Sorry for creating another "How to Drive MT" thread but I have questions specifically about driving TSX MT. I did my search and found some great threads that I will list here for reference (they contain tips on driving MT in general):

https://acurazine.com/forums/showthr...ghlight=manual

https://acurazine.com/forums/showthr...ghlight=manual

https://acurazine.com/forums/showthr...ghlight=manual

As for my questions....I got my MT a little more than a month ago and have been practicing on a Saab 9-5. I caught on with the Saab pretty quickly and been driving it smoothly for the past month. Now I finally got to drive my TSX but to my surprise, it's NOTHING like the Saab and I am having a really hard time adjusting. So, I have some questions that's specifically geared for the TSX's high reving engine/6MT transmission.

1. My upshifts were very smoooth on the Saab but now I am jerking like crazy on the TSX. With the Saab, from 2-3 and 3-4, I can just clutch all the way, shift, and let go of clutch completely, and then gas. With the TSX, the rpm drops sooo fast that by the time I am on the gas again, the car's jerking like crazy. I can smooth it out if I shift at low rpm and ride the clutch but I want to avoid that.

2. The Saab has 5 gears so I am never on 5th when driving local. With the TSX, what's the minimum speed I can still be on 5th and at what speed should I upshift to 6th? Also, is it me or is 6th really hard to find? I am scared of shifting to reverse by accident, and I accidently downshifted to 4th once on the highway....not very fun.

3. The engagement point in the TSX is pretty high and I am used to just letting the clutch go once past the halfway point. Is this what's causing the jolting? Should I let the clutch go quicker in the beginning and slow it down at the top?

4. (A general question) I never see the need to downshift and revmatch to slow down. If I am slowing down for a light or stop sign, I just brake till the rpm drops to 1500 and then clutch and either stay in gear or put in neutral. If I know I don't have to do a complete stop, I will still stay in the higher gear till I really need to downshift. Am I putting more wear on the clutch?


Again, sorry if this feels like deja vu, but hopefully it will help other TSX MT noobs out there. I do visit standshift.com but figure you guys can give me better first hand insights.

And one last thing, I LOVE MY CAR!!! I just don't want to mess it up with my lack of skillz.

 

Instead of releasing the gas all the way when you put the clutch in, hold the throttle steady, depress the clutch, gently back off the throttle just a little and then slowly release the clutch. This should help smooth it out.

Not sure about the minimum speed, but it's pretty easy to just cruise around in 5th around town. And 6th gear on the TSX is pretty low so don't hesitate to use it. As for being afraid to shift into it, don't be. The electronic lockout will keep you from going into reverse. Just put some pressure to the right before you shift it down.

Smooth, steady clutch engagement will get you better results than dumping the clutch. Just be smooth with the clutch and you'll be fine.

Nope, you're fine. As long as you're not lugging the motor, you should be okay.

Just keep practicing and you'll get it.

 

Funny..I, too, am learning to drive stick right now and am finding the same issues have come up. My friend who drives an old Bimmer noticed the jerking as well. She said the gas is much more "peppy" than her BMW. I think the TSX just requires some smoother clutch action from the driver. She did say that the shift is shorter, as well, which I think is kinda nice.

I've driven an old Civic and a new Chevy Colbalt in stick to learn the basics and have now been driving the TSX solely and really prefer the TSX over both. (Of course).

I practiced stops and starts so much one night that I got a foot cramp in my left foot!!

I did get to use sixth when on the highway, but will use fifth on local street when I'm doing 45 or so.

As posted above, my hubby is teaching me and stressing smooth, smooth, smooth on the clutch and steady gas. It's going well, but I'm still not driving it on a regular basis. Can't wait to get out there and go crazy with it, but I'm sure that will be a long time coming!!

 

I am a complete noob....I didn't know you can still gas a little while depressing the clutch all the way down to shift. I always thought that meant "riding the clutch" and bad for your car. But thanks for your tips. I just got back from the grocery store and notice that if I synchronize the release of the clutch and the depressing of the gas pedal just at the right time, everything is smooth as silk. Of course out of 10 times, I only get 2 or 3 smooth shifting.

 

Good luck!

