Questions after my first detail
06-03-2009, 10:14 AM
#1
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Questions after my first detail
sup everybody,
So I placed order from Pat (Excel Detail), and he helped me through the whole process (and is still helping)...
Got the UDM buffer, Opt Polish II, Opt Finishing Polish, Four Star Polymer Protectant, and a host of other smaller items....
Everything seemed to go pretty smoothly for my first time, though I'm sure there's a lot of room for improvement in my technique.
For starters, I went through half the Opt Polish II (8 oz bottle), and three quarters of the Finishing polish (8 oz bottle).
I heard/read that what can be bad/damaging for the paint, is to have the buffer on it with no product....... therefore, I used plenty of product, but most of the time did so with the three dime spots on the buffer.
I attempted to trace the 12 x 12 area as suggested in the article by Detailed Imaged, but usually the polish would mostly go on the first couple inches, and then the rest of the area would have hardly any.
On the hood and the trunk, it was easy to go through the back and forth motions as suggested in that article, but in the harder to reach places, I found myself just trying to cover them without leaving the buffer in one spot for long.
I did everything this past Friday, and out here in the Southbay of LA, it was very overcast. As a matter of fact, I couldn't view my work in the sunlight until Monday.
At first it seemed like a pretty flawless job, but come Monday, I noticed a few spider webs. Not bad spider webs, but they were definitely there, and it bothered me.
Yesterday was much sunnier, and I noticed even more spider webs.
Again it wasn't "bad" per se, as you had to really move in close and catch them at a certain angle, but it definitely shows that I guess either I did something wrong, or there is room for improvement.
I'm actually waiting to hear back from Pat on email, but thought I'd start to share my story now, and get a variety of feedback and suggestions.
Another issue I have is cleaning the pads. I soaked them in water afterwards, and then used a little Ivory soap, rubbed them, and soaked them some more. I could not get all the polish out of the pad.
My concern is that the polish will harden, and that pad will be ruined after just one use. (all three pads actually, have product still in them)
I was thinking about swirling the pads in a bucket with the buffer, as I had accidentally did this a few times while buffing (swirling the pads in the air before hitting the off button), and product sprayed everywhere (yes you can laugh, I'm an idiot at this
).... so I was thinking of maybe doing that inside a bucket, to get the product out of the pads.
My car is a brand new 09 TSX, Crystal Pearl Black.
Any help, feedback, comments, suggestions, constructive criticisms etc. are welcome.
Thanks very much
So I placed order from Pat (Excel Detail), and he helped me through the whole process (and is still helping)...
Got the UDM buffer, Opt Polish II, Opt Finishing Polish, Four Star Polymer Protectant, and a host of other smaller items....
Everything seemed to go pretty smoothly for my first time, though I'm sure there's a lot of room for improvement in my technique.
For starters, I went through half the Opt Polish II (8 oz bottle), and three quarters of the Finishing polish (8 oz bottle).
I heard/read that what can be bad/damaging for the paint, is to have the buffer on it with no product....... therefore, I used plenty of product, but most of the time did so with the three dime spots on the buffer.
I attempted to trace the 12 x 12 area as suggested in the article by Detailed Imaged, but usually the polish would mostly go on the first couple inches, and then the rest of the area would have hardly any.
On the hood and the trunk, it was easy to go through the back and forth motions as suggested in that article, but in the harder to reach places, I found myself just trying to cover them without leaving the buffer in one spot for long.
I did everything this past Friday, and out here in the Southbay of LA, it was very overcast. As a matter of fact, I couldn't view my work in the sunlight until Monday.
At first it seemed like a pretty flawless job, but come Monday, I noticed a few spider webs. Not bad spider webs, but they were definitely there, and it bothered me.
Yesterday was much sunnier, and I noticed even more spider webs.
Again it wasn't "bad" per se, as you had to really move in close and catch them at a certain angle, but it definitely shows that I guess either I did something wrong, or there is room for improvement.
I'm actually waiting to hear back from Pat on email, but thought I'd start to share my story now, and get a variety of feedback and suggestions.
Another issue I have is cleaning the pads. I soaked them in water afterwards, and then used a little Ivory soap, rubbed them, and soaked them some more. I could not get all the polish out of the pad.
