ALL question and Details about MM aka RES
11-06-2001, 11:09 PM
#82
As long as the cover goes back on I'm down with it.
I never realized the hood clearance on our car was so low that the RES has trouble fitting though.
Definitely time for a massive hood scoop.
Maybe Snook could sell custom hoods with a nice phat ram air scoop on them! 
Btw, a few pages ago I mentioned Xephyr. I was not relating this product's availability to that of the Xerphyr CAI, nor the quality. I was merely using the most obvious example of why buying parts over the 'net is not as good as holding it in my hands and deciding whether or not I want to buy it. That is all. Get over it, I was just stating my reservations.
I never realized the hood clearance on our car was so low that the RES has trouble fitting though.
Definitely time for a massive hood scoop.
Maybe Snook could sell custom hoods with a nice phat ram air scoop on them!
Btw, a few pages ago I mentioned Xephyr. I was not relating this product's availability to that of the Xerphyr CAI, nor the quality. I was merely using the most obvious example of why buying parts over the 'net is not as good as holding it in my hands and deciding whether or not I want to buy it. That is all. Get over it, I was just stating my reservations.
11-06-2001, 11:12 PM
#83
Here's a question:
The headers are around +30hp, right?
The MM dynos another +20-30hp, right?
Does this mean that working together you are looking at +50-60hp over stock?
If so, I might just get those two mods and forego a supercharger altogether, because for me it's almost the same amount of gain for much less $$$ and less transmission hassle.
The headers are around +30hp, right?
The MM dynos another +20-30hp, right?
Does this mean that working together you are looking at +50-60hp over stock?
If so, I might just get those two mods and forego a supercharger altogether, because for me it's almost the same amount of gain for much less $$$ and less transmission hassle.
11-07-2001, 05:41 AM
#84
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Originally posted by BNut
When will the dyno's for the J30A RES be available? Any estimated timeline?
I think it is awesome that what Doug has managed to do with a simple $300 piece of metal.
BTW, is the RES made via a casting process or via machining?
I can't wait to plop my money down on this part!!!
BTW, people like JRock... just ignore them... If they don't have 2 brain cells required to understand by now that the RES mod is not some dyno anomoly, then you shouldn't waste your time trying to educate them because its obvious it won't help any.
I think that permanent backorder list would be a good idea.
When will the dyno's for the J30A RES be available? Any estimated timeline?
I think it is awesome that what Doug has managed to do with a simple $300 piece of metal.
BTW, is the RES made via a casting process or via machining?
I can't wait to plop my money down on this part!!!
BTW, people like JRock... just ignore them... If they don't have 2 brain cells required to understand by now that the RES mod is not some dyno anomoly, then you shouldn't waste your time trying to educate them because its obvious it won't help any.
I think that permanent backorder list would be a good idea.
BTW i was the guy at the Comptech booth that snapped the picture of the sucker. Was i the only one that got a picture?? geez, i kinda feel special now, good thing i noticed ur badge.
11-07-2001, 04:50 PM
#85
Question about the RES...
Since no one bothers to read the Sticky topic about the RES at the top of the page anymore, I'm going to make a new thread for my question.
Here's a question:
The headers are around +10-30hp and +10-20torque, right?
The MM dynos another +10-15hp and +15-20torque, right?
Does this mean that working together you are looking at +45hp, +35torque over stock?
If so, I might just get those two mods and forego a supercharger altogether, because for me it's almost the same amount of gain for much less $$$ and less transmission hassle.
Here's a question:
The headers are around +10-30hp and +10-20torque, right?
The MM dynos another +10-15hp and +15-20torque, right?
Does this mean that working together you are looking at +45hp, +35torque over stock?
If so, I might just get those two mods and forego a supercharger altogether, because for me it's almost the same amount of gain for much less $$$ and less transmission hassle.
11-07-2001, 07:58 PM
#87
10th Gear
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JRock, bolt on parts horsepower claims are usually made by the maker just using their own mod, to obviously reduce the amount of variables in testing. They may not always "stack" together like we would hope. If I added up every 5 to 10 HP bolt on for the 5.0 mustang you would have a 400 HP car from a factory engine! (And I've tried a few!) That being said, in our case, the headers are freeing up the exhaust and the CAI frees up the inlet, maybe this MM will indeed "stack" the way we hope and bring us the 45+ Hp we'd all love to get!!! 
