Nashua_Night_Hawk

What a cool idea. I hope one day I would see a G-Force based warnning system that will show you the G-forces the car is doing +1G -1G on any of 360 degree axises. Also, Showing the components of the G-force vector, forward/backward, left/right would be cool too.

The best would be a cool human voice saying : " Warnning, Warnning, you are on the verge of Skidding, Skidding is immminante!"

Something like that in an air fighter, "Eject, Eject, you'are screwed"

------------------
Black, Eboney, 3.2 CL Type-S.
- Acura NAV.
- 3M clear bra (full front bumper, and side mirros)
- Wheels locks.
- Mooonroof visor
- Splash guards,
- Winter mats,
- Trunk liner,
- Acura Spoiler.
- Valentine V1 Radar Locator.
- PIAA 19169 road lamps.

soopa

heh heh heh

------------------
2001 Acura 3.2 CL Type-S
San Marino Red (Navigation)
PIAA 19173 Ion Yellow Fog Lights
Aftermarket Black Wood Trim Kit

CLpower

it's called a nagging girlfriend

KavexTrax

------------------
- Kvit -
2001 CL-P Monterey Blue, Parchment interior
Polarg BlHybrid M-6 Road lamps
Polarg/PIAA super white interior lights *bling bling*
http://albums.photopoint.com/j/Album...725&a=10358832
Club Events Moderator

[This message has been edited by KavexTrax (edited 02-27-2001).]

mishka420

Damn man, its sounds like my girlfriend and your girlfriend are sisters. She never stop screaming when I start going into turns.


------------------
01' CL Type-S, Navigation, Spoiler
4% tint on the backs and 34% on the fronts
Eibach Pro-Kit Springs (2" Drop)

CLpower

yep, but then when they drive there stock cars it's like they are F1 racing

F=ma_RENAMED

R34 Skyline GTR's come stock with an accelerometer with display in all directions... for accelerating, braking, and cornering left/right. And it also goes above 1.0+ G's sustained laterally

It also comes with a serial port and it logs all the data so it can be downloaded to a personal computer.

No wonder the Skyline is so completely badass.

------------------
Kenny
Slow TL

CLpower

i don't have a skyline

KavexTrax

Whats all the talk with skylines? Is it being legalized soon or something? Is nissan going to port it over for north americans?
I mean the steerin wheel is on the right


------------------
- Kvit -
2001 CL-P Monterey Blue, Parchment interior
Polarg BlHybrid M-6 Road lamps
Polarg/PIAA super white interior lights *bling bling*
http://albums.photopoint.com/j/Album...725&a=10358832
Club Events Moderator

CLpower

you can already get em...i've driven in a modded r32....DIZNAM!!!! fucking sick

RandyMax

I've heard rumors that Nissan is considering bringing the R35 in as an Infiniti to compete with the new NSX...

------------------
01' CL-S, Silver/Ebony

CLpower

i believe they already pulled the plug on the R35 project


------------------
"the needle got buried at 140.....1,500 RPM later...the tach got buried"

pays to be young and crazy


99 3.0 CL
55 Chevy Suburban (chopped, dropped, tubbed and FLAME RETARDENT!!)

58 Eldorado Biarritz

patsmere

Nissan is supposedly bringing the R35 in 2003 for the lucky folks in the U.S.
I know I will be saving up for one myself

CLpower

i believe they pulled the plug on the project

Jens H.

For about 90 large MOTOREX in California will be more than glad to sell you a brand new GT-R fully street legal with a warranty.At last report they can't keep up with demand for the beasts.MOTOREX will also sell you a earlier model for less coinage.Jens

------------------
1992 mazda Miata lowered with Eibach springs KYB AGX adjustable struts Sparco racing buckets 4 point safety harnesses Momo steering wheel lo profile headlite system with PIAA superwhite bulbs Custom audio system Custom gauges Jackson racing supercharger with header and Greddy cat back exhaust and a ton of other stuff 2000 Honda Civic on APEX coilovers Full Alpine Audio system factory fogs with Piaa bulbs Catz ZETA headlamp system tinted custom taillites and on and on

DtEW

Well, good intentions, but not really a good idea.

See, I easily and routinely pull over 2G's lateral on stock tires w/o skidding in my IS.

"But just about all cars are rated at sub 1G on a skidpad by the mags."

That's right. Constant speed on a constant radius. But is that how anyone takes a turn?

You see, just about any car (even SUVs, although you really don't want to do that) can be made to exceed 2G's lateral by trail braking/weight transfer. But that peak is only achieved for a very short period of time (weight transfer effects exist only as long as you're decelerating, peaks as the car body reaches the point where it stops compressing the front suspension, and there's only so long you can decelerate before you've missed the entire point, which is cornering), is dependent on the exact line taken, and most importantly, the skill of the driver. (This ability to extract maximum cornering potential from a car is what separates a commuter from a pro on the track.) This dependence on driver ability makes it unsuitable as a benchmark for vehicle evaluation. The constant G skidpad test does not at all indicate how hard a car can really corner, but is easily reproduceable and offers quantification of one factor of the difficult-to-quantify equation called handling.

"So cars can easily pull over 2g's if not forced to maintain a constant speed/turning radius. Why don't we just set that as the maximum limit?"

We can't do that because the limit is dynamic. It's one thing at N milliseconds into your deceleration at X g's, and another at M milliseconds into your deceleration at Y g's. It's a whole other set of things on a different surface.

------------------
051/LP/SR/LD/HH

Kevin M

Hey Guys,
The G-tech is able to measure G's.
Kevin

Nashua_Night_Hawk

Dtew,

It seems you are "a car handling expert".

