Formula One: 2013 Season News and Discussion Thread **Brazil Grand Prix page 9**
#161
Senior Moderator
Montreal FP2:
POS DRIVER NATIONALITY ENTRANT TIME
1. Fernando Alonso Spain Ferrari 1:14.818
2. Lewis Hamilton Britain Mercedes GP 1:14.830
3. Romain Grosjean France Lotus-Renault 1:15.083
4. Mark Webber Australia Red Bull-Renault 1:15.212
5. Nico Rosberg Germany Mercedes GP 1:15.249
6. Felipe Massa Brazil Ferrari 1:15.254
7. Sebastian Vettel Germany Red Bull-Renault 1:15.280
8. Adrian Sutil Germany Force India-Mercedes 1:15.396
9. Jenson Button Britain McLaren-Mercedes 1:15.422
10. Daniel Ricciardo Australia Toro Rosso-Ferrari 1:15.566
11. Kimi Raikkonen Finland Lotus-Renault 1:15.599
12. Sergio Perez Mexico McLaren-Mercedes 1:15.661
13. Paul di Resta Britain Force India-Mercedes 1:15.855
14. Pastor Maldonado Venezuela Williams-Renault 1:16.319
15. Jean-Eric Vergne France Toro Rosso-Ferrari 1:16.351
16. Valtteri Bottas Finland Williams-Renault 1:16.374
17. Esteban Gutierrez Mexico Sauber-Ferrari 1:16.475
18. Nico Hulkenberg Germany Sauber-Ferrari 1:16.929
19. Jules Bianchi France Marussia-Cosworth 1:17.070
20. Charles Pic France Caterham-Renault 1:17.236
21. Max Chilton Britain Marussia-Cosworth 1:17.888
22. Giedo van der Garde Netherlands Caterham-Renault 1:18.392
POS DRIVER NATIONALITY ENTRANT TIME
1. Fernando Alonso Spain Ferrari 1:14.818
2. Lewis Hamilton Britain Mercedes GP 1:14.830
3. Romain Grosjean France Lotus-Renault 1:15.083
4. Mark Webber Australia Red Bull-Renault 1:15.212
5. Nico Rosberg Germany Mercedes GP 1:15.249
6. Felipe Massa Brazil Ferrari 1:15.254
7. Sebastian Vettel Germany Red Bull-Renault 1:15.280
8. Adrian Sutil Germany Force India-Mercedes 1:15.396
9. Jenson Button Britain McLaren-Mercedes 1:15.422
10. Daniel Ricciardo Australia Toro Rosso-Ferrari 1:15.566
11. Kimi Raikkonen Finland Lotus-Renault 1:15.599
12. Sergio Perez Mexico McLaren-Mercedes 1:15.661
13. Paul di Resta Britain Force India-Mercedes 1:15.855
14. Pastor Maldonado Venezuela Williams-Renault 1:16.319
15. Jean-Eric Vergne France Toro Rosso-Ferrari 1:16.351
16. Valtteri Bottas Finland Williams-Renault 1:16.374
17. Esteban Gutierrez Mexico Sauber-Ferrari 1:16.475
18. Nico Hulkenberg Germany Sauber-Ferrari 1:16.929
19. Jules Bianchi France Marussia-Cosworth 1:17.070
20. Charles Pic France Caterham-Renault 1:17.236
21. Max Chilton Britain Marussia-Cosworth 1:17.888
22. Giedo van der Garde Netherlands Caterham-Renault 1:18.392
#162
Senior Moderator
A race-track worker at the Canadian Grand Prix was killed Sunday after he slipped under the wheel of a crane at the end of the Formula One event.
Officials said the man was escorting the crane as it moved Esteban Gutierrez’s Sauber car, which did not finish the Montreal race.
The accident occurred shortly after the checkered flag waved to signal the end of the race, a major weekend sporting event for the city that draws hundreds of thousands of fans to Circuit Gilles Villeneuve.
Officials said the man was escorting the crane as it moved Esteban Gutierrez’s Sauber car, which did not finish the Montreal race.
The accident occurred shortly after the checkered flag waved to signal the end of the race, a major weekend sporting event for the city that draws hundreds of thousands of fans to Circuit Gilles Villeneuve.
![Sad](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/sad.gif)
![RIP](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/smitty.gif)
#163
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Ohhhh no!!!
![Pup Eyes](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/pupeyes.gif)
#165
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wonder if it was one of these 2 guys? This just sucks, he was only 38 years old and trying to retrieve a dropped radio when he got run over.
![](http://photos.imageevent.com/scottprintup/gifs/websize/IMG_1843.jpg)
#166
Senior Moderator
![](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BMWYZxTCcAA0PzR.jpg:large)
Poor fellow is the one standing right in front of the crane's wheel. This was taken right before the accident. There is another photo the accident right after he was run over, but I'm not posting that.
#167
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![Sad](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/sad.gif)
![RIP](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/smitty.gif)
#168
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Vettel extends contract at Red Bull until 2015.
#169
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Smart move, I expect another 2 championships from that combo.
#171
Senior Moderator
http://formula-one.speedtv.com/artic...ring-concludes
Decision this Friday. Speculation?
