Formula One: 2021 Season News and Discussion Thread
12-15-2021, 12:41 PM
#1241
AZ Community Team
Join Date: May 2007
Location: N35°03'16.75", W 080°51'0.9"
Posts: 32,488
Received 7,770 Likes
on
4,341 Posts
I'm going to jump in with my thoughts. I've watched the sport for 41 years, and this was the best season I can recall, and the way it ended was IMO not so controversial.
Motor racing is all about who crosses the line first at the end, regardless of what events take place within the race. Car failures, crashes, yellow flags, safety cars etc all notwithstanding, all that matters is who crosses first on the day.
The way I read and interpret the safety car rules, the Director can make the choice to remove cars who may interfere with the leaders but they do not have to unlap the entire field. So, the decision to allow them to race the last lap was in fact accurate and within the scope of the rules.
Further to that, and something none of you have picked up on or commented about is the simple ALL IN approach that RedBull took towards things. They took every risk imaginable, and their efforts were rewarded. Did they get unbelievably lucky that Latifi crashed where and when he did? Absolutely. I've seen some people suggest a Red Flag should have been thrown to 'preserve the race', however Masi said after Kimi's crash in practice that the same thing would not bring out a Red Flag in the race. Red Flags are for safety, not for the purpose of enhancing the race. However, RedBulls forethought goes deeper still.
RedBull were so intent on winning the WDC for Max, their number 1, they completely abandoned all shot at the Constructors money. Let's all pause and consider that for a second. We are talking giving up many tens of millions of dollars here, all to give Max a better shot. How did they do this you ask? They under fuelled Checo by seven laps. No wonder he was so competitive for that lap and a half with Lewis, and this is also why he was retired from the race. He didn't have fuel onboard to finish. I would argue night and day that his lap in front of Lewis is what enabled Max to win. Without that, even with the end of race SC, Max doesn't win.
RedBull went 1000% behind their number one at the cost of millions of dollars to themselves. MB did not commit to their number 1 in remotely the same way.
RedBull took the risks and things worked out so they were rewarded. MB played it Conservative and lost because of it. First lap shenanigans completely notwithstanding. That was a clean pass any way I look at it.
Motor racing is all about who crosses the line first at the end, regardless of what events take place within the race. Car failures, crashes, yellow flags, safety cars etc all notwithstanding, all that matters is who crosses first on the day.
The way I read and interpret the safety car rules, the Director can make the choice to remove cars who may interfere with the leaders but they do not have to unlap the entire field. So, the decision to allow them to race the last lap was in fact accurate and within the scope of the rules.
Further to that, and something none of you have picked up on or commented about is the simple ALL IN approach that RedBull took towards things. They took every risk imaginable, and their efforts were rewarded. Did they get unbelievably lucky that Latifi crashed where and when he did? Absolutely. I've seen some people suggest a Red Flag should have been thrown to 'preserve the race', however Masi said after Kimi's crash in practice that the same thing would not bring out a Red Flag in the race. Red Flags are for safety, not for the purpose of enhancing the race. However, RedBulls forethought goes deeper still.
RedBull were so intent on winning the WDC for Max, their number 1, they completely abandoned all shot at the Constructors money. Let's all pause and consider that for a second. We are talking giving up many tens of millions of dollars here, all to give Max a better shot. How did they do this you ask? They under fuelled Checo by seven laps. No wonder he was so competitive for that lap and a half with Lewis, and this is also why he was retired from the race. He didn't have fuel onboard to finish. I would argue night and day that his lap in front of Lewis is what enabled Max to win. Without that, even with the end of race SC, Max doesn't win.
RedBull went 1000% behind their number one at the cost of millions of dollars to themselves. MB did not commit to their number 1 in remotely the same way.
RedBull took the risks and things worked out so they were rewarded. MB played it Conservative and lost because of it. First lap shenanigans completely notwithstanding. That was a clean pass any way I look at it.
Have you considered starting a podcast?
12-15-2021, 12:42 PM
#1242
Senior Moderator
Thread Starter
And here's the video of Luke flying back to Yavin.
NSX
NSX
12-15-2021, 12:54 PM
#1243
Senior Moderator
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Western New York
Age: 64
Posts: 25,181
Received 7,142 Likes
on
3,631 Posts
The following users liked this post:
civicdrivr (12-16-2021)
12-16-2021, 05:50 AM
#1244
Senior Moderator
Thread Starter
12-16-2021, 07:13 AM
#1245
AZ Community Team
^ I'm guessing MB did that to avoid bad PR, and to move onto 2022. I suspect MB as well as RBR will be the strong front contenders in 2022 and wanna have the ridiculous race end clouding the issue.
