A Month With the 3.2TL-
02-17-2013, 11:31 AM
#1
A Month With the 3.2TL-
The $1,200, one owner, 16 year old car with less than 48,000 miles barely started when I picked it up in Chicago last month.
After researching the car , I knew these cars had a reputation for going through starters, and while I had hoped it was just a battery, no such luck; it took both a new battery and a new starter. The car starts now after the $603 replacement (parts and labor) starter and a fresh Kirkland (Costco) battery, $91. The $1,200 car is now approaching a $2,000. However, I still think it a good deal even at that price.
The car's major weakness is the faded, rippled and scuffed and touched up exterior (it was never garaged). After giving the car a wash I noticed rusty ice in the spare tire compartment. I used a hammer to break it up and remove it and knocked a soft ball sized hole in the floor of the spare tire compartment -- the car taking on water for years, the compartment had rotted. I have placed a rubber backed floor mat over the hole. This summer I may have some steel tacked over the hole. Two mechanics each opined "leave it alone, you'll never worry about water there again".
The brakes checked out as new and the tires are likely its second set, all four matching Michelin Hydroedge (all season with plenty oftread left). The interior is nearly mint.
With the exception of the hole I knocked in the trunk I have been fairly lucky with other DYI projects.
1. I took a screwdriver and pushed the front passenger fabric speaker cover back into place-- it looked pretty bad at first, but when I finished, I must say, very workmanlike-- one would never know.
2. Next, I fixed the traverse on the driver's side mirror. This was the first thing I noticed wrong with the car when I drove it home from the city.
At first I thought it would be a minor nuisance, I could simply hand adjust it-- and that seemed to work, except that the mirror could not be pushed far enough outward to cover the blind spot. Even when pushed to the extreme, it would float back inward. So what was a minor issue turned out to be a rather significant safety concern.
Upon inspection I saw that the mirror was held by one large center ball and socket (not unlike a shoulder joint). When I popped the mirror off of that center ball and socket, I saw that there was a smaller post with ball and socket at the 9 o'clock that was detached-- this was the traverse and this was the problem.
I imagined the fix as easy as snapping the detached traverse ball into the back plate's socket, then snapping the mirror back onto the large center ball. That's essentially what it took, but it was far easier imagined than executed, only after several failed attempts was I eventually able to snap it back on with every ounce of force Icould muster.
3. The "push in to pop open" cup holder lid. The catch on the lid was broken, so the lid remained open- I had planned on fixing this with a magnet tohold the lid down, but once I got into the mechanism I discovered the lid was powered to open with two small springs- I removed one of the two springs, and now the lid stays down- to open it, now one simply has to push the back edge ofthe cover down (rather than the front edge as designed) and the remaining spring has sufficient force to keep the lid open.
4. Last weekend I detailed the interior- the car mats to a laundromat and in a washing machine-- no need to vacuum or scrub, they came out good as new.
5. The car is missing its tool kit- the contents required to operate the jack, so I consider this an essential part. I posted my need for this on the forum and I bought a replacement.
The car is truly a vintage piece and I enjoy its simplicity. The TL 3.2 Premium cost around $35,000 new in 1997. That equates to roughly $50,000 in today’s dollars. The car had a 4 year 50,000 mile bumper to bumper warranty when new. My car has just over 48,000 miles. So I think it a remarkable vehicle. I was pleasantly surprised the car was a Premium, the extra grip in the winter of great value. I was surprised the vehicle did not have a outside temperature thermometer or computing (fairly standard luxury items for the day).
The car has a basic rational design (inside and out). Among this car's many virtues, the engine and transmission run good as new, the ride is smooth and quiet, the interior in very good shape. The car is enjoyable to drive with plenty of front leg room and a fairly large trunk. It handles far better than the soft ride would lead you to predict and it has sufficient power in the V-6 (200hp, 210ft/lbs torque). All of the electronics and buttons, knobs and etc., are functional (although there is a crackle in the passenger door speaker).
I'm hoping to get 5 years (30,000 miles) of trouble free motoring out of the car, wish me luck!
