Scooter

was thinking of Hawk, but noticed Cobalt Friction...heard from fellow autox'ers EBC green/redstuff pads suck tho

i don't wanna spend hella much, but Hawk's prices seem to b perfect

any other opinions??? thx

Red Rider

Better late than never Scooter. I've been doing alot of brake research lately and read a great article in Car And Driver comparing various brake upgrades for a WRX. They compared stock, Hawk pad upgrade and 3 big Brake kits including 2 Brembos. To make a long story short they loved the Hawks and there was a significant gain in shortening the length of braking. Sounds like a good purchase for under $80-90. Good luck.

liquid_x

what about the endless pads. they are a reputable company but i have never heard of anyone on the boards with them on.

aruca_RENAMED

I just installed my Hawk HPS pads on Monday (and Brembo blank rotors - front)......................and so far I'm very very pleased. It took about 2 days to break it in, but after that - it has been really responsive. Before, when I step on my break pedal - I had to slowly increase my foot pressure to make a complete stop. Now it seems like as the car get slower - the more it grips, I don't have to push my pedals any further.
Just make sure you get the Street pads, not the racing.

Scooter

right right...that's what i was looking for...now to find that article

lou_RENAMED

here is the article

http://www.caranddriver.com/xp/Caran...=brakes&page=1

by the way how do these pads compare with the Brembo after 4 stops from 90MPH on the WRX the stock averaged 340 feet, the Hawks averaged 316 and the Brembo averaged 185 feet after 4 stops from 90 mph. How can 316 ft to 185 ft even be considered comparable, its night and day if you ask me.

and from stock to Hawk there is only a difference of 24 ft. after 4 stops so thats roughly 6 feet per stop not BAD but still doesn't compare to Brembo and also keep in mind that if the test was 10 stops the difference would be greater.

cakennedy

I have Hawk HPS pads on my 330ci, and I give them a mixed review. Very little difference from OEM on the street, but noticeable difference on the track. Much higher initial-bite torque, and seemed a little more fade resistant than the OEMs, which didn't fade much anyway. Overall stopping distance (not scientifically tested) seems about the same as OEM (which are made by Pagid).

BUT, I'm about to take the Hawk pads off and use them only on the track, because they squeal something awful. I did the break-in/bedding procedure properly, and I've applied antisqueal to the pad backs twice. The problem is that the Hawk pads do not include the thin metal shims riveted to the back of the OEM pads. So, if your CL OEM pads have a similar metal shim, the Hawk pads could be unpleasantly loud.

CLpower

from what i've heard to hard a compound to use on stock rotors



i'd go w/ hawk, i've heard good things about them.

Scooter

Lou, thanx for proving u can't read...

#1, Hawk pads tested 4 times from 90 - 0 averaged 316 feet

#2, "The F50 kit had the shortest average stop from 70 mph (185 feet); the Lotus kit needed another 15 feet on average"

#3, "The StopTech is the least expensive kit, yet it performed as well as the others. It had the shortest average stopping distance in the 90-mph fade test — 297 feet — and at 187, was only two feet behind the Brembo F50's 185-foot average in stopping from 70 mph."

conclusion: it's pretty apparent that the premium u pay with Brembo's is not justified...if u wanna compare the Hawk brake pads alone against the Brembo kit, it's comparing apples to oranges...i initially TRIED to compare apples to apples by using my ss-lines (Goodridge) against the Brembo standard ss-lines, cd/slotted rotors against the Brembo cd only rotors, and Hawk pads on stock calipers against the 4-piston Brembo calipers w/ pads...the prices of my put-together braking system cost me X-amount, while the Brembo kit cost over $2K, and by saving over $1000 dollars, i sacrifice a certain amount of braking...and since the StopTech had the shortest 90 - 0 distance of 297 feet, the difference between the Hawk's and Brembo's is somewhere under 20 feet (keep in mind this is pads vs. whole kit)...so tell me again y i should b paying over $2K for the kit

lou_RENAMED

Since my post was a direct response from your initial post about the Hawk pads performing surprisingly well compared to the Brembo Big Brake kit after reading that article that was never mentioned. How you got that presumption is beyond me.

Since this is the article that you were referring to as your proof of the Hawk pads testing surprisingly well against the Brembo I read it again. Here is what I got from it and feel free to correct me if Im wrong.

Lets look at the test car WRX a vehicle which weighs 3085 compared to the CL-S 3500.

