Do you guys think the TL is a better car than a 530i?
01-21-2004, 04:05 PM
#81
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Originally posted by Gabo3k
Based on what you said, then you too realize that BMW is just the ultimate driving machine in its class, and not just the ulimate driving machine, right!
Also, you do realize that perfection is humanly impossible, right! And even if perfection was attainable, Lexus would not be the company to achieve it...
Based on what you said, then you too realize that BMW is just the ultimate driving machine in its class, and not just the ulimate driving machine, right!
Also, you do realize that perfection is humanly impossible, right! And even if perfection was attainable, Lexus would not be the company to achieve it...
01-21-2004, 04:46 PM
#82
"A BMW is a sports car, a luxury car, and a practical everyday car all in one. I stand by the statement of ultimate driving machine."
A BMW 5 series is not a sports car. And to call an entire brand of cars the Ultimate Driving Machine is a bit arrogant despite it being a slogan for a commercial/advertisement. I certainly do not consider the X5/X3 ultimate. To give them credit, I think they do offer the best balance of ride and handling. But others are getting real close to it and to me, the premium is just too high. If I were to buy prestige, I'd rather have a Porsche or Mercedes. To me, BMW is a notch lower.
A BMW 5 series is not a sports car. And to call an entire brand of cars the Ultimate Driving Machine is a bit arrogant despite it being a slogan for a commercial/advertisement. I certainly do not consider the X5/X3 ultimate. To give them credit, I think they do offer the best balance of ride and handling. But others are getting real close to it and to me, the premium is just too high. If I were to buy prestige, I'd rather have a Porsche or Mercedes. To me, BMW is a notch lower.
01-21-2004, 04:53 PM
#83
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Originally posted by dacura
"A BMW is a sports car, a luxury car, and a practical everyday car all in one. I stand by the statement of ultimate driving machine."
A BMW 5 series is not a sports car. And to call an entire brand of cars the Ultimate Driving Machine is a bit arrogant despite it being a slogan for a commercial/advertisement. I certainly do not consider the X5/X3 ultimate. To give them credit, I think they do offer the best balance of ride and handling. But others are getting real close to it and to me, the premium is just too high. If I were to buy prestige, I'd rather have a Porsche or Mercedes. To me, BMW is a notch lower.
"A BMW is a sports car, a luxury car, and a practical everyday car all in one. I stand by the statement of ultimate driving machine."
A BMW 5 series is not a sports car. And to call an entire brand of cars the Ultimate Driving Machine is a bit arrogant despite it being a slogan for a commercial/advertisement. I certainly do not consider the X5/X3 ultimate. To give them credit, I think they do offer the best balance of ride and handling. But others are getting real close to it and to me, the premium is just too high. If I were to buy prestige, I'd rather have a Porsche or Mercedes. To me, BMW is a notch lower.
But bmws ARE sporty, very much so, and i would call a 6, 8 series sports cars. i would call and m3 a sports car. i would call an m5 a sports sedan. mcoupe - sports car.
My questions is have some of you people making statements even driven a bmw for anything length of time? if so, then fine you have your opinions and i have mine, wonderful. But if you havent, then you need to quit basing opinions off of nothing, cause you have o ground to stand.
As for getting a porsche, if i wanted a pure sports car with less luxury, yeah id go porsche.
Mercedes, never really liked them, still dont. Only ever liked the SLs.
01-21-2004, 05:07 PM
#84
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Wow 4 pages. Let's REMEMBER, the TL is for those seeking "value" and it's a car to "remind" them of a BMW. It's not a BMW. Sure the TL has a lot of equipment, BMW does tons more R&D in how the car drives etc etc.
I still can't see how we are compaing a 38k with a 58k car seriously. But I am not surprised. Over on the other site, they used to compare their TL-S against a GS 400 or 540...
And I don't care what u say, when u pay a certain amount of money for a car, you want people to notice and appreciate it. You can buy the most feature laden, value packed TL, no one will notice or care. You could drive a bare bones 525, and people will constantly be asking you about it. Yeah, it's silly, but such is life.
Well those are high aspirations. I'd rather roll with that then "The feel of value" or " Your payments will be cheaper with us" or whatever slogan Acura uses.
Correct me if I am wrong I think they were available in the 740 way before the 99 TL. And while Acura sticks to the cheapest HIDs, luxury car companies have HAD self leveling units and now have moved on to HIDs that move in the direction of the steering wheel.
Acura had NAV is 99 with the TL right? I know the GS had it in 98, with some of those features. I am pretty sure BMW/Benz had it in the 7/S before 1999.
I still can't see how we are compaing a 38k with a 58k car seriously. But I am not surprised. Over on the other site, they used to compare their TL-S against a GS 400 or 540...