After researching the car , I knew these cars had a reputation for going through starters, and while I had hoped it was just a battery, no such luck; it took both a new battery and a new starter. The car starts now after the $603 replacement (parts and labor) starter and a fresh Kirkland (Costco) battery, $91. The $1,200 car is now approaching a $2,000. However, I still think it a good deal even at that price.
The car's major weakness is the faded, rippled and scuffed and touched up exterior (it was never garaged). After giving the car a wash I noticed rusty ice in the spare tire compartment. I used a hammer to break it up and remove it and knocked a soft ball sized hole in the floor of the spare tire compartment -- the car taking on water for years, the compartment had rotted. I have placed a rubber backed floor mat over the hole. This summer I may have some steel tacked over the hole. Two mechanics each opined "leave it alone, you'll never worry about water there again".
The brakes checked out as new and the tires are likely its second set, all four matching Michelin Hydroedge (all season with plenty oftread left). The interior is nearly mint.
With the exception of the hole I knocked in the trunk I have been fairly lucky with other DYI projects.
1. I took a screwdriver and pushed the front passenger fabric speaker cover back into place-- it looked pretty bad at first, but when I finished, I must say, very workmanlike-- one would never know.
2. Next, I fixed the traverse on the driver's side mirror. This was the first thing I noticed wrong with the car when I drove it home from the city.
At first I thought it would be a minor nuisance, I could simply hand adjust it-- and that seemed to work, except that the mirror could not be pushed far enough outward to cover the blind spot. Even when pushed to the extreme, it would float back inward. So what was a minor issue turned out to be a rather significant safety concern.
Upon inspection I saw that the mirror was held by one large center ball and socket (not unlike a shoulder joint). When I popped the mirror off of that center ball and socket, I saw that there was a smaller post with ball and socket at the 9 o'clock that was detached-- this was the traverse and this was the problem.
I imagined the fix as easy as snapping the detached traverse ball into the back plate's socket, then snapping the mirror back onto the large center ball. That's essentially what it took, but it was far easier imagined than executed, only after several failed attempts was I eventually able to snap it back on with every ounce of force Icould muster.
3. The "push in to pop open" cup holder lid. The catch on the lid was broken, so the lid remained open- I had planned on fixing this with a magnet tohold the lid down, but once I got into the mechanism I discovered the lid was powered to open with two small springs- I removed one of the two springs, and now the lid stays down- to open it, now one simply has to push the back edge ofthe cover down (rather than the front edge as designed) and the remaining spring has sufficient force to keep the lid open.
4. Last weekend I detailed the interior- the car mats to a laundromat and in a washing machine-- no need to vacuum or scrub, they came out good as new.
5. The car is missing its tool kit- the contents required to operate the jack, so I consider this an essential part. I posted my need for this on the forum and I bought a replacement.
The car is truly a vintage piece and I enjoy its simplicity. The TL 3.2 Premium cost around $35,000 new in 1997. That equates to roughly $50,000 in today’s dollars. The car had a 4 year 50,000 mile bumper to bumper warranty when new. My car has just over 48,000 miles. So I think it a remarkable vehicle. I was pleasantly surprised the car was a Premium, the extra grip in the winter of great value. I was surprised the vehicle did not have a outside temperature thermometer or computing (fairly standard luxury items for the day).
The car has a basic rational design (inside and out). Among this car's many virtues, the engine and transmission run good as new, the ride is smooth and quiet, the interior in very good shape. The car is enjoyable to drive with plenty of front leg room and a fairly large trunk. It handles far better than the soft ride would lead you to predict and it has sufficient power in the V-6 (200hp, 210ft/lbs torque). All of the electronics and buttons, knobs and etc., are functional (although there is a crackle in the passenger door speaker).
I'm hoping to get 5 years (30,000 miles) of trouble free motoring out of the car, wish me luck!
02-17-2013, 06:22 PM
#2
I still think you are getting good value for the money.
I just took over my Dad's 2.5TL and it's just as a remember it when he picked it up. I was very jealous at the time...
Somewhat simple, but elegant and function design. As I commented in another post it is remarkable how similar the TL is to his new C300 Mercedes. Timeless it would seem.
Maintenance is the key I always say, especially those oil changes!
Best of luck and enjoy!
Chris
I just took over my Dad's 2.5TL and it's just as a remember it when he picked it up. I was very jealous at the time...
