I know quite a number of ppl have had failed trannies, but was there any reason given from the dealer WHY the tranny failed? I mean, there must be a reason for the failure. Did something not get installed properly? Did some part break or wear out?

I heard from my service advisor (Robert Paris of Stevens Creek Acura) that he had seen 2 failed trannies. In both cases, it was because of some bolt that had not been torqued to spec or not properly installed. Something to that effect.

What have you guys experienced?

 

They didn't tell me - cause they don't know at the dealership. They call the failure in to the warranty center and are told 'put a new one in'. They don't take em apart at the dealership. I don't know if they then dispose of it or ship it back to some engineering center. At this point it seems any link between you and 'that' tranny is gone.

Acura customer service will neither tell you what became of your tranny or comment on tranny problems in general. Their standard response is 'Acura does not have tranny problems'.

 

My first car was a four year old 1964 Buick Electra 225 with a bullet proof reliable no computer to control it Turbo Hydromatic 300 automatic transmission. I sold the car in 1971. When I lost track of it circa 1975 the transmission had never been overhauled and probably contained the original atf.

It seems we have made great strides backwards in automatic transmission technology (with Acura/Honda leading the retro-race). Although they are now computer controlled, smaller, and lighter, they seem to fail much more frerquently. I suspect the smaller and lighter part has a lot to do with this. I also suspect as a result of being smaller and lighter they run a lot hotter. In other words, material wise they are much wimpier but are asked to operate at much higher temperatures with relatively large engines.

I also have no clue what the high tech computers are supposed to do. My 1998 3.0 CL is my first automatic since the 1964 Buick. However, I do not recollect any performance or rough shifting problems with the old Turbo Hydromatic. In fact, I remember it being quite responsive and smooth shifting with that big V8 driving it. My CL does not shift any smoother but has that noticeable and annoying hesitation every time I suddenly give it throttle. So what have we gained with the whiz bang electronics?

My transmission just required a $1400 overhaul with less than 100k on the car. This will be my final and last automatic ever. It will also be my last Honda product.

 

This is my 1st automatic too. I owned 6 manual transmission cars & now the Acura. I got tired of shifting & figured I could go 100k easy without having to worry about clutch replacements.

I was always hard on clutches.

So much for a maintence free auto-trans!

 

This has got to be my biggest gripe with Acura/Honda.
The Denial that there is a problem.

My mother-in-law has a '99 Avalon & a 27k the engine started burning oil
& smoking pretty bad on startup.
So I take it in for her & the Service rep calls me the next day & says we know exactly what the problem is & we have a TSB for it.
A bunch of V-6's got built in the Avalon/Camry/4Runner/Tacoma with bad valve guide seals.
We're going to pull the heads, clean 'em up & put in new seals that will fix the known problem.
"Don't worry we'll take care of it." Got a loaner & everything.
It was fixed in less than a week & runs fine once again.

That is honest & straight forward customer service.

Why in the Hell can't Acura address this issue the same way ?!?

Has Acura not figured out the problem after 12+months ??

Have the Honda bean counters done a cost benefit analysis & determined it's not worth it to find a permanent solution?
It's just cheaper to keep replacing tranny's with an inherent design flaw ??

Are they just sticking their collective heads in the sand a the expense of permanently loosing customers ?

I don't get it & the attitude they display doesn't inspire confidence.

 

My dealer told me it was "defective" that's it.

 

Well, I could "ramble-on" for a few days about "all-of-this"...

1. Diff carrier bearings (a couple of birds told me)

2. Torque converter (multiple birds and some guessing).. (not the slip/flare stuff)

3. Heat issues -- my own personal mini-math sessions based on a cooler the size of a hockey-puck and a heat load that would tax a good sized B&M stand-alone unit when the tranny is putting out all 260HP at full load (think of going up a mountain at 6800 RPM on a hot day, and I'll put money down that it won't last too long.
Of course, there were a few nice tech. folks that did report that some of the "fried" trannies had ATF that looked like it just came out of the ground (nice black, smelly, with a certain roasted aroma)...