Also I suspect MB exec's may have gotten involved and told Wolff to back down on the appeal.
Also I suspect MB exec's may have gotten involved and told Wolff to back down on the appeal.
12-16-2021, 08:18 AM
#1246
Whats up with RDX owners?
iTrader: (9)
Class act and Mercedes was mentioned. Figured it's good to bring this up:
https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/ha...-gala/6885862/
Childish IMO. Their team won the Constructors Championship for the 8th time in a row and they won't even be there to represent the team.
Hamilton and Wolff to miss FIA prize-giving gala
Lewis Hamilton and Mercedes Formula 1 team boss Toto Wolff will miss this evening's FIA prize-giving gala, amid their ongoing anger at the events of the Abu Dhabi Grand Prix.
Lewis Hamilton and Mercedes Formula 1 team boss Toto Wolff will miss this evening's FIA prize-giving gala, amid their ongoing anger at the events of the Abu Dhabi Grand Prix.
Childish IMO. Their team won the Constructors Championship for the 8th time in a row and they won't even be there to represent the team.
The following users liked this post:
is300eater (12-16-2021)
12-16-2021, 08:23 AM
#1247
Senior Moderator
Thread Starter
And De Telegraaf newspaper also claims Mercedes is refusing to make its Formula 1 and Formula E cars available for an official FIA photo session at the event at Le Louvre.
The following users liked this post:
Bearcat94 (12-16-2021)
12-16-2021, 08:29 AM
#1248
Senior Moderator
That's how it goes some times. 
12-16-2021, 08:38 AM
#1249
Moderator
On to 2022
The following users liked this post:
F23A4 (12-16-2021)
12-16-2021, 11:18 AM
#1250
Senior Moderator
Thread Starter
Sure. I'm sure that no one will lose sleep if these primadonnas don't show up to a wine and dine event.
More drama for Drive to Survive! The Netflix people must be loving this. They don't even have to edit anything.
More drama for Drive to Survive! The Netflix people must be loving this. They don't even have to edit anything.
12-16-2021, 12:31 PM
#1251
Senior Moderator
A good number of folks don't like MB/LH anyway. So, this should be the ideal scenario for these folks. Get to pretend (somewhat) that LH never tarnished the sport with his presence.
12-16-2021, 03:17 PM
#1252
Senior Moderator
12-16-2021, 03:44 PM
#1253
Moderator
Couldn't watch at work, but I can't imagine him retiring over the '21 Finale.
He's got the form for a few more good years & it's doubtful MB will drop the ball on '22 development.
<- Not a LH fan, but just not seeing it, based on his status in the sport.
Rosberg's retirement was a surprise, but I don't put him on the level of LH.
He's got the form for a few more good years & it's doubtful MB will drop the ball on '22 development.
<- Not a LH fan, but just not seeing it, based on his status in the sport.
Rosberg's retirement was a surprise, but I don't put him on the level of LH.
12-16-2021, 04:22 PM
#1254
Senior Moderator
Thread Starter
Watching the live gala because nothing else to do right now. Ham is a no show, and didn't even send a pre-recorded message. Even Alonso who couldn't make it to accept an award at least sent a video message.
12-16-2021, 04:28 PM
#1255
Moderator
Chain Bear on Abu Dhabi
12-16-2021, 05:37 PM
#1256
Senior Moderator
12-17-2021, 10:27 AM
#1257
Stay Out Of the Left Lane
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: SE Mass --- > Central VA --- > SE Mass
Age: 57
Posts: 8,964
Received 1,237 Likes
on
1,024 Posts
https://www.planetf1.com/news/lewis-...appeal-report/
Lewis Hamilton reportedly played an integral role in ensuring Mercedes did not pursue their intent to appeal the Abu Dhabi Grand Prix result.
In the immediate aftermath of Red Bull driver Max Verstappen clinching the Drivers’ World Championship on the very last lap, Mercedes lodged a notice of intent to appeal the decision of the stewards – who initially dismissed both of Mercedes post-race protests – which triggered the creation of a 96-hour window for the Silver Arrows to officially lodge the grounds for appeal.
Since that moment it has been near radio silence from the Mercedes camp, only broken somewhat by Hamilton who made his first public appearance since the season finale when receiving his knighthood from the Prince of Wales at Windsor Castle on Wednesday.
But, Mercedes’ silence was broken on Thursday with the deadline to fully launch an appeal fast approaching and, according to the Daily Mail, Hamilton had informed Mercedes that he did not want to win what would have been a record eighth World Championship title via the courts and, as a result, his team acknowledged that request.
