Hello everyone.

I will be in the market for a car in the spring/summer of '07 and I have been leaning heavily towards the TL 6 spd, as I have been driving manuals all of my life. I really want a manual but something about the RL is really tugging at me. I'm not sure if it is the beautiful interior, SH-AWD, understated elegance, technology or just the bang for the buck. I know that the TL is a sportier car, but to be honest, I'm afraid the RL will make me forget all about the TL and driving a manual.

I am going to test drive the RL this weekend and I wanted to get your feelings about it before I do. I plan to purchase a used CPO '05/'06, with the A-Spec suspension added shortly after.

I look forwards to your comments.

 

I think you will find the reason will differ from owner to owner. Personally, I loved the SH-AWD, electronics package and audio system.

 

I will give you my spin on it. I currently own a 2G TL because its whats in my price range. However, I think the 2G RL is a REALLY good looking car (I think all the new acuras are though) and I would take one in a heartbeat if I could afford it. I been it on and its just a nice car and theres also a lot of little things I noticed I liked about it. Now I have never driven one but im gonna take a stab at it and say it handles beastly (I mean with almost 300 HP and AWD it would have too). This is coming from a 17 year old too and I dont think its as sporty as the TL but I diffenently dont think its an old persons car either.

However, I would be able to give you more of my opinion on it if I ever drove one? Anyone feel like letting me borrow theres?

 

I would say test drive both vehicles the same day, first the TL then the RL. Once you have done this you wont need to know waht we think, you'll just know. Good Luck. Btw alot of us are former TL owners, me to be included.

 

Well, as the owner of both a TL (not a manual, though) AND an RL, I can tell you this - The RL has made driving the TL not much fun, at least for me. Why?

Well, the TL is "sportier", I guess, but the plushness and civility of the RL immediately came to mean more to me than the sportiness of the TL. That's because the TL's sportiness translates to coarseness (some not-so-pretty ride characteristics, heavy steering, engine vibration and buzzing, some rattles and vibes, a somewhat hard and glinty interior, etc.).

Now, the guys over on the TL forum would lynch me if they saw this, but I'm just tellin' it like I see it.

The RL is just much more polished ... it's quiet, smooth and just much more luxurious. The interior materials are much better, the build quality is 'way better, the interior layout is nicer IMO, and the amenities are superior to the TL's. Things like the Nav, the HFL, the audio system, the seat comfort, the outward visibility, etc., etc,. are all better.

And IMO you don't give up much in the bargain as compared to the TL in terms of performance. You maybe have to press the RL a little more to get it, but it will beat virtually everyone away from a traffic light, will accelerate onto a freeway and merge with the fastest traffic, will take you through the twisties at a very brisk rate, will pass a truck on a narrow two-lane, and otherwise do all the stuff the TL will. Okay, maybe it's a few ticks slower to 60, but you won't notice that in everyday driving, and you'll be distracted enough by the luxury that you won't care aout it anyway.

But if you're a commited boy racer, maybe you'd better at least look at the new '07 TL Type S. I still think you'll pat yourself on the back if you get the RL, though.
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The SH-AWD is soooo good that the handling numbers on the RL are almsot the same as my NSX, and the NSX has much better handling tires. Check out the numbers in Road and Track, I find the RL has a more secure feeling in the corners compared to the NSX due to SH-AWD.
Try to let a sales guy give you a super demo of SH-AWD if he can.
I drove the TL-s and it is nice but FWD is nothing compared to SH_AWD. The RL is and insane car for those who appreciate a bit faster driving, most people have no idea how good it is.

 

I got a 2006 TL as a loaner when I had my 2005 RL at the dealer Friday for the A-Spec suspension install. There's no comparison between the 2 car. The TL is "sportier" and lighter, but the RL is more refined in every way. Better materials, better build quality, better integration of the technology, SH-AWD, etc. I would recommend the RL (especially with A-Spec suspension) over the TL to anyone considering the 2. I also thought my 2003 TL-S Navi drove better and felt more powerful than the 2006 TL, even though the 2006 TL had more gadgets.

 

As a former '04 TL owner I can honestly say there is no comparison possible. The RL is such a superior vehicle, but for a price. My '06 RL is quieter, roomier and has more cache than the TL. That said, I would buy an '07 TL-S in a minute if I didn't have the RL. You can't lose with either one.

 

Not a commited boy race (I'm 39), but like a little fun when driving. I have driven the '06 TL a while back and it felt like my 1992 accord 5 speed (which I still have), although much faster, more comfortable, etc.

I'm not too sure about the TL-S for a few reasons:
-289 hp in FWD platform
-Red interior lighting
-Too many on the road
-The '07 really doesn't look as clean as the '06
-Not as roomy as the RL
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I guess I won't know until the test drive, which I'm really excited about. I will do as suggested and drive both the same day.

