2009 Season F1 Technology Thread
#41
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#43
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#45
Unofficial Goat
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Ferrari Threaten to withdraw from F1 over spec engine proposal!
Ferrari Statement
"The Board of Directors of Ferrari SpA met today under the chairmanship of Luca di Montezemolo, to examine the third quarter results. The Board of Directors also examined the proposed changes to the Formula One regulations, in the light of the current global economic crisis.
"Whilst reiterating its wholehearted commitment to a substantial and needed reduction in costs in Formula One, starting with propulsion, the Ferrari Board of Directors expressed strong concerns regarding plans to standardise engines as it felt that such a move would detract from the entire raison of a sport with which Ferrari has been involved continuously since 1950, a raison d’etre based principally on competition and technological development.
"The Board of Directors expressed the opinion that should these key elements be diminished, it would have to re-evaluate, with its partners the viability of continuing its presence in the sport."
"The Board of Directors of Ferrari SpA met today under the chairmanship of Luca di Montezemolo, to examine the third quarter results. The Board of Directors also examined the proposed changes to the Formula One regulations, in the light of the current global economic crisis.
"Whilst reiterating its wholehearted commitment to a substantial and needed reduction in costs in Formula One, starting with propulsion, the Ferrari Board of Directors expressed strong concerns regarding plans to standardise engines as it felt that such a move would detract from the entire raison of a sport with which Ferrari has been involved continuously since 1950, a raison d’etre based principally on competition and technological development.
"The Board of Directors expressed the opinion that should these key elements be diminished, it would have to re-evaluate, with its partners the viability of continuing its presence in the sport."
Well it's about time someone stands up to these freaking tools! GO FERRARI!
#47
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Honda, BMW, and Toyota have all said the same thing. Stupid Mosely is in for a fight.
#48
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Confirmed: Next year, engines to last three races.
#50
F1 cart racer
how does this reduce cost, thier going to invest more money to make these motors strong....they will probably till produce a lot of motors to use. the savings aren't great IMHO. i'm starting to aggravated with all of these new rule changes. let them race, let them be the pinnacle of motor racing.
#52
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#53
Big Block go VROOOM!
So I guess I'm the only one that doesn't think 3 race engines is a stupid rule. No, it will not save anything on development costs. I'd be willing to bet though, that the decreased production and logistical needs will probably still save millions of dollars among the suppliers when factored over the course of a season.
#54
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So I guess I'm the only one that doesn't think 3 race engines is a stupid rule. No, it will not save anything on development costs. I'd be willing to bet though, that the decreased production and logistical needs will probably still save millions of dollars among the suppliers when factored over the course of a season.
#57
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So I guess I'm the only one that doesn't think 3 race engines is a stupid rule. No, it will not save anything on development costs. I'd be willing to bet though, that the decreased production and logistical needs will probably still save millions of dollars among the suppliers when factored over the course of a season.
Where does something like this stop? They talk about a standardized engine. What next? a standard chassis?
#58
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I would say yes you are one of the few?? Teams will still produce the same amount of engines for testing and practicing. There is still the friday practice on a different engine than the race engine. And like Dougler said. Its only 3 engines per season. Not that big of a deal, especially if 1 or 2 fail durring the season. The added cost/design (How this will work in a frozen engine regulation??) will still be costly.
Where does something like this stop? They talk about a standardized engine. What next? a standard chassis?
Where does something like this stop? They talk about a standardized engine. What next? a standard chassis?
#59
Big Block go VROOOM!
I would say yes you are one of the few?? Teams will still produce the same amount of engines for testing and practicing. There is still the friday practice on a different engine than the race engine. And like Dougler said. Its only 3 engines per season. Not that big of a deal, especially if 1 or 2 fail durring the season.
-Machining time/production costs
-Inspection/certification of produced parts
-Assembly time
-Dyno testing
-Shipping/transport to other countries or other side of the world
-Each of the above for six engines (minimum), not three
Spare/replacement engines are irrelevant. You have one or two replacement engines on-hand for each car. If you have a failure, you use the replacement engine that’s on hand and then produce/build another motor to put back into the pool of what’s available. How would this change at all with three races per engine versus two? The same holds true for the practice engines. They’re irrelevant to the two vs. three race debate.
#60
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BMW testing the 2009 aero package at Barcelona.
Honda testing 2009 front wing?
#62
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I think the intent is to reduce the air wake caused by the rear wing, and to increase front end grip while trailing a car. Better overtaking? We shall see. Otherwise, it sure does look
#63
Big Block go VROOOM!
Holy crap. I didn't think the narrower rear wings would look shockingly different but I was wrong. It sort of looks like an F1 car with a Hitler mustache.
#64
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F1tler?
#66
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Whoooolllyyyyy Fawk are those cars going to take some getting used to
#67
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^^^just like the narrow stance, non-slick shod cars that are being replaced by these fugly things next year.
#69
Three Wheelin'
I think that's the car BMW was testing recently. I don't know if they've decided to go with the tiny rear wing for the 2009 season. It looks ridiculous, though.
#72
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Ilmor is reportedly the front runner to develope and build Formula One engines should the FIA decide to go to a standard engine formula.
According to the German publication Auto, Motor und Sport, Ilmor is one several contractors who have responded to FIA's invitation to tender along with Cosworth, Mecachrome, Zytek and Judd. None of the current Formula One manufacturers are expected to submit a proposal.
All of the firms mentioned have at one time participated in Formula One.
Ilmor supplied 3.5 litre V10 engines for various F1 teams from 1991 to 1994 and they built engines for Mercedes Benz's F1 program until the German manufacturer took complete control of that process in 2005. Since 1983, the company has also been involved in engine design and development for the IndyCar series and in 2003, they entered into a partnership with Honda to supply and build all the engines currently used in the IRL.
