It is not an attitude my friend, it is a fact. The buyer largely sets the tone when they tell me what invoice is, holdback, the buy rate, the marketing support. They create this type of relationship should their attitude also be maladjusted. And I should have prefaced my remarks by defining 'soaked' as paying MSRP which is what Acura feels their products are worth. It does happen sometimes.

Did you honestly believe that everyone can pay $3,500.00 below invoice (or more) for an RL and not one person would pay MSRP? Dealerships are not non-profit organizations.

Do no be so quick to judge until you have walked in another person's shoes. My level of service does not increase in proportion to the size of the gross but, honestly, somebody paying $4,000.00 below invoice should not expect the same level of care as someone paying more.

 

CL6: Here's a paragraph that I posted previously:

I'm a capitalist and understand that sellers of products need to make a profit. The purchase of a vehicle can be a win/win for both parties. I can appreciate CL6's points made about the unethical buyer never having the courtesy to even contact the dealer to tell them that they're backing out of the deal. As CL6 said, he's then stuck with a prepped car and no immediate buyer- he loses money. For savings of $50 it's incredibly short sighted of someone to go to another dealer- that's about the cost of an oil change and tire rotation; which the dealer he made the deal with would do for free anyway to retain his business. Forthrightness, honesty, integrity, loyalty, a good service department should all be rewarded not punsihed.


I'm agreeing with your right to make a profit. I'm very willing to pay extra for service. I'm just not willing to accept paying $10K more for the same commodity nor should I think anyone else should. There's no difference in the car you're selling than the dealership down the road is selling. You may be more professional, your service department may be outstanding, you may offer free coffee and internet service. You may offer free car washes and loaner cars. All your salespeople may be like jcbridges. Those are all worth something. An extra $1K-$2K-sure. It's not worth $10K my friend. You're a consumer of other products.

How would you feel if you went into a music store to buy a grand piano? The store sells you the piano for $50K. The next person walks in the same store and only pays $40K because he did a little bit of research and chatted with some people online and determined that the store would be willing to sell it to him for only $40K. How would you feel if afterwards you find out that this happened? Wouldn't you feel ripped off? Wouldn't you feel taken as a sucker? Maybe you were offered free yearly tuning at your home for the next 10 years with your purchase. Well, that service is worth something. Maybe it's worth $1K-$2K. But you're not going to feel that it was worth $10K.

I'll ask you the same question I asked jcbridges:

Why would a dealer agree to sell a 2007 RL TECH for $38.5K? Would you make any money on the deal?

If the guy that pays $38.5K and sends a friend in to buy one at that price also maybe that's a good thing because now you have 2 less of these cars that are so hard to sell off your lot. The thing is I doubt that iceburg is the type of guy that would do that.

I feel the need to repeat myself. I will pay extra for service. Just don't try to rip me or people like me off. You won't get any more business from our large circle of friends and acquaintances and we won't go back and buy another car from you. We'll also give you a great deal of bad publicity.

There has to be a solution for this vicious circle. Maybe the business plan that Saturn has is the right one. I doubt there are too many people in this forum that would consider purchasing a Saturn.

Finally, in a way I understand your predicament of consumers having access to most of the pricing information. The tables have definitely turned to favor the consumer. Did you read my previous posting of how I was treated as a youngster going in to buy a car? This is what soured me with car dealers:

The first time I bought a car about 20 years ago the contract comes out and the dealership added an extended warranty. The sales guy said "that's how they always get processed". Not only did they never get another sale from me, but I told everyone I knew about this and cost them business.

A long time ago I once waited 59 days for "my exact car" to be delivered. The sales guy called and asked me to come in to see the car after I had called him every week for nearly 2 months wondering when the car would be in. There was a maximum 60 day wait on the contract or he'd lose my business. He had the nerve to tell me when I got there that there was $1500 worth of extras on "my car"- pin stripes and "under body sealant". I was a young kid and this was the unethical types of behavoirs that were around- still are I'm sure.

If I heard about this crap today those sales people would be fired.

CL6, I wish you well and hope you sell a great deal of cars in 2007. You offer great products!

 

All I hear is poor you. I have no pity for anyone associated with the sale of an auto. It is my responsibility to get the best deal for me. You have silly arguments.
All I hear is blah blah blah. Let's agree to disagree.
Whaaaaaaaaaaa

BTW....I took 'salesmanship' in college, but they refused to even dignify auto sales...I think you know what I mean..

