Rest of the article is here.

http://www.jdpa.com/pdf/2004037.pdf


Discuss.

 

Wow Hummer is always at the bottom of this list.

Did Acura fall a few spots since the last list was out? Also is Scion really being considering a seperate company from Toyota?

 

Buick, Mercury and Hyundai seemed to have leapfrogged quite a bit of the competition. I'm EXTREMELY surprised to see Hyundai there.

 

Hmmm.. That interesting. I'm still operating under the impression that they're crap, but I guess my opinion was formed in the 80s. Turns out I'm wrong (again)

Looks like the quality is great on the Hyundai, but I wonder if the resale values are up with the initial quality numbers

 

It'd be tough for me to spend 20K on a car, and have it depreciate almost half of what I paid for it on the first year.

 

As I expected, Hyundai is gearing towards quality as their japanese counterparts (something that Toyota did on the seventies)

Very good for them. I really like that brand. If I could not afford an Acura I would've definetely consider looking at the Tiburon.

 

Tell me about it. I've had my CLS 6spd for 1 1/2 years and it's probably worth 2/3 (20K??) now

I bought an Acura because I thought I'd be getting decent quality and resale value. I'm jaded now w/ acura.

With the Hyundai at least I'd have known what I was getting into up front.

 

Yup, I agree monster.


This is my last acura/honda product EVER.

 

Jeese Cadillac has been busy these past few years eh? My 97 Catera was utterly horrible - that score is surprising and shows some nice changes to the make (but still not enough to ever buy a Big 3 car ever again).

 

Best part is Hyundai has that long arse warranty to boot.

Before I got my Maxima I...gulp...actually considered the Sonata V6. But its power was just SOOOO inadequate. Given Navi and at least 240hp it WOULD BE a contender.

And it looks like Hummer actually improved quite a bit; I kind of recall '225 problems per 100 vehicles' last year.

peace.

 

Monster, I'm surprised that you didn't consider that coupes tend to have worse resale when compared to sedans. I don't think Acura resale is bad per se, as the TLs have pretty good resale, but I figured that with the CL being a coupe and having known that it didn't sell well it would not have the greatest resale value. Why are you surprised now? I've seen you post about this several times now.

Yeah and Acura took a quality hit over the last year on so on that JD powers survey, but we all expected this with the bad trannies. Overall I am willing to give up a little quality (TL<any hyundai) for a little more sportiness (TL>any hyundai). As for the other cars with "better" quality, well either they are too pricey (GS4xx, 540, E430/500) or I just plain and simply didn't like what they had (Buick, Olds, Jag, etc). A few others I considered but preferred the TL.

Good for Hyundai and others that have improved and tisk-tisk for Acura and those others that didn't!

 

WOW.... This looks like something I read about yesterday.
Oh wait......I DID

http://www.acura-cl.com/forums/showt...hreadid=139014

 

Damn its a

 

I know that coupes aren't the best bet for resale (my last car was a coupe). I guess I'm just bitter that since the CL has been discontinued the resale value has been plummeting.

When I was researching the CL prior to buying, I read that the CL should retain about 50% of it's value after 5 years. It looks like it'll be worth 50% alot sooner then 5 yrs.

 

Wow. I cant believe this study.

What do they concider a "problem"...? I just find it hard to believe that Porsche has so many problems..


From my experiences from working at dealers, they more expensive the car, the more it was brought back into the shop.

For example. Lincoln. Most drivers are of an older age. They would come back every time they heard a squeek or something felt wierd. Most people I know with Hondas just drive the damn car. They have small things that have been wrong with the car from day 1, but they never do anyting about it. Do you think any of these things are taken into concideration.???

 

This doesn't surprise me at a bit .. my ownership experience with my 3rd Acura (2nd CLS) has been below avg .. it doesn't surprise me that Acura scored just a bit above average .. good thing they don't factor in the crappy dealership experience that Acura offers .. because they'd be at the bottom of the list. But I know one thing .. I will not pay above avg prices for an average quality car with crappy dealers again .. Acura ... kiss this repeat customer goodbye .. hope it is easier to win new customers than it is to maintain repeats ...

 

This thing is crap, my dad has had porsches for 20 years and never had a problem.

 

Its the SUV thats hurting them.

 

Wow lots of suprises there! I didn't expect Mazda and Nissan to be so low on the list.

 

I remember seeing something that was done by car instead of manufacturer and I'm pretty sure the porsche 911 was #1 in reliability. one bad apple can ruin everything in that ranking.

 

Fuck it, it's still a Hyundai

 

Wise words.

 

I dont get it. The study is per 100 vehicles. How can half of them have a greater number than 100?

 

The same car returned multiple times in 90 days for repairs.

 

Yeah, but the Porsches of 20 years ago were alot less complex then the ones today. Heck, today they even have radiators in 'em

Dad must have an 80's Carrera (20 years old). Those had Motronic fuel injection so the guys with MFI (mechanical FI) would probably say that the Carrera were more complex then the early 911s (1965-1973).

Like Crazy sellout mentioned the SUV is even more complex with more, doors, seats, interior peices, etc. etc. with a greater possiblity of problems arising.

 

+1

 

No no, hes had a 944, 968, and then 3 911's . All have been rock solid, currently has a 03 Carrera

 

the cayenne is what killed porsche

 

^^ what are the problems with the cayenne?

 

Porsche should have stayed out of the suv(or whatever they call them now) mess...the last caddy I drove was a huge 2003 deville....that was quiet and fast, my mom and step dad have had no problems at all...

 

interesting that honda is up top and acrua is at the bottom... consider most all the cars in the lineup are identical short of the body

 

Maybe acura owners are more anal with their surveys?

 

damn acuras low?, its probably trannys

 

Wait...the Cayenne has been a cash cow for Porsche. You see, Porsche is a weird company....they actually want a profit margin. Go figure.

 

honda and acura 5-speed trannys are all questionable...

 

This survey is done after 3 months of ownership or lease. I don't see how tranny problems could effect it too much. Most tranny failures in the Tl/CL seemed to happen later than 90 days, and the 03 seems to have even less tranny problems.

It is impressive tho, that after 3 months of use that Hyundai had fewer problems than all the other makes below it. But it's all relative, and most of the cars above the average are very trouble free.