On another note, I have only seen one RL while driving this entire weekend. Truly a car you don't see everyday.

 

Oops, I meant to say "cachet"; not cache. I guess I spend too much time on the computer.

 

As previously posted, take a test drive of both cars. You will notice the difference. And then, just sit in the cars without the salesperson for a length of time. If you can hold out for the change in model years, you will find a substantial discount for the RL.

 

As a former 3G TL owner:

After three months and nearly 4000 miles in an A-Spec RL, I have almost forgotten what it was like in the TL. I hope that helps. This comes from someone who LOVED (and still loves) the TL.

SH-AWD + more power makes this heavy car boogie faster than you think it should, and the build quality is much better than the TL overall.

Frankly, you will do well with either, and your decision will come down to

a) more sport lux with a distinguished look (RL) or
b) more sport with a hot-rod, BMW-ish look (TL).

 

Never ever considered the TL because there are just so many of them around. The RL was a rare bird on the roads, though a little less so now. I like how it's still less common than the TL though. SH AWD is a dream and I just cannot imagine how even a powerful front wheel driver can out-do SH AWD. I hear unfavorable things about torque steer with the TL.

Giving up those fractions of 0-60 secs by going for the RL vs the TL is well worth it IMHO. I think about it like this: Rear-wheel drive = fair weather friend, Front-wheel drive = possible survivor in poor weather, SH AWD = all weather capable.

 

heard the RL is a great car , but has a few bug's to be worked out!, check out edmunds.com , or Consumer report's , JD power's etc...if your still curious! the next Gen, if it come's with a V-8 and an aggressive exterior , I might jump on it!....but I prefer my TL!...that's my Dos peso's worth!.... but drive both and see what get's your pulse to rise!

 

So why didn't you just go buy yourself a FERRARI !

 

I take Consumer Reports with a grain of salt, considering that they limit the surveys to subscribers of their magazine. They don't even include readers who purchase the magazine off the racks. However, I believe the RL has been doing okay under J.D. Powers reliability surveys. And at least the RL hasn't has anything similar to the previous-generation TL/CL tranny problems yet.

 

A few months back before I bought my 2006 RL, I was seriously looking at the 2006 TL. I was 99% sure I wanted the TL, but when I drove the RL..... I realized they are totally different. Both cars are very nice, but I think the RL is more refined. My previous car was a Nissan Maxima SE, and the TL ride reminded me of my Maxima SE. The ride is a bit more firm and basically is a sports sedan. The RL has more of a luxury ride and higher quality of materials.

For me, I had to justify the price different....but after doing it. I don't regret it! I am 100% satified with my choice.

Best thing to do is drive both cars and decide for yourself.

 

Spoken like a true RL NON-owner.

I only have about 5,550 miles on my '06 RL, but I'd have to say it has fewer "bugs to work out" than most cars. My particular RL doesn't have any bugs, while my '06 TL - with similar miles - has rattles and buzzing trim pieces galore that haven't been "worked out" ater 3 years on the market, and has splitting seat leather like many TL owners have reported.

I also seem to recall that '04, as well as some '05, TL's had fatal automatic transmission issues and the 6spd manual has problems to this day. Then there were the collapsing headliners, the infamous pulling to the right, the crappy Turanza tires on non-Nav models, etc., etc.

Maybe that just goes to show ... er, something.
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This exactly describes the 2006 TL loaner I had Friday. Buzzing trim pieces, rattles, and crappy Turanza tires. I couldn't give it back fast enough.

 

There were some 1st issues with early '05 models, but that's been resolved for '06. Just check the TSB list. Most, if not all of them cover early run '05 models. '06s have been solid.

 

To come to the defense of other TL owners, I was one of the first 3G TL owners (I think I was the first on this board, but I have to look way back to be sure). The tranny issue was only on the first 14k 2004 TLs, one of which I had, and was fixed by a 2nd gear oil jet fix. I also was the first of many to complain about the "Bullshitstone Terroranzas" after I hydroplaned on 9k mile-old tires in a moderate rainstorm. Acura, to its credit, put pressure on Bridgestone to change the formulation of the tire so that it was slightly better. I was thankful not to have a collapsing headliner, but that was indeed an early problem that was, for the most part, licked.

Right now, the 3G TL is a solid car with the main issues being rattles, cracking leather, and 6MT tranny issues, as you state. The quality issues are really not that bad, but the RL is better, especially in its 2nd year (2006 MY). The 2007 ought to be even better, with a tech model with rearview camera and mp3 port, while we get stuck with that flaming poo called Music Link.

 

I have to agree, even here in Seattle I rarely see the new RL's, but I see may of the 1st Gen's. Im 32 yrs old and I yet to see someone even close to my age drive one, guess it makes me feel young, but have no doubt, its a great car.

