Sly Raskal

iTrader: (1)

I'm getting really irritated at my car's issues. The dealership still has no clue what is going on with my car. No error codes are being thrown yet the car is driving pretty bad. It surges/sputters during acceleration, it shakes when I get on/off the throttle, Throttle response is delayed when I get on or off it, idle is slightly rough even though I already had the IAC valve replaced.

So I want to start doing my own investigating, and replace the smaller inexpensive parts that could cause these issues after I check them out myself.

I was going through my Helm's service manual and all over the place it says something like "check using scan tool"

My question for you guys is, are they refering to an OBD2 tool?

If so, is there one that you guys recommend?

I really would like to do what I can to be able to keep this car because it is nice car and my trim is the rarest. I know if I ever had to trade it in or sell it i'd kick myself in the arse the day after.

Sly Raskal

iTrader: (1)

Of course after I posted this, I went through google to search for some answers and found this on eBay:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...link:middle:us

mrsteve

iTrader: (1)

Yeah so you pretty much answered your question there. No it is not the same device.

mrsteve

iTrader: (1)

It sounds like your coil packs are dying or one is already dead.

Sly Raskal

iTrader: (1)

Doesn't a dead coil pack throw a CEL?

Sly Raskal

iTrader: (1)

Ok, so correct me here if I'm wrong,

an OBD2 reader will simply report certain values to me, whereas the scan tool does it all?

mrsteve

iTrader: (1)

A scan tool will report back to you things like throttle position, IAT, coolant temp, etc.

Some tools only report DTC codes (things associated with a CEL) some will show all the data I described.

The Honda tool you linked on eBay is a dealer tool that we really have no use for.

mrsteve

iTrader: (1)

During misfires it would.

Sly Raskal

iTrader: (1)

So a bad Coilpack on it's own won't throw a CEL? I haven't had any misfires since no codes have been thrown and the CEL hasn't turned on yet.

I guess I'll probably be [checking|replacing] the coilpacks for starters too.

The other thing I was going to start off checking was the EGR valve.

nbennettksu

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mrsteve

iTrader: (1)

Does your CEL come on during start up? (This is normal). Maybe the bulb is dead? lol

I'm just wondering because the symptoms you are describing are exactly what a bad coil pack would do.

mrsteve

iTrader: (1)

Could be a throttle position sensor too

Sly Raskal

iTrader: (1)

yea, my CEL is functioning.


well replacing all 6 coil packs isn't too expensive. The labor if I have the dealer do it is.

I may give that a try first. How many miles do coilpacks typically last? Considering I have 153K on my car now, there's a lot of things that cuold potentitally begin to fail IMO.

Sly Raskal

iTrader: (1)

I thought that too, unfortunately after speaking with the service guys and reading the Helm's manual, the TPS sensor isn't replaceable. Although there is a company, I think King Motorsports that sells a separate unit, I dont' know if it's specs match the OEM unit.

Even still, buying a new TB for $200 as someone else found isn't too bad of a replacement part either for me.

Sly Raskal

iTrader: (1)

I should have a mod update the title of this thread

mrsteve

iTrader: (1)

With a scan tool you could test the TPS. If the reading is jumping all over the place while you are WOT and "surging" that might be a way to diagnosis it.

If you aren't getting misfires then it probably isn't the coil packs. Have you replaced the spark plugs yet?

Sly Raskal

iTrader: (1)

Yup, they were replaced at the 105K service mark by the dealer.

Another member said to check the TPS sensor, but I don't know how else to check it. Should I just disconnect the harness from the TPS sensor and plug in a voltmeter and check it at idle and WOT?

2CLean

I would check the spark plugs again just to be sure. I recently replaced mine and somehow one of the rear plugs backed out of it's seat. No CEL's, but my throttle response and fuel economy dropped significantly. I actually heard a weird noise which led me to check the plugs. The sound I was hearing was the compression blowing passed the loose plug. I used anti-seize and re-torqued the loose plug and now no noise and the throttle response and fuel economy are back where they should be. Just a suggestion, cuz I never would have realized it until I checked. I would have thought something like this would throw a CEL, which it did not.

Sly Raskal

iTrader: (1)

^^^ I'll look into that after I check the EGR valve.

I looked in my Helm's manual but I haven't been able to locate where the EGR valve is. I want to try to clean it to see if that will fix the problem.

Anyone know where the EGR valve is? It's connected to the Intake Manifold as reported by the Helms manual, but it doesn't show where in the engine bay it is located.

fsttyms1

may want to try to clean the IAC as well. That could cause symptoms like you described
Cleaning EGR ports
https://acurazine.com/forums/showpos...39&postcount=8


EGR

Sly Raskal

iTrader: (1)

^^^ thanks man!

I hope I will be able to remove the part and clean it without messing anything up.

As for my IAC valve, I had a new one put on earlier this year, so cleaning it at this point isn't needed.

Thanks for the info!

Sly Raskal

iTrader: (1)

Alright, I went ahead and ordered a new EGR valve. I haven't had time to take the part off to see if it needs cleaning. And the new valve and gasket was only $80. So I'll just put a new one on and see if that remedy's the problem.

If it doesn't, next up to check are the coil packs, MAP sensor, TPS Sensor not in that order.

