Hi, all.

Been a while since I've been around here because I traded out my last Acura quite a few years ago.

I'm currently looking at possibly purchasing a 2016/2017 Used RDX AWD with the Technology Package (only). I have no interest in the other packages because they either add things I specifically don't want (like Adaptive Cruise Control) or add things that have no value for me (so I'm not paying for them). I've purchased CPO's before, including Acura, but want to know if I should -really- be considering it here for the extra cost it carries (which is not trivial).

Firstly, does anyone have any specific reasons to buy one model year over the other?

Does anyone have any compelling reasons to seek out a CPO version of the car, especially the 2016 which will have its original bumper-to-bumper warranty expiring in the coming 8-12 months?

Does anyone have any "gotcha's" to look for on these cars?

Any meaningful input would be helpful and appreciated.

 

A CPO car gets 2 years/ 24k miles additional warranty over and above any existing one. That should cure a few Gotchas.

 

CPO Warranty may give some peace of mind. Most owners' experience with the RDX is fairly trouble-free, and Acura had several years to work out bugs in this model by 2016. I personally would not pay for a CPO on this model.

 

This is sort of what I've been thinking. I've had both Honda's and Acura's and have never really had an issue with any of them. The one problem I had was actually with a CPO Acura and it came down to them "pushing it through the garage" to apply the CPO label - they never actually checked that the rear defroster worked (and it didn't). So, they were on the hook to replace the entire rear window on their dime and it was expensive.

I realize that a 2016 model year would be approaching its end of original warranty in the coming half year or so (based on when it was actually sold) and I'm taking note of original in-service date to potentially use for negotiating.

 

Yes, the extra time and mileage coverage is nice, but the sort of "gotcha's" that I'm referring to are issues that are hard to resolve and not necessarily covered under warranty in any fashion. For example, I had a 2008 MDX Tech/Ent in the dark red. It turns out that Acura had a design issue with that setup where any of the dark-colored vehicles could experience functional issues of the headphones due to heat. I had the controllers for the rear-seat entertainment system replaced three times because of the headphones going dead (and then starting to work again) before they finally decided that the "fix" was to keep the vehicle out of the direct summer sun on really hot days when it's parked.

 

When we bought a CPO RDX last March, there where special finance rates. Not sure if that is still active.

 

0%?

The total finance charge that I'm looking at for this loan would be about $2,000 (assuming I would finance the whole thing). Given that I would end up paying at least $1,000 more for a certified version of the car, plus additional associated sales taxes, the special financing would have to be zero in order to make it attractive on that level.

It's a great piece of info and I appreciate you sharing. I will look into it although I have seen nothing about that advertised as of yet at this point. At a minimum, I could at least ask the one dealer I've spoken with that sells these only as Certified to find out what their finance rates actually are.

 

I think it is more important to purchase an used Acura that has as much as possible of the 4/50,000 basic warranty still active. Even with a CPO, the basic warranty will be used first (if still active) and cover more items. The CPO is just an inspection process and they ensure wearable items like tires, brakes, suspension, fluids, and filters are within a certain %. Acura is usually adding on Acura Care or similar after the basic warranty expiration date and the extra cost is why CPO runs a little higher than non-CPO Acura. Acura Care or 3rd party doesn't cover as much compared to the basic 4/50k bumper-to-bumper.

You still have the 4/50,000 mile basic bumper-to-bumper PLUS the 6/70,000 mile powertrain before the CPO warranty is used in most cases. You might come out cheaper going non-CPO and purchasing Acura Care before the 4/50,000 basic runs out. I did this form my 11 MDX I purchased used at 30,000 miles in 2014. The basic warranty paid for the replacement of a torn front endlink, both front magnetic struts, broken 2nd row cup holder, replacement of driver 1 key fob with low X-mitt range, and 6AT firmware update. I purchased Acura Care for 5 more years and up to 120,000 miles for $2350 online from an out of state Acura dealership at 47,000 miles on my MDX right before the basic warranty ran out.

