ESHBG

That is not the case, the 2015 GTI Autobahn does offer a manual transmission and comes with dual zone climate control.

From a business point of view, I get the whole Acura does not offer a manual transmission because the numbers just weren't right argument. However, I still stand by my opinion that the numbers aren't ever right because they don't really give you a choice; Acura markets itself as near luxury/luxury yet the only chance to get a manual transmission for quite some time was by choosing the model with a big step down interior-wise and with a lack of important options that makes a car like an Acura worthwhile.

silverTL6

iTrader: (2)

Indeed, 6MT's with nav/tech used to be available on quite a few models...all Type-S cars, 09-11 TSX's, 04-06 TL's, and 4G TL SH-AWD's.

Then they claimed these models didn't sell, and began limiting 6MT to non-tech models (TSX SE and ILX 2.4). And the same excuse again when eliminating the 6MT for good with the TLX and MMC ILX.

I'd love to see sales stats for each of these models, as they would likely prove that it's been a self-fulfilling prophecy all along

usdmJON

You guys act like it is some conspiracy that Acura won't make you an MT.

They decided they weren't making enough money. These are financial decisions. Simple as that.

There are so many other fine cars out there. Many with manual options. It's pretty futile to complain that Acura isn't doing it too. Go buy a Subaru or a Lexus.

silverTL6

iTrader: (2)

For a brand that historically tried to peddle a sporty image, having no MT's in the lineup is just hearsay. They aren't Lexus or MB, where luxury is #1 priority. I'm sure they'd rather be compared to BMW and Audi, which still offer multiple MT models. For all the millions they spend on advertising, I just don't buy the bean counter excuses.

Yes I can always buy another brand, but I'd be much happier if it were an Acura

ESHBG

You're proving exactly what I feel is wrong with this mentality: "If you don't like it, go buy another car." Okay, I will, along with many others. Is it smart for a brand that tries to market itself as sporty/luxury to tell its customers to shop elsewhere if they want a SPORTY/LUXURY car?!? Many of us would prefer to stay with Acura, but they are now telling me they are no longer interested in my business. If I am a niche of a niche that's fine however, I am willing to pay for exactly what I want.

And I never once excused the economics argument. But I will counter that argument with the most recent TL as an example: the manual was in a class all of its own, sold well and are still sought after vehicles and they come complete with the Tech package...I do not feel as if that is a coincidence.

pnoi521

I think Acura has moved on from the sport luxury aspirations. Acura is now "smart luxury"

panamera125

I guess that's a way to put it. Acura competes with the bulk of the luxury market, but not to any extremes. That means (in, say, Mercedes terms) a CLA competitor, a C Class competitor, an E Class competitor, and a GLK and an ML class competitor. That's the bulk of Mercedes sales, and that's where Acura competes. From a business standpoint, that makes a lot of sense.

usdmJON

To me that just sounds like you expect Acura to have 6 of every model available. Acura decided what you want is not worth their time and money. End of story. So yes go buy another car.
One brand can't make everything.
I love my acura.
But if I wanted a sporty car I would have not bought one. Period.

There are so many other companies making great cars. I'd rather acura never made another sporty car again and focus on luxury. If in the future I want a sporty car I'll hit up Subaru or another company that makes sporty cars.

ESHBG

So you'd rather the brand that you like and support bleed sales to competitors? I think the naysayers are missing one very important point: Honda/Acura has proven that they can do sporty and luxury right and brought us cars like the Honda S2000, Prelude, RSX, TL-S... It is not an unreasonable or non cost-effective leap for them to do it again.

And the problem with the full on luxury argument is that they aren't even blowing that category out of the water right now and let's face it, most of their new models are just catching up to other manufacturers (and even a few cars that are below their class have been beating them in technology for a few model years now).

I love my car and I have owned and driven countless Honda/Acura products but the brand is not impressing me all that much anymore and I feel that is disappointing, and there are numerous missed opportunities. I am not asking for "6 of every model", I am asking for one, and that is not unreasonable.

Colin

To be honest, I think you're overestimating the amount of potential sales lost. On a personal note, I'm hugely disappointed since I'm a lifelong MT driver, but professionally, it's hardly the kiss of death to my bottom line.