Hamilton intervened to stop Mercedes appeal – report
Date published: December 16 2021 - Mark ScottLewis Hamilton reportedly played an integral role in ensuring Mercedes did not pursue their intent to appeal the Abu Dhabi Grand Prix result.In the immediate aftermath of Red Bull driver Max Verstappen clinching the Drivers’ World Championship on the very last lap, Mercedes lodged a notice of intent to appeal the decision of the stewards – who initially dismissed both of Mercedes post-race protests – which triggered the creation of a 96-hour window for the Silver Arrows to officially lodge the grounds for appeal.
Since that moment it has been near radio silence from the Mercedes camp, only broken somewhat by Hamilton who made his first public appearance since the season finale when receiving his knighthood from the Prince of Wales at Windsor Castle on Wednesday.
But, Mercedes’ silence was broken on Thursday with the deadline to fully launch an appeal fast approaching and, according to the Daily Mail, Hamilton had informed Mercedes that he did not want to win what would have been a record eighth World Championship title via the courts and, as a result, his team acknowledged that request.
12-17-2021, 11:36 AM
#1258
Moderator
2021 Highlights
12-17-2021, 03:52 PM
#1259
Moderator
https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/su...rules/6886492/
In the wake of the controversy over the safety car restart at the Abu Dhabi Grand Prix that has left Hamilton disillusioned with the sport, he and his team boss Toto Wolff elected to miss the FIA end-of-season gathering in Paris on Thursday night.
Hamilton's absence, as runner-up in the drivers' championship, appears to be a breach of F1's Sporting Regulations.
Article 6.6 of the rules states: "The drivers finishing first, second and third in the Championship must be present at the annual FIA Prize Giving ceremony."
One of Sulayem's first responsibilities since taking over will be to judge whether or not Hamilton's absence from the event goes against the regulations.
Speaking about the situation in his first official press conference at president, Sulayem said: "At the end of the day, rules are rules.
"So we are going to look into the side of where the technical rules are there to be employed and was he in breach? I have to look into it."
He added: "Of course, we'll have to be also be following our rules. But in the meanwhile, it doesn't stop us from making a champion feel good about the sport, you know.
"It's easy to be nice to people. And it is cheap to be nice. And it's also to motivate people. But definitely, if there is any breach, there is no forgiveness in this."
Sulayem said that critical for the FIA to understand was whether or not Hamilton did break the regulations – as he admitted that the world champion was 'broken' by the events of the weekend.
Asked to clarify if he could really rule out any "forgiveness", Sulayem said: "Forgiveness is always there, but rules are rules. We look at the rules.
"And I always say: rules are not made. A human made them...and they can be improved and changed by humans. So the rules are there to be improved.
"I know that Lewis is really sad about what happened and one word I would say is he's broken. But we have to look if there was any breach.
"I cannot [say for now]. It's just a few hours now I've been a president, and I've just started giving answers without going back to the facts."
If Hamilton is found guilty, then he could face a financial penalty for his absence rather than any sporting sanction.
Hamilton's absence, as runner-up in the drivers' championship, appears to be a breach of F1's Sporting Regulations.
Article 6.6 of the rules states: "The drivers finishing first, second and third in the Championship must be present at the annual FIA Prize Giving ceremony."
One of Sulayem's first responsibilities since taking over will be to judge whether or not Hamilton's absence from the event goes against the regulations.
Speaking about the situation in his first official press conference at president, Sulayem said: "At the end of the day, rules are rules.
"So we are going to look into the side of where the technical rules are there to be employed and was he in breach? I have to look into it."
He added: "Of course, we'll have to be also be following our rules. But in the meanwhile, it doesn't stop us from making a champion feel good about the sport, you know.
"It's easy to be nice to people. And it is cheap to be nice. And it's also to motivate people. But definitely, if there is any breach, there is no forgiveness in this."
Sulayem said that critical for the FIA to understand was whether or not Hamilton did break the regulations – as he admitted that the world champion was 'broken' by the events of the weekend.
Asked to clarify if he could really rule out any "forgiveness", Sulayem said: "Forgiveness is always there, but rules are rules. We look at the rules.
"And I always say: rules are not made. A human made them...and they can be improved and changed by humans. So the rules are there to be improved.
"I know that Lewis is really sad about what happened and one word I would say is he's broken. But we have to look if there was any breach.
"I cannot [say for now]. It's just a few hours now I've been a president, and I've just started giving answers without going back to the facts."