Why should we, HERE on this board, care about all this. These are problems for the Auto Dealer's or Manufacturers Boards/forums rather than what it seems is more of an "owners" neighborhood.

 

[QUOTE=gcook]BTW....I took 'salesmanship' in college, but they refused to even dignify auto sales...I think you know what I mean..QUOTE]


I wish you many happy miles in your beautiful RL!

 

If you don't mind, I'll answer for jc. I work at an Acura dealership as well.

A good deal is really a state of mind. I think we can all agree the RL is a great car, and I'm sure there's plenty of people that think it's a great $50,000 car. If they're getting a great car at $50,000 they got a great deal.

It's not that someone needs to get their head chopped off to pay for those that go down to invoice, it's that they got a great car for $50,000. These people are usually the most satisfied with their vehicle.

As was mentioned above: It's also the same way in the opposite manner. You start at MSRP to negotiate because it's the price on the window. Also because the people that know what invoice is and will only pay that, will generally think there's more money they could have gotten if you agree on the first pass (I bet I could have gotten them into holdback, etc.). This = Unhappy Customer, didn't get the "best deal."

We don't make it difficult to get a great deal where I work, but I'll show MSRP and make someone ask for one.

The people that sell RL Tech for that little money = Losing a ton of dough. I have no clue how they do it.

 

Mizzeaux:

Thanks for being here. You sell some of the best automobiles in the world. I hope you find that very rewarding. Thanks for your candid comments.

How about my analagous comment about the purchase of a grand piano and that of an automobile. All of us understand that people who work for the business will receive a larger discount. It's hard for me and others to understand the dramatic differences in prices people not connected to the business pay for the exact same commodity- an RL.

I think you can appreciate the fact that the folks paying so much more might be quite upset if they found out that someone else paid so much less. Exact same car, exact same dealer, exact same day, exact same sales guy, bought the car at 11 a.m. and someone else bought it at 2 p.m. Does "this dance" have to go on?

 

The comments from the salesguys are definitely appreciated.

I totally agree with Mizzeaux when he says that a good deal is a state of mind.

I didn't pay as little as some of the guys here, but I still feel I got a good deal and my salesman didn't give me a hard time of it when I asked for a deal. It's probably why I've bought three Acuras from him and try to send people to him.

Personally, I think it's hard to find a car salesman you can trust but when you do, that (hopefully) mutual respect can certainly help when negotiating a deal. (It's the same in any profession you may require for service!)

 

To answer acuralvr1's question, the short answer is no we would never sell an 07 RL Tech for anything closte to $38.5. I will show you actual numbers on this car.

Base Invoice: 44,266.86

Holdback: $1,328.01 (3% of Base Invoice)

Destination: $670

Marketing Support: $3,500

So, Base - Holdback + Destination - Marketing = $40,108.85

As you can see the gross cost of each RL is more than $1500 over that figure of $38.5 and this is before you take floorplan, advertising, electricity, commission, etc. into this equation.

The only way I would sell an RL for that price is if I started smoking crack OR we had about 20-25 of them that we just could not move. Neither of these situations apply in our case though. We have 2 on the lot right now (both Tech) and we will probably never have more than 3 on the lot at once.

I guess my main point of contention is the customer who somehow uses sale price alone as some sort of basis for "value". This is the same sort of Wal-Mart attitude that makes me want to puke. Sometimes I have to go to Wal-Mart and it makes me sick b/c while there is some big rollback smiler at the door to say "hi" there is never anyone inside the store to show me where something is or anything, and if I do find someone they either don't speak English or if they do they have no idea what I'm talking about or where I might find it. Call me crazy but I would much rather spend a little more for personal service and product knowledge.

 

I have to aggree with both jcbridges and Mizzeauk. A good deal is a state of mind and I would rather pay a little more and get personal service and product knowledge. I do not own an RL yet,(mine will be in by mid-April), and this will be the fourth Acura that our family has bought from this dealership.

I am paying $42,000.00 for an RL with Tech Pkg(plus a few extras) and I had figured the dealer was making around a 5% profit or around $2000.00 on the deal. They are in business to make money and I am sure overhead is substantial.

Could I have gotten a better deal? Maybe, but I feel that for the car I am getting the price is fair. Their are not many RL's on the lots of the dealers that are in my area.

With all of the information available today, I would find it hard to believe that many cars are
actually sold at MSRP.

