Scrib

@ fdl

2001AudiS4

So I would guess it specifies that you have to have the neutral facing up then?

svtmike

Don't think so... all of mine are hot side up and I'm in the same region as scrib.

2001AudiS4

That's weird. You would think if they require you to put the outlets horizontal that they would make sure you had the neutral up and not the hot. When we install tv's we always put the outlets horizontal above the mounting plate and always put the neutral up just in case of the .0001% chance someone drops a metal plate or something right in that spot. Better safe then sorry I guess.

Scottman111

Copper pipe for what, exactly?


And I have never heard of that horizontal outlet code in IL. I thought we had some retarded code around here


Although, honestly, the horizontal code makes more sense than the conduit code you guys have. But in the end, they are both just ways for people to make more money off of consumers...

svtmike

Pressure side piping in the walls. PVC is only used for drains in my home.

Scrib

yih... Copper for all water. PVC for drains.


Conduit does have its place. You can certainly make an argument whether it's needed in residential homes, but it does serve a purpose.

soopa

Copper supply lines is a pretty common code country wide, mainly because there was no real alternative until recently.

My new house has all PEX (one of the few in the area that I've seen), and I really like it. It allows plumbing to be installed more like electrical could be, all home runs in a star configuration. Makes a lot more sense then copper cut in and fed from any number of places inside your walls.

But, time will tell.

Scrib

The PEX installs I've seen have looked like SHIT, though (blame it on the contractor, not the material). Probably 3 times cheaper... Copper is very expensive currently.

soopa

It will never look as pretty as copper. It's flexible, for one, so it will always appear loose versus the tight look of copper. It's often installed in a home run configuration, which means a lot more material is used and a lot more is visible at the distribution point versus copper which might only have 4 main lines, with many branches at various locations hidden throughout the house.

Not to mention the visible hardware, it could never look as pretty as a clean solder.

That said, is it really about looks?

It's definitely cheaper then copper, but copper isn't expensive because it's a superior plumbing material. It's not one of those things where because it costs more it means its better.

I think the fact that PEX is cheaper (which allows it to be installed in a more logical and well planned manner) is a big plus.

soopa

Also, keep in mind, it wasn't too long ago that people were having these same debates about cast iron verse PVC for drain lines.

Would you ever even consider using cast iron today?

Scottman111

Oh okay, that's what I thought but wasn't sure. I know my Dad did all of our plumbing in PVC and we've yet to have any trouble in all of its 15 years.




And I definitely agree that conduit is very necessary, but I think there's a line between where it's needed and where it's just a waste of time/money.

After everything I saw in my five years of wiring houses, the only real justifiable benefit of conduit is the protection from people driving long nails/screws or sawing into their wall.

I can't think of any other real benefits off the top of my head, but I'm open for suggestions.