 

I have about 20,000 miles on my 2005 RL. I drove it from Northern VA to Northern CA. So far, no real problems yet. In fact, my biggest complaint so far is a small vibration coming from the air vent near the driver's side A pillar when the car is cold. That's about it so far. I had a much harder time with the 2001 Acura CL Type S I had, which was in the shop for 6 weeks thanks to the tranny issue.

 

and the great DVD-Audio sound system. With the A-Spec pkg, I got Yokohoma AVS-100's I believe, great, 18" tires, but with the size, there was not as much cushion on the road and you felt more imperfections. This was ok with me since I like hi-pro cars and know that they all come with trade-offs for certain areas of performance. This car handled like a dream for a fwd, and could get sideways on launches with the 6 speed because of that, but you allow for that and know going in, right ? Finally got tired of shifting it a million times in this city of at least 2 million bad drivers, so traded it in for an '05 RL and have been just fine with the RL. I had Zaino'd the TL so good that it looked better than any of their showroom vehicles; it was perfect, and they sold it within a day of it being on their lot. Younger guys like yourself would be attracted to the TL first, I know, and Im an old guy ! I never experienced any of the problems others have listed with my TL, so perhaps its the way it works - some are good and some not so good.. Hope you end up finding what you want and enjoy ! DanF

 

I also own both and agree to a point with Mike here.

The RL is a pure Luxury car while the TL is made with more Sport than Luxury. The TL though is QUIETER in the engine noise area while the RL has a bit of a noisy engine when its reved. My TL you can barely hear it when getting on it under 4800 rpms but the RL is pretty raspy under that. The RL rides much smoother, easier to steer but it doesn't handle as good as the TL due to its softer sprung suspension and tire sizes I believe.

So far both of our cars have shown no rattles. The TL is 6 months old while our RL is 2-3 months old.

 

Ok, here are some facts.
Per Car and Driver, the TL does .81g's on the sikdpad and the RL does .87g's on a 300ft pad.
The RL with SH-AWD is a much better handling car ove the TL.
The RL WILL handle MUCH fster than you think, you need power on in the turns to help the system work rather than coast through a turn.

 

The RL does NOT handle near as good as the TL. Sorry but I RACE at Motor Sport Ranch (use too) and was a driving instructor and I can easily tell the difference between the two cars since I do own both. The fact is below the TL does out handle the RL.

Here is from C&D on the TL. And no, it isn't the A-SPEC.

Drivers pushed hard to discover the 3500-pound TL's bad habits. Turns out there weren't many in the second-lightest car after the BMW. For a front-driver with lux-car pretensions, the Acura keeps its understeer well hidden, its 60/40 weight bias well disguised, its roll and pitch well checked. The TL's 0.91 skidpad performance and 62.5-mph lane-change speed were tops. The steering is light — some thought a bit too light — and the nose is eager to veer where it's pointed.

http://www.caranddriver.com/comparis...-acura-tl.html

The TL does .91g! In some cases it has done .87-89g on other tests. It does nothing close to .81g that a Caddy can do.

 

In all fairness, I think there's handling and then there's handling.

True, there is a measurable kind of handling, where a car is pushed to its limits on a test track and cold scientific numbers are generated by measuring devices. And that's great, because it makes for easy comparison between various cars' dynamic abilities. It's also useful to racers, since they are more prone to push cars to those limits than normal mortals are in everyday driving.

But then there's the way a car handles in traffic and in those everyday driving situations. It's characterized by how tiring a car is to drive all day, and how satisfying it is on a curvy road and how good it feels when you have to make a sudden stop, or when you swerve to miss a less-competent driver. It's the weight of the steering, the responsiveness of the engine, and to some degree even the comfort of the seats and the angle of the steering wheel and how well you can see out without twisting your neck.

This last kind of handling isn't as measurable, and it's subjective to a large extent, but it's actually more important to me than how fast someone can drive in a tight circle before the tires break traction.

In MY book, the RL handles better than the TL because it's more satisfying to drive under the same conditions as the TL. Not scientific, I know, but it matters to me.
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I read the Article you post and I have never seen a number that high on a 300 ft pad for the TL, I did not see what size pad they used or what tires.
I personally will take the RL any day ove rthe ft drive TL. If you look in the back of Road and track at the charts, the RL is almost the same as the NSX with much lesser tires.
Here is the 2004 Car and Drive .81 for the TL. You will see SH-AWD on the new NSX for sure.
AND the RL is 500 pounds heavier than the TL and about 1000 pounds over the NSX.
http://www.caranddriver.com/roadtest...-tl-page3.html

 

I read the Car & Driver information. They test drove the TL with manual transmission. I wonder if they would get the same results with an automatic transmission.

Secondly, skid pad numbers are quantitative, which is a good thing. However, it does not measure qualitative data, such as how much the driver has to fight to control the car due to torque steer. Torque steer isn't necessarily dangerous, but it is damned annoying. That's why I stopped driving FWD cars.