My guess. Mercedes loses all Friday practice for the rest of the year to "make up" for the over testing. Points penalty for the constructors championship. A hefty donation to the FIA.
The International Tribunal hearing into the Mercedes testing case took place in Paris on Thursday, with some heated debate led by the lawyers of the team, the FIA, and Pirelli.
The FIA has confirmed that a verdict will be announced Friday, after Edwin Glasgow – the president of the tribunal – initially said that the four judges would reveal their conclusion “by tomorrow.”
Intriguingly, as part of his summing up on behalf of Mercedes, lawyer Paul Harris said that his client had tried to act in good faith and thus if deemed guilty something like a reprimand – or exclusion from the upcoming Young Driver test, where the current cars are used by all teams – would be an appropriate punishment.
As expected, Mercedes insisted it had permission to conduct the controversial test. Meanwhile, the FIA claimed it did not, and Pirelli was adamant that it cannot be sanctioned by the FIA.
Proceedings began early Thursday morning with the FIA’s legal counsel, Mark Howard, presenting the governing body’s case.
Intriguingly, in addition to outlining the breach of Article 22, related to in-season testing a current car, he also mentioned Article 151c, which involves bringing the sport into disrepute, or more specifically bans “fraudulent conduct or any act prejudicial to the interests of any competition or to the interests of motorsport generally.”
Howard argued that: “Without the knowledge, consent and participation of other competitors, Mercedes and Pirelli may have engaged in activity that was prejudicial to the competition.”
In essence, he repeated what the FIA said in a media statement on Sunday evening in Monaco: essentially, that conversations took place between Mercedes and Charlie Whiting in early May, but Whiting did not formally sanction the Barcelona test with the current car. Howard stressed the FIA’s requirement that other teams be informed and invited.
He said: “Whiting was asked a general and non-specific question – the general question on the permissibility of using a 2013 car. His preliminary response was that such a test would comply with Article 22, providing the purpose was for Pirelli to test its tire, and he would check.”
He added that even though Pirelli has a contract with the FIA which allows for 1,000-kilometer tests to be conducted by teams, the Sporting Regulations should take precedence.
Howard also argued that Mercedes had gained some knowledge from the test, saying: “We would suggest that it is difficult to say Mercedes obtained no benefit from the test.”
Speaking on behalf of Mercedes, lawyer Paul Harris claimed that the team did not break the rules, in essence because the test was arranged and run by Pirelli, and not by Mercedes in its role as a competitor.
The rules state: “Track testing shall be considered any track running time not part of an Event undertaken by a competitor entered in the Championship, using cars which conform substantially with the current Formula One Technical Regulations in addition to those from the previous or subsequent year.”
Indeed, after talking to both Mercedes team manager Ron Meadows and Ross Brawn on May 3, Whiting had checked with FIA lawyer Sebastian Bernard on the relevance of the phrase “undertaken by the competitor,” and was told that if the test was deemed to be undertaken by Pirelli, it could be permissible.
Harris even claimed that Mercedes didn’t have to check with the FIA, given that it was a Pirelli test, claiming that Brawn took a cautious approach.
Harris also argued that if Mercedes is deemed to be in the wrong, then the pre-Spanish GP Ferrari test should be considered a breach in that, despite the fact it was done with a two-year-old car, the car did “conform substantially with the current Formula One technical regulations,” which is what the rules forbid.
Harris also pointed out that the Ferrari test was booked and paid for by the Italian team, and this was in contrast to Pirelli’s arrangements for the Mercedes test.
Intriguingly, he also revealed that in 2012 Felipe Massa had taken part in a similar test on Pirelli’s behalf at Barcelona.
Harris also apologized for the fact that Lewis Hamilton and Nico Rosberg had completed the test in plain, unmarked helmets, claiming – somewhat unbelievably – that it was to lessen interest from fans due to a lack of security and bodyguards.
When he took the stand, Ross Brawn was adamant initially that Mercedes gained no benefit from the test and that Pirelli had not told the team what tires it was running, although under question he conceded that inevitably there was some benefit.
Meanwhile, Pirelli lawyer Dominque Dumas then argued that it does not come under the jurisdiction of the FIA as a non-license holder, citing the 2009 ‘Crashgate’ case – which led to senior team personnel being licensed and thus subject to punishment. Briatore was banned by the FIA, but that was overturned in the French courts.
The FIA has confirmed that a verdict will be announced Friday, after Edwin Glasgow – the president of the tribunal – initially said that the four judges would reveal their conclusion “by tomorrow.”
Intriguingly, as part of his summing up on behalf of Mercedes, lawyer Paul Harris said that his client had tried to act in good faith and thus if deemed guilty something like a reprimand – or exclusion from the upcoming Young Driver test, where the current cars are used by all teams – would be an appropriate punishment.
As expected, Mercedes insisted it had permission to conduct the controversial test. Meanwhile, the FIA claimed it did not, and Pirelli was adamant that it cannot be sanctioned by the FIA.
Proceedings began early Thursday morning with the FIA’s legal counsel, Mark Howard, presenting the governing body’s case.
