Subleasing and Foreclosure

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Old Jan 26, 2011 | 05:15 PM
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Subleasing and Foreclosure

I'm currently subleasing this condo unit in downtown LA. Yesterday, when I got back home from work, found a legal document on the front door. (NOTICE OF TRUSTEE'S SALE) It said, if I'm the sub-leaser, I'll have to leave the property within 60 days AFTER a new owner gets selected and contacts me.

I guess the owner wasn't paying the mortgage. My contract with the owner will end within 2 months.

Do I stop paying the rent to him? I'm probably not going to get my deposit back from the owner at this point, correct? Would I have any credit issue due to not paying my rent bill to the owner?

What do I do? Please help! Thank you guys.
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Old Jan 26, 2011 | 07:30 PM
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Interesting question...Not sure.how do you pay the current owner? through a company? or a direct check?

Better question...are you paying the owner? Or the main lessee?

How many months rent of a deposit does he have?

I'd try and phone a local lawyer that deals with foreclosures and see what they have to say.

In the meantime...I'd start looking to move ASAP. I mean who knows how it will take to get a new owner, and you have 60 days after that...and the new owner may want potentially keep renting to you...so it could be good amount of time. But is it worth dealing with the headache and uncertainty?
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Old Jan 26, 2011 | 09:01 PM
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This has been a big topic during one of the radio talk shows I listen to.

You are still legally obligated to pay your land lord rent, BUT, more likely than not if you stop paying rent no legal action will be taken against you. Because the property is going into foreclosure, the chances that the land lord doesn't have your deposit are very high.

Also, don't worry about being kicked out any time soon. This process usually takes a loooooooooonnnnnnnngggggg time.
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Old Jan 27, 2011 | 01:20 AM
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You get to decide if you want to honor your contract. I mean that the landlord is entitled to the rent as long as he owns the place but may or may not come after you. If you honestly feel that you would deserve your deposit back you could announce that it may be used for your final months rent. Your rental contract probably says that you can't do this however.

If the property is foreclosed on the lender or Fannie Mae will likely want you to move out. They are generally not set up to be property managers. There may be a financial incentive for you to move quickly (they might offer to pay you to leave).

The right thing to do imho is to continue to pay your rent and move out ASAP. You have to decide what you want to do about the deposit. The state website ca.gov has a tenant handbook and other info that you may find useful. I would not count on it being many months before they move forward with foreclosure and eviction.

Also, as Sarlacc asked, who exactly are you paying, owner, initial lesee, management company?

Last edited by MR1; Jan 27, 2011 at 01:24 AM.
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Old Jan 27, 2011 | 01:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Sarlacc
Interesting question...Not sure.how do you pay the current owner? through a company? or a direct check?

Better question...are you paying the owner? Or the main lessee?

How many months rent of a deposit does he have?

I'd try and phone a local lawyer that deals with foreclosures and see what they have to say.

In the meantime...I'd start looking to move ASAP. I mean who knows how it will take to get a new owner, and you have 60 days after that...and the new owner may want potentially keep renting to you...so it could be good amount of time. But is it worth dealing with the headache and uncertainty?

A direct check to the owner

1 month rent deposit

I'll start looking other places soon, but I'm still not decided on whether or not to pay the rest of year. I'm almost sure that I'm not getting my deposit back.

It's pretty messed up that the owner didn't call to say sorry or at least let me know about this earlier. How many months do you have to not pay the mortgage to get to this point usually?

I'm going to try to contact a local lawyer tomorrow..
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Old Jan 27, 2011 | 01:35 PM
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Sorry for your problem. It's pretty F'd up that this happened since your rent should be covering his mortgage payment. If it's not, then he's an idiot.
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Old Jan 27, 2011 | 03:10 PM
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^ Exactly... that was my point!
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Old Jan 27, 2011 | 03:15 PM
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Originally Posted by JS + MS3
I'll start looking other places soon, but I'm still not decided on whether or not to pay the rest of year. I'm almost sure that I'm not getting my deposit back.

It's pretty messed up that the owner didn't call to say sorry or at least let me know about this earlier. How many months do you have to not pay the mortgage to get to this point usually?
My practical suggestion [CAVEAT: which is also a breach of your lease] is to pay the rent except for the amount covered by the deposit, i.e. don't pay for the last month.

Technically, you will be in breach of the lease contract. However, the security deposit is used to reimburse the owner for repairs of any damage by the tenant, and the current owner won't be doing any repairs in light of a foreclosure sale.

A foreclosure sale will not normally occur until a borrower has missed several months' payment, so your rent money was probably not being used to pay the loan.
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Old Jan 27, 2011 | 03:16 PM
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So you are leasing, not sub-leasing....correct?
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Old Jan 27, 2011 | 03:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Will Y.
My practical suggestion [CAVEAT: which is also a breach of your lease] is to pay the rent except for the amount covered by the deposit, i.e. don't pay for the last month.