Somewhat simple, but elegant and function design. As I commented in another post it is remarkable how similar the TL is to his new C300 Mercedes. Timeless it would seem.
Maintenance is the key I always say, especially those oil changes!
Best of luck and enjoy!
Chris
02-18-2013, 02:46 PM
#3
Oil Change Due at 50,000
Chris-
How neat you have your Dad's car and you remember it from when it was new. This car belonged to my friend/coworker's mother. Her mother purchased it new in 1997 after her husband passed away and this car served her until she could no longer drive (she is 86 and I am sorry to say in failing health). Her caretakers drove it the last few years, until it would no longer reliably start. Initially my coworker considered donating it to charity, but I convinced her to sell it to me "sight unseen."
I do think the car has a very German style to it in terms of being well constructed, simple, practical and luxurious at the same time. The ride and steering strikes me as very "American," but the handling as I mentioned earlier really incredible considering the soft ride.
You are so right! If the car is going to "go the distance," I'll need to maintain it. The corner mechanic who replaced the starter checked the fluids and recommended I run the car to the next oil change (now I have less than 2,000 miles to go) then he'll do the oil change and service the transmission and differential. He said the car appeared to have been regularly maintained by the previous owner.
Adding some photos I took today-
How neat you have your Dad's car and you remember it from when it was new. This car belonged to my friend/coworker's mother. Her mother purchased it new in 1997 after her husband passed away and this car served her until she could no longer drive (she is 86 and I am sorry to say in failing health). Her caretakers drove it the last few years, until it would no longer reliably start. Initially my coworker considered donating it to charity, but I convinced her to sell it to me "sight unseen."
I do think the car has a very German style to it in terms of being well constructed, simple, practical and luxurious at the same time. The ride and steering strikes me as very "American," but the handling as I mentioned earlier really incredible considering the soft ride.
You are so right! If the car is going to "go the distance," I'll need to maintain it. The corner mechanic who replaced the starter checked the fluids and recommended I run the car to the next oil change (now I have less than 2,000 miles to go) then he'll do the oil change and service the transmission and differential. He said the car appeared to have been regularly maintained by the previous owner.
Adding some photos I took today-
02-18-2013, 05:57 PM
#7
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02-18-2013, 07:16 PM
#9
Thanks all, it is really nice to see that others appreciate this car! The interior and the powertrain are the best parts of this car-- the exterior is nowhere near as nice. For the sake of full disclosure, the next nice day I will wash the car and take some photos of the rough exterior and will even go into the trunk compartment and show you the rusted out hole I knocked into it with a hammer!
02-20-2013, 07:50 AM
#10
that car is a beaut... sad that it sat unused for so long... but glad that it is in the hands of a very capable and keen owner now...
just a tip for the future... with anything that has been sitting for a while, brute force will do more damage as you have seen with your spare tire well in the trunk... slow and steady wins the race... i have helped my friend restore some old classics and even with old rusted bolts... its alot of pb blaster, heat, turn the bolt once, then pb blaster and let sit overnight... repeat for like a week until it comes out free...
if you find ice, use a heat gun to melt everything and then soak up with rags or dry/wet vac... if the car got that much water in the trunk over time, check the trunk seals and also the gaskets on the taillights, or water will make its way in there again...
just a tip for the future... with anything that has been sitting for a while, brute force will do more damage as you have seen with your spare tire well in the trunk... slow and steady wins the race... i have helped my friend restore some old classics and even with old rusted bolts... its alot of pb blaster, heat, turn the bolt once, then pb blaster and let sit overnight... repeat for like a week until it comes out free...
if you find ice, use a heat gun to melt everything and then soak up with rags or dry/wet vac... if the car got that much water in the trunk over time, check the trunk seals and also the gaskets on the taillights, or water will make its way in there again...
02-20-2013, 07:00 PM
#11
Well maybe I am not such a capable owner! You are right I should not have used a hammer to break up the ice. By the way, I think the tail light(s) the likely point of entry for the water-- in particular the passenger side-- I noticed dampness only in that portion of the carpet- so water is still entering the car.