Intriguingly, in addition to outlining the breach of Article 22, related to in-season testing a current car, he also mentioned Article 151c, which involves bringing the sport into disrepute, or more specifically bans “fraudulent conduct or any act prejudicial to the interests of any competition or to the interests of motorsport generally.”
Howard argued that: “Without the knowledge, consent and participation of other competitors, Mercedes and Pirelli may have engaged in activity that was prejudicial to the competition.”
In essence, he repeated what the FIA said in a media statement on Sunday evening in Monaco: essentially, that conversations took place between Mercedes and Charlie Whiting in early May, but Whiting did not formally sanction the Barcelona test with the current car. Howard stressed the FIA’s requirement that other teams be informed and invited.
He said: “Whiting was asked a general and non-specific question – the general question on the permissibility of using a 2013 car. His preliminary response was that such a test would comply with Article 22, providing the purpose was for Pirelli to test its tire, and he would check.”
He added that even though Pirelli has a contract with the FIA which allows for 1,000-kilometer tests to be conducted by teams, the Sporting Regulations should take precedence.
Howard also argued that Mercedes had gained some knowledge from the test, saying: “We would suggest that it is difficult to say Mercedes obtained no benefit from the test.”
Speaking on behalf of Mercedes, lawyer Paul Harris claimed that the team did not break the rules, in essence because the test was arranged and run by Pirelli, and not by Mercedes in its role as a competitor.
The rules state: “Track testing shall be considered any track running time not part of an Event undertaken by a competitor entered in the Championship, using cars which conform substantially with the current Formula One Technical Regulations in addition to those from the previous or subsequent year.”
Indeed, after talking to both Mercedes team manager Ron Meadows and Ross Brawn on May 3, Whiting had checked with FIA lawyer Sebastian Bernard on the relevance of the phrase “undertaken by the competitor,” and was told that if the test was deemed to be undertaken by Pirelli, it could be permissible.
Harris even claimed that Mercedes didn’t have to check with the FIA, given that it was a Pirelli test, claiming that Brawn took a cautious approach.
Harris also argued that if Mercedes is deemed to be in the wrong, then the pre-Spanish GP Ferrari test should be considered a breach in that, despite the fact it was done with a two-year-old car, the car did “conform substantially with the current Formula One technical regulations,” which is what the rules forbid.
Harris also pointed out that the Ferrari test was booked and paid for by the Italian team, and this was in contrast to Pirelli’s arrangements for the Mercedes test.
Intriguingly, he also revealed that in 2012 Felipe Massa had taken part in a similar test on Pirelli’s behalf at Barcelona.
Harris also apologized for the fact that Lewis Hamilton and Nico Rosberg had completed the test in plain, unmarked helmets, claiming – somewhat unbelievably – that it was to lessen interest from fans due to a lack of security and bodyguards.
When he took the stand, Ross Brawn was adamant initially that Mercedes gained no benefit from the test and that Pirelli had not told the team what tires it was running, although under question he conceded that inevitably there was some benefit.
Meanwhile, Pirelli lawyer Dominque Dumas then argued that it does not come under the jurisdiction of the FIA as a non-license holder, citing the 2009 ‘Crashgate’ case – which led to senior team personnel being licensed and thus subject to punishment. Briatore was banned by the FIA, but that was overturned in the French courts.
My guess. Mercedes loses all Friday practice for the rest of the year to "make up" for the over testing. Points penalty for the constructors championship. A hefty donation to the FIA.
#172
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Mercedes suspended from young driver test 21 Jun 2013
Mercedes have been suspended from participating in this year's young driver test, it was announced Friday, after the FIA’s International Tribunal (IT) deemed that the private tyre test conducted by Pirelli and Mercedes in Barcelona last month constituted a breach of the Formula One rules.
Both Mercedes and Pirelli have also been reprimanded.
More to follow
Mercedes have been suspended from participating in this year's young driver test, it was announced Friday, after the FIA’s International Tribunal (IT) deemed that the private tyre test conducted by Pirelli and Mercedes in Barcelona last month constituted a breach of the Formula One rules.
Both Mercedes and Pirelli have also been reprimanded.
More to follow
#173
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from jamesallenonf1:
The FIA International Tribunal has handed Mercedes a reprimand over its part in the controversial Pirelli tyre test and stopped it from taking part in the Young Drivers’ test next month.
Pirelli has also been reprimanded; it will be interesting to see what their reaction is as they felt that they should not have been part of the proceedings in the first place. Their lawyer Dominique Dumas said yesterday that “we do not come under the jurisdiction or authority of the FIA”.
Here’s what the statement said:
“The Tribunal, after having heard the parties and examined their submissions, decided that:
1. Mercedes be reprimanded;
2. Mercedes be suspended from participating in the forthcoming “three day young driver training test”;
3. Pirelli be reprimanded;
and rejected all other and further conclusions.”
Clearly the Tribunal found that there had been a breach of the rules, but that it was done in good faith.
The verdict will come as a disappointment to Red Bull, Ferrari and others who felt that there was a clear breach of the Sporting Regulations and that Mercedes had gained an advantage.
