TL with 24K miles)
BTW, when did your age change from 26 last year to 32 this year?

Peace,

 

clangjr, You picked up co-workers in 2+ feet of snow in Your's A6? I want to see this!

 

in case you didnt know, 06 model audi's and older come with free maintanence 4 yrs/50k and 07 models they offer the maintanence pkg for $550 that covers the same length

 

It's ancient history now but I had lots of experience with Audi/VW and I partially agree with you. No dobt that the German driving experience is a very good feeling.

BUT, my wife has only two request when I get a bug to buy a new car. #1, don't tell her we can't afford the things that she wants because of the car (no problem). #2, Please don't ever buy another Audi! I ignored her on the last Audi purchase about 10 years ago and I'm still hearing about it. I had a total of three, loved driving them all. Spent way to much money on all repairing things that should not have broken, sometimes annually. Concurrently, we have had one or another Honda product around for my wife to drive. Normal maintenance only on these.

I'm a little slow but finally decided that I could give up a little driving fun and reduce the frustration level a lot by just buying Acura/Honda products. At some point in the distant future, I may try Audi or BMW again but not now thanks.

On the extended free repairs, there is a good reason for them. When your reputation gets so bad that you have trouble moving product something must be done. Check out who is providing free service these days. GM is doing so well that they offer 0% 60 month financing on certain (dog) models, go figure.

 

Hmm, I had a Audi A4 Quattro, and the RL AWD is much better and seemless compared to it. The A4 could never take tunrs like the RL can. The RL also is better in the snow due to the way its designed.

 

I am not sure about this. My 03 Audi A4 1.8t Quattro had no free maintenance.

 

You're not on a high horse. Everything thing you said is true. The motive of those who would question truly independent testing and reporting of any product, including automobiles, is suspect. CR isn't perfect, but in a world increasingly given over to caveat emptor as a standard business practice, Consumers Reports is a healthy dose of sanity.

 

Wow, what was the intent of that "drive-by" comment? Your constant cynicism is somewhat annoying. If you dislike this group so much, why are you here? I hand around CL because I have a Land Cruiser, I occasionally will venture into the GS forum and while I have gotten into debates, I don't see the benefit of throwing unprovoked grenades like you just did.

As for CR, I take their reviews with a grain of salt. Typically because I feel that their "tastes" typically differ from mine. THey nitpick certain things, but not others.

IMO, they almost rate the car strictly as an appliance, and don't factor in the intangibles. Almost using a Camry as a benchmark (and yes I used to own a Camry).

So in the end, I may look over what they have to say, but my decision will not hinge on their review.

Now what I will look at more closely is their reliability ratings, only because that information comes directly for the reader experience.

 

I don't see the big deal about Audis. Have been driven around in an A4, have sat in an A8 and A6 and they are nice but nothing special. The jizzing people do on their interiors boggles my mind. Lexus destroys Audi here...IMO.

I don't find Audis from the exterior to be anything amazing either. They use the wonderful cookie cutter design all german brands seem to sue for thier cars. Get some originality and make your cars appear a bit diff.

I think the Audi love just comes down to some lame German car bias thing and if Audi was Japanese (but made the exact same cars) they'd get less love.

I also find all car mags to be worthless as it is clear they are clueless about what the avg buyer cares about and they obviously have a bias towards their fav brands. I mean anyone who puts value in a review of a 50+k luxury car where the basis is on it's track performance is an idiot....and that is what car mags do. Go peep a review of a luxury car in all the auto rags and see how about 6 words are spent on the actual luxury component of the car and another 5 billion on how it does the slalom or runs around the skidpad like I am going to be taking my luxo sedan to the track rather than be driving it to/from work and other places.

A good review site IMO is familycar.com. The peeps there can grasp the purpose of specific types of cars and write the reviews accordingly.

 

Why do you take things personally? do you think i'm picking on you or somehthing? As for being annoying, I find britney spears gossip on TV annoying...so I change the freakin' channel. Maybe you should just stop reading my posts if you find my cynicism annoying.

I'm making an observation from experience as being a long time member of this forum how in one thread, people can hold a car up on a pedestal because of a glowing magazine article while in another thread they trash the same magazine as being biased because they gave a not-as glowing review to another model of the same brand or gave the car a better spot in a shootout or whatever.

 

Keep the heat down, guys (GH and mrdeeno), just a friendly conversation about Audis here....

Agree about using the reliability ratings in CR. They rock, but their reviews certainly leave something to be desired. CR is definitely not meant for car enthusiasts and thus their priorities necessarily differ from car enthusiasts'.

 

Agreed...Their reliability ratings are good. If they don't have a statistically significant sample, they don't list it. Aside from that, CR is yet another source of information and as you mentioned, better information for the everyday buyer rather than the enthusiast. CR will spend more time on things like "usability" (kind of like a practical ergonomics) like cupholder size and placement, car seat attachments, safety, and reliability. Most car mags focus on looks and performance.