My concern is that the polish will harden, and that pad will be ruined after just one use. (all three pads actually, have product still in them)
I was thinking about swirling the pads in a bucket with the buffer, as I had accidentally did this a few times while buffing (swirling the pads in the air before hitting the off button), and product sprayed everywhere (yes you can laugh, I'm an idiot at this
).... so I was thinking of maybe doing that inside a bucket, to get the product out of the pads.My car is a brand new 09 TSX, Crystal Pearl Black.
Any help, feedback, comments, suggestions, constructive criticisms etc. are welcome.
Thanks very much
06-03-2009, 11:01 AM
#2
Former Sponsor
Mike, you have been emailed.......Once I sent it, I thought I would share with others, hope you dont mind!
"Mike, back is doing good! Almost 90%! Thank you for asking!
As for your dilemma......Mike, understand, as with anything new, improvements come with time, as will understanding each products characteristics. If you improve the appearance, and learn just a little more with each detail, your successful.
Learning the capabilities, of each polish you use, can only come with experience.
The Optimum Polish will only remove very light swirls, but it has a step in each detail. The Compound will remove, slightly deeper swirls, that the Polish is not capable of. And further more, the Hyper Compound will remove what the Compound wouldnt have.
Also understand, that with each use of a progressive polish i.e. polish, compound, hyper compound, one must perform a "cleanup" polish. Just as in baseball, where you have one at the plate (hyper compound), one on deck (compound) and one hitting "cleanup" (polish). The one on deck, or in cleanup, is suppose to theoretically, clean up the preceding batters, or compounds.
Another thing to consider is, over time, adjusting your technique. Instead of 3 minimal passes, with say 5lbs of pressure, go 5 passes, with a tad more then 5lbs of pressure. You could also overlap 75% instead of 50%! See what I mean? There are all kinds of variances and possibilities, which can be tried with each unique detail. You have to use, what, in your experience, has worked before. But.....this is all new to you, you dont have any experience to draw from, you are LEARNING and EXPERIENCING now.
To sum up, what you need, is just more time Mike. How much more do you know now, then when you called a few weeks ago? It all comes together, over time amigo!! I still learn new things WITH EACH AND EVERY DETAIL. With that said, you will never "know it all"......
Mike, have fun, call, PM, text me with anything!"
"Mike, back is doing good! Almost 90%! Thank you for asking!
As for your dilemma......Mike, understand, as with anything new, improvements come with time, as will understanding each products characteristics. If you improve the appearance, and learn just a little more with each detail, your successful.
Learning the capabilities, of each polish you use, can only come with experience.
The Optimum Polish will only remove very light swirls, but it has a step in each detail. The Compound will remove, slightly deeper swirls, that the Polish is not capable of. And further more, the Hyper Compound will remove what the Compound wouldnt have.
Also understand, that with each use of a progressive polish i.e. polish, compound, hyper compound, one must perform a "cleanup" polish. Just as in baseball, where you have one at the plate (hyper compound), one on deck (compound) and one hitting "cleanup" (polish). The one on deck, or in cleanup, is suppose to theoretically, clean up the preceding batters, or compounds.
Another thing to consider is, over time, adjusting your technique. Instead of 3 minimal passes, with say 5lbs of pressure, go 5 passes, with a tad more then 5lbs of pressure. You could also overlap 75% instead of 50%! See what I mean? There are all kinds of variances and possibilities, which can be tried with each unique detail. You have to use, what, in your experience, has worked before. But.....this is all new to you, you dont have any experience to draw from, you are LEARNING and EXPERIENCING now.
To sum up, what you need, is just more time Mike. How much more do you know now, then when you called a few weeks ago? It all comes together, over time amigo!! I still learn new things WITH EACH AND EVERY DETAIL. With that said, you will never "know it all"......
Mike, have fun, call, PM, text me with anything!"