Now could you answer this question:

Asume you are driving on HW and or taking a an exit/ramp at High Speed. The question is when can you detect that your driving is bit agressive and the car/tires reached its/their handling limits?!!!. If you do not slow (or speed more) you are in real danger of losing grip and going off road!!!.

On track, it's much easier to compute the theoritcal speed to take a cornner, and you can practice how close you car can go fast to that theoritical limit. On the HW and for the first time taking a curve it would be a challange not to exceed the limit of your CLS.

------------------
Black, Eboney, 3.2 CL Type-S.
- Acura NAV.
- 3M clear bra (full front bumper, and side mirros)
- Wheels locks.
- Mooonroof visor
- Splash guards,
- Winter mats,
- Trunk liner,
- Acura Spoiler.
- Valentine V1 Radar Locator.
- PIAA 19169 road lamps.

DtEW

For a general-consumer car, yaw angle, which is to say, when the car body is no longer traveling in the direction that that the tires are pointed in. And this is the basis for all the stability control systems out on the market.

Right.

On-ramps/off-ramps aren't just turns, but narrow-laned turns involving elevation change (usually) and require hard acceleration or hard deceleration at the end. You can't select a line or deal with any yaw angle, because the lane is too narrow and the sides are restricted with barriers. Transitions into/from inclines/decline also play a number on grip, but the overzealous anticipation of the needed acceleration/deceleration at the end is what usually screws drivers up. On top of that, they're highly trafficked but rarely swept for the gravel and debris that comes from such traffic.

The freeway cloverleaf is fairly special because it is probably the most sustained curve you will ever encounter in real life. Very few curves exceed 180 degrees, and the cloverleaf is usually around 270 degrees.

No.

With the addition of variables such as varying lines, braking zones, controlled slip, fading brakes, foaming shocks, wearing tires, ect., It's actually much more complicated. They have yet to define formulas that can adequately describe the full effect, which is why simulators are still imperfect and nobody has tried to build a computer-controlled racer, even as an engineering demonstration. They can barely build a computer-controlled car that can stay in it's own lane.

But how do humans do it?

We don't develop formulas. We possess neural systems, which basically compares input and output to develop response curves that mimic true-blue formulas. We can mimic any formula of just about any complexity (computers are limited in their formula complexity when time is a factor, and racers have to respond in milliseconds) by acquiring data points, the more of which reinforces the mimicked curve better. That's why track time is so very important to racers.

[FYI, the drawback to neural systems is the resolution (read: accuracy) of the mimic. On top of that, humans are notoriously inconsistent. They are already experimenting with electronic neural systems for racecars in engine management.]

Right. And that's why there's VSA. But VSA can really only deal with yaw, like in a steady, terminal push or coming around on a snowy road. Few stability control systems can react fast enough to deal with the extreme fluctuating grip of a suspension system in gyrations (wild wallowing), extending in one corner (extreme camber changes and no weight) and bottoming out in the other (extreme camber changes and weight transfer), and repeating vice versa. The high rotational inertia of a long, big-engined FWD car does not help matters. That's why I told a few people here that spring rates more resistant to bottoming, increased damping, and higher-rate stabilizers are the first things they'll need to enjoy this car like a enthusiast. In stock form, it's great as a highway cruiser in the same way my mom's GS300 is, but like the soft-sprung/damped GS300, pushing it can be a real handful, as a few people here have already proved.

------------------
051/LP/SR/LD/HH

[This message has been edited by DtEW (edited 02-28-2001).]

Nashua_Night_Hawk

DtEW,

Thanks for the long and informative post.

Also, another question. I am not sure wether the steering boost on CLS is good or bad.

I feel that I can/need to turn my steering a complete half turn, just to get out of parking oval into the the street. Similarly, the steering feels "free flowing" while at 30-40 MPH.!!!

Is it overboosted or am I too picky?

------------------
Black, Eboney, 3.2 CL Type-S.
- Acura NAV.
- 3M clear bra (full front bumper, and side mirros)
- Wheels locks.
- Mooonroof visor
- Splash guards,
- Winter mats,
- Trunk liner,
- Acura Spoiler.
- Valentine V1 Radar Locator.
- PIAA 19169 road lamps.

DtEW

I dunno, but it sounds like you're griping about the steering ratio rather than the boost. For the parking lot situation, were you annoyed by the physical effort needed to turn the wheel, or by the number/degree of rotation that was needed to produce the change in direction?

------------------
051/LP/SR/LD/HH

Nashua_Night_Hawk

I guess by the number of turn/degree needed to turn. Is it too much? The steering wheel is so smooth like silk, I can not complain about that

------------------
Black, Eboney, 3.2 CL Type-S.
- Acura NAV.
- 3M clear bra (full front bumper, and side mirros)
- Wheels locks.
- Mooonroof visor
- Splash guards,
- Winter mats,
- Trunk liner,
- Acura Spoiler.
- Valentine V1 Radar Locator.
- PIAA 19169 road lamps.

DtEW

That's the steering ratio. For the CL, it's 16.6:1, which is somewhat higher than the ratios for the 330ci (15.5:1) and IS300 (15.7:1). As you might have already guessed, a higher ratio offers less nervous handling at freeway speeds at the expense of lower speed agility (you have to turn the steering wheel more to get the same amount of change in wheel angle).

Honda has recently developed a fairly revolutionary system which provides a variable steering ratio giving a car both agility at lower speeds and stability at higher speeds. It has been introduced in the JDM S2000 Type V, and you can read more about it here:



------------------
051/LP/SR/LD/HH

[This message has been edited by DtEW (edited 02-28-2001).]