As for reliabilty, CR asks readers about specific problems they've had in the past 12 months. Compare that to the JD Powers initial quality survey (IQS) which looks for problems within the first three months of ownership (when in reality, very little goes wrong and what does is typically small). In 2005, CR readers provided CR with information on more than 1 million cars. JD Powers IQS was based on about 60,000 responses.

LL

 

Your recommendation led me to check out their opinion of the RL.

http://www.familycar.com/RoadTests/AcuraRL/

Pretty fair review IMHO.

 

I have a 06 RL and a 07 Audi Q7 so I can tell you guys a little about the 2 AWD systems...




















They both seem to work well for me!

 

Ditto that. I have an '05 RL and an '06 A4. Both AWD systems work fine for my ski/snowboarding trips. Magic word...*gasp* 'Snow Tires'.

 

Ok, I will have to call you out on this. You drove through a sleet storm at 80MPH? First of all, that is definately asking/begging for trouble. I don't care if you're in a Hummer--doing 80MPH during incliment weather is dangerous. Also, the biggest factor in traction will be your TIRES. Having snow tires will make a dramatic difference in your car's handling and traction in snow. I believe that any AWD car will handle just as well in snow, as long as they are fitted with proper tires...unless you're going 80mph. Then nothing will help you.

Also, how did you drive through 2 feet of snow in your A6? That's 24 inches of snow, which is close to or even above the top of your wheels. I have a hard time believing that, only because my Jeep Grand Cherokee w/ AT tires have a hard time in 2 feet of snow. But perhaps the AWD system in the Audi is better than the 4WD in my Jeep? Just busting your chops, but I think you're exaggerating a bit.

 

I had a 2002 Audi A6 2.7T Sport and found it to be nice handling luxo car, but the 4000 lbs of mass plus the incredible understeer from the motor hanging in front of the front axle, caused me to reconsider when the lease was up.
Reliability was decent for me, but then I had it just three years and less than 45K miles.

I then got a Subaru Legacy GT. An extremely agile car with plenty of power (250HP) in a <3,500 lbs car.
The AWD system in the Subaru’s is vastly superior to the Audi’s IMHO. I can drive much faster through corners and up slippery hills in the Subie.
Problem is, as much as I love my Subie, it’s to dang noisy for a 1.5 hr commute each way (3hrs a day). If I had a 30 minute or less commute, I’d not be considering a change.

An A6 was one of the cars on the short list of luxury cars in the $50K range with AWD, but given my prior experience, I scratched it off as not a viable candidate this time around.

 

Maybe it was 2 feet wide, not 2 feet deep.

LL

 

Ok... so Acura/Audi share a dealership here in Knoxville. (actually it's Porsche, Infinity, Jaguar, Acura, Audi) Small town... oh well.

So when I was in having my tires rotated (would have taken it to Walmart but I lost my wheel lock key and had to have the dealer get the locks off...so I figured I would just let them rotate the tires while I was there)... ok this is getting too long... I'll get to the point...
There was a used Audi A6 (2006) with 15k without Nav...(they are asking $39K for it) so I took it for a test drive while I was waiting for the service to be done.

Here's what I think... the car is very 'solid' feeling. It looked beautiful (Silver with Black interior) but only 1yr old and there was already obvious wear and tear to the 'plastic pieces'. The black plastic seals around the doors were worn, the chrome trim on the trunk and grille were oxidized. Perhaps they just didn't take care of it... but hell, it's only 1yr old (if that). As far as the interior... the RL's leather is MUCH higher quality. The plastic mold around the drivers seat that houses the power seat adjustments, had come loose and was flopping around. The plastic around the dash is cheaper in appearance. The instrument cluster much more spartan. (I think I would have liked it better if it was in the evening...and I saw it with the red lights)

Driving... The car felt heavy, and the 3.2L - 6 does not move that car well. The RL is much quicker.. not only off the line, but in all throttle response. Lastly the brakes... yikes, they squeaked and grinded and moaned. With only 15K mi's on them they sounded like they needed replacing. I've never heard a peep out of my brakes.

Sooo for giggles...I asked the sales person to put together some figures for me.
I wanted to know what it would cost for the A6 with the add'n of a 100K warranty and Nav. Here's what he sent back

A6 39,900 + Nav 2,000 + Warranty $998 (dealer splits 1/2 cost) Total $41,998+Tax
Trade in on 06 RL non-tech with 10K mi - $34,000.

Sooo in summary... I would pay > $8K and get a car with a worse reputation for reliability, 5K more miles, no xenons, no adaptive headlights, no keyless entry, no power rear sunshade, 35 less HP... and in my humble opinion worse handling, brakes, acceleration, leather, and fit/finish.

Hmmmm.... I think I'll stick with what I have. I was glad I took it for a drive... now I know how good I have it.