Ok now that we got that out of the way we can start on the article here are the baseline figures that they used. After 4 stops the stock WRX averaged (340 ft) so about 85 ft. per stop while the Hawk pads did it in (316 ft) around 79 feet per stop. They didn't do any more test stops after the 4 runs because the brakes were fading too much.

Then they tested the Brembo Brake kits two different ones the F50 and the Lotus which they tested from 70-0 MPH. Why they tested from 70 MPH is beyond me but that right there doesn't prove squat compared to stock figures.


the Brembo F50 did the 70-0 an average of 185 in 4 runs so 46 ft. per stop while the Lotus averaged 200 around 50 feet per stop.. I couldn't even speculate what the footage would be if they did it from 90-0 but Im assuming it will be a lot less than the 316 the Hawk pads did it. Tell me again how a difference of 100ft. in 4 runs proves that Hawk pads tested even close to Brembo's. I did not even read about stoptech or what ever they tested after since its not even made for our car. All I was trying to say is the the Hawk pads is a good first step and thats it....it will in no way compare to a complete kit whatever brand you choose. You should know better than that if your satisfied with that good but its not close scooter no matter which way you slice it.

lou_RENAMED

here you go Scooter from the same article

Increasing the rotor size is important because the brake rotors dissipate much of the heat that is generated when the brakes are applied. Aftermarket rotors dissipate heat better than stock ones, owing not only to their larger surface area but also to more effective venting.


the pads bite better and will perform better to stock but will still heat up. You have to upgrade to a bigger rotor that is a legitamate cross-drilled rotor or just any slotted rotor. The stock rotors with holes in it are just for show purposes don't believe me ask around you'll be surprised what you hear.

liquid_x

so are we all agreeing that hawk is the way to go?

Scooter

if u don't wanna spend a ton of money on the Brembo's, yes

lou_RENAMED

yes they do improve the fade that you will experience with the stock pads. For the money its a great investment by far and some slotted/crosdrilled rotors with SS lines like Scooter has will be even better. The only step after that would be Brembo or Rotora for even greater non-fade braking but it does come with its price. Like the saying goes YOU GET WHAT YOU PAY FOR.

Only reason I went with Brembo is because my car was due for front brake job soon and I picked up a set for a great price. I still think Brembo are the best aftermarket kit available for our cars even though some test will show differently.

Scooter

here ya go, Lou, fromt the same article

so i'm gonna spend an extra grand for what??? 20 feet???

dajuice27

I'M SO CONFUSED!!!!!!

Scooter

i'm not

it's pretty clear to me that u don't have to spend an arm & a leg to get good performance out of yer brakes, performance that's almost as good, the same as, even BETTER than kits costing over 17 times as much money

the numbers speak for themselves...not sure what else to say

foe

do the hawks make schreeching sounds?

flint

iTrader: (2)

Lou,

What offset on your rims did you need to clear the brembo caliper?

korchen

So are Axxis Metal Master pads ok to use? Or does everyone here not like them?

ch1276

i have axxis metal masters and they do make a screeching sound when they are cold, its kind of annoying, i'm thinking about switching them

drrfs

Another alternative. I also participate in the Taurus SHO forum and we're getting Carbotech Bobcat pads for our SHO's. So I am going to have them make a set for my CLS too. I have to send them some front backing plates since they don't have the Acura blanks. Check out the Bobcats -- much better than other ceramic pads I have read about -- with less rotor wear but still the same kind of excellent cold stopping, low dust, etc.


03 CLS 6spd
OZ Racing 17x8 PilotSport AS 235/45/17
icebox
ground control/Konis

thatguy

get these!!!

http://www.endlessusa.com/estore/spo...50&submit.y=15

peiqinglong

I recommend the Porterfield R4S. Less brake dust than stock and NO squeaking or squealing. Also Endless makes bombass brakes.

EricL

Porterfield ... yep....

drrfs

You might also try Carbotech -- Bobcat pad material. I have it on three vehicles. Excellent stopping, low dust, low rotor wear. Got it from the (Taurus) SHO forum -- a bunch of similar performance minded people...

fender4

I just bought the axis ultimate and rotora blanks,, will be putting them on this week end,, any body try these ??

SpeedyV6

I'm afraid you're misinterpreting what you read. The average stopping distance is per stop not the sum of stopping distances over 4 stops. If you find a car that can stop from 70 - 0 mph in 46 feet let me know![If you don't believe me take a look at the 70-0 stopping distances in the C&D Road test reviews.]

The main benefits of larger rotors are: increased fade resistance, diminished susceptibility to warping, & increased mechanical advantage when gripping the rotor because of a larger radius - this translates to a better initial bite but not to greatly reduced stopping distances.