11-07-2001, 08:05 PM
#88
Suzuka Master
Picture of Mikes best vs. I/H/E w/no MM and I/HE with MM:
Stock, MM, MM + I:
You could draw some conclusions about the MM + I/H/E....
Who knows about the final dyno of the SC????
Stock, MM, MM + I:
You could draw some conclusions about the MM + I/H/E....
Who knows about the final dyno of the SC????
11-07-2001, 08:08 PM
#90
Suzuka Master
Originally posted by spiroh
what I want to know is were the prototypes the ones dyno tested, or the production units.
what I want to know is were the prototypes the ones dyno tested, or the production units.
I would like to see the cold weather aspect too...
So, we can ask all we like, but....
11-07-2001, 11:19 PM
#91
Too many lines and the graph picture is too low quality to tell. The one thing that does stand out, is the peak horsepower appears to be about 20-25 more with all the mods on it than with just the MM or just the Headers.
Really confusing though. The low end does not make sense at all.
Argh.
Plus the temperature differences are a bitch. I would be interested to see what a car pulls on the dyno with Intake, Headers, and MM in 92Fdegrees so I can overlay that directly over the nice clear Intake/MM dyno. Then we can determine gains from I/H/MM much more clearly than that tiny, distorted scan.
Really confusing though. The low end does not make sense at all.
Argh.
Plus the temperature differences are a bitch. I would be interested to see what a car pulls on the dyno with Intake, Headers, and MM in 92Fdegrees so I can overlay that directly over the nice clear Intake/MM dyno. Then we can determine gains from I/H/MM much more clearly than that tiny, distorted scan.
11-08-2001, 12:01 AM
#92
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Originally posted by spiroh
i guess my ? wont be answered.
i guess my ? wont be answered.
I'd still like to get my hands on a prototype cast version though that allows more performance value...
11-08-2001, 12:53 AM
#93
Suzuka Master
Originally posted by JRock
Too many lines and the graph picture is too low quality to tell. The one thing that does stand out, is the peak horsepower appears to be about 20-25 more with all the mods on it than with just the MM or just the Headers.
Really confusing though. The low end does not make sense at all.
Argh.
Plus the temperature differences are a bitch. I would be interested to see what a car pulls on the dyno with Intake, Headers, and MM in 92Fdegrees so I can overlay that directly over the nice clear Intake/MM dyno. Then we can determine gains from I/H/MM much more clearly than that tiny, distorted scan.
Too many lines and the graph picture is too low quality to tell. The one thing that does stand out, is the peak horsepower appears to be about 20-25 more with all the mods on it than with just the MM or just the Headers.
Really confusing though. The low end does not make sense at all.
Argh.
Plus the temperature differences are a bitch. I would be interested to see what a car pulls on the dyno with Intake, Headers, and MM in 92Fdegrees so I can overlay that directly over the nice clear Intake/MM dyno. Then we can determine gains from I/H/MM much more clearly than that tiny, distorted scan.
Here is the other one stock, MM, MM + CAI (you can get the "baseline" from this one [similar temps]):
You're all set now...
11-08-2001, 02:47 AM
#94
Suzuka Master
Originally posted by JRock
Too many lines and the graph picture is too low quality to tell. The one thing that does stand out, is the peak horsepower appears to be about 20-25 more with all the mods on it than with just the MM or just the Headers.
Really confusing though. The low end does not make sense at all.
Argh.
Plus the temperature differences are a bitch. I would be interested to see what a car pulls on the dyno with Intake, Headers, and MM in 92Fdegrees so I can overlay that directly over the nice clear Intake/MM dyno. Then we can determine gains from I/H/MM much more clearly than that tiny, distorted scan.
Too many lines and the graph picture is too low quality to tell. The one thing that does stand out, is the peak horsepower appears to be about 20-25 more with all the mods on it than with just the MM or just the Headers.
Really confusing though. The low end does not make sense at all.
Argh.
Plus the temperature differences are a bitch. I would be interested to see what a car pulls on the dyno with Intake, Headers, and MM in 92Fdegrees so I can overlay that directly over the nice clear Intake/MM dyno. Then we can determine gains from I/H/MM much more clearly than that tiny, distorted scan.
22 lb-ft (at 90+ degrees F -- SAE corrected) peak-to-peak difference above 4K
If you compare the 202 - 175 ft-lb @ 6000, there is about 27 lb-ft gained there
JROCK -- here is your graph. One of the problems with uploading here is pixel interpolation problems with sizing the combined graphs down to 640x480. I now will upload the graphs to TL forum and link to there.