If Hamilton is found guilty, then he could face a financial penalty for his absence rather than any sporting sanction.
12-17-2021, 05:49 PM
#1260
AZ Community Team
Totally, it's so petty not to show to the gala by the organization that screwed them out of the 2021 F1 WDC 
I think MB has decided to move on to 2022
+1, should be a great season. hoping for better competitive racing with more teams.
I think MB has decided to move on to 2022+1, should be a great season. hoping for better competitive racing with more teams.
The following 3 users liked this post by Legend2TL:
12-18-2021, 07:25 PM
#1261
The following users liked this post:
F23A4 (12-18-2021)
12-18-2021, 08:25 PM
#1262
Senior Moderator
The following users liked this post:
Legend2TL (12-19-2021)
12-19-2021, 05:48 PM
#1263
Senior Moderator
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Western New York
Age: 64
Posts: 25,181
Received 7,142 Likes
on
3,631 Posts
Valtteri says good bye. Kinda sad, he gave it his all, was a dutiful #2, helped MBZ secure 8 Constructor's Championships in a row and he's sent packing. At least he is seemingly happy with a multi-year contract at AR. I hope they get their act together and make it worthwhile for him.
Last edited by Chief F1 Fan; 12-19-2021 at 05:57 PM.
12-20-2021, 09:52 AM
#1264
AZ Community Team
A Trip Down Memory Lane with Valtteri Bottas
Nice sendoff video from MB for Bottas with the five cars he drove for MB
Last edited by Legend2TL; 12-20-2021 at 09:55 AM.
12-20-2021, 02:18 PM
#1265
AZ Community Team
Valtteri and Toto: Last Video
Kinda cute video where they are asked all of Bottas's records at MB
The following users liked this post:
00TL-P3.2 (12-21-2021)
12-20-2021, 02:49 PM
#1266
Senior Moderator
Bottas definitely held his own but also supported HAM in numerous races, he was a great wing-man/2nd fiddle, similar to Perez and VER. I wish him the very best at Alfa...
12-21-2021, 10:00 AM
#1267
AZ Community Team
Prize draw but no refunds for F1 fans who attended Belgian GP washout
https://www.crash.net/f1/news/994885...ian-gp-washout
What a ripoff to those in attendance to say the least
What a ripoff to those in attendance to say the least
12-21-2021, 10:36 AM
#1268
Moderator
Maybe they'll pull a COTA refund policy to get them to come back.
I forget the specifics but if COTA gets x inches of rain within y days of race weekend [or race day, can't recall], tickets are refunded 115%. IIRC.
12-21-2021, 03:06 PM
#1269
Senior Moderator
Thread Starter
Bad move on the part of the race organizers and the F1. At a minimum, they should get a 50% refund since the F1 teams got only 50% of the points.
For Indy, IIRC, it was Michelin that provided the refunds to the fans (as they should). Rain is force majeure, so not much that can be done about it unless Liberty did something (which they should).
For Indy, IIRC, it was Michelin that provided the refunds to the fans (as they should). Rain is force majeure, so not much that can be done about it unless Liberty did something (which they should).
Last edited by F-C; 12-21-2021 at 03:08 PM.
12-23-2021, 08:54 AM
#1270
Senior Moderator
12-23-2021, 11:13 AM
#1271
AZ Community Team
Which F1 driver accrued highest crash damage costs in 2021 season?
https://www.sportskeeda.com/f1/which...ts-2021-season
How was Mazepin only #8 on the list? Perhaps some of the 7 above him were caused by him?
How was Mazepin only #8 on the list? Perhaps some of the 7 above him were caused by him?
- Mick Schumacher, Haas - €4,212,500
- Charles Leclerc, Ferrari - €4,046,000
- Max Verstappen, Red Bull Racing - €3,889,000
- Nicholas Latifi, Williams - €3,116,500
- Valtteri Bottas, Mercedes - €2,713,500
- Lance Stroll, Aston Martin - €2,686,000
- Yuki Tsunoda, Alpha Tauri - €2,606,500
- Nikita Mazepin, Haas - €2,468,000
- Kimi Raikkonen, Alfa Romeo Racing - €1,950,000
- George Russell, Williams - €1,845,000
- Carlos Sainz, Ferrari - €1,756,000
- Lando Norris, McLaren - €1,453,000
- Lewis Hamilton, Mercedes - €1,235,000
- Pierre Gasly, Alpha Tauri - €1,113,000
- Sergio Perez, Red Bull Racing - €939,000
- Antonio Giovinazzi, Alfa Romeo Racing - €854,000
- Daniel Ricciardo, McLaren - €713,000
- Sebastian Vettel, Aston Martin - €660,000
- Fernando Alonso, Alpine - €315,000
- Esteban Ocon, Alpine - €280,000
12-23-2021, 02:15 PM
#1272
Senior Moderator
Thread Starter
It would be more interesting to analyze who is at fault in those incidents to come up with a different calculation.
