NFL: 2017 Season and Discussion Thead
squeaked by to make it to the championship in one of my leagues, thanks to Gurley pwning and Matty Ice being his usual self this season.
12-19-2017 | 08:47 AM
#763
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From: ShitsBurgh
I actually forgot about this guy...
Contrary to popular belief throughout New England, the Patriots do have influence in the offices of the NFL.
His name is Alberto Riveron, and he is the NFL’s senior vice president of officiating.
Whether you agree (Patriots fans) with his call Sunday night robbing Jesse James of a touchdown or not (Steelers fans), Riveron has helped decide three victories for New England just this season.
This is not to accuse Riveron, in his first season on the job, of favoritism toward the Patriots, but here are the facts:
• New England’s Brandin Cooks caught a 25-yard touchdown pass with 23 seconds left to beat Houston 36-33 on Sept. 24. He caught the ball with both feet in the end zone but lost control as he hit the ground out of bounds. It was ruled a touchdown, and Riveron did not overturn it upon review.
An NFL source told the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette Cooks’ catch remained a touchdown because there was no good video angle that showed him losing control of the ball when he hit the ground.
• New York Jets tight end Austin Seferian-Jenkins caught a 4-yard touchdown pass against the Patriots, and fumbled through the back of the end zone once he crossed the line. It was ruled a touchdown on the field. Riveron overturned it. The Patriots got the ball at the 20. New England went on to win 24-17 on Oct 15.
• Then, Sunday night Jesse James caught a pass from Ben Roethlisberger over the middle, was never touched as his knee hit the ground, stretched the ball over the goal line and only then seemed to lose control of it. Riveron overturned the score, putting the ball back at the 10. New England won, 27-24.
The Jets and the Steelers were incensed by Riveron taking the touchdowns away. Both believe their receivers made “football moves” — a factor in the rule — before losing control of the ball. In addition, many Steelers do not believe there was enough evidence that James even did lose control to overturn it, as the replay rules require.
Of course, if both Seferian-Jenkins and James had clearly held on, Riveron would not have had to overturn those two calls.
His name is Alberto Riveron, and he is the NFL’s senior vice president of officiating.
Whether you agree (Patriots fans) with his call Sunday night robbing Jesse James of a touchdown or not (Steelers fans), Riveron has helped decide three victories for New England just this season.
This is not to accuse Riveron, in his first season on the job, of favoritism toward the Patriots, but here are the facts:
• New England’s Brandin Cooks caught a 25-yard touchdown pass with 23 seconds left to beat Houston 36-33 on Sept. 24. He caught the ball with both feet in the end zone but lost control as he hit the ground out of bounds. It was ruled a touchdown, and Riveron did not overturn it upon review.
An NFL source told the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette Cooks’ catch remained a touchdown because there was no good video angle that showed him losing control of the ball when he hit the ground.
• New York Jets tight end Austin Seferian-Jenkins caught a 4-yard touchdown pass against the Patriots, and fumbled through the back of the end zone once he crossed the line. It was ruled a touchdown on the field. Riveron overturned it. The Patriots got the ball at the 20. New England went on to win 24-17 on Oct 15.
• Then, Sunday night Jesse James caught a pass from Ben Roethlisberger over the middle, was never touched as his knee hit the ground, stretched the ball over the goal line and only then seemed to lose control of it. Riveron overturned the score, putting the ball back at the 10. New England won, 27-24.
The Jets and the Steelers were incensed by Riveron taking the touchdowns away. Both believe their receivers made “football moves” — a factor in the rule — before losing control of the ball. In addition, many Steelers do not believe there was enough evidence that James even did lose control to overturn it, as the replay rules require.
Of course, if both Seferian-Jenkins and James had clearly held on, Riveron would not have had to overturn those two calls.
12-19-2017 | 09:11 AM
#764
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Suzuka Master
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From: Boston
Jesus buddy dont go all conspiracy theory on me. Did you even read the article (little biased coming from the Pittsburg Gazette but whatever)
- Cooks was called a TD and there was no evidence to overturn it
- ASJ fumbled through the end zone, just like Derek Car did Sunday night
- Jessie lost control of the ball when he hit the ground.
- Cooks was called a TD and there was no evidence to overturn it
- ASJ fumbled through the end zone, just like Derek Car did Sunday night
- Jessie lost control of the ball when he hit the ground.
12-19-2017 | 09:17 AM
#766
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From: Boston
You forgot to quote the part where your coach is an idiot
Late-game confusion
The confusion by the Steelers and their coaching staff after the James touchdown was overturned was baffling.