06-03-2009, 11:44 AM
#3
Instructor
hey southbay you've come a long way from when i last read your posts. congrats on the first detail.
patrick is absolutely correct. i was met with a huge learning curve over the memorial day weekend but it was expected. i too also had flaws on the car that i either missed or wouldnt come out despite my best effort. i am though still satisified since the results still exceeded my expectations. am i going to jump in there and chase after the flaws? probably not now. im going to give the four star a chance to do its work and revisit things in 4 or 5 months when its time to clean things up for these harsh socal winters. now that i have an idea of what to expect the next time around shouldnt be so bad and ill have a better chance at correcting the left over flaws. (plus i have my wife's corolla to practice on 
)
patrick is absolutely correct. i was met with a huge learning curve over the memorial day weekend but it was expected. i too also had flaws on the car that i either missed or wouldnt come out despite my best effort. i am though still satisified since the results still exceeded my expectations. am i going to jump in there and chase after the flaws? probably not now. im going to give the four star a chance to do its work and revisit things in 4 or 5 months when its time to clean things up for these harsh socal winters.
now that i have an idea of what to expect the next time around shouldnt be so bad and ill have a better chance at correcting the left over flaws. (plus i have my wife's corolla to practice on )
06-03-2009, 12:39 PM
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Few pointers, one of the first things that jumps out to me is that you used too much product. I barely use an ounce of polish per coat on a mid sized vehicle. If you're having difficulty spreading the polish in a 12" x 12" area, I'd give one slight mist of distilled water on your pad to help spread the product.
The problem with using too much product is you're adding more and more abrasives to the pad with more polish. This means you have to work the product in even longer to properly break down the polishes. If you stop polishing prematurely and the abrasives in the polish have not fully broken down, this is typically when you are left with imperfections, hazing, marring and other buffer related imperfections.
Another question I'd have for you is how many pads did you use? 4oz of product on one pad is sure to saturate the pad and give you less than optimal results. I highly recommend swapping out for a fresh pad every few panels. I typically use 3 - 5 pads on an average coat of polish. What are the benefits of this? You aren't saturating your pad, so that more and more abrasive particles build up making it harder to finish down to the level you want. Also, caked up product can easily bog down a machine like a PC and as you experienced, makes cleaning significantly more difficult. If you swap out for a fresh pad every couple panels, you're going to experience the same cutting ability for the entire detail. Look over your paint and see if you notice that where you started got better results in correcting imperfections than where you ended your detail. Fresh pads can break abrasive particles down more effectively. If you did use 1 pad, think of how much easier it would be to clean if it had 1/4 of the product on it spaced over 4 pads. It helps your pads stay newer longer.
As everyone mentioned, you will get better with each detail. You should experiment with various techniques to see what gives you and your paint the best possible results, while staying close to the recommended guidelines.
I'd also highly recommend investing in some proper lighting, a dual halogen setup from Sears runs about $30 and will help expose your imperfections while your polishing so you can monitor your results as you go.
Hope some of this helps improve your results next time around.
George
The problem with using too much product is you're adding more and more abrasives to the pad with more polish. This means you have to work the product in even longer to properly break down the polishes. If you stop polishing prematurely and the abrasives in the polish have not fully broken down, this is typically when you are left with imperfections, hazing, marring and other buffer related imperfections.
Another question I'd have for you is how many pads did you use? 4oz of product on one pad is sure to saturate the pad and give you less than optimal results. I highly recommend swapping out for a fresh pad every few panels. I typically use 3 - 5 pads on an average coat of polish. What are the benefits of this? You aren't saturating your pad, so that more and more abrasive particles build up making it harder to finish down to the level you want. Also, caked up product can easily bog down a machine like a PC and as you experienced, makes cleaning significantly more difficult. If you swap out for a fresh pad every couple panels, you're going to experience the same cutting ability for the entire detail. Look over your paint and see if you notice that where you started got better results in correcting imperfections than where you ended your detail. Fresh pads can break abrasive particles down more effectively. If you did use 1 pad, think of how much easier it would be to clean if it had 1/4 of the product on it spaced over 4 pads. It helps your pads stay newer longer.
As everyone mentioned, you will get better with each detail. You should experiment with various techniques to see what gives you and your paint the best possible results, while staying close to the recommended guidelines.
I'd also highly recommend investing in some proper lighting, a dual halogen setup from Sears runs about $30 and will help expose your imperfections while your polishing so you can monitor your results as you go.
Hope some of this helps improve your results next time around.
George
06-04-2009, 04:42 PM
#5
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Just wanted to say thanks guys for the help/feedback!!!
As for the pads, what say you guys about cleaning the pads afterwards?
If I can't get all the polish out, is the pad going to harden?
If I use the pad next time around, and it still has product in it, will that damage the paint?
Those are some really good tips George, and I'm gonna incorporate them the next time around.
As for the halogen lamps, I don't have a garage, so Imma see if that will still work out on the street.