Regarding the hammer...I think the portion of the spare tire compartment that I knocked out was quite rotted, so it was very likely a loss in any event. A couple of days ago, I removed additional decay from around the opening and sprayed some lithium grease on the edges. Hopefully that will help preserve some of metal until I have time to get it to the body shop and get the hole repaired. Again, thanks everyone for the interest. Since owning this car, I am noticing how few of them are still on the road in my neck of the woods. Lots of newer TLs, not so many of these early ones.
Regarding the hammer...I think the portion of the spare tire compartment that I knocked out was quite rotted, so it was very likely a loss in any event. A couple of days ago, I removed additional decay from around the opening and sprayed some lithium grease on the edges. Hopefully that will help preserve some of metal until I have time to get it to the body shop and get the hole repaired. Again, thanks everyone for the interest. Since owning this car, I am noticing how few of them are still on the road in my neck of the woods. Lots of newer TLs, not so many of these early ones.
02-20-2013, 10:22 PM
#12
Three Wheelin'
Hmm... I remember reading years ago the production numbers of the 1st gen TLs by years, but can't seem to find it anymore. Anyone came across this?
02-21-2013, 03:51 PM
#13
Well maybe I am not such a capable owner! You are right I should not have used a hammer to break up the ice. By the way, I think the tail light(s) the likely point of entry for the water-- in particular the passenger side-- I noticed dampness only in that portion of the carpet- so water is still entering the car.
Regarding the hammer...I think the portion of the spare tire compartment that I knocked out was quite rotted, so it was very likely a loss in any event. A couple of days ago, I removed additional decay from around the opening and sprayed some lithium grease on the edges. Hopefully that will help preserve some of metal until I have time to get it to the body shop and get the hole repaired. Again, thanks everyone for the interest. Since owning this car, I am noticing how few of them are still on the road in my neck of the woods. Lots of newer TLs, not so many of these early ones.
Regarding the hammer...I think the portion of the spare tire compartment that I knocked out was quite rotted, so it was very likely a loss in any event. A couple of days ago, I removed additional decay from around the opening and sprayed some lithium grease on the edges. Hopefully that will help preserve some of metal until I have time to get it to the body shop and get the hole repaired. Again, thanks everyone for the interest. Since owning this car, I am noticing how few of them are still on the road in my neck of the woods. Lots of newer TLs, not so many of these early ones.
my intention wasn't to attack you with my response... just wanted to pass along some helpful info for the future... also, naval jelly is great for stopping and preventing further cancer from spreading... you have already done a great job with the car... keep it up!!!
02-21-2013, 06:19 PM
#14
. I really enjoyed your response!!!!! I thought what I did with that hammer worthy of a Darwin award, and hopefully I did not come off as being defensive. But after the dust....or more accurately "rust" settled, I figured (rationalized) what I knocked out with that hammer was rotted out and no great loss.I'm enjoying this car more than anyone around me can understand...so it is nice to have this place to come to and vent my joy.
02-22-2013, 09:25 AM
#16
A Classic?
I do think the first generation Acura 3.2TL has the makings of a classic. A great car, timeless lines, and well built. I was not sure how a car qualifies for the moniker "classic" I looked it up on Wikipedia.
According to the CCCA a "classic car "is a "fine" or "distinctive" automobile, either American or foreign built, produced between 1925 and 1948. Other factors, including engine displacement, custom coachwork and luxury accessories, such as power brakes, power clutch, and "one-shot" or automatic lubrication systems, help determine whether a car is considered a Classic." So by this definition our cars have a long way to go.
In the US the legal definition of classic requires that the car be at least 20 years old-- so by this definition our cars are getting close to that! The article notes "The 1980s are often viewed as the early modern period due to the rise of Japanese automakers... ." While the 1980s represent a decade where the Japanese automakers stole a lot of thunder from Detroit, I believe the 1990s will be remembered as the decade that the likes of Acura and Lexus stole a lot of thunder from the German automakers.
The first generation TL might best be described by losely as "a modern classic." Those cars tend to be 15 to 25 years old.
According to the CCCA a "classic car "is a "fine" or "distinctive" automobile, either American or foreign built, produced between 1925 and 1948. Other factors, including engine displacement, custom coachwork and luxury accessories, such as power brakes, power clutch, and "one-shot" or automatic lubrication systems, help determine whether a car is considered a Classic." So by this definition our cars have a long way to go.