See if this helps; it is the "stock TLS (no mods) vs. TLS w/ MM + I/H/E. I left horz lines to denote values. The two graphs need to be resized to match-up, that is why you will see some garbage around the size. I don't have the raw data and would prefer to NOT have to pull out my digitizing tablet!!!
11-08-2001, 08:15 PM
#97
Suzuka Master
Re: RES
Originally posted by drakhen
How much is this mod ggoing to cost with the hood and installation?
How much is this mod ggoing to cost with the hood and installation?
1. No hood change required
2. Looks pretty simple to install (as in do it yourself or minimum labor costs)
$.02
08-03-2003, 08:21 PM
#103
Senior Moderator
Originally posted by Crazy Sellout
i just want to know when i can get one for my cousins car
i just want to know when i can get one for my cousins car
08-03-2003, 08:24 PM
#104
I just installed something similar in my Z...car pulls much harder now in the upper rpms. What the heck happened to this project for the CL? Maybe the guy that's selling them for the z can do a CL version...? Anyone live in Tenessee?
www.crawfordzcar.com
www.crawfordzcar.com
08-03-2003, 08:25 PM
#105
Sweet as Gold
so did I...especially when another member was asking for pics of the upper intake manifold from underneathe and on top...I just can't believe that no one else has tried to make this happen for us...common now 13,000 members and NO ONE HAS CONNECTIONS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
08-03-2003, 08:29 PM
#106
Sweet as Gold
I DON'T KNOW IF THIS IS A COINCIDENCE....BUT IF YOU CLICK ON THAT LINK ( www.crawfordzcar.com ) THERE IS A SECTION ON THE LEFT THAT SAYS ABOUT DOUG.....CLICK ON IT...IS THIS THE SAME GUY THAT WE CAN'T FIND TO MAKE OURS!!!!!!!!
08-03-2003, 09:10 PM
#109
Happy CL-S Pilot
Again, can someone explain the role of the center chamber and the how does it affect/interact with the injector's runners? As you see the from the Graph (scalbert posted) air will come from the throttle body to the side chambers then tot he injectors runners.
The center chamber should be connected to the runners somehow. I believe that the air will fill the center chamber and the air wave would be bounce off the plate resulting in resonacnce. Also, when the plate switch to the horizontal position the resonance is gone.
Now how about making the upper plate (cover) also a resonace plate and hence you get your Resonance Ehnancement System.
If you understand how resonance is done you should be able doing a RES. Note also from the pics Scalbert posted that the upper plate cover is not smoth nor it is designed to resoante.
Nashua.
The center chamber should be connected to the runners somehow. I believe that the air will fill the center chamber and the air wave would be bounce off the plate resulting in resonacnce. Also, when the plate switch to the horizontal position the resonance is gone.
Now how about making the upper plate (cover) also a resonace plate and hence you get your Resonance Ehnancement System.
If you understand how resonance is done you should be able doing a RES. Note also from the pics Scalbert posted that the upper plate cover is not smoth nor it is designed to resoante.
Nashua.
08-03-2003, 10:51 PM
#110
Senior Moderator
jizzle, you homo. :sqnteek:
08-04-2003, 06:00 AM
#111
Suzuka Master
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Originally posted by Nashua_Night_Hawk
Again, can someone explain the role of the center chamber and the how does it affect/interact with the injector's runners? As you see the from the Graph (scalbert posted) air will come from the throttle body to the side chambers then tot he injectors runners.
Again, can someone explain the role of the center chamber and the how does it affect/interact with the injector's runners? As you see the from the Graph (scalbert posted) air will come from the throttle body to the side chambers then tot he injectors runners.
The principal is that at the lower revs the IMRC plates (valve) are closed. This separates the two halves and two distinct volumes. At the higher revs, opening at 3800 RPM, the valve is opened which effectively doubles the volume available to each half.
Remember, the flow is not constant; it comes in pulses with the opening of the intake valves. It is the varying conditions inside and the dependency changes which allow for the increased volume to aid filling.
Here is an excellent write up on the principal behind this; I believe this is the same article EricL has mentioned before:
http://www.geocities.com/mikey9t6/car_uvwxyz_vris.htm
And the drawing again showing the portions.
08-04-2003, 07:28 AM
#112
Happy CL-S Pilot
After reading the article, I understand that decreasing the plenum volume will shift to resonance frequency higher.