 

If this helps:

I'm a 21 year old that has only ever driven an MT car. (94 Altima GXE). The worst driving experience I've ever had was when my grandpa let me drive his 84 911 Carrera - It's in perfect showroom condition (<75k mi). I was not used to all that power and had the same problem with shifting up and keeping RPMs up. I got scared, cause I had serious problems with this testing the TL 6spd (I hated it) bc it was a lot of power that I simply didn't want (in addition to the pricetag that was undesirable).

You have to learn to give it gas before popping the clutch. What helps is to be ready in the gear you need faster, to not give the engine time to slow down. This is also much more fun. What's important to remember is that like women, every car is different. You have to try different things to make them pur. Once you figure what works, stick with it (pun not really intended). Your car and significant other will thank you.

I don't claim to be an expert cause I'm not, but the best advice is to turn off all the noise in the car (cell, radio, etc.) and just listen to the engine. The car talks to you, and you have to alter your behavior because you control the car. This is the beauty of driving a manual and what makes driving such an intimate experience with your vehicle.

A 94 Altima is not my dream car, but it felt like an extension of me, because it needed me to operate.

Good luck. I'm honestly a bit worried about how I'll adjust to my new baby as well. I'll let you all know shortly :-D!

 

Damn, that's the sexy-ist explanation of driving I've ever seen. Is it hot in here???

 

You gave your car the shocker or a hot carl?

 

Riding the clutch means literally resting your left foot on the clutch pedal while not actually shifting. You end up partially depressing the pedal (from the weight of your foot/leg) causing the clutch to slip and accelerating wear. It's a bad habit to get into.

As far as shifting goes, it sounds like you're on the right track, and you're getting good advice here. Driving a stick is as much about feel as anything. People can give you all the advice in the world, but you still have to develop a feel for the whole process, how all the machinery works together. Even then, as you've experienced with the Saab, things can vary from car to car, and that's where the experience comes in. Even people who've driven sticks for years will often have to adjust when driving an unfamiliar car for the first few times.

Keep practicing and you'll have it down before you know it.

 

Riding the clutch means literally resting your left foot on the clutch pedal while not actually shifting. You end up partially depressing the pedal (from the weight of your foot/leg) causing the clutch to slip and accelerating wear. It's a bad habit to get into.

As far as shifting goes, it sounds like you're on the right track, and you're getting good advice here. Driving a stick is as much about feel as anything. People can give you all the advice in the world, but you still have to develop a feel for the whole process, how all the machinery works together. Even then, as you've experienced with the Saab, things can vary from car to car, and that's where the experience comes in. Even people who've driven sticks for years will often have to adjust when driving an unfamiliar car for the first few times.

Keep practicing and you'll have it down before you know it.

 

This is very good advice, especially with a car as quiet as the TSX. You need to be able to hear what's happening, particularly when learning. Kill the tunes.

 

This means as you are driving, right? Well, even at a stand still idle, it's still bad.

You know I never really understood that term "riding the clutch", but if that's what it means, then I just don't understand how people do that, I mean the pedal itself has a bit of upper uh....i guess, placement, so why even rest your foot on it. Your leg will be cocked near a 90 degree angle and for me it fatigues it. Personally, I'm so used to the dead pedal and the need to fully extend my legs

 

Simply put, riding the clutch means the clutch is neither fully engaged or fully disengaged.

Technically, you could be riding the clutch even during shifting, by releasing the clutch very slowly.

 

I stumbled a bit with my TSX at first, and in fact I still have some issues 600 miles later. I think I'm getting quite good at it, but striking the balance between slipping the clutch too much and jolting the drivetrain is difficult unless you are used to contemporary Honda products--which I am not.

While the gearbox in this car is exceptional, I've only driven one Honda with a really intuitive clutch, and it was an old '85 Civic with what was probably an aftermarket replacement.

If you get to a point where you're pulling off reasonably smooth shifts, you are doing very well. I agree that Saabs as well as a few other select European makes have pretty awesome clutches--engaging down low where you have much more control over your foot and leg. It's brainless to pull off very nice shifts, almost out of the box.

Honda is good at so many things--but not clutches. So don't feel bad about it. You'll get it soon enough. Everyday my technique improves. I really love the car and I'm sure that helps as well.