The 2nd Gen RDX is way more reliable than my 11 MDX Adv+Ent. It might only be for piece of mind going for CPO, getting Acura Care, or 3rd party warranty with the 2nd Gen RDX.

 

CPO adds one year and 12,000 miles to the bumper to bumper coverage as long as it's purchased while the original warranty is still in force.

Car comes with 6 year / 70k powertrain - that gets extended to 7 year / 100k coverage.

These are the exact same as the original warranties.

 

Do you really need a back up warranty in an RDX? All the minor issues can be fixed as and when needed and still it might end up cheaper. The chances of getting a major problem are extremely less. My car is past 70k miles and therefore out of all warranty coverage, I never bought any extended anything for this. A lot of minor issues mentioned here are vibration here and there, VCM issues and so on. Basically you can ignore these if you want to. But in case you are the over sensitive / OCD types person, I would recommend this method over purchasing a CPO.
Any money saved is money earned. You’ll hardly find someone who bought this gen RDX which has been a horrible car / death trap/ peace of mind killer, etc. take it easy man and use the extra money for whatever else you want, may be upgraded wheels, other aftermarket kits, etc. You won’t go terribly wrong either way.

 

I purchased a 2017 Advance CPO about a year and a half ago.

If I had to do it again, I would likely not go the CPO route, as this thing is just rock solid.

I would find a used model with service records, if I was starting at square one, and save a few bucks for a rainy day.

Either way, you will likely be satisfied with the outcome!

 

The APR special back in March from Acura finance was 3.49%

 

I can get this or better direct on any used car, so no appeal there for me. Thanks.

 

Thanks for the thoughts.

My only real consideration for an add-on purchase would be a second set of "decent" wheels to mount snows on to swap on when winter is in full force. I've owned "AWD" vehicles before that use this stupid differential system (where it isn't TRUE AWD), so I know what to expect. Nothing is perfect, so a good set of snows should make the car quite solid when the white stuff flies.

As for the reports of VCM issues, I suspect there's little that could be done shy of disabling the feature. I have a similar feature in my truck where it drops four cylinders when possible and I've never, ever felt it engage or disengage them. Some have disabled the AFM feature citing that they feel the motor change or that it somehow gives them more power. I've never found the complaints to be warranted on mine.

 

Honda has had some serious issues with their VCM system which may or may not have been resolved on these RDXs.

 

Had a late 2000's Odyssey with the V6 with Eco Mode. No issues with it at all. How similar / different is the motor in these RDX'es?

 

egads is correct...and you were lucky with your Odyssey where many were not to include myself.

Honda settles class-action lawsuit over oil-burning V6s

I had an 08 Honda Odyssey EX-L with transmission and oil consumption issues and a 11 Pilot with oil consumption issues. VCM deactivation devices had yet to make it to the market while owning the Odyssey so the oil consumption went unaddressed and the transmission (TC shudder) were cured by switching to MaxLife ATF...after giving the dealer several opportunities to correct to include a new torque converter under warranty. Installing S-VCM Controller at the end of my ownership in the 11 Pilot gave promising results for its oil consumption issues and refined its driving experience.

I purchased a 13 RDX-TECH AWD last year for the wife...right off the bat the transmission was behaving like the 08 Odyssey. The addition of MaxLife ATF and S-VCM Controller had the RDX driving and performing as it should for the high-end vehicle it is.

I'm a firm believer in running on all 6 cylinders all the time...and any / all Hondas in my personal fleet have MaxLife ATF in the transmission.

 

Good to know of the ATF stuff.. Will keep it in mind.

I have no issue with allowing cylinder deactivation systems to operate as I've seen first-hand the fuel savings in my truck (17MPG average over 65,000 miles of driving for me, in my terrain, and given my use is respectable for a full sized truck with a V8). If that system gets in the way of the vehicle operating properly, then we have an issue.