There were 28 seconds left on the game clock as the play was being reviewed. If it stands, Steelers most likely win the game. But shouldn’t they have taken the time to prepare what they would do next if it was reversed? Even though out of timeouts, the review gave them plenty of time to discuss the next play or even the next two plays if the first did not score.
They apparently did not. Even Bill Cowher mentioned it Monday on an appearance on 93.7 The Fan Morning Show. According to host Colin Dunlap, Cowher questioned why Roethlisberger and Todd Haley weren’t meeting together to plan what to do if the call was overturned.
When it was, the Steelers lined up and Roethlisberger threw short left to Darrius Heyward-Bey, who did not get out of bounds after gaining 3 yards. The clock kept moving.
That is when more confusion reigned about whether to spike the ball to bring up a fourth down at the 7 and a tying field goal, or go for it first and then kick. The result was a mish-mash fake-spike play in which just one receiver ran into the middle of the Patriots defense. The Patriots were less confused on the play than the Steelers.
Roethlisberger’s pass to Eli Rogers was tipped and intercepted with five seconds to go. Ballgame.
Mike Tomlin looked ahead publicly to the New England game three weeks ago, yet the coaching staff did not use the extended time during the touchdown review to look one or even two plays ahead in that very game.
The confusion by the Steelers and their coaching staff after the James touchdown was overturned was baffling.
There were 28 seconds left on the game clock as the play was being reviewed. If it stands, Steelers most likely win the game. But shouldn’t they have taken the time to prepare what they would do next if it was reversed? Even though out of timeouts, the review gave them plenty of time to discuss the next play or even the next two plays if the first did not score.
They apparently did not. Even Bill Cowher mentioned it Monday on an appearance on 93.7 The Fan Morning Show. According to host Colin Dunlap, Cowher questioned why Roethlisberger and Todd Haley weren’t meeting together to plan what to do if the call was overturned.
When it was, the Steelers lined up and Roethlisberger threw short left to Darrius Heyward-Bey, who did not get out of bounds after gaining 3 yards. The clock kept moving.
That is when more confusion reigned about whether to spike the ball to bring up a fourth down at the 7 and a tying field goal, or go for it first and then kick. The result was a mish-mash fake-spike play in which just one receiver ran into the middle of the Patriots defense. The Patriots were less confused on the play than the Steelers.
Roethlisberger’s pass to Eli Rogers was tipped and intercepted with five seconds to go. Ballgame.
Mike Tomlin looked ahead publicly to the New England game three weeks ago, yet the coaching staff did not use the extended time during the touchdown review to look one or even two plays ahead in that very game.
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97BlackAckCL (12-19-2017)
12-19-2017 | 09:56 AM
#771
He made a "football move" towards the endzone, crossed the plain, touchdown! If the ball came loose the ground can't cause a fumble. What defines a catch and making a "football move" then? They need to figure that shit out, because one play it is the next it isn't. Plain and simple that play cost them the game, and yes Tomlin and staff should have prepared for the worst in any case. Just makes it 10 times worse since it was against the Cheaters and it went their way, per usual...
So much for the A. Rodgers 2.0 comeback to win the Superbowl...
On to seeing if the Browns will be 0-16 this year. Can the Bears and Steelers shut them out this year?
So much for the A. Rodgers 2.0 comeback to win the Superbowl...
On to seeing if the Browns will be 0-16 this year. Can the Bears and Steelers shut them out this year?
12-19-2017 | 10:09 AM
#774
12-19-2017 | 10:21 AM
#776
Old Man Yelling at Clouds
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That rule almost describes the play perfectly. I think the flaw in the rule is not addressing what happens if the player crosses the goal line during the act. Any other play once the ball crosses the plane (and they have possession) the play is over. This rule provides an exception which makes it at odds with how other plays are treated. I think the rule should be amended to address if the goal line is crossed. That said, it's a bad rule that appears to have been interpreted correctly. Steelers have a right to be pissed, but they should be pissed at the rule IMO.
12-19-2017 | 01:40 PM
#780
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That rule almost describes the play perfectly. I think the flaw in the rule is not addressing what happens if the player crosses the goal line during the act. Any other play once the ball crosses the plane (and they have possession) the play is over. This rule provides an exception which makes it at odds with how other plays are treated. I think the rule should be amended to address if the goal line is crossed. That said, it's a bad rule that appears to have been interpreted correctly. Steelers have a right to be pissed, but they should be pissed at the rule IMO.
The play never had a chance a being a touchdown because the player did not complete the catch. He was going to the ground as he caught it and did not maintain possession after contact with the ground. An incomplete pass at mid-field, goal line, or back of the end zone always results in loss of down.