Technically, you will be in breach of the lease contract. However, the security deposit is used to reimburse the owner for repairs of any damage by the tenant, and the current owner won't be doing any repairs in light of a foreclosure sale.

A foreclosure sale will not normally occur until a borrower has missed several months' payment, so your rent money was probably not being used to pay the loan.
Got it!

Thank you very much for your help..

Originally Posted by Moog-Type-S
So you are leasing, not sub-leasing....correct?
Oops, yes.. leasing!
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Old Jan 27, 2011 | 03:29 PM
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Before May 20, 2009, most renters lost their leases upon foreclosure. The rule in most states was that if the mortgage was recorded before the lease was signed, a foreclosure wiped out the lease (this rule is known as "first in time, first in right"). Because most leases last no longer than a year, it was all too common for the mortgage to predate the lease and destroy it upon foreclosure.

These rules changed dramatically on May 20, 2009, when President Obama signed the "Protecting Tenants at Foreclosure Act of 2009." This legislation provided that leases would survive a foreclosure -- meaning the tenant could stay at least until the end of the lease, and that month-to-month tenants would be entitled to 90 days' notice before having to move out (this notice period is longer than any state's non-foreclosure notice period, a real boon to tenants).

An exception was carved out for the buyer who intends to live on the property -- this buyer may terminate a lease with 90 days' notice. Importantly, the law provides that any state legislation that is more generous to tenants will not be preempted by the federal law. These protections apply to Section 8 tenants, too.

Importantly, tenants who live in cities with rent control "just cause" eviction protection are also protected from terminations at the hands of an acquiring bank or new owner. These tenants can rely on their ordinance's list of allowable, or "just causes," for termination. Because a change of ownership, without more, does not justify a termination, the fact that the change occurred through foreclosure will not justify a termination.
http://www.nolo.com/legal-encycloped...cle-30064.html
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Old Jan 27, 2011 | 03:38 PM
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Originally Posted by JS + MS3
Got it!

Thank you very much for your help..





OP's lease ends within two months on its own terms, so it won't have to be terminated by new ownership anyway.
The new owner has also given notice that the lease will not be renewed, so OP will still need to find a new place.
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Old Jan 27, 2011 | 03:40 PM
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That's what I get for not reading.

So the OP was out anyway....the only "big deal" is maybe not getting the security deposit back.
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Old Jan 27, 2011 | 03:51 PM
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praying this comes out right for you man! There is more and more of this happening, so there should be a number a resources you can tap into to get out of this smoothly and into another place with no changes to your zip code or credit report...
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Old Jan 27, 2011 | 03:53 PM
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Old Jan 27, 2011 | 05:28 PM
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All true and all well and good.
Question is at what point is the tenant legally notified? I know of at least one case where the tenant has been told that they were given legal notice when the NOD was posted on the door. The 90 day period began on that date.
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Old Feb 24, 2011 | 11:30 AM
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Just a little update:

I did talk to the bank agent and told them I will need at least a month and a half to look for a new place. They are offering cash for me to leave early. I don't know how much yet, but they said they will let me know the exact amount by the end of today, so I'm just waiting on that.

If it's less than a sum of 60 days of my place's current rent, then I'm just going to tell him to make this an eviction. Because I talked to my lawyer and I guess they will have to send me an eviction notice first then wait 60 days to kick me out.
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Old Feb 28, 2011 | 05:32 PM
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UPDATE:

The Fannie Mae is offering $ 2,070 under the condition of us moving out of the condo on March 31st.

I think we are going to take this cash for key deal since we found a new place, which is going to be ready to be moved in on the same day.

The agent is going to email me the form about this whole thing and I'm going to send it to my lawyer to make sure we are not getting ripped off.

Hope everything goes well.

Oh yeah, the previous owner was nice enough to return the full amount of our security deposit. That was unexpected.
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Old Feb 28, 2011 | 05:40 PM
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@ The Fannie Mae.

Is that anything like The Ben Bernanke?
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Old Feb 28, 2011 | 06:31 PM
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I would ask for cash or at least a check drawn on a local bank. Try to cash them at the bank they are drawn from. I'd be a little scared to deposit to my account.
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Old Feb 28, 2011 | 06:33 PM
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Yeah, I'm kinda scared since this is the first time something like this happened to me and my gf.
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Old Feb 28, 2011 | 10:54 PM
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Originally Posted by JS + MS3
UPDATE:

The Fannie Mae is offering $ 2,070 under the condition of us moving out of the condo on March 31st.
...Oh yeah, the previous owner was nice enough to return the full amount of our security deposit. That was unexpected.
Conrats! That's a great deal for you.
It sounds like the owner didn't want to screw you over.