VWNOWHONDA

TPS or MAP sensor would cause your car to jerk and stumble off idle as soon as you step on the gas and would prob cause a CEL.. You could stick a voltage meter inside the TPS to check for the correct voltage should be above 13volts(if im not mistaken) but your issue sounds like an EGR valve.

Sly Raskal

iTrader: (1)

^^^ Thanks for the info. That's what I'll be trying IF the EGR valve replacement doesn't solve the problem.



Probably be at least a week and a half before I get the part. Picked it up from acuraoemparts.com and ships from Florida.

kyle77777

Does the problem you have ever make your car die/shutoff? Or just sputter?

Sly Raskal

iTrader: (1)

Nope hasn't ever died on me or shutoff, although when I'm letting the clutch out, it sometimes feels like I have to let it out slower or give it more gas otherwise it'll stall. I know it's not a clutch issue because I just put in a new clutch earlier this year.

As for sputter, well it doesn't make that odd sound like it's not getting enough gas, what happens is during acceleration, typically in 2nd and 3rd gear and worse when going uphill, it doesn't accelerate smoothly, instead it surges/bucks.

Also many times during acceleration, especially uphill, if I were to go WOT, the car feels underpowered and slowly starts taking off, granted faster than I was accelerating before i went WOT, but definitly not the way it should behave typically at WOT.

kyle77777

I had similar symptoms the first week I bought my CL, I had taken it to the dealership probably 5 times with no luck. Changed injectors, replaced coil packs etc. They ended up finding out what it was, and it was I had bent intake valves. I really hope this is not what is whats wrong with yours, cause it was a $4K job (warrantied).

They said it was caused from the previous owner probably accidentally missed a shift and red lined the RPM's at a high speed.

Sly Raskal

iTrader: (1)

I hope to god that's not what it is!

I think I can count on one hand how many times I've taken it up past 6,500RPM. I do drive my car hard, but I know how to shift. Hell, my stock clutch lasted me till 150K miles.

I want to weed out all these small pesky items before I look at the big ones.

Sly Raskal

iTrader: (1)

http://replacement.teamacuparts.com/...=null&dp=false



I didn't order this one, but was just curious about what they are talking about, hence why I posted it.

I ordered the standard one Part # 18011-RCA-A00

Sly Raskal

iTrader: (1)

gotta wait till the 27th. That's the scheduled delivery date of the valve.

I can't wait to put the new valve on to see if it improves anything.

Sly Raskal

iTrader: (1)

Got my new EGR valve and gasket today. Tried to install it tonight but the engine was still too hot so I'll have to do it tomorrow.

I also have to pick up a wrench from Autozone to make it easier to get at the bolts that hold the valve.

More news tomorrow.

Sly Raskal

iTrader: (1)

Swapped out the EGR Valve this morning.

I had to pick up a 12mm angled wrench to get good access to the bolts. I suppose you could get to it with a normal wrench but with all the hoses and stuff it made it much much easier with the angled wrench.

Anyway, so I took detached the cable, removed the two bolts, and took off the old EGR valve. The openings on it looked alright, didn't seem dirty. The gasket was pretty much stuck on the valve, couldn't peel it off if I tried.

I placed the new gasket on the mount location for the gasket, placed the valve on the studs, reused the same bolts and that was it. Took a total of an hour to do. Definitely can be done in less time. I took it slow after I took the part off and took pics, looked at the part and stuff. You could honestly probably do the swap in 20 minutes. Very very easy to do.

In any case, I've noticed a few things immediately after swapping the part. Car is idling better, seems to be running smoother during acceleration as well. engine response is better too. For a high mileage car (150K+ mi), I'd recommend doing this replacement because it's such a quick and easy repair. Parts ran about $80 for the valve and gasket from acuraoemparts.com

As for solving all my issues though, well the delayed throttle response is still there. It's not as bad as it was since the car is running smoother, but too me it's still noticeable.

At idle I was checking the throttle response. The car would be idling at 750rpm. I'd slowly apply pressure to the accelerator and what would happen is, rather than the throttle inching up slowly, it would shoot up to 1250 or 1500rpm out of no where. There was no middle ground. I tried and tried, but I couldn't get the throttle to response slowly and accurately within that range for some reason. My guess is the TPS sensor is going bad. The throttle cables aren't sticking as far as I can tell.

So next up to replace is the Throttle Body, which I do have some questions about that I will post later.

As for the EGR valve replacement, I'm glad I did it because it did improve things. Definitely not a waste of money.

Sly Raskal

iTrader: (1)

Something else I noticed that's improved on my car since swapping out the EGR valve, I no longer have that odd sputtering/surging feeling when accelerating from a stop or low speed on level ground or going uphill. It's completely gone.

1hotcls6

This is the exact problem I am experiencing now! I cant figure out what it is!!!

Mr. Incredible

how many miles on the car and have you changed your PCV valve? should be done about every 45K miles on "most" cars.. if the PCV gets stuck closed you are killing the vaccum pressure in the motor, if it gets stuck open you have a leak and the motor will surge..


I just diagnosed and fixed the exact some symtoms on a buddies car over the weekend, he had terrible throttle response, and surging..

cleaned the TB, replaced the PCV and IAT and his motor was like new again.

1hotcls6

hmm, that could explain it!! I will check and clean now and report back.

(this may explain why my vacuum gauge is reading -30vac)