 

Other than the 1-2 shift, the RPM drops on our transmission are quite low, so you'll get best results by shifting pretty quickly. This doesn't mean you shouldn't shift smoothly though. Similar to Kevin's advice, what I normally do is push the clutch pedal in, release the gas slightly after the clutch disengages (engine noise will briefly rise in pitch -- this prevents you from letting go the gas too early and slowing the car down), quickly throw the shifter into the next gear (the RPM drop is low, so don't bother with waiting or shifting slowly to ease the synchros' work), and immediately but smoothly release the clutch (control the release all the way to the top as our engagement point is relatively high) while gently getting back on the gas (but not too much before the clutch is out). It really just takes practice; after a few weeks it will become second nature to you.

Just shift when you feel the engine is revving higher than it needs to be -- if you're cruising on flat ground, that's around 2500-3000rpm, but try not to rely on the tach and just shift when the engine is starting to get loud (well, loud by TSX standards). If you're in hilly territory or think you may need some instant power, shift a little later. If you're racing shift much later

Don't worry about shifting into reverse by accident as it is impossible. I find that just pulling the shifter straight back from 5 lands me in 6 but many people say this doesn't work for them If this is the case for you, backhanding the shifter (pushing down while your hand is on the left side of the knob, which adds some pressure to the right) is completely safe and will never land you in reverse.

My friend who owns an RSX did this a few times and it does make the shifts much joltier. Let the clutch pedal out smoothly all the way from the bottom to the top (technically speaking the bottom few inches it won't be doing anything, but it pays to build good habits), and pay attention to the feel transmitted through the pedal to your left foot -- you'll eventually get used to it.

Don't worry about it until you've gotten some more experience. When you feel you are good at normal driving you will want to learn how to downshift properly, both for accelerating and decelerating. This will allow you to control your speed more effectively and always be in the right gear when it's time to speed up again. I've been driving stick for about 6 months and am starting to get good at proper downshifts but it's much harder to practice when you aren't comfortable with the basics yet. Rev-matching is especially hard in our car because the slight delay introduced by DBW means you have much less feedback and it's difficult to gauge the right amount of throttle to use while the clutch is in, so it's best not to even try until you are comfortable enough with the basics that a bad downshift won't cause you to become stressed out and affect your ability to drive normally.

 

Sorry, I have to disagree with you. When I was shopping for this car the only manual transmission I had driven was in my 1990 Geo Metro, and the TSX's clutch was by far the easiest to use right off the bat of all the cars I drove. The VW (Jetta TDI and GLI) and Audi (A3 and A4) clutches were the worst, with an engagement point so high I literally had to lift my knee off the seat to fully release the clutch, but the TSX's super-lightweight clutch was easier to operate than even the 325i's in my opinion.

 

Oh yeah, there are certainly far worse clutches out there, but far better as well--as illustrated by the author of this thread.

I agree the TSX clutch is light and easy to operate--in fact it is one of the few manual transmission cars that I don't get fatigued driving for a long time in rush hour. However there are a lot of cars out there which are much easier to learn... Modern Hondas just don't have that "lift the ball of your foot to slip" clutch balance. There is some knee action required, which generally takes longer to learn to control.

If anyone has a TSX that has a near-floor clutch, I'd really like to drive it, and then steal your clutch hardware.

 

3. The engagement point in the TSX is pretty high and I am used to just letting the clutch go once past the halfway point. Is this what's causing the jolting? Should I let the clutch go quicker in the beginning and slow it down at the top?

Thats your problem, keep practicing..

 

I think it's the DBW, more than the clutch, that can make the TSX a bit tricky to shift some times, and it also contributes to the jerkiness someone described above. I will say that the clutch engagement point can be a little vague on the TSX, but it's something you get used to.

 

Yup...I think that's my problem. It's really hard to pinpoint the engagement point on the TSX while driving. It's really high up there and alot of knee work involved. The transmission is definitely smooth but the clutch is a little too high for me.

Last night, I took the car out to practice and I am doing better. My 3-4 is almost flawless and 2-3 is smoother. Getting out of 1st still slow and jerky and slipping the clutch alot on 1-2. I plan to practice an hour afterwork every night till I get the hang of it. Thanks for everyone's tips.

