jayhawks

I've got a weird technical question.

Does the transmitter that sends out signals to communicate with your wireless phone only start transmitting a signal once you've "paired" the phone with the car is it an "always-on" signal regardless?

The reason I ask is because I don't plan on taking advantage of the bluetooth capability when I get my TSX next weekend (can't wait!) and have heard that stray signals can be used for less-than scrupulous purposes.

Thanks.

brighton

Interesting question. Have heard that from a security standpoint Bluetooth is VERY secure.

Have also heard that the energy that is emitted only occurs when you're actively using it (e.g. yapping on the phone) so if you don't pair the phone with the car it probably just sits idle I guess.

timd38

Once you get use to BlueTooth in your car, you won't buy another car without it.

Trip

The BT is kind of always on, whether or not a phone is paired to the system. Its always on the look out for other devices but this is not an open data link. Once it detects a device it checks to see if it "knows" it and only then will connect with it (which is why a phone has to specifically be paired with it.) If other people are in the car, the system might not even know they have a phone.

The other device has to have their BT mode "ON"... other phones or deveis might be nearby but if they're not BT enabled, HFL won't even know they're there.

HFL has to recognize it as a paired phone... once it picks up a signal, it will only work with phones it recognizes.

The other device has to be within 20 ft of the car... so unless the person hacking the HFL is pacing you on the highway, chances no one will ever be near you long enough for anything to happen.

Because of the above conditions, its unlikely anyone can hack into it. Even if they did, what could they do besides use your phone? If anything, the cell phone is probably the weak link in the system as far as security risks go.

JimDaugherty

Initially, the car only looks for your phone when you set it up. The setup process “pairs” the phone and the car. After it is set up, when the car is turned on, it looks for the phone. If your phone is on Bluetooth, it hooks up with the car. Of course, if your phone Bluetooth is turned off, the car won’t find it.

I suppose that unscrupulous people could “hijack” your car’s Bluetooth connection. Recognize that the car is only a bit more than a Bluetooth headset with some phone controls. The phone controls include:
the car has its own phone book, and
it can disconnect itself if you want to continue a cell phone conversation outside of the car’s range.

It does some other tricks, too; check out the manual.

So, hijacking your TSX is about as easy and as useful as hijacking your cell phone headset; not so much.

I think that the Bluetooth (and voice recognition) capabilities on a car are a cool parlor trick IMHO. It is neat that the TSX has so much standard “kit” that you pay extra for on other cars. I notice on SLKWorld that people report spending a grand or two to get Bluetooth capabilities in their roadsters. There are a fair number of work arounds not having Bluetooth. While I also have the navigation system in the TSX, I have neither sat nav or Bluetooth in my roadster. I find both of these features a bit distracting while driving. This is true especially in the roadster, but in the TSX, too. I may have a quick phone call in the car. But, I don’t do brain surgery. In the cars, I’m focused on driving; the other stuff can wait until I get safely to my destination.

Congratulations on your new car. The TSX seems to be good value for money.

Notice that here, the people are bitching about piddly stuff probably because they don’t have greater problems to deal with on the TSX (fortunately). If you want to read about real, expensive problems, check out the German car sites.

Earlier life: 1966 Datsun 1600 Sport, 1972 BMW 2002tii, 1973 Volvo 142e, 72 Datsun 240Z, 72 Mercedes 250, 73 BMW 2002, 73 Datsun 260Z, 73 Volvo 164e, 71 BMW 2800cs, 77 BMW 320i, 82 Mercedes 300D, 84 BMW 325e, 86 Acura Legend, 90 Miata, 00 Acura TL
Current life: 06 TSX 6sp, 05 Mercedes SLK 350 7sp, 03 Toy RAV4
A car is an expensive PITA; get one you like.

1Louder

I can't add to the technical answers (which are excellent), but I will say this: you will absolutely love the BT feature. I didn't use mine initially, but WA has a hands-free law going into effect in 08 so I got a new phone and set it up over the summer. I can't belive I was going without it! I love it so much now I would never buy another car without it. And I don't even use the phone that much - but it's so much easier and safer now when I do.

Congrats on the new car!

davidspalding

The HFL is only a BT headset. What do you think someone outside your car could do with it?

I can't spout the technical details, but the pairing is done with a pass code. Another use can't just "pair" with it. A passcode has to be entered. You'll see when you get it and RT(F)M.

BTW, ignore the trailers for that Diane Lane film ... "OMFG, he's hacked into my CAR!"

P.S. to Jim: Wow, you've had some neat-o Datsuns. I remember when the 240Z came out. Saw one last year, looking as sweet as in 1972.

SoCaliTrojan

If I start the car and drive off, and later realize that my cell phone's bluetooth is off, I'll turn it on. However, the car doesn't recognize it until I hit the "HFL" button followed by the "HFL cancel" button. After that, the car will pair with the phone. Thus, it only looks for signals when the car is started or the HFL button is pressed. This is unlike the bluetooth on a computer. My computer pairs with my phone as soon as I get into range...

bluetooth only works within a short range. You can't use bluetooth to communicate with something in the next room, for instance. I don't think a hacker will want to tailgate your car to stay within range...

1Louder

^^ What year is your TSX? My 06 will look and recognize automatically - no buttons needed. Just curious.

Also, my cell will beep when it's no longer mated to a bluetooth device. I've noticed that I walk about 15-20' away from the car before I hear the disconnect. So the range is very short.

mrgold35

The car’s Bluetooth transmitter is only active when the TSX is in the position II and/or the engine is on. Bluetooth is very secure mode of transmitting. It uses a low power spread spectrum random frequency hoping method transmitted at the 2.4Ghz range. The two devices (TSX and HF phone) have to “handshake” (exchange encryption keys and frequency hoping pattern) and create a point-to-point data link to communicate. The power is so low and it hops so fast (something like 1600 hops/sec), it doesn’t interfere with other 2.4Ghz devices (wireless networks) or receive inference for other devices like microwaves. The TSX’s BT transmitter is only useful if the car is on and your phone is paired to the system within 0-30 feet range.

I work for a government agency and they allow Bluetooth devices because of its security aspects (spread spectrum frequency hoping, smaller data packets, low power, short range, encryption, random encryption key generation).

It is not impossible to break into Bluetooth transmission; it is just very very difficult without a supercomputer. Just keep in mind, all encryption codes used in the USA for military and civilian uses are generated by the National Security Agency (NSA). The NSA would not allow any encryption code to be used unless they have a means to decode in the interest of national security. I was a signal officer and a communication security custodian (COMSEC) back in my Army days +12 years ago.

davidspalding

Depends on the cell phone model. Some are only partially supported, mine included. Fer instance, the transfer feature basically fails if I dial on the phone and then try to use HFL with the "Transfer" command. HFL connects, tells the phone it's "got headset" but doesn't work. I've had people hang up on me that way, so I've got to learn to stop trying. ... If I dial from HFL, then it's all good. But I can't drive and read numbers off my phone to HFL. Safety tip: pull over to do sheot like that.
With the key in the ACCESSORY (1) position? HFL works on my 2006 with the ignition in the ACCESSORY (1) position. My phone (Nokia 6682, BTW) beeps (if warning tones are enabled) about 15 seconds after HFL turns off (basically, ignition key in LOCK (0) position, or removed). That's usually the time it takes me to walk about 10' from the car. It's not instantaneous. Of course, all phones are different. YMMV, &c.

1Louder

^^ *wiping egg from face* - that's what it is. My bad. I'll try a true range check one day just to save some face here. I'm as bad as that Edmunds reviewer in the other thread...makin' stuff up as I go

davidspalding

^^ Keeps it interesting.