Why no one has tried to decrease the volume of the plenum ?
Why no one has tried to decrease the volume of the plenum ?
08-04-2003, 08:36 AM
#113
Cost Drivers!!!!
Originally posted by Nashua_Night_Hawk
After reading the article, I understand that decreasing the plenum volume will shift to resonance frequency higher.
Why no one has tried to decrease the volume of the plenum ?
After reading the article, I understand that decreasing the plenum volume will shift to resonance frequency higher.
Why no one has tried to decrease the volume of the plenum ?
Excellent point. Perhaps that's what the system doug designed did????
This is BS...somebody needs to get this shit to market. Somebody go talk to doug.
08-04-2003, 08:45 AM
#115
Cost Drivers!!!!
scalbert,
oh come on now Give the rest of us with FI a lil help At this point i'm willing to find Doug, lock him in a room and get him to hand over the cad specs. Who else is down?
Shit knowing the inefficiencies of the stock header and seeing what kind of gains are seen I can totally believe that RES can provide th gains people want. Cripes.
I'd be willing to pay! Out with it already!!
oh come on now
Give the rest of us with FI a lil help At this point i'm willing to find Doug, lock him in a room and get him to hand over the cad specs. Who else is down? Shit knowing the inefficiencies of the stock header and seeing what kind of gains are seen I can totally believe that RES can provide th gains people want. Cripes.
I'd be willing to pay! Out with it already!!
08-04-2003, 08:53 AM
#116
Happy CL-S Pilot
Zapta, are you willing to help establish an R&D fund to cover dyno-based R&D for the RES?
I have in mind, designing different gasket-like plates that sits below the uppper intake cover that willl reduce reshape the intake manifold chamber.
Dyno rent is like $100 per hr. If we can come up with $400-$500 fund, the RES could be a reality!
What do you think?
I have in mind, designing different gasket-like plates that sits below the uppper intake cover that willl reduce reshape the intake manifold chamber.
Dyno rent is like $100 per hr. If we can come up with $400-$500 fund, the RES could be a reality!
What do you think?
08-04-2003, 09:04 AM
#117
Cost Drivers!!!!
Originally posted by Nashua_Night_Hawk
Zapta, are you willing to help establish an R&D fund to cover dyno-based R&D for the RES?
I have in mind, designing different gasket-like plates that sits below the uppper intake cover that willl reduce reshape the intake manifold chamber.
Dyno rent is like $100 per hr. If we can come up with $400-$500 fund, the RES could be a reality!
What do you think?
Zapta, are you willing to help establish an R&D fund to cover dyno-based R&D for the RES?
I have in mind, designing different gasket-like plates that sits below the uppper intake cover that willl reduce reshape the intake manifold chamber.
Dyno rent is like $100 per hr. If we can come up with $400-$500 fund, the RES could be a reality!
What do you think?
At this point I'm willing to help out however I can but the most direct route seems to be getting doug just to release this dang thing. The design is already completed and tested.
I can get a dyno place for $70/hr might even be able to work something out to reduce the cost.
08-04-2003, 09:23 AM
#118
Moderator Alumnus
He went where the $$ is... I don't blame him, the afternmarket for the 350z will be better than the CLS/TLS
However if it would have bolted on the Accord/TL it would have had a decent market.
But it's almost a guarantee 350z owners will be passtionate about performance vs. people who purachse a TL or Accord.
my
However if it would have bolted on the Accord/TL it would have had a decent market.
But it's almost a guarantee 350z owners will be passtionate about performance vs. people who purachse a TL or Accord.
my
08-04-2003, 09:29 AM
#120
Cost Drivers!!!!
Originally posted by SiGGy
He went where the $$ is... I don't blame him, the afternmarket for the 350z will be better than the CLS/TLS
However if it would have bolted on the Accord/TL it would have had a decent market.
But it's almost a guarantee 350z owners will be passtionate about performance vs. people who purachse a TL or Accord.
my
He went where the $$ is... I don't blame him, the afternmarket for the 350z will be better than the CLS/TLS
However if it would have bolted on the Accord/TL it would have had a decent market.
But it's almost a guarantee 350z owners will be passtionate about performance vs. people who purachse a TL or Accord.
my
who went where the money is? Doug? My understanding is that the doug mentioned via this crawford place isn't doug foss who designed the RES for the j3x engine.