vipertrunk

My first original thread on Acurazine! I have done some searching, but haven't found a satisfactory answer to some paint questions.

Everyone loves pics, so here's my baby '01 CLS SSM (bone stock). I am the original owner:

[IMG][/IMG]

She is pretty clean, but the blemishes are adding up and I'm going to repaint next spring. I intend to use the same color and want a quality paint job with the following characteristics:

Matches original color
More durable than Acura paint
Deep shine

I'm not a paint expert, so what type of paint am I looking for? I assume it will be a base-coat, clear-coat - but I don't even know what to ask for and don't want to be snowed by a body shop.

Caveats: this is (and will remain) my daily driver. I'm not going to paint the engine bay, door jambs, inside of trunk - etc. That paint is in good condition and I don't want to spend that much money on my daily driver.

I'm willing to spend about $2K. There are some minor scratches that must be repaired, but nothing that could be called a "dent."

If any of the paint "pros" could weigh in, I'd appreciate it. I'm really looking for paint types (enamel, poly, lacquer etc) and any good/bad experiences or advice. If anyone happens to be in, or near, the Montgomery AL area and can recommend a shop that would also be appreciated.

stic2it

iTrader: (1)

I want to paint my baby as well, after having her out here in Cali, the hood is to shit now.

RaviNJCLs

iTrader: (4)

The thing you have to consider is getting the paint to match and also to have a good quality job.

Are you planning on painting the entire car? Remember that your car is 5 years old and there are likely areas that are faded. My advise if you plan on keeping the car for a while will be to paint the entire car. But for that you will need to come up with more than $2000 for a good job.

I had my entire car re-painted when I got rear-ended. The owner of the shop told me that if I just wanted to pay to paint my car, it would run me about $5K. I also had my Maxima re-painted and it cost me about $2200. There was a huge difference in quality.

Also....you've been a member since 2005 and just 3 posts?

fuzzy02CLS

iTrader: (2)

A repaint is likely not needed. A good body shop can wet sand & use special cleaners & abrasives to bring out the paint to almost new. For far less then $2K.

vipertrunk

But I have a couple of scrapes that are through the paint and down to the metal/plastic. There is no way around painting at least part of the car. Let me show you what I mean:

This little gem courtesy of either the dealer or Acura - it's obviously a ding that was touched up before the car was sold. I didn't even notice until 2 years later when the paint started to oxidize.

Here's a couple more on the drivers side door:

Hit in a parking lot, about 3 years ago.

This is my personal favorite:

This was my fault, backed into a barb-wire fence.

Anyway, I figure that every single body panel (except the roof and passenger's side door) has a deep scratch of some kind. The rest of the paint is (fairly) good, but I wonder how well the paint could be matched and I don't want to end up with a car that looks like a dalmation.

RaviNJCLs: Also....you've been a member since 2005 and just 3 posts?

Yep. I have watched too many people get flamed for posting stupid questions without using search - so I always really looked for an answer here before posting. And, generally I always found it. Plus, I'm stationed overseas and doing work on my car has been a far-away dream - so just never posted much. But I'll be back in the CONUS soon and fixing up the car is looming closer.

I don't think I'm going to spend $5K on a car that's only worth about $12K - especially since I have a long list of mods (in addition to paint) that I want to do. I'll open a poll though:

How much did you pay for your paint job?
What type of paint/brand of paint did they use?
Did they remove the glass/chrome/plastic and shoot the whole car or mask?
Did you go original color, or a different color?

Thanks for the replies!

fuzzy02CLS

iTrader: (2)

It looks like they could spot paint the areas & then blend the areas around in. The bumpers can be sanded, bondo'd & painted, or replaced & then painted. Some paintwork yes, but $2K is more then enough.

vipertrunk

The paint in the non-scratched areas is actually not that bad - and if the shop could actually match the paint correctly - it would be more economical.

I do have a question about your earlier post:
A repaint is likely not needed. A good body shop can wet sand & use special cleaners & abrasives to bring out the paint to almost new.

I assume the Acura SSM paint is a color coat of SSM covered by a clear-coat. Most cars are these days and that's what it looks like to me.

If they wet sand and use those cleaners and abrasives, won't they just be working on the clear-coat? Or will they actually work down to the color coat and restore that? I understand (after some research here on acurazine) that impurities in the paint/clear coat will dull the finish over time; that's why detailers use clay (or chemical products) to strip those impurities off before they "wax" and detail the car. Is that what you were talking about when you said: "special cleaners and abrasives?"