However, the FIA International Tribunal is a new body established to distance the disciplinary function of the FIA from the office of the President and as such is considered to be fully independent.
The nub of the problem from Mercedes’ side was the issue of “permission”
They believed that by contacting FIA’s Charlie Whiting and asking if they could use a 2013 car to conduct a test for Pirelli, they had “permission”. As was pointed out in the Tribunal only the Head of FIA’s Sport Department Pierre de Connick and the World Motor Sport Council could consider something which contravened the rules, but Mercedes followed the procedure used at race meetings of approaching Whiting for an opinion.
He gave an opinion that it might be possible subject to certain qualifications, like all the other teams being notified, but Mercedes did not follow that up with a clear written outline of what they planned to do. So they did not have “permission” to do a 1,000km test with Pirelli at Barcelona.
Mercedes felt that they had acted in good faith and that if there was a breach of the regulations it was because of an interpretation of the rules, rather than a desire to gain an unfair advantage over rivals.
Mercedes’ submission to the Tribunal stated that the car ran in the same specification at the test in which it had completed the Grand Prix a few days earlier, with only parts past their life, bing replaced being for similar ones.
Red Bull team boss Christian Horner was present at the Tribunal yesterday and had his say afterwards, while Ferrari team boss Stefano Domenicali is to take part in a live Ferrari webchat this evening at 7pm CET, presumably to answer some of the points arising from the Tribunal which concern Ferrari, such as the presence of Felipe Massa at Ferrari’s pre-Barcelona Pirelli test with a 2011 car, which was cleared by the FIA.
The FIA International Tribunal has handed Mercedes a reprimand over its part in the controversial Pirelli tyre test and stopped it from taking part in the Young Drivers’ test next month.
Pirelli has also been reprimanded; it will be interesting to see what their reaction is as they felt that they should not have been part of the proceedings in the first place. Their lawyer Dominique Dumas said yesterday that “we do not come under the jurisdiction or authority of the FIA”.
Here’s what the statement said:
“The Tribunal, after having heard the parties and examined their submissions, decided that:
1. Mercedes be reprimanded;
2. Mercedes be suspended from participating in the forthcoming “three day young driver training test”;
3. Pirelli be reprimanded;
and rejected all other and further conclusions.”
Clearly the Tribunal found that there had been a breach of the rules, but that it was done in good faith.
The verdict will come as a disappointment to Red Bull, Ferrari and others who felt that there was a clear breach of the Sporting Regulations and that Mercedes had gained an advantage.
However, the FIA International Tribunal is a new body established to distance the disciplinary function of the FIA from the office of the President and as such is considered to be fully independent.
The nub of the problem from Mercedes’ side was the issue of “permission”
They believed that by contacting FIA’s Charlie Whiting and asking if they could use a 2013 car to conduct a test for Pirelli, they had “permission”. As was pointed out in the Tribunal only the Head of FIA’s Sport Department Pierre de Connick and the World Motor Sport Council could consider something which contravened the rules, but Mercedes followed the procedure used at race meetings of approaching Whiting for an opinion.
He gave an opinion that it might be possible subject to certain qualifications, like all the other teams being notified, but Mercedes did not follow that up with a clear written outline of what they planned to do. So they did not have “permission” to do a 1,000km test with Pirelli at Barcelona.
Mercedes felt that they had acted in good faith and that if there was a breach of the regulations it was because of an interpretation of the rules, rather than a desire to gain an unfair advantage over rivals.
Mercedes’ submission to the Tribunal stated that the car ran in the same specification at the test in which it had completed the Grand Prix a few days earlier, with only parts past their life, bing replaced being for similar ones.
Red Bull team boss Christian Horner was present at the Tribunal yesterday and had his say afterwards, while Ferrari team boss Stefano Domenicali is to take part in a live Ferrari webchat this evening at 7pm CET, presumably to answer some of the points arising from the Tribunal which concern Ferrari, such as the presence of Felipe Massa at Ferrari’s pre-Barcelona Pirelli test with a 2011 car, which was cleared by the FIA.
#174
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Lame penalty.
#175
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Agreed. I don't understand how the Tribunal could have believed Brawn's assertion the tire test was undertaken in "good faith" based on a conversation with Charlie Whiting that was non-specific and noncommittal.
Everything I read said the FIA does not usually give litigants what it suggests for punishment but they did here. Oh well, back to racing . . .
![Dunno](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/dunno.gif)
#176
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Thread Starter
^ Mercedes and Brawn sorta threw Whiting under the bus by implicating his verbal acknowledgment implied formal FIA approval. From what I've read most of the team managers and technical directors respect Charlie since he's been neutral and non-partisan whne it comes to rules and sporting regs. I doubt FIA will fire Whiting over this but I'd bet that either more formalized communication is established from here out.
#177
AZ Community Team
Thread Starter
Good article about Frank Williams wife Virginia who recently died of cancer
http://blogs.espnf1.com/Maurice-Hami...oman_power.php
There's a new decal on the Williams F1 cars in tribute to Virginia Williams.
There's a new decal on the Williams F1 cars in tribute to Virginia Williams.
![](http://www.motorsport-total.com/bilder/2013/130322/z1363938658.jpg)
Last edited by Legend2TL; 06-27-2013 at 06:35 AM.