I think I mentioned this earlier, but assuming that the new Direct Injection engine requires re-certification with the EPA (for MT usage), it would be HUGELY expensive to do considering the ILX manual volume. From what I hear, it's millions of dollars invested to (eventually) sell hundreds of cars. IMO, the only alternative would have been to leave the old engine in place or switch the Civic Si to the new DI motor to get enough volume.

I know you cited other MT H/A cars, but remember that the S2000 sold more per year than MT ILXs and it went for 10 years to recoup it's costs, the ILX has only 2 left on this cycle (I know they could use the drivetrain the next car but who knows, maybe turbos are in the future?). Don't forget, if they decided to bring the manual the the TLX, or move the Si to DI, maybe a future ILX could get it too.

ESHBG

I may be and you would definitely know better than I would. But if we were offered exactly what we were looking for, I'm not sure it would still be the kiss of death to your bottom line. But of course I only have a hypothetical for my case and we may never know unfortunately. However, while I recognize this forum caters to enthusiasts who would be more inclined to want an MT so the opinions here may not be the best examples, I do know quite a few people in "the real world" who would jump on a manual in a second if it was offered. In fact I have two very good recent examples, where they decided to downgrade a bit just to be able to pick up a car with an MT.

A very good point and one I thought of as well, and with regulations and technology down the road, this may further push the MTs into the graveyard. The writing may be on the wall at this point and when you see some of the world's top sports cars being released without an MT, it does make one think. But...I don't know, I just think that "the niche of a niche" is a market worth not writing off just yet and the results may be surprising if done correctly.

iutodd

When is this thing hitting dealers?

panamera125

I thought it was February, but that seems too early. Maybe I'm wrong?

silverTL6

iTrader: (2)

I for one don't think MT lux sedans are a niche of a niche. Combined with the right platform, looks, and options, I'd wager they'd sell in fairly competitive numbers. Look at all the hoopla when BMW initially released the E60 M5 without one. I can't begin to imagine what would happen if the same occurred with the M3, and these are niche models moreso than any Acura (ok, maybe except the RLX).

Sure, there are currently no Acura's worthy of a manual, their budget may not be as big as others, and adding one to the NSX has its own technical obstacles. But dedicate some resources to building a truly performance-oriented lux model with one, and I bet they will come. Even if they don't break even, it would do wonders for their reputation (which would be more useful to them now than big profits IMO).

Nedmundo

I wish I agreed with this, but unfortunately luxury MT sedans are an increasingly small niche. MB, Lexus, and now Acura don't offer any, an even BMW is restricting MT availability within the 3/4 Series lineup where it was probably most popular. For example, if you want AWD, it's 335i only, and MT isn't available at all on the Grand Coupe and wagons regardless of engine choice. I recall reading that BMW wanted to ditch MT on the new M3/4, but the outcry from the U.S. market inspired them to add it, as it did with the M5.

Even so, I've been a little confused by the MT situation with Acura. On the one hand, their current approach suggests the take rate is so low that offering MT isn't viable, but the dealers I've spoken to say they sold quickly, and the salesman with whom I tested the TLX said several of his customers were on the fence about it due to lack of MT. So, I don't know whether there might be more demand than Acura realizes, or whether, with the 4G TL and 2G TSX, they accurately assessed the demand, and limited production numbers to what would sell, which forced some buyers (like me) to have cars shipped from distant dealerships. I suspect that, like everyone else, they saw MT sales decreasing over time, and decided it's simply not worth it anymore.

Regardless, given Honda's spectacular MT's, it would be a shame if they disappeared permanently from the Acura lineup. The 8DCT in the TLX is fantastic, but still no substitute IMO. One option, which was suggested years ago by a Car & Driver editor, would be for companies to charge extra for MT to defray the certification costs. The hard core would pay it, for sure.

One problem, of course, is CAFE standards and fuel economy bragging rights. Now that AT's and DCT's offer better fuel economy than MT's, the latter will decrease a company's average economy for CAFE purposes, and offering MT would force companies to list the lower MT numbers which would dilute the fuel economy message in advertising.