I think one team principle said this year that the party at fault should pay for the damages after one too many incidents involving their team.
I think one team principle said this year that the party at fault should pay for the damages after one too many incidents involving their team.
12-25-2021, 01:34 PM
#1273
Senior Moderator
Originally Posted by Legend2TL;[url=tel:16782691
16782691[/url]]https://www.sportskeeda.com/f1/which...ts-2021-season
How was Mazepin only #8 on the list? Perhaps some of the 7 above him were caused by him?
How was Mazepin only #8 on the list? Perhaps some of the 7 above him were caused by him?
- Mick Schumacher, Haas - €4,212,500
- Charles Leclerc, Ferrari - €4,046,000
- Max Verstappen, Red Bull Racing - €3,889,000
- Nicholas Latifi, Williams - €3,116,500
- Valtteri Bottas, Mercedes - €2,713,500
- Lance Stroll, Aston Martin - €2,686,000
- Yuki Tsunoda, Alpha Tauri - €2,606,500
- Nikita Mazepin, Haas - €2,468,000
- Kimi Raikkonen, Alfa Romeo Racing - €1,950,000
- George Russell, Williams - €1,845,000
- Carlos Sainz, Ferrari - €1,756,000
- Lando Norris, McLaren - €1,453,000
- Lewis Hamilton, Mercedes - €1,235,000
- Pierre Gasly, Alpha Tauri - €1,113,000
- Sergio Perez, Red Bull Racing - €939,000
- Antonio Giovinazzi, Alfa Romeo Racing - €854,000
- Daniel Ricciardo, McLaren - €713,000
- Sebastian Vettel, Aston Martin - €660,000
- Fernando Alonso, Alpine - €315,000
- Esteban Ocon, Alpine - €280,000
12-25-2021, 02:45 PM
#1274
Senior Moderator
12-26-2021, 10:47 AM
#1275
Senior Moderator
Thread Starter
Why would anyone want to know what SLJ thinks about F1?
OTOH, I guess having SLJ commenting on F1 shows how far F1 has seeped into the US???
OTOH, I guess having SLJ commenting on F1 shows how far F1 has seeped into the US???
The following users liked this post:
F23A4 (12-27-2021)
12-26-2021, 05:17 PM
#1276
Senior Moderator
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Western New York
Age: 64
Posts: 25,181
Received 7,142 Likes
on
3,631 Posts
https://www.sportskeeda.com/f1/which...ts-2021-season
How was Mazepin only #8 on the list? Perhaps some of the 7 above him were caused by him?
How was Mazepin only #8 on the list? Perhaps some of the 7 above him were caused by him?
- Mick Schumacher, Haas - €4,212,500
- Charles Leclerc, Ferrari - €4,046,000
- Max Verstappen, Red Bull Racing - €3,889,000
- Nicholas Latifi, Williams - €3,116,500
- Valtteri Bottas, Mercedes - €2,713,500
- Lance Stroll, Aston Martin - €2,686,000
- Yuki Tsunoda, Alpha Tauri - €2,606,500
- Nikita Mazepin, Haas - €2,468,000
- Kimi Raikkonen, Alfa Romeo Racing - €1,950,000
- George Russell, Williams - €1,845,000
- Carlos Sainz, Ferrari - €1,756,000
- Lando Norris, McLaren - €1,453,000
- Lewis Hamilton, Mercedes - €1,235,000
- Pierre Gasly, Alpha Tauri - €1,113,000
- Sergio Perez, Red Bull Racing - €939,000
- Antonio Giovinazzi, Alfa Romeo Racing - €854,000
- Daniel Ricciardo, McLaren - €713,000
- Sebastian Vettel, Aston Martin - €660,000
- Fernando Alonso, Alpine - €315,000
- Esteban Ocon, Alpine - €280,000
12-27-2021, 12:03 PM
#1277
Moderator
12-27-2021, 12:05 PM
#1278
Moderator
2021 Best Overtakes
12-27-2021, 12:13 PM
#1279
Moderator
12-28-2021, 06:20 PM
#1280
Senior Moderator
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Western New York
Age: 64
Posts: 25,181
Received 7,142 Likes
on
3,631 Posts