12-19-2017 | 02:08 PM
#781
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From: ShitsBurgh
I totally agree that the rule is horrible, my issue is that the rule was interpreted wrong, conveniently by someone who used to work for the Pats, no bias there. The ruling on the field was a completed catch and a touchdown, to me there isn't enough conclusive evidence to overturn it. Once he makes the catch, the knee goes down, and he reaches for the endzone he breaks the plane as a runner and the play should be dead after the ball crosses the plane. The ground can't cause a fumble, but it can make you not catch a ball after you've stretched over the goal line, stupid rule.
12-19-2017 | 02:39 PM
#782
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He never ran. He never established possession of the ball. You can only fumble with possession, so the ground did not cause a fumble.
I have a lot more issue with the rule in how it was levied against Megatron. I’m not seeing the Steelers incompletion as questionable. Maintain control through the catch and there is no question.
And I hate the Patriots.
I have a lot more issue with the rule in how it was levied against Megatron. I’m not seeing the Steelers incompletion as questionable. Maintain control through the catch and there is no question.
And I hate the Patriots.
12-19-2017 | 02:40 PM
#783
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From: Seattle, WA
Where the receiver is while making the catch doesn’t change the requirements for making a catch. If the player were fully in the end zone but did not complete the catch, would it be a touchdown? Why would the goal line make a difference?
The play never had a chance a being a touchdown because the player did not complete the catch. He was going to the ground as he caught it and did not maintain possession after contact with the ground. An incomplete pass at mid-field, goal line, or back of the end zone always results in loss of down.
The play never had a chance a being a touchdown because the player did not complete the catch. He was going to the ground as he caught it and did not maintain possession after contact with the ground. An incomplete pass at mid-field, goal line, or back of the end zone always results in loss of down.
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97BlackAckCL (12-19-2017)
12-19-2017 | 03:13 PM
#784
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From: Boston
Originally Posted by 97BlackAckCL
I Once he makes the catch, the knee goes down, and he reaches for the endzone he breaks the plane as a runner and the play should be dead after the ball crosses the plane. The ground can't cause a fumble, but it can make you not catch a ball after you've stretched over the goal line, stupid rule.
If he was a running or caught the ball and took a couple steps, then yes it would be a TD because the ground can't cause a fumble.
Technically with the ball in his hands, both knees and an elbow down, it's still not considered a catch yet. It's absolutely crazy, but that's the rule.
12-19-2017 | 03:20 PM
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From: ShitsBurgh
Yeah, I see why if it's not a complete catch per the rule then he never had possession as he crossed the goal line. But to the eyeball, he had caught the pass, didn't bobble it, and even made a "football move" (lunge) to the end zone, and had it firmly as the ball crossed the goal line. I get the rule, but what we saw doesn't really pass the common sense test.
12-19-2017 | 03:33 PM
#786
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Like spy mentioned, I think the Megatron call was worse. But by letter of the rulebook... it's called correctly. It may get changed in the future, who knows.
As much as I hate the Raiders, the tuck rule is total bullshit. It took a while for that to change.
As much as I hate the Raiders, the tuck rule is total bullshit. It took a while for that to change.
12-19-2017 | 03:37 PM
#787
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From: ShitsBurgh
The Megatron call was definitely worse, but I still have a right to be pissed, the rule sucks and it's applied selectively. Besides, it's fun to troll a Pats fan who's never known anything in his life but Tom Brady. Shit I had season tickets to Michigan when Tommy boy was a third stringer 
12-19-2017 | 03:46 PM
#788
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From: Boston
Originally Posted by 97BlackAckCL
The Megatron call was definitely worse, but I still have a right to be pissed, the rule sucks and it's applied selectively. Besides, it's fun to troll a Pats fan who's never known anything in his life but Tom Brady. Shit I had season tickets to Michigan when Tommy boy was a third stringer
12-19-2017 | 04:37 PM
#791
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Honestly great little documentary on the Tuck Rule https://youtu.be/n8gtOAyPWwE
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97BlackAckCL (12-31-2017)
12-24-2017 | 07:57 PM
#794
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From: Vancouver BC
49ers are undefeated with Jimmy Garoppolo, just imagine if he had been traded to SF earlier in the season 
(and he also did his old team a favor today, by beating the Jags, the Patriots clinched first round bye)
(and he also did his old team a favor today, by beating the Jags, the Patriots clinched first round bye)
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is300eater (12-24-2017)
12-24-2017 | 11:42 PM
#799
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From: Chicago
Would be fitting.....