What would be the smart course here? Watch for issues and resolve as needed? Take a proactive approach with ATF and having the VCM disabled? I really don't want to sacrifice mileage by disabling the VCM. If I didn't really care, I would buy the current generation with the underpowered turbo that will suck gas around town just like the previous one did...

 

Not sure which truck you have, but if it's GM...they've had their own issues with extremely high oil consumption in engines with their version of cylinder deactivation. I have a buddy with an 08 Silverado which has consumed oil at a rate of 1qt / 1k miles and has done so since day 1 when he bought it as a 1 year old vehicle. GM has been no help and he's tried several things on his own to no avail.

IMO VCM is a poor tack-on technology to help the manufacturers make their CAFE number. Has Honda perfected this technology as of today? I don't know...but at the same time I'm personally not going to take the chance on problems appearing some point down the road. The 1-2 mpg loss is just not worth that possibility for me...notwithstanding the increase in the quality of the drive with VCM deactivation.

My wife's RDX get's 24.5-25 mpg on the hwy on the occasions I've checked it...that's completely acceptable for a 270 horse AWD SUV IMO.

Everyone has to make their own decision...the more information one has, the easier it is to make that decision.

Good Luck

 

The worst of the VCM issues were with engines that had some experimental low friction piston rings. With the Odyssey that affected 2008-2013 model years.
(Honda had issues with other engines without VCM that used the rings. This was supposed to be all handled by the 2014 models, but there are reports over at
the Odyclub of a few 2014 having engine issues. I bet the VCM in the RDX is as good as it ever got, but the MPG saving is not great on an individual basis, it
is all about CAFE ratings.

I have yet to sneak a VCM device on my wife's 2016 RDX, but probably will just because of how long we end up keeping our cars. For one thing, it helps to track
down any jerkiness all these Honda V-6s seem to suffer as the trans fluid deteriorates. Is it the shifting or the VCM engaging/disengaging? Sometimes these things
happen together. The dealer can apply software updates and change the fluid three times as the TSB calls for. But they can't disable the VCM. Only you can do that.

I would not compare this little SUV to a big truck.

I also don't necessarily think the MaxLife ATF is as magic as just being on board to keeping fresh fluid in there. All Honda automatics have always required regular ATF changes.
Many who are new to Honda/Acura don't know that.

 

2014 marked a new generation of motors for GM and is very different than the AFM-enabled motors of prior generations like the one you're referring to. Mine is from the new generation.

Suggestions for disabling VCM? And, does Honda / Acura give you the same hard time about anything motor related that's covered under warranty if you've done that?

 

I've gotten very different guidance from my local mechanic as to the regular ATF changes... Granted, the car we're talking about is a 200,000 mile plus Accord, but the mechanic's stance is to leave it alone as long as it isn't showing as dirty, doesn't smell burnt, and the car is shifting ok. He has had issues where he has changed fluids in a perfectly fine car only to have it stir up crap and cause the car to misbehave and end up needing an entire transmission rebuild.

To be fair, I do suspect that the above may well be attributed to NOT having been overly diligent with changing the ATF throughout the car's life and the concern that there may now be build-up in the transmission that could get disturbed and cause issues. I would believe that regularly changing the fluid, early even, would significantly reduce the chance for issues.

 

While I would certainly agree that fresh fluid helps...in my experience, MaxLife ATF has worked when fresh OEM fluid has not. Again...starting with my 08 Odyssey, the dealership performed a drain/fill twice with 2 software updates and again when they replaced the torque converter under warranty. None of these 3 drains/fills had any kind of lasting effect (< 1 month IIRC). When I finally switched to MaxLife...the Odyssey transmission performed as it should from that point on. From that experience, my SOP going forward with any newly acquired Honda is to perform an initial drain/fill x3 and then a drain/fill every 50k miles thereafter. Works for me...YMMV.