#179
Goodbye.
#180
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always win with a popular tribute, never win with a Williams car (nowadays anyways)
#181
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Thread Starter
#182
Senior Moderator
Silverstone FP1:
POS DRIVER NATIONALITY ENTRANT TIME
1. Daniel Ricciardo Australia Toro Rosso-Ferrari 1:54.249
2. Nico Hulkenberg Germany Sauber-Ferrari 1:55.033
3. Pastor Maldonado Venezuela Williams-Renault 1:55.354
4. Lewis Hamilton Britain Mercedes GP 1:55.458
5. Esteban Gutierrez Mexico Sauber-Ferrari 1:55.825
6. Valtteri Bottas Finland Williams-Renault 1:56.361
7. Jean-Eric Vergne France Toro Rosso-Ferrari 1:57.891
8. Giedo van der Garde Netherlands Caterham-Renault 1:58.859
9. Max Chilton Britain Marussia-Cosworth 1:59.719
10. Jules Bianchi France Marussia-Cosworth 1:59.876
11. Felipe Massa Brazil Ferrari 2:06.534
12. Nico Rosberg Germany Mercedes GP No Time
13. Paul di Resta Britain Force India-Mercedes No Time
14. Romain Grosjean France Lotus-Renault No Time
15. Jenson Button Britain McLaren-Mercedes No Time
16. Adrian Sutil Germany Force India-Mercedes No Time
17. Fernando Alonso Spain Ferrari No Time
18. Mark Webber Australia Red Bull-Renault No Time
19. Sergio Perez Mexico McLaren-Mercedes No Time
20. Charles Pic France Caterham-Renault No Time
21. Sebastian Vettel Germany Red Bull-Renault No Time
22. Kimi Raikkonen Finland Lotus-Renault No Time
POS DRIVER NATIONALITY ENTRANT TIME
1. Daniel Ricciardo Australia Toro Rosso-Ferrari 1:54.249
2. Nico Hulkenberg Germany Sauber-Ferrari 1:55.033
3. Pastor Maldonado Venezuela Williams-Renault 1:55.354
4. Lewis Hamilton Britain Mercedes GP 1:55.458
5. Esteban Gutierrez Mexico Sauber-Ferrari 1:55.825
6. Valtteri Bottas Finland Williams-Renault 1:56.361
7. Jean-Eric Vergne France Toro Rosso-Ferrari 1:57.891
8. Giedo van der Garde Netherlands Caterham-Renault 1:58.859
9. Max Chilton Britain Marussia-Cosworth 1:59.719
10. Jules Bianchi France Marussia-Cosworth 1:59.876
11. Felipe Massa Brazil Ferrari 2:06.534
12. Nico Rosberg Germany Mercedes GP No Time
13. Paul di Resta Britain Force India-Mercedes No Time
14. Romain Grosjean France Lotus-Renault No Time
15. Jenson Button Britain McLaren-Mercedes No Time
16. Adrian Sutil Germany Force India-Mercedes No Time
17. Fernando Alonso Spain Ferrari No Time
18. Mark Webber Australia Red Bull-Renault No Time
19. Sergio Perez Mexico McLaren-Mercedes No Time
20. Charles Pic France Caterham-Renault No Time
21. Sebastian Vettel Germany Red Bull-Renault No Time
22. Kimi Raikkonen Finland Lotus-Renault No Time
#183
Senior Moderator
No "Infiniti" engine next year.
Engine makers will have to supply identical packages to each partner team when the new V6 formula kicks off next year.
But Germany's Auto Motor und Sport reports that Red Bull and Renault fought hard against the FIA's plans, with the reigning champions having wanted to involve team sponsor Infiniti - Nissan's luxury arm - in the development of its power unit.
But the entire Renault 'power unit' will now have to be homologated, meaning all of Renault's customers - including Toro Rosso and probably Lotus and Caterham - receive exactly the same package.
Auto Motor und Sport said that rule will be ratified by the World Motor Sport Council on Friday.
The German report said Mercedes argued strongly against allowing different engine specifications for individual teams, which might have driven up costs and deepened the gap between the big and small teams.
A paddock source is quoted as saying: "Infiniti can build their own engine if they want to."
But Germany's Auto Motor und Sport reports that Red Bull and Renault fought hard against the FIA's plans, with the reigning champions having wanted to involve team sponsor Infiniti - Nissan's luxury arm - in the development of its power unit.
But the entire Renault 'power unit' will now have to be homologated, meaning all of Renault's customers - including Toro Rosso and probably Lotus and Caterham - receive exactly the same package.
Auto Motor und Sport said that rule will be ratified by the World Motor Sport Council on Friday.
The German report said Mercedes argued strongly against allowing different engine specifications for individual teams, which might have driven up costs and deepened the gap between the big and small teams.
A paddock source is quoted as saying: "Infiniti can build their own engine if they want to."