 

Well I set up some test drives for this coming week and will see how it goes. There are a few dealers within a 40 mile radius that have over 20 RLs on the lot. Some have gotten the inventory down to a handful of 5 to 10. I have not started bothering them for pricing as I want to make sue I want this car. I will try this, the M, GS, and 5 series and buy the one I like regardless of final price.

The dealerships are in an area of town that I don't frequent much, so I went for a drive today to see if I could find a suitable route that would show off the car is a variety of conditions. I took my 5 year old and we stopped at an Infiniti dealership (closed). Is it just me or is it hard to tell an "M" from a "G" at first glance. I had to walk up to the car to look at it. I will test drive one just to compare, but the styling doesn't do that much for me. Intellectually, I want to like it because of all the raves from the mags, CR, etc, but I don't know. I may feel differently after a drive. The Lexus dealer we went to did not have a single GS350 on the lot. Strange since I didn't think they were flying off the lots either.

Kinda like a car I bought over 20 years ago. I really wanted to buy a Nissan 200SX since it had all the bells and whistles and was well priced. I ended up with a Honda Prelude because it just felt better.

 

It's not just you. The G and the M look very much alike and, despite Consumer Reports' raves, I disliked the Infiniti styling so much that I never even drove an M.

 

Thanks jcbridges.

I don't shop at Walmart because I like to have helpful salespeople that speak english as well and are knowledgeable. Additionally, where I live there are many choices of competitors- many folks who live in rural areas don't have a good alternative so they're stuck with only Walmart. Sports Authority and Macy's are the Walmarts of their respective market niches- I try to stay away from them also.

At least some people here agree that service is worth something.

 

I'm thrilled to report that I purchased a new RL TECH on Friday.

It was a delightful experience with a dealer that I've now purchased 3 consecutive cars from. I paid $41,936 including the destination and handling fee, splash guards installed and wheel locks.

Last month I spoke to the General Sales Manager- I don't have patience with the "I need to check with the manager" routine that most car sales people like to use. I was offered $45,436 prior to the 3/1/07-4/30/07 $3500 marketing incentive- $499 over invoice. All's I did was deduct the $3500 and made an offer that he accepted. The splash guards and wheel locks were "thrown in" because I agreed to buy the car by the end of this month.

After the deal was made I decided to have the dealership install a faux wood steering wheel- love the look. The dealership charged me $599 and I made it a point to speak to the service manager since I know the installation is a bit tricky. The dealership has a $198 "documentery fee" which I know is pure additional profit- which is fine. The only other fees were tax and registraton.

I'm very happy with the transaction. The young guy that was delegated the task to follow up did a nice job of contacting the insurance company, getting all the paperwork together and explaining many of the features of the car. I'm going to write a nice letter to the owner of the dealership complimenting him on his very professional employees.

I saved some money, the dealership made some money, and I'll continue using them for service and I'll coninue sending friends and acquaintances over there. Everyone's happy and I've got a great car!

This replaces my 2004 TL. A car I liked a great deal, but it lacked navigation which I really wanted. The ride of the RL is so much more to my liking and I love the extra interior technological features, and the added luxury.

 

wow......this is really great deal......wonder if the dealer will give me a same deal if i am currently under the lease with TL.......i dont want to use swaplease or other websites......was hoping if dealer could just buy back the lease......and get me into a RL????

 

Very nice deal on a great car. As we saw from the nicely detailed above, you paid just $500 over invoice and that is reasonable for all parties. You're right to be thrilled. Congratulations.

I traded up from a 2004 non-nav TL myself just 4 months ago. Loved the TL but got over it very quickly indeed!

 

Where did you get the car from? When I was looking to by my 04 TL, Ramsey NJ had the best deal and it was all done over the phone, my local Acura dealer in Westchester County, NY matched the deal Ramsey gave me but only after I got the quote from Ramsey, they didnt want too until they knew I had a real quote.

Funny thing is on my sticker is said Ramsey on it, maybe they got it from the lot in Ramsey.

Also did you finance or lease it? I get tired of cars fast so I plan on doing a lease/smart buy again.

 

www.bridgewateracura.com

I bought it as I noted in the post. Lease rates for the RL are very uncompetitive right now.

 

I bought the RL just before the lease ended.

 

Paid 44,100 for frost silver / taupe tech/pax with Pro pack... In Northern California

 

Love the Platinum Frost Metallic color!

 

That's a GREAT deal! Awesome. Don't forget to post your pertinents in the "RL owner sign in" thread.