I'm not trying to be difficult, I just don't understand what they would actually do and how it would work.

My only experience painting a car was my '84 Vette and I did all the prep work myself. I will never prep a fiberglass car again. That sucks. It was a total re-paint though, so I didn't have to worry about matching the paint and blending.

Thank you for the advice. I'm really looking forward to making the car pretty again, but as I said earlier I want to be economical. The other mods I want will be significant costs as well when they all add up.

fuzzy02CLS

iTrader: (2)

Most stuff is in the clear coat yes, but they could also go down to paint & then shoot some clear back over the spot.
I've seen good body shops do amazing work on making 10 year old paint look like new.
It's all in the quality of the body shop.

RaviNJCLs

iTrader: (4)

I paid almost nothing for the paint job. Some moron rear-ended me and I worked out a deal with the body shop. He painted the entire car for hardly any thing from me.

I'm not 100% sure which paint he used. I can check.

He stripped the car to paint it. It was a weird sight seeing ever piece of chrome and plastic off the car.

And it was the original color.

RaviNJCLs

iTrader: (4)

Based on the pics you posted though, I'm sure they can fix it up without painting the entire thing.

vipertrunk

It will still be a few months before I'm able to get the work done, but I am looking forward to it.

I still put a lot of time and effort into making the car look pretty - and when I put a good coat of wax on it - it is still a nice looking machine, blemishes and all.

I'll expand my question to ask:

Those of you who've had an "ugly spot" or two fixed on a car OR
If you've had the paint "rejuvenated" (if you will) instead of repainting...

Please tell me the good and the bad.

Also, what sort of experiences have people had with these plastic bumpers being repaired? I know the paint on my old corvette faded first on the plastic bumpers. That would lead me to believe that the paint might be more faded there than on the rest (even though it's not readily apparent to me). I would also think that patching gouges in the plastic would be tougher than on the metal of the car. Just curious.

Have people had good luck or bad luck with patching up and repainting the bumpers rather than replacing them?

RaviNJCLs

iTrader: (4)

I have never had great experiences with painted bumpers. The paint always seem to crack over time. And I've had bumpers painted 4 or 5 different times at different places. NYC parkers sucks.

gbone88

Hey, these are the questions that make me feel useful in this forum. I've been in the body shop biz for 16 years now. I am very good at what I do. I have seceral cars in the " World of Wheels" show which is in Chicago. You say there are no dents in your car just some minor scratches? Getting the whole car repainted would not be in your best interest if that is the case. Getting the car buffed would be your best bet. Buffing will get rid of alot of the minor imperfections in your clearcoat. By doing this it will look "shinier" As far as the bigger scratches go- generally if you can feel them with your nail they will not be able to be buffed. Our cars are painted basecoat/clearcoat. Basically there is "e" coat on the bare metal. This etches the metal which gives everything else something to hold on to. After that comes the basecoat which in your case(and mine) is the silver. This is just color.It has no ultraviolet repelling qualities what so-ever. After usually about 3 coats of the base comes the clearcoat. A high solid urethane clear is what you want. there is a 2 coat minimum with this. Extra coats will not make the final product look any different. They will however give you more material to work with down the line. Then the cured paint job will be wet sanded with 1500-2000 grit sandpaper and buffed. Did I get off the subject? At my shop $2000 would not get very far. For a paint job to be done right there is a lot of disassembly and reassembly involved. Bumper covers, lights, door handles, mirrors,belt moldings, glass, rocker moldings--pretty much all exterior trim should come off to do it right. If it is not there won't be good adhesion and the clear WILL eventually start flaking off. So before you go getting your whole car painted make sure of the process the body shop is going to do. Are they going to disassemble what is necessary? How are they going to prep the undamaged paint? Are they using a BC/CC system? Is there a guarantee? Our paint jobs are guaranteed for the life of the car (hazing, adhesion, discoloration,etc.) I hope I was somewhat of a help and remember YOU GET WHAT YOU PAY FOR!!!!!! GBONE

vipertrunk

"Hey, these are the questions that make me feel useful in this forum. I've been in the body shop biz for 16 years now."

These are the answers that make me love the forum, thanks.

I was waxing my car this weekend, and took inventory of the scratches and dings.

The scratch count is pretty high, but most are pretty small and nearly all on the bottom 3rd of the car - here's a few examples:
-3 Chips in the hood. Small, but I could definitely feel them with my fingernail.