In the US the legal definition of classic requires that the car be at least 20 years old-- so by this definition our cars are getting close to that! The article notes "The 1980s are often viewed as the early modern period due to the rise of Japanese automakers... ." While the 1980s represent a decade where the Japanese automakers stole a lot of thunder from Detroit, I believe the 1990s will be remembered as the decade that the likes of Acura and Lexus stole a lot of thunder from the German automakers.
The first generation TL might best be described by losely as "a modern classic." Those cars tend to be 15 to 25 years old.
03-06-2013, 08:39 AM
#17
98 3.2 Flamenco Black
If you keep with the paint and engine, it will serve you well. Still keep on getting questions like...what year is that? 1998...get out of here replies...
Puts a smile on my face.
And yeah BTW, the son owns this car now, he's just finishing his degree...so it is still my daily ride.
Puts a smile on my face.
And yeah BTW, the son owns this car now, he's just finishing his degree...so it is still my daily ride.
04-30-2013, 04:28 PM
#18
Udate: Four Months- my first service
We've owned the car since late January, after initial investment in the new starter and battery, the mechanic advised that I should drive it until the next oil change due (according to the sticker due at 50,200), then he'd see to the oil change, transmission and differential. I managed to fix the water leak in the trunk by taking out the offending tail light and sealing everything up with silicone. That seems to have done the trick. As the weather, warmed last week, I realized the car's A/C was not blowing cold.
I dropped the car off yesterday, oil, filter, transmission and differential- total $131. The mechanic was surprised at the cost of the required Honda transmission fluid and he had initally underestimated the cost. The A/C appeared to be holding pressure, so he recharged the system, $200.
The transmission was shifting smoothly and the car running perfectly before the maintenance, so I can't report anything improved other than cold air from the A/C. The mechanic prounced the car road worthy for any lenghty trip.
Now my $1,200 car thanks to the starter ($600), battery ($100), A/C ($200) and oil/fluids ($131) is a $2,231 car. But with 50,000 miles on the engine and drivetrain and this service done, I remain optimistic that this car will serve us well with minimal expense for many years to come.
Last week I saw a 1st Gen 3.2TL that was the spitting image of my car (right down to the same color), driving westbound on North Avenue near Elmhurst, IL. The other driver noticed my car as well and we exchanged a wave and several admiring glances. I keep my eyes open for these cars now that I own one and this was the first I have seen in 4 months!
I dropped the car off yesterday, oil, filter, transmission and differential- total $131. The mechanic was surprised at the cost of the required Honda transmission fluid and he had initally underestimated the cost. The A/C appeared to be holding pressure, so he recharged the system, $200.
The transmission was shifting smoothly and the car running perfectly before the maintenance, so I can't report anything improved other than cold air from the A/C. The mechanic prounced the car road worthy for any lenghty trip.
Now my $1,200 car thanks to the starter ($600), battery ($100), A/C ($200) and oil/fluids ($131) is a $2,231 car. But with 50,000 miles on the engine and drivetrain and this service done, I remain optimistic that this car will serve us well with minimal expense for many years to come.
Last week I saw a 1st Gen 3.2TL that was the spitting image of my car (right down to the same color), driving westbound on North Avenue near Elmhurst, IL. The other driver noticed my car as well and we exchanged a wave and several admiring glances. I keep my eyes open for these cars now that I own one and this was the first I have seen in 4 months!
05-28-2013, 03:17 PM
#19
You should reasonably expect to get at least another 150,000 out of this car as long as the rust doesn't get too bad...
Good luck!
06-04-2013, 07:22 PM
#21
With the car sorted out, low miles, driving like a dream and everything working, the weather worn exterior (what the rest of the world sees) is kind of hard to justify. I have toyed with the idea of having a body shop go over it and straighten the little dents here and there and spray a fresh coat of paint; then dismiss it because this car is sitting out in the driveway or in a parking lot 24/7. We use this car now as much as the other two cars combined...so it is delivering a great value. One thing about having a car like this is we don't worry about parking lot dings! It may be after owning it for a few more years, I will tend to the body. Or perhaps get my 50,000 miles out of it and let the next (3rd) owner take care of that!
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