And I don't care what u say, when u pay a certain amount of money for a car, you want people to notice and appreciate it. You can buy the most feature laden, value packed TL, no one will notice or care. You could drive a bare bones 525, and people will constantly be asking you about it. Yeah, it's silly, but such is life.
Based on what you said, then you too realize that BMW is just the ultimate driving machine in its class, and not just the ulimate driving machine, right!
Also, you do realize that perfection is humanly impossible, right! And even if perfection was attainable, Lexus would not be the company to achieve it...
Also, you do realize that perfection is humanly impossible, right! And even if perfection was attainable, Lexus would not be the company to achieve it...
Acura offered Xenon in the US before BMW. STANDARD. $800 option on 530... but yes you get a couple more gimmicks
Acura was the FIRST with a Navigation system, the FIRST with DVD based system, the FIRST to integrate climate controls and navi.
01-21-2004, 05:14 PM
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Originally posted by 1SICKLEX
And I don't care what u say, when u pay a certain amount of money for a car, you want people to notice and appreciate it. You can buy the most feature laden, value packed TL, no one will notice or care. You could drive a bare bones 525, and people will constantly be asking you about it. Yeah, it's silly, but such is life.
And I don't care what u say, when u pay a certain amount of money for a car, you want people to notice and appreciate it. You can buy the most feature laden, value packed TL, no one will notice or care. You could drive a bare bones 525, and people will constantly be asking you about it. Yeah, it's silly, but such is life.
The bmw will receive more attention because...its a bmw.
(and cause they made them so fucking ugly now
)
01-21-2004, 05:15 PM
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Originally posted by darrinb
u just cant compare these 2 cars
u just cant compare these 2 cars
No, you're absolutely right, you cant.
01-21-2004, 05:16 PM
#88
I do not think you need to have experienced everything you tend to have an opinion on. If that's a requirement, then noone should be running for president. Even your assessment of your extended time in a BMW is an opinion at the end of the day. People support an opinion in many ways not just from pure experience which can also be highly subjective.
I don't own a BMW but I have 3 close friends that do and I get to drive a 5 series, and X5 and a 323, while not often but certainly enough times. I won't go into my impressions and like I said I think they have a good balance.
But again to call the entire brand of car the ultimate driving machine turns me off. Not to say that they don't have sports cars, they do. Z8, Z4 are. To me, I wouldn't even call an M3 a sports car. I don't even think they pull .90g on a skidpad.
I don't own a BMW but I have 3 close friends that do and I get to drive a 5 series, and X5 and a 323, while not often but certainly enough times. I won't go into my impressions and like I said I think they have a good balance.
But again to call the entire brand of car the ultimate driving machine turns me off. Not to say that they don't have sports cars, they do. Z8, Z4 are. To me, I wouldn't even call an M3 a sports car. I don't even think they pull .90g on a skidpad.
01-21-2004, 05:20 PM
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Originally posted by dacura
I won't go into my impressions and like I said I think they have a good balance.
But again to call the entire brand of car the ultimate driving machine turns me off.
I won't go into my impressions and like I said I think they have a good balance.
But again to call the entire brand of car the ultimate driving machine turns me off.
Best balance of sport, ot luxury, of practicality, of comfort, of technology, of precisness, of driver experience.
Does this some it up better. This is why I ( ME, MYSELF, and no one else) buys in to bimmers rhetoric.
01-21-2004, 05:23 PM
#90
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Originally posted by dacura
I do not think you need to have experienced everything you tend to have an opinion on.
I do not think you need to have experienced everything you tend to have an opinion on.
I may judge cars on looks, but I have ever dissed a car on how handles or drives that i myself have never taken the wheel of.
01-21-2004, 05:37 PM
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But again to call the entire brand of car the ultimate driving machine turns me off. Not to say that they don't have sports cars, they do. Z8, Z4 are. To me, I wouldn't even call an M3 a sports car. I don't even think they pull .90g on a skidpad.
Z4 getting very mixed reviews. IN my Sports Car International, they blasted the car twice, once with the manual and once with the SMG.
M3, are u kidding. Now I agree, BMW purists (which I am not) claim it's now a porker and losing it's feel. To me, I would LOVE one of these stock, let alone modded. The last 2 M3s (E36/E46) have been kicking everyone's asses for the last 8 years...
Then we have the M3 CSL, who according to EVO, or nevermind.....
You want some cheap true fun in a sedan. Buy an IS 300, many BMW owners state it reminds them of the E36, more fun to drive.
01-21-2004, 06:45 PM
#92
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acura has had navi since 96 or 97...it 1st appeared in their RLs
trust me, highline hondas in japan can give some of the high end lux cars a close run in tech features and details...its sad honda is so conservative w/their offerings here
trust me, highline hondas in japan can give some of the high end lux cars a close run in tech features and details...its sad honda is so conservative w/their offerings here
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