#184
Senior Moderator
Silverstone FP2:
POS DRIVER NATIONALITY ENTRANT TIME
1. Nico Rosberg Germany Mercedes GP 1:32.248
2. Mark Webber Australia Red Bull-Renault 1:32.547
3. Sebastian Vettel Germany Red Bull-Renault 1:32.680
4. Paul di Resta Britain Force India-Mercedes 1:32.832
5. Lewis Hamilton Britain Mercedes GP 1:32.911
6. Daniel Ricciardo Australia Toro Rosso-Ferrari 1:33.171
7. Jean-Eric Vergne France Toro Rosso-Ferrari 1:33.290
8. Adrian Sutil Germany Force India-Mercedes 1:33.313
9. Romain Grosjean France Lotus-Renault 1:33.322
10. Fernando Alonso Spain Ferrari 1:33.494
11. Jenson Button Britain McLaren-Mercedes 1:33.740
12. Nico Hulkenberg Germany Sauber-Ferrari 1:33.896
13. Kimi Raikkonen Finland Lotus-Renault 1:34.120
14. Sergio Perez Mexico McLaren-Mercedes 1:34.130
15. Esteban Gutierrez Mexico Sauber-Ferrari 1:34.998
16. Valtteri Bottas Finland Williams-Renault 1:35.070
17. Pastor Maldonado Venezuela Williams-Renault 1:35.127
18. Jules Bianchi France Marussia-Cosworth 1:35.802
19. Giedo van der Garde Netherlands Caterham-Renault 1:35.984
20. Charles Pic France Caterham-Renault 1:36.079
21. Max Chilton Britain Marussia-Cosworth 1:37.329
22. Felipe Massa Brazil Ferrari 1:43.466
POS DRIVER NATIONALITY ENTRANT TIME
1. Nico Rosberg Germany Mercedes GP 1:32.248
2. Mark Webber Australia Red Bull-Renault 1:32.547
3. Sebastian Vettel Germany Red Bull-Renault 1:32.680
4. Paul di Resta Britain Force India-Mercedes 1:32.832
5. Lewis Hamilton Britain Mercedes GP 1:32.911
6. Daniel Ricciardo Australia Toro Rosso-Ferrari 1:33.171
7. Jean-Eric Vergne France Toro Rosso-Ferrari 1:33.290
8. Adrian Sutil Germany Force India-Mercedes 1:33.313
9. Romain Grosjean France Lotus-Renault 1:33.322
10. Fernando Alonso Spain Ferrari 1:33.494
11. Jenson Button Britain McLaren-Mercedes 1:33.740
12. Nico Hulkenberg Germany Sauber-Ferrari 1:33.896
13. Kimi Raikkonen Finland Lotus-Renault 1:34.120
14. Sergio Perez Mexico McLaren-Mercedes 1:34.130
15. Esteban Gutierrez Mexico Sauber-Ferrari 1:34.998
16. Valtteri Bottas Finland Williams-Renault 1:35.070
17. Pastor Maldonado Venezuela Williams-Renault 1:35.127
18. Jules Bianchi France Marussia-Cosworth 1:35.802
19. Giedo van der Garde Netherlands Caterham-Renault 1:35.984
20. Charles Pic France Caterham-Renault 1:36.079
21. Max Chilton Britain Marussia-Cosworth 1:37.329
22. Felipe Massa Brazil Ferrari 1:43.466
#186
AZ Community Team
Thread Starter
Q&A on F1 with gary Anderson
- The British Grand Prix
- Mercedes and Pirelli 'tyregate' verdict
- McLaren so far this season
- Tips for budding technical directors
- Working with Eddie Jordan
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/23061695
- Raikkonen being perfect for Red Bull
- Refuelling during racing
- Whether DRS has damaged the sport
- Gary's fantasy F1 team
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/22387361
Great column from former F1 designer Gary Anderson, I agree with his opinion of Button, Hamilton, Kimi, and Vettel
- Mercedes and Pirelli 'tyregate' verdict
- McLaren so far this season
- Tips for budding technical directors
- Working with Eddie Jordan
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/23061695
- Raikkonen being perfect for Red Bull
- Refuelling during racing
- Whether DRS has damaged the sport
- Gary's fantasy F1 team
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/22387361
Great column from former F1 designer Gary Anderson, I agree with his opinion of Button, Hamilton, Kimi, and Vettel
#187
Senior Moderator
I'm not too sure Red Bull's motivation for acquiring Raikkonen is because they are afraid Vettel will bolt if someone offers more money. IMO, Vettel is only motivated by wins, at least for now. If he was motivated by money, he would have gone to Mercedes or McLaren, or tried to get a bigger salary from Red Bull. As long as Red Bull can continue to produce a top car, I don't think Vettel will leave.
#188
Senior Moderator
Paul Di Resta has been disqualified from qualifying at the British Grand Prix after his car was found to be underweight.
The Scot's Force India was 1.5kg under the minimum weight limit after checks were completed and the matter was referred to stewards.
The penalty deprived the 27-year-old of a career-best qualifying position.
Force India blamed a discrepancy in Di Resta's weight after qualifying - driver and car count together.
Governing body the FIA said Di Resta would move to the back of the grid, but he may well be forced to start from the pits.
If the team need to add ballast to the car to make up its weight, that would be a change of set-up, which is not allowed under F1's parc ferme regulations.