Cosworth supplied engines to the Jaguar, Williams, Minardi, Red Bull and Toro Rosso F1 teams from 2000 until leaving the sport in 2006. They were also involved in engine design and development in American open-wheel racing, including being the sole supplier for the Champ Car World Series.
Mechachrome was responsible for supplying the Williams team and Canadian Jacques Villeneuve with engines during the 1998 F1 season. The company has also designed and developed engines for GP2 and endurance racing.
Zytek was the first company to supply the FIA Formula 3000 series with engines and they have also been involved in endurance car racing as well as supplying engines to the A1GP series from 2004 to 2008.
Judd supplied Formula One engines to March, Williams F1 and Ligier in 1988, scoring four podium results in their first season of competition. At the end of the 1992 season, Judd withdrew from F1 competition but John Judd entered into an agreement with Yamaha to continue production of his engines and in 1997 Damon Hill narrowly missed winning the Hungarian Grand Prix in a Yamaha-powered Arrows.
According to the German publication Auto, Motor und Sport, Ilmor is one several contractors who have responded to FIA's invitation to tender along with Cosworth, Mecachrome, Zytek and Judd. None of the current Formula One manufacturers are expected to submit a proposal.
All of the firms mentioned have at one time participated in Formula One.
Ilmor supplied 3.5 litre V10 engines for various F1 teams from 1991 to 1994 and they built engines for Mercedes Benz's F1 program until the German manufacturer took complete control of that process in 2005. Since 1983, the company has also been involved in engine design and development for the IndyCar series and in 2003, they entered into a partnership with Honda to supply and build all the engines currently used in the IRL.
Cosworth supplied engines to the Jaguar, Williams, Minardi, Red Bull and Toro Rosso F1 teams from 2000 until leaving the sport in 2006. They were also involved in engine design and development in American open-wheel racing, including being the sole supplier for the Champ Car World Series.
Mechachrome was responsible for supplying the Williams team and Canadian Jacques Villeneuve with engines during the 1998 F1 season. The company has also designed and developed engines for GP2 and endurance racing.
Zytek was the first company to supply the FIA Formula 3000 series with engines and they have also been involved in endurance car racing as well as supplying engines to the A1GP series from 2004 to 2008.
Judd supplied Formula One engines to March, Williams F1 and Ligier in 1988, scoring four podium results in their first season of competition. At the end of the 1992 season, Judd withdrew from F1 competition but John Judd entered into an agreement with Yamaha to continue production of his engines and in 1997 Damon Hill narrowly missed winning the Hungarian Grand Prix in a Yamaha-powered Arrows.
#76
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yes on 09 wing seen on the BMW as it is supposed to be able to increase a car's ability to follow closely, the car in front of it while the rear wing is supposed to decrease aero drag. Combined it is supposed to put more of an emphasis on mechanical rather than aerodynamic grip and therefore, more passing. Yeah, RIGHT!
#77
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Welcome to last week.
#79
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Interesting
I'm all for making things less predictable.
McLaren’s engineering boss Paddy Lowe expects the introduction of Kinetic Energy Recovery Systems (KERS) will shake up the pecking order from circuit-to-circuit in 2009.
Next year cars will be allowed to run with KERS units to recover and store kinetic energy under deceleration and then use it as a boost to aid overtaking.
Lowe believes KERS will provide a greater advantage at some circuits over others, and as a result, the order at the front could change from race-to-race depending on which team has developed the best system and whether it suits the track.
“Certainly, the variation from circuit to circuit will be different,” he told McLaren’s official website.
“Also KERS will have more authority at some tracks than at others – so the pecking order from circuit to circuit may change a little bit.”
Lowe added that building a good KERS unit will be about reducing weight and making it more efficient rather than producing power, which will be capped at around 80bhp.
Many teams are already concerned that KERS will push the basic weight of their cars closer to the 600kg minimum, restricting the ability to adjust weight distribution with movable ballast.
As a result, Lowe believes the main battleground for KERS development will be on reducing weight and optimising its integration with the car’s set-up.
“There will definitely be constant development of the KERS device through the year,” said Lowe.
“One thing to bear in mind is that the ultimate idealised performance benefit of KERS is capped – because it’s limited in power and energy.
“So assuming you’ve delivered to that cap, you’re looking more into the domains of doing it for less weight or doing it more efficiently or more reliably.”
Next year cars will be allowed to run with KERS units to recover and store kinetic energy under deceleration and then use it as a boost to aid overtaking.
Lowe believes KERS will provide a greater advantage at some circuits over others, and as a result, the order at the front could change from race-to-race depending on which team has developed the best system and whether it suits the track.
“Certainly, the variation from circuit to circuit will be different,” he told McLaren’s official website.
“Also KERS will have more authority at some tracks than at others – so the pecking order from circuit to circuit may change a little bit.”
Lowe added that building a good KERS unit will be about reducing weight and making it more efficient rather than producing power, which will be capped at around 80bhp.
Many teams are already concerned that KERS will push the basic weight of their cars closer to the 600kg minimum, restricting the ability to adjust weight distribution with movable ballast.
As a result, Lowe believes the main battleground for KERS development will be on reducing weight and optimising its integration with the car’s set-up.
“There will definitely be constant development of the KERS device through the year,” said Lowe.
“One thing to bear in mind is that the ultimate idealised performance benefit of KERS is capped – because it’s limited in power and energy.
“So assuming you’ve delivered to that cap, you’re looking more into the domains of doing it for less weight or doing it more efficiently or more reliably.”
#80
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me too but worry KERS is gonna really hurt someone, like during refueling when static discharge may occur