Finally, this is a nice academic exercise, but I doubt if many people acquire mid-sized sedans to drive around the track. For those that do, I recommend they get a real sport sedan such as the BMW 3 Series, and leave behind any pretense.

 

Here is an TL test from Mootor trend where they used a 200 ft pad and got .80 G for the TL.
http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...test_data.html

 

Come ON guys, lest we forget that the TL and RL serve totally different missions and are both great cars.

Again to defend the TL, the torque steer was frankly minimal compared to other high-output FF cars. I've driven FR cars like the BMW 3 series and with A-Spec, the TL's handling comes close....other than you really feel a bit of understeer in the curves at a point where you don't feel any in the BMW. Our favorite FF comparo on the 3G side is the Nissan Maxima....that car is a torque-steer monster. You really have to hold the steering wheel on that one. Not so much on the TL.

OTOH, it's great not to worry about torque steer at all on the RL. Again, with RL A-Spec, the handling in curves is better than the stock TL and almost (but not quite) as good as my modded A-Spec TL with Comptech RSB. In the RL, you really do have to keep some power to the engine/wheels to navigate a steep curve well. That's where SH-AWD really shines. In the TL, you have to let off the gas to avoid understeer. You have to use A-Spec and a thicker RSB to lessen the tendency in the TL.

 

One other thing......of course, the TL won its division at Thunderhill this year. That certainly says a lot as the Spoon RL (only 2700 pounds!!! Wow!) got lap times up to ten seconds slower than the Honda Research TL. I wonder who would win stock?

 

People who say the RL handles better than the TL obviously have no real experience in driving behind a car and pushing its limits to know what a car feels like when it does handle good. The TL is more darty, more responsive, when I tell it where to go, while the RL is less responsive, but also leans and (a bit less feedback) which also makes it feel more unsafe when taking turns harder.

Between the two cars, I would never trust the RL on a road race track. I would trust the TL however. My G35 was awesome at motor sport ranch, with its perfect balance. The TL is not as good, but its close. The RL however does not inspire my confidence.

 

Whoa there, no need to be insulting to others here. I agree with you about the stock RL. But alter the suspension (A-Spec is just one example) and put some decent rubber on and you've got quite a different car. I'm not claiming to be a road race expert, but even this unwashed driver can tell the difference. Do the A-Spec on your RL and come back with a report--still won't be as good as an A-Spec-ized TL (as I state above) but you might be surprised. Believe me, I am the only person in this discussion (unless others unmask themselves) who has driven both the RL and TL stock AND in A-Spec form.

 

I didn't mean to be rude in any way. When I saw that someone says the RL out handles the TL, I knew that wasn't true. Since I have driven both and own both with experience with cars on a road course I can easily tell more than the common person which one is better and which one I feel safer in. The RL I would never trust on a road-course without upgrades, but the TL stock leaves enough confidence that I would be willing to push its limits.

The RL and TL are both not performance machines. The 350z and G35 were built to be one. But the TL and RL perform well.

 

Push the RL, it will make you say that it cannot do what it does, remember no other car outside of Honda has this kind of SH-AWD, none. I find the Sh-Awd much more sure footed in the corners than the TL.
Please do not comment on the RL's handling unless you have taken it to a very high cornering level under power, it is amazing. Yes it will lean.
Again, more sure footed than my NSX.

 

Woah there buddy. Sorry but I have PUSHED it a few times in corners since I have owned it. and I also have more liberty to say since I am a Instructor at Motor Sport Ranch. It pushed and felt like a heavy pig. It does NOT handle like you seem to believe.

Even the SPOON RL weighed 2700lb was still 4-5 sec slower in lap times compared to the TL on the other thread. Need I say more? I think not.

 

kirby, if you say the stock RL is more sure-footed in a corner than your NSX, then it will be a total cornering beast in the corners with A-Spec and its resultant minimal lean. I mean, I can do (and have done) stupid things on freeway on and off ramps that I could not possibly get away with in a TL.

I apologize for preaching that A-Spec goodness, but if you want your RL to handle corners aggressively....you have to give it a try. The best part is that it is still a very smooth ride in non-assertive driving.

We spend a lot of time talking about what Acura does wrong with its cars, but Acura definitely did the A-Spec right. A-Spec should REALLY be advertised as the performance upgrade it is!

 

I may go A-spec sometime, but my NSX (second one) is my sports car, I love the RL for what it does and does it so well. I find it much more suited for my taste, I am sick of FWD, all performers are going away from it.
The TL-S now has reduced power I am told in the first 2 gears to deal with torque steer. Never drove an A-spec though on either RL or TL, not many around.
And I still say the RL handles better than stock TL's, if you work on bars and tires, number will change alot, most reviews put the TL with regular tires at .81, the RL at .87.
I am done.