I have the S-VCM Controller installed in my 13 RDX. My RDX is out of warranty and I've never taken it back to the dealership as I perform all its routine maintenance...but as the FTC currently interprets the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act, Acura should not be able to deny warranty coverage by use of the device. Having said that...if I had a car in warranty, I would remove it prior to any service or warranty claims at the dealership just to avoid a hassle. The S-VCM Controller easily installs and can be removed in just a few minutes.

 

Having done zero searches about this, I'm presuming it's an ODB-II plug-in device?

Since the ECM's can track changes to settings (like using a fuel management disabler), more and more dealers are winning the battles for under warranty claims that are related to the engine or similar by being able to show that the user purposefully changed the operation of the motor. So, while it may be returned to normal operation by removing the control device, the ECM would still have the ability to track that and show it to a tech.

The Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act used to be staunchly on the side of the consumer by forcing the manufacturers to prove that something that a user did directly contributed to the problem. With so much heavy integration of tech now, it's actually a bit easier for the manufacturers to show that the user purposefully changed operating parameters and that these changes have the POTENTIAL to cause an impact.

 

See this thread...plenty of explanation and user experience expressed here

S-VCM Controller now has a website

 

Thanks. Seems there are a couple of options but only getting a lot of feedback. Will definitely keep it in mind.

Thanks for all of the great info here, everyone.

Now... anyone have any tips on finding one of these things at actually reasonable prices? All of the dealers in my area are asked for premium prices and have their "Best price first" marketing fluff out there to tell you they won't negotiate. Even the off-brand dealers want top dollar for cars that simply aren't worth it.

 

Check out below - details on what CPO entails. Look at items 16 & 19 - maintenance that is within 90 of required interval must be done as part of CPO process. Most dealers check things off but don't actually do the inspection. Brake fluid changed every three years so if you are looking at off lease car with 33 months from orig inservice date, they should change fluid. Same for other things, cabin filter, rear diff fluid etc. Mid-Model refresh has some nice additional features, BLS warning, backup traffic warning, did not think these things would be a big deal but they have been very helpful. As always, make sure engine oil has been changed on schedule as well as rear diff fluid (15K). These fluids protect very expensive components and if you keep cars past warranty, you want one that has been properly maintained. Check the brake pads and rotors too - Honda rotors notorious for premature warping. Dealers try to machine off a bit to make the warping and pulsing of bad rotors as minimally noticeable as possible. New Acura rotors are like $50 each + install. Pads like $38 a set. Wagner aftermarkets are good and not expensive.

https://www.acura.com/content/pdf/CPO_150pt.pdf

 

All good info, but also reinforcing my points from my own experiences. The dealers don't check the things they claim they do. "Certifying" a car is more an exercise in checking boxes than checking components. I could take the checklist and go through it myself to ensure that things were actually verified or I could hand it off to a mechanic that I trust (any pay way less than what it runs to get the CPO badge). So, if they aren't actually validating that things are in proper working order, why am I paying a premium? I'd love to take one for an extended test drive and have my mechanic prove they didn't do the work they claimed before certifying it and then using it as a negotiating tool to drop the price... Won't happen, but it's a nice thought.

BLS? Are you talking about the Blind Spot stuff (BSI)? That's a "nice to have", but isn't a compelling feature.

On the topic of maintenance, I am using CarFax to find what I can and will either ask for paperwork for what isn't there (ha!) or will rely on the input of a solid mechanic to validate. Since I'm looking at cars in the 20k-25k range for mileage, I suspect that even missing an interval on something like the diff fluid won't be horrid since the car will have been driven so little.

 

Oh the rear cross traffic warning is the best thing since sliced bread. All the other warnings we turned off the first day. (although the side blind spot does still light up) But we have a Tech and not an Advance, so there is not everything. The audio in the Tech is killer, but the Navigation is underwhelming. The base is probably enough for the frugal. But these things are holding their value, hard to find a deal that isn't tainted.