4. Synergy of crud – Take a dash too much heat, weak diff carrier bearing that shed metal (with magnetic properties / AKA ferrous metal) into the shift solenoids -- that by definition generate a magnetic field -- and you now have “dueling” clutch packs (they engage at the same time and fry each other out). Then, you have the clutch material that starts to infiltrate into and through the tranny once the solenoids go, and ... well, what a mess..

5. The tech factor -- Now, toss-in, mechanics that need an AA degree in electronics and transmission diagnostics, and a course in systems integration and defect tracking to properly get a handle on all of the various "parts" that might need replacement in addition to the transmission proper. For example, if you have a bum PCM and it tells the clutch packs to not engage at the right time, you have some serious problems that may or may escape the diagnostics. (Just think of the possibilities once you don’t replace ALL of the tranny related parts, fluid, etc. on a car that’s on tranny #2.)

And

1. If Acura said, "Hey, we are bunch of losers and gave you a POS tranny, but have a bunch of 400HP/400 ft-lb models that we just don't feel like giving you, I would bet (being a firm believer in human nature) that those who knew of the failures would be mighty temped to give the current box "a ‘special’ workout" – to insure that the current one failed – and insist on a replacement with the "real-deal super-beef tranny". (So, I'm not saying something couldn't be worked out, but it might help to "play” pretend car manufacturer for a while, and think about those articles on car companies that have “folks” working the balance sheets, figuring out how long to keep a defect in a car based on the human lives lost (per year) vs. cost of fixing all the suspect/”killer” cars… .

2. How awful – let me do the math… I’m going to assume a 2% failure with 20,000 cars a year. And that all 2% get two replacement transmission per year. Now, at $5,000 a pop, that works out to .02 * 20,000 * 5,000 * 2 = 4 million bucks per year. So, you say, how can Acura afford this? If they are going to kill the CLS anyway, they are looking at some additional warranty extensions, some time to keep the tranny plant open to keep the second sales going long enough to clear the lease-backs off the lots, and problem gone. If they replaced the transmission in every car (based on 20,000 in just one year) and assuming only one year’s replacement, the cost works out to: 100-million bucks! So, looking at the PR issue, why not later just blow the tranny issue of as a bad experience that they learned from and replace the whole sucker with a CVT and electric motor. With the recent talk regarding the environment and no V8 power, it looks like Honda is going to be friendly to whales and enthusiasts (yes/no/perhaps?). There is something to say for hybrid technology when used as a “pulsed power” platform; in green mode, it takes the braking and otherwise lost energy back into batteries for low gas engine usage OR it can be used to “tank-up” the batteries for a fast quarter-mile run… Who knows?




$0.02 -- just my opinion...

 

So what are you saying? That if I didn't get the 400HP/400 ft-lb model my newly replaced tranny could potentially go out in another 20k miles? Also you are saying the CL is going to be scrapped?

 

1. There are a number of people that reported that the CLS is not going to be continued past 2003 (as the CLS). Meaning is vague, and for all I know they come out with a CLX -- don't know.


2. I never said that your tranny is going to fail at 20K more miles. It might fail tomorrow, or it might run for 150K miles. I have low miles and my tranny is fine (knock on wood). AS to the replacements, some seem to fix things and other people seem to only go a short while before they are onto #2, etc.

3. The notion of a 400hp/400tq tranny (think about the new G35 with it getting a V8 transmission for a V6) is a comment on what could be, and on what could be a possible outcome if it were available. Could you honestly tell me that is this "mythical" transmission existed, that you wouldn't want one? There have already been a few members that suggested that they would consider "abusing" their trannies in the hope of getting a "new" transmission if it truly had "upgraded" components. (Does that imply that everyone would do something like that? Of course not!)


Look, there are some people that only have a few thousand miles and have the tranny go. There have been others that got 50K+ miles out of a tranny.

So, there are some problems in "some" of the trannies -- as to how to know... that's the million dollar question!

Also, there were two different people who mentioned the differential carrier bearings as being a weak area in the transmission. The existing case (two halves), is too small to take a bigger one (so I’ve been told). I was told that Acura was trying to put the best/strongest bearing they could in there. The question is -- will it stand-up to heavy use? I have no idea.