Take the $$ and by 3/31!
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Old Mar 26, 2011 | 02:58 PM
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Hi guys,

so we are finally moving out on next saturday. the agent for the bank is coming to meet us on the move out day.

anyway one question, this cabinet was here when we first moved in. i think the previous owner just left here for us to use it. what should i do with this now that the previous owner is just gone. should i just leave it or take it? if the bank is going to remodel the property anyway, i would just take this it and might as well use it.



what do you guys think? should I just leave it or take it?
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Old Mar 26, 2011 | 03:02 PM
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one thing I should mention it to you guys is that last week, i got a mail saying the property is going under eviction. so i called the agent and asked what this letter is about. And he said i shouldn't worry about it at all and it's just a back up plan in case me and my gf decide to change our mind in the last minute.

is this something that i should be worried about?
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Old Mar 26, 2011 | 06:37 PM
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Originally Posted by JS + MS3
...anyway one question, this cabinet was here when we first moved in. i think the previous owner just left here for us to use it. what should i do with this now that the previous owner is just gone. should i just leave it or take it?
I'd check with the prior owner first.
Otherwise, if the cabinet is a fixture, i.e. attached to the wall/condo, you should leave it.
Originally Posted by JS + MS3
one thing I should mention it to you guys is that last week, i got a mail saying the property is going under eviction. so i called the agent and asked what this letter is about.
Is it a letter or a summons and complaint?
If it's a letter, then does it say, "notice to quit?" It may be that, which is a necessary step to filing an eviction action.
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Old Mar 26, 2011 | 08:03 PM
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If you want the cabinet I think you should take it. It will likely be tossed when they clean the place up. There will be no inventory for things like that and it has little/no value imho.

Why are you worried about a commitment from Fannie Mae for a check? Hope all is in writing and move forward.

Last edited by MR1; Mar 26, 2011 at 08:06 PM.
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Old Mar 26, 2011 | 08:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Will Y.
I'd check with the prior owner first.
Otherwise, if the cabinet is a fixture, i.e. attached to the wall/condo, you should leave it.

Is it a letter or a summons and complaint?
If it's a letter, then does it say, "notice to quit?" It may be that, which is a necessary step to filing an eviction action.
Got it. I'll call up the owner and ask.

It's not attached to the wall. It's just one of those customizable cabinet from IKEA.

It's just not just a letter, it's a stack of papers.

It says "SUMMONS (CITACION JUDICIAL) UNLAWFUL DTAINER - EVICTION"
Notice to defendat: "previous owner's name"
YOU ARE BEING SUED BY PLAINTIff: Federal National Mortgage Association

So, I called Federal National Mortgage Association and told the representative that I'm just a tenant. And she said she wanted a copy of lease agreement. I faxed it out and she said she got it and I shouldn't worry about it.

Originally Posted by MR1
If you want the cabinet I think you should take it. It will likely be tossed when they clean the place up. There will be no inventory for things like that and it has little/no value imho.

Why are you worried about a commitment from Fannie Mae for a check? Hope all is in writing and move forward.
The agent from Fannie Mae is not email me a copy of the writing, he always says he's too busy and tells me not to worry about it. He says he's going to give me a check when he meets me on the move out day.

Do they usually write me a check? Because he doesn't even know my full name.
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Old Mar 26, 2011 | 08:40 PM
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Originally Posted by JS + MS3
It says "SUMMONS (CITACION JUDICIAL) UNLAWFUL DTAINER - EVICTION"
Notice to defendat: "previous owner's name"
...
The agent from Fannie Mae is not email me a copy of the writing, he always says he's too busy and tells me not to worry about it. He says he's going to give me a check when he meets me on the move out day.
You will be fine if you move out next week. If you don't, the bank can go forward with the eviction immediately thereafter without adding your name into the lawsuit.

BTW, is the key money still being given to you by the bank?
A prior post mentioned key money if you move out on or before 3/31, but next Saturday is 4/2.
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Old Mar 26, 2011 | 08:46 PM
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Got it.

I changed the date couple weeks ago since we wanted to move out on Saturday. I notified the agent and he said that's fine. And yes, the key money is given to us by the bank.
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Old Mar 27, 2011 | 11:11 PM
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Originally Posted by JS + MS3
The agent from Fannie Mae is not email me a copy of the writing, he always says he's too busy and tells me not to worry about it. He says he's going to give me a check when he meets me on the move out day.

Do they usually write me a check? Because he doesn't even know my full name.
Not sure. I do know that not everyone tells the truth. I would make it my business to get something in writing before I move. Even if you have to make a trip to his office. This way there in no confusion about what is supposed to happen and when. At this point what assurance do you have?
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