The team have decided not to appeal against the decision.
Di Resta weighed less than expected on the FIA scales after qualifying but team boss Bob Fernley said that when he was weighed again later he was back to his normal weight.
The weight of the car and driver combined must be at least 642kg to comply with the regulations.
The Scot's Force India was 1.5kg under the minimum weight limit after checks were completed and the matter was referred to stewards.
The penalty deprived the 27-year-old of a career-best qualifying position.
Force India blamed a discrepancy in Di Resta's weight after qualifying - driver and car count together.
Governing body the FIA said Di Resta would move to the back of the grid, but he may well be forced to start from the pits.
If the team need to add ballast to the car to make up its weight, that would be a change of set-up, which is not allowed under F1's parc ferme regulations.
The team have decided not to appeal against the decision.
Di Resta weighed less than expected on the FIA scales after qualifying but team boss Bob Fernley said that when he was weighed again later he was back to his normal weight.
The weight of the car and driver combined must be at least 642kg to comply with the regulations.
![Popcorn](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/popcorn.gif)
#189
AZ Community Team
Thread Starter
![Wink](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/icons/icon12.gif)
#190
Suzuka Master
what a f'ckin insane race!!
Wish Hamilton didnt have his tire blown up though
Wish Hamilton didnt have his tire blown up though
![Sad](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/sad.gif)
#191
Senior Moderator
Bizarre race. I don't think I've ever seen a race quite like this. I lost count of the number of tire failures.
Also:
Looks like Mercedes is the new Ferrari at dodging penalties.
Also:
Nico Rosberg logged his second win of 2013 after a superb performance at Silverstone – but it was only confirmed after he escaped with a reprimand for not making a “significant reduction in speed” under double waved yellow flags.
Frustrated rivals pointed out that the German logged a purple sector – the fastest of the race to date – when the flags were shown.
Nevertheless it was a canny drive by Rosberg, who ran third early on and benefited from Lewis Hamilton’s tire failure and Sebastian Vettel’s gearbox breakage.
Frustrated rivals pointed out that the German logged a purple sector – the fastest of the race to date – when the flags were shown.
Nevertheless it was a canny drive by Rosberg, who ran third early on and benefited from Lewis Hamilton’s tire failure and Sebastian Vettel’s gearbox breakage.
![what](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/what.gif)
#192
Suzuka Master
Damn gonna a lot of rebuttals at mercedes
#196
Senior Moderator
Claims that Pirelli changed tyres without consent at Silverstone
F1's tyre scandal could be set to deepen yet further, as a Spanish sports newspaper claims Pirelli - already under reprimand for 'test-gate' - blatantly broke the rules.
Marca correspondent Marco Canseco reports that, prior to the tyre-explosive British grand prix, F1's official supplier changed the construction of its 2013 tyre without the knowledge or the consent of the FIA or the teams.
"At worst, it jeopardised the lives of the drivers," Canseco said, referring to the spate of spectacular tyre failures at the British grand prix that have thrown the sport into crisis.
Marca said the tyres used at Silverstone had a completely new structure, with a layer of kevlar included in the internal steel-belt.
Earlier, teams including Lotus, Force India and Ferrari vetoed the introduction of the purely kevlar-belted tyres, due to the rule requiring unanimity for mid-season changes.
Canseco said he discovered Pirelli's breach when Sauber and McLaren sent team personnel out to the scene of Sunday's tyre explosions, only to discover kevlar shards among the debris.
Pirelli's Paul Hembery denies the charge.
"I can assure you that the tyres (at Silverstone) were the same construction as the ones used in Barcelona," he said.
Reacting to F1's new tyre crisis, the FIA has agreed to open up the forthcoming three-day young driver test at Silverstone to include the use of race drivers for tyre development.
"The test may also be extended by one day," read a statement issued by the Paris federation.
Mercedes, however, remains banned from the test, even though team director Toto Wolff expressed concerns about what the other teams will be allowed to do.
"If it is a pure tyre test, I'm all for it," he is quoted by Germany's Sport Bild.
The FIA also said it will seek the World Motor Sport Council's consent to allow Pirelli to introduce new specifications during the season without the need for unanimity.
"In the meantime," the governing body added, "the FIA has asked Pirelli for an assurance that there will be no repetition of the tyre problems at this weekend's German grand prix or at subsequent grands prix."
If that guarantee is not forthcoming, it is possible drivers will boycott the Nurburgring.
"I don't think that will happen," Bernie Ecclestone told the BBC.
But McLaren team boss Martin Whitmarsh insists: "There is that danger (of boycott), if it is not certain that it is safe.
"But this is not what we want for F1. We had these problems in Indianapolis (in 2005) and it was terrible for the sport.
"This is not the time to blame anyone," he is quoted by Auto Hebdo, "we need to work together and find a solution."
The Telegraph reports that Pirelli will "almost certainly" use its safer kevlar tyres this weekend.
"We would support this," Lotus boss Eric Boullier, who previously blocked the introduction of the kevlar tyres on sporting grounds, is quoted by AFP news agency.
"Safety is the primary concern," he insisted.