-1 scratched area on the hood - on the corner nearest the driver's door. I'm sure it was caused by setting something on the hood when it was dirty and then sliding the object across the hood. I don't remember doing it, but I'm not the only driver either (married.)

-The front bumper has 2 gouged areas that have no paint at all (black undercoating shows) and one side has a scrape mark on the bottom - I'm sure from a tall curb or parking stop that I scraped. At best I believe this bumper will have to be totally refinished by a pro - or perhaps replaced. The scrape removed some material on the bottom lip - not obvious, but it's there.

-I have the standard scratches on/around the doors from parking lots. One is a scrape where my wife intro'd the door to another car's bumper. It's mostly in the paint, but as you can see in the second picture of my second post - there is a slight ripple in the sheet metal there(1/2 inch tall, 1/8 inch wide ripple). 10 feet away you can't see it, but it will definitely have to be straightened out and it's down to the metal.

-I have the ugly spot on the trunk lid that will simply have to be sanded down to the metal, primed and painted. First pic of my second post.

-And, of course, I have the barb-wire scratches in the rear bumper.

Both front fenders are clean, rear 1/4 panels are clean, roof and pillars are clean - everything else has a chip or scratch of some kind.

As a question for the pro(s) - Gbone or others - how will a quality (and honest) body shop determine when the "refinishing" cost/pain exceeds the "repaint" cost/pain? I know that repainting costs more - although I don't know if it has a higher profit margin. I'm sure that, if there is more profit to be made in a re-paint, a dubious body shop is going to tell me that it can't be refinished. Other than getting a second/third opinion and doing my research on the body shops - how can I convince the shop that I really want the car refinished, if at all possible?

Should I lead off with that suggestion, and resist the re-paint option? Should I say "You're the pro - you tell me?" "Here's my wallet - phone me when you're done?" (kidding!)

Thanks again for the great replies, everyone!

ChucksCL-S

Just take your car to a really good paint shop in your area and show them what you want fixed. Tell them you don't really want a total re-paint, that you just want the car to look new again with all panels matching and that you are on a budget. $2000 dollars at $80 (or whatever it is in your area) an hour plus materials might just do the trick. The owner or manager of the shop will tell you what he can do, so go from there.

gbone88

Being able to fix my own cars kind of blurs how I would go about getting one fixed. I see where you are leary. I would ask around(friends,family) about a good shop in your area. If you can find that the rest will take care of itself. If it is a good honest shop they will give you a fair reasonable estimate. I would go in there and show them exactly what you want done. If they come at you with something called "blending" it is not them trying to rip you off. Say you have a dent or deep scratch by your door handle.By the time that is repaired the primer will be right up to the door edge.Now on just about every color but black it would require blending to achieve an undetectible color match. Along with painting that damaged door the 1/4 panel would also be refinished. The basecoat(silver) would be applied over the primered area and then it would be blended into the adjacent 1/4 panel. The whole 1/4 panel would not be colored because that would defeat the purpose of the blend. After the base is blended the complete panels would be clearcoated. By doing this correctly there should be no color difference seen. As far as your car goes the bumpers should be able to be repainted without blending the 1/4 panels. For some reason the particular color of your car(codeNH623M) matches up good on bumper repaints. So don't let them tell you they would have to blend the 1/4's and fender in order to paint your bumpers. As far as the chips in the hood go- as long as there are only a few you should not have to get into the fenders. When you do go for the estimate make sure of the process like I said before. If they're painting a door are they removing the handle/mirror/belt molding? That will be something you would want to pay extra for. you should not have a problem getting the damaged areas on your car for under$2000. If you want when you get the estimate give me a hollar gbone88@yahoo.com and I'll look over it and give you my opinion..........GBONE

vipertrunk

Well, I think I've gotten what I needed out of this post - thanks for all the great advice - particularly GBone.

I'll still take advice, success stories or horror stories if you have them - or this post can die a slow death. Hopefully it can help other folks with the same questions.

I can't wait to ship it back to the USA so I can get the dings repaired!

vipertrunk

I assume the answer is "yes", but is it pretty easy to get the paint shop to remove the pinstripe on the car? How about de-badging the trunk-lid? (I'm keeping the "A" symbol and removing the rest.) I know I could de-badge it myself, but I need the trunk lid worked on anyway and that way they can refinish the areas where the badges were at the same time.

Thanks!

So much for the thread "dying a slow death, huh?"

kik

Awesome. I wish every thread was like this. Too often you have to read unecessary garbage, but it's check's and balances that count in the end.