 

Tech only is what I'm looking for. The Base is just a bit shy of the minimum and everything else adds features that are unwanted. I've come across a couple of interestingly priced ones here and there, but I guess the public just hasn't figured out that cars aren't selling and they need to walk away from bad deals for a while to get the dealerships to understand. I've reached out to two local dealerships that had cars that were priced "ok" and offered a legitimate amount for them and even told them I would finance through them. Since it's a used car, the financing would go through a regular bank and that's another chance to them to pad their profit. Both dealerships gave me some lame excuse about how they can't accept offers and then both cars disappeared 10 days later to go to the local auctions. It's infuriating how a car can sell at an auction for X and it's totally ok but they would NEVER allow X + $1000 to happen at the dealership.

If you think the NAVI is underwhelming, you should try it in any other manufacturer... Honda/Acura has one of the better functioning systems out there.

 

You have to pay for the most basic version of Acura Watch for the traffic to show. My wife did have NAV in her last Honda and we could not figure out how to use this one.
It turns out that, to manually enter an address, one pushes "menu" and not "Nav" The voice feature always defaults to phone, so that just never really works. Didn't work
for the service advisor either. Now that we know how to manually enter an address we may use it more. But we all have much better navigation on our phones. I have at least 4 different apps.

All this said, I hear the new screens that are supposed to mirror your iphone or android device are giving the service centers headaches.

 

My recollection from my 2008 MDX is that you had to have a Sirius XM subscription AND the live traffic subscription. Ridiculous waste of money.

Yes, the navigation apps on the phones are much smarter because they include realtime traffic updates (that are ACTUALLY close to real time). But the money you pay to be able to mirror that app to the navigation screen is ridiculous. I want the tech for pretty much all of the extras EXCEPT the navigation.

 

The Tech & Advance have a built in cell like GM Onstar, they call it Acuralink. That is how the traffic gets onto the NAV in this model.

https://acuralink.acura.com/#/

 

Thanks.

Is that required to leverage the GPS-Linked climate control functions? I know that in the past, the vehicle would automatically make minor adjustments to temperatures based on which side of the car was facing the sun versus being in the shade.

 

A couple of additional questions...

- If you had the chance to buy a CPO RDX with about 30k on the clock but just about zero service history available (not even though Carfax), would that concern you? I'm wondering if I should have ANY concerns about the differential potentially not having been serviced the two times it should have been by now. Dealer is citing the "inspected by an Acura certified mechanic" line, but we know what that really means...

- Thoughts on a second set of wheels to swap between three season and snows? Are there any really nice looking aftermarkets to run "normally" and relegate the OEM's to winter duty? Or should I get something more basic for winter duty and keep the OEM's for the rest of the year?

 

Having a basic service history is generally a requirement for any car I would want to purchase. Otherwise you are in for a gamble. I heard of people leasing cars and never bothering to service since they are returning it at the end of three years anyway. That could do some damage to the longevity of the engine in case you are planning to keep it for a while.

 

Yeah, exactly the sort of view that I have on this too and why I'm asking. It's not "close by", so I can't just have my own mechanic take a look at it. I've already told them that having the basic service history information is a requirement, so we'll see what happens.

 

The one we bought had little history. There was a Carfax, but very little on it. It is my opinion that it is pretty hard to do much damage to a Honda in 30k miles.
In fact, I would rather have one that the previous owner waited on the first oil change. There are polymers in the factory fill that should not be dumped early.
The lack of history does affect the price in your favor.

 

That's sort of what I was thinking. There's a 3-day money-back on it, so all I need to do is line it up to drive it straight to my mechanic to be sure it's all good.

I agree with not changing that first batch of oil out until the car tells you to. The additives from the factory combined with a full break-in cycle are what make those motors completely bullet proof over time.

 

My new-to-me 2018 RDX had 11K miles on it and was CPO. I came from Mercedes, and my model year was full of problems, and on stuff that I had never heard of and that never should not have gone wrong with a "luxury" car. I did not have CPO then, and that experience made me keen on getting it for the next car. So far, so good, and glad to have the warranty. I take comfort from having it.

I try to learn from my earlier missteps...