Another question for you guys -
I only finished one coat of polymer last weekend. Is it ok to apply a second coat a week later?
Also, when I use the spray wax after a wash, do I let it dry before rubbing off? (of course, I won't use the spray wax if I'm gonna do the polymer this weekend)
As for the pads, what say you guys about cleaning the pads afterwards?
If I can't get all the polish out, is the pad going to harden?
If I use the pad next time around, and it still has product in it, will that damage the paint?
Those are some really good tips George, and I'm gonna incorporate them the next time around.
As for the halogen lamps, I don't have a garage, so Imma see if that will still work out on the street.
Another question for you guys -
I only finished one coat of polymer last weekend. Is it ok to apply a second coat a week later?
Also, when I use the spray wax after a wash, do I let it dry before rubbing off? (of course, I won't use the spray wax if I'm gonna do the polymer this weekend)
06-04-2009, 05:01 PM
#6
Former Sponsor
Bold....
As for the pads, what say you guys about cleaning the pads afterwards? I normally just massage some liquid soap into the pads pores, rinse, repeat.
If I can't get all the polish out, is the pad going to harden?
I think once youve cleaned them, you have weakened any leftover product. I wouldnt say they would harden, but you may end up with a cloud of dust when you use it next! Just take your time and clean thoroughly.
If I use the pad next time around, and it still has product in it, will that damage the paint? Thats not going to happen cuz your going to clean thoroughly arent you Mike!!??
As for the halogen lamps, I don't have a garage, so Imma see if that will still work out on the street. Even a LED flashlight will reveal defects.......Not that you could work with it, but its nice to have to check panels when all done vs. moving the Halo all around. I had a Halo in Hollywood once while detailing a Carrera, and I had a young man I was teaching detailing to, who tripped over it, knocked it over, nearly and I mean nearly (as in 1") hit the front qtr panel on the Carrera.
Another question for you guys -
I only finished one coat of polymer last weekend. Is it ok to apply a second coat a week later? Perfectly fine..........Just make sure the surface is clean....
Also, when I use the spray wax after a wash, do I let it dry before rubbing off? (of course, I won't use the spray wax if I'm gonna do the polymer this weekend) No....If you use the spray wax while drying, simplly spray before wiping the panel. If you use after drying, use a soft MF ( vs. a WW which you would use while drying). Mist the panel, and mist the MF. Wipe in, turn towel over, buff off......
[/quote]
As for the pads, what say you guys about cleaning the pads afterwards? I normally just massage some liquid soap into the pads pores, rinse, repeat.
If I can't get all the polish out, is the pad going to harden?
I think once youve cleaned them, you have weakened any leftover product. I wouldnt say they would harden, but you may end up with a cloud of dust when you use it next! Just take your time and clean thoroughly.
If I use the pad next time around, and it still has product in it, will that damage the paint? Thats not going to happen cuz your going to clean thoroughly arent you Mike!!??
As for the halogen lamps, I don't have a garage, so Imma see if that will still work out on the street. Even a LED flashlight will reveal defects.......Not that you could work with it, but its nice to have to check panels when all done vs. moving the Halo all around. I had a Halo in Hollywood once while detailing a Carrera, and I had a young man I was teaching detailing to, who tripped over it, knocked it over, nearly and I mean nearly (as in 1") hit the front qtr panel on the Carrera.
Another question for you guys -
I only finished one coat of polymer last weekend. Is it ok to apply a second coat a week later? Perfectly fine..........Just make sure the surface is clean....
Also, when I use the spray wax after a wash, do I let it dry before rubbing off? (of course, I won't use the spray wax if I'm gonna do the polymer this weekend) No....If you use the spray wax while drying, simplly spray before wiping the panel. If you use after drying, use a soft MF ( vs. a WW which you would use while drying). Mist the panel, and mist the MF. Wipe in, turn towel over, buff off......
[/quote]
06-04-2009, 11:01 PM
#7
Practice makes perfect...you got a lot of the right ideas though.
I'm in the same boat...I just used my PC for the first time a couple of months ago.
I thought I did an ok job but in fact I didn't do much in restoring the surface.
Just going to keep reading and trying.
I'm in the same boat...I just used my PC for the first time a couple of months ago.
I thought I did an ok job but in fact I didn't do much in restoring the surface.
Just going to keep reading and trying.
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