 

The easiest way to get used to the engagement point of a new clutch is to stop the car in a parking lot, put the shifter in first, and slowly let the clutch out while holding the (foot) brake and watching the tach. When the needle starts to drop the clutch is starting to engage -- if you pay attention you will feel the pedal vibrate slightly, too, and that is what you should get used to. You can then test yourself on a slight uphill by stopping, letting the clutch out to engagement point, and then letting off the brake. If you roll forward, that's past the engagement point; if you roll backward you aren't at it yet, and if your car stays perfectly still you are right on the dot. (Don't hold that situation for too long as it will burn your clutch up in relatively short order, but a couple seconds at a time is fine.)

The 1-2 upshift has a MUCH higher RPM drop (43%) than 2-3 (28%) or 3-4 (24%). You will have to wait rather longer before releasing the clutch pedal. If you are practicing in a low-traffic area, you can watch your tach needle to see whether you waited too long or not long enough -- the needle will go up as you release the clutch if you waited too long, and down very rapidly if you didn't wait long enough. Also it is especially important when shifting out of first gear not to let off the gas until the clutch is disengaging, because the engine braking effect is strongest in first.

A last tip: when practicing, don't shift too early. If you shift at 4000rpm you'll have more time than if you shift at 2500 so you're less likely to be in a rush and mess up.

Good luck and happy shifting

 

I've noticed that it is easier to shift smooth if you do wind it out to at least 4000 RPM. Trying to shift too early gets hairy because of how touchy the throttle is.

 

But the higher the RPM, the faster it drops when I am shifting. So if I shift at 4k RPM, it drops to 2.5K by the time I release the clutch, which causes the car to jolt as it tries to get the RPM back to like 3k or so. If I shift REALLY fast, then it's all good. Maybe I am just slow....

 

You should be able to move smoothly and still shift way faster than that. Think about the shift you want to do and then make one fluid motion of pushing clutch, releasing gas, moving shifter, getting slightly on gas, releasing clutch, getting back on gas. If the whole thing takes you more than one second, practice the motion while the car is off until it doesn't.

 

It must become intuitive, Grasshopper.

 

hmmm.....is it me or does the shifts get alot smoother when you have a full tank of gas?? For the past week, I been driving with 1/4 tank left. Last night, I filled the whole tank up ($45...wtf), and today I am shifting without any major jolts. Maybe I got better overnight.

 

I doubt it.
But you might be getting better and more used to the car.
How many miles are on the TSX now? How many of those miles are from you?

 

It's definitely you, not the gas Stick with it, you're learning!

 

The car has about 1034 miles....About 200 miles are from me with 150 of those miles at 6th gear on the highway for 2 hours.

I do think I am getting the hang of it. For anyone learning stick now, the best advice is to pay very very close attention to the tachometer (and the road too). Watch the way your rpm varies between shift and find the range that gives you the smoothest shift. Thanks everyone. Definitely enjoying my car.

 

Maybe it's that extra 100# you're having to accelerate.


But seriously, I'm glad you're enjoying the car more now. I, too, found a definite learning curve with this one. I'm still not always perfectly smooth shifting into 1st or 2nd.

 

While this can help you learn quicker, it's important not to become dependent on the distractometer. You should be paying attention to how the car feels and get an intuitive sense of when you should shift and how long it should take.

 

Agree 100%. In the beginning, I think it helps to look at the tachometer to synchronize the car and yourself. Hopefully, it will become second nature soon. I usually dont have to look at the tach unless I am having trouble shifting and only on a clear road.

 

The tach is there for a reason. I learned on a stick and have been driving them for 30 years, and I still use it all the time in the TSX. A quick glance is all it takes. It's more precise than guessing where the engine is in the rev band.

 

Just drove 2 hours back to Chicago and hit some traffic on the dan ryan (no surprise there). Wasn't too bad and I managed. Got home in one piece but scratched my front passenger rim by parking too close to the curb.......argh....

no pain no gain i guess.....will do better next time but poor rim.

 

This is one area which I still have problems, after 2+ years of driving stick.

When slowing down say from 75 - 30 mph (arbitrary numbers), I would normally keep it in 6th, brake down to desired speed, then check the speedo/tach to see what the proper gear should be, then shift to that gear.
The guesswork would probably be eliminated if I downshifted through every gear, but I'd rather not stress the clutch and tranny.

Personally, I learned to drive stick on a car without a tach, and would always have to guess how much to blip the throttle on a downshift.
With the TSX, it became much easier, but the darned DBW makes it tricky to blip to the right amount... need more practice there.