F1 chief executive Ecclestone confirmed: "They (Pirelli) can change them (the tyres).
"(FIA president) Jean (Todt) agreed with that and I told Pirelli."
Influential French sports daily L'Equipe headlined that the sport is "in tatters" after Silverstone, but the most damage has been to Pirelli's image.
"Fortunately they (Pirelli) don't make condoms," joked German tennis legend Boris Becker, according to Welt newspaper.
Ferrari's Stefano Domenicali thinks the Nurburgring will be a "less stressful" circuit for tyres than high-speed Silverstone.
F1's tyre scandal could be set to deepen yet further, as a Spanish sports newspaper claims Pirelli - already under reprimand for 'test-gate' - blatantly broke the rules.
Marca correspondent Marco Canseco reports that, prior to the tyre-explosive British grand prix, F1's official supplier changed the construction of its 2013 tyre without the knowledge or the consent of the FIA or the teams.
"At worst, it jeopardised the lives of the drivers," Canseco said, referring to the spate of spectacular tyre failures at the British grand prix that have thrown the sport into crisis.
Marca said the tyres used at Silverstone had a completely new structure, with a layer of kevlar included in the internal steel-belt.
Earlier, teams including Lotus, Force India and Ferrari vetoed the introduction of the purely kevlar-belted tyres, due to the rule requiring unanimity for mid-season changes.
Canseco said he discovered Pirelli's breach when Sauber and McLaren sent team personnel out to the scene of Sunday's tyre explosions, only to discover kevlar shards among the debris.
Pirelli's Paul Hembery denies the charge.
"I can assure you that the tyres (at Silverstone) were the same construction as the ones used in Barcelona," he said.
Reacting to F1's new tyre crisis, the FIA has agreed to open up the forthcoming three-day young driver test at Silverstone to include the use of race drivers for tyre development.
"The test may also be extended by one day," read a statement issued by the Paris federation.
Mercedes, however, remains banned from the test, even though team director Toto Wolff expressed concerns about what the other teams will be allowed to do.
"If it is a pure tyre test, I'm all for it," he is quoted by Germany's Sport Bild.
The FIA also said it will seek the World Motor Sport Council's consent to allow Pirelli to introduce new specifications during the season without the need for unanimity.
"In the meantime," the governing body added, "the FIA has asked Pirelli for an assurance that there will be no repetition of the tyre problems at this weekend's German grand prix or at subsequent grands prix."
If that guarantee is not forthcoming, it is possible drivers will boycott the Nurburgring.
"I don't think that will happen," Bernie Ecclestone told the BBC.
But McLaren team boss Martin Whitmarsh insists: "There is that danger (of boycott), if it is not certain that it is safe.
"But this is not what we want for F1. We had these problems in Indianapolis (in 2005) and it was terrible for the sport.
"This is not the time to blame anyone," he is quoted by Auto Hebdo, "we need to work together and find a solution."
The Telegraph reports that Pirelli will "almost certainly" use its safer kevlar tyres this weekend.
"We would support this," Lotus boss Eric Boullier, who previously blocked the introduction of the kevlar tyres on sporting grounds, is quoted by AFP news agency.
"Safety is the primary concern," he insisted.
F1 chief executive Ecclestone confirmed: "They (Pirelli) can change them (the tyres).
"(FIA president) Jean (Todt) agreed with that and I told Pirelli."
Influential French sports daily L'Equipe headlined that the sport is "in tatters" after Silverstone, but the most damage has been to Pirelli's image.
"Fortunately they (Pirelli) don't make condoms," joked German tennis legend Boris Becker, according to Welt newspaper.
Ferrari's Stefano Domenicali thinks the Nurburgring will be a "less stressful" circuit for tyres than high-speed Silverstone.
#197
6G TLX-S
^^^^^
This is what will happen when there is no competition, with a single tire supplier.
Also, FIA can't do much, because if Pirelli doesn't run the show, no one can, especially right in the middle of a race season.
Even if FIA penalizes Pirelli, Pirelli won't give a damn. Pirelli can simply withdraw from F1 next season, just like Michelin and Bridgestone did years before.
This is what will happen when there is no competition, with a single tire supplier.
Also, FIA can't do much, because if Pirelli doesn't run the show, no one can, especially right in the middle of a race season.
Even if FIA penalizes Pirelli, Pirelli won't give a damn. Pirelli can simply withdraw from F1 next season, just like Michelin and Bridgestone did years before.
#198
Senior Moderator
Join Date: Jan 2001
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two tire manufacturers at the same time is no good either-I was at the USGP at Indy when the Michelin cars all exited at the end of the reconnaissance lap leaving 6 cars (2 Ferraris and 4 back markers) left on the grid. That SUCKED
#200
AZ Community Team
Thread Starter
![Talking](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/icons/icon10.gif)
http://en.espnf1.com/ferrari/motorsp...ry/116051.html
It must be mid-season, cause Luca for the past ~5 years says basically the same statement being "Felipe is fully aware he can count on our total confidence in him,"
It must be mid-season, cause Luca for the past ~5 years says basically the same statement being "Felipe is fully aware he can count on our total confidence in him,"
![Tongue](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/tongue.gif)