Brock70

Hello,

I was driving around and saw this place with a lot of wheels for sale so I stopped to check it out. I saw some 'vossen' for sale and was quoted 800 with used tires, I decided to look up which these were and saw the picture on the official Vossen website and something feels off. So I'm wondering if you guys can determine if these are fake, or if you could tell me how I can check further.




I'm pretty sure these are suppose to be cv7s? Correct me if i'm wrong.




Thanks in advance !

teh CL

iTrader: (1)

Seems pretty cheap for brand new Vossen's, let alone with tires

wackjum

Well for one thing it is missing that embossed VOSSEN logo on the wheel itself.

Brock70

That was the first thing I noticed which made me wonder

teh CL

iTrader: (1)

Yea its def fake. Also missing the chamfered edges on the spokes

thoiboi

Just ask them!

teh CL

iTrader: (1)

Just

csmeance

Most Vossens are cheap low pressure cast wheels priced in the forged rim territory. No wonder fakes/replicas are being offered! Stick with a better brand.

Brock70

Personally I wasn't going for Vossens, just saw these so had to pull over and check it out. Almost went for it but figured something felt wrong. I'm still looking for some rims for my 07 Accord

myron

iTrader: (4)

yea I am with you, probably better to buy those replicas since the quality will probably be the same and price will be thousands less

wackjum

After owning a lot of cars and wheels, I am tired of after-market. It doesn't matter if they are genuine or not. They are designed for looks first and durability second. They just don't hold up to real world use. Give me OEM. Or if the OEM wheels look terrible, hopefully you can swap with OEMs from a different model, different year, or up and down the lineup.

usdmJON

Being the honorary Vossen Hater I figure I'll jump in and throw my 2 cents around.

Very wrong. Those replicas are likely not tested to be safe by ANYONE. At least Vossens do meet the TUV standards for their wheels. If a company is shitty enough to not want their name on their product then chances are you cant trust it. Id put my money on real Vossens holding up longer than those reps.

You serious bro? You clearly buy cheap ass wheels then. You get what you research and clearly you didnt research wheels before purchasing if you can make such a wrong and sweeping claim.
My Work wheels are aftermarket, forged, and would run circles around 99% of the OEM wheels currently on 2016 model vehicles.

wackjum

Yes I'm serious.

How do they run circles around OEMs? Looks? Lighter weight? Stronger? They're not stronger, I can tell you that. It is a matter of physics. Big wheels with thin spokes just aren't going to be as durable as chunky ones.

usdmJON

Lighter than comparable size wheels, yes... look better IMO at least.
But that's up for interpretation.


And yes, much much stronger. Fck your physics. lmao My wheels are forged splitrims not just some cast monoblocks.

Stronger wouldn't be the best term used as I'm not entirely sure on the give point of cast verse a solid grain. I'd assume the solid grain would hold longer but what I know for sure is cast snaps while forged aluminum bends much further before snapping which makes them far more durable. Further more, they are split rims. The outer barrel and inner barrel are two pieces both separate from the face. Which means in case on part is ruined, most commonly the inner barrel gets bent, you can either attempt to bend it back or just replace the inner barrel. While on a cast wheel it will fracture and you could possible have a major loss of air.

knight rider

iTrader: (1)

I love Vossens. I hate you. All jokes aside, I didn't know that. I would actually love to have some Vossen CVTs on my G37 (coupe). BUT, I can't peel off that much dough on wheels. AND, I can only imagine how livid I'd be if they got scratched. Also, my OEMs look great (IMO). Now I can add to my excuse list that Vossens are actually cheaply made? Forget what I said about you earlier.

edit: OP - Who knows. I suppose one would have to look inside of the wheel to find out.

wackjum

Physics is the one true constant we have in this universe. That's the theory anyway.

Forged is stronger than cast. But for wheel manufacturers, it means they can get away with using less material in their designs. A forged wheel would be stronger than a cast wheel of the same design. It doesn't mean all forged wheels are automatically stronger than all cast wheels.

I was trying to give some real practical advice for the OP who is shopping for wheels on a budget. You may have a set of nice wheels. Good for you. But most wheels aren't as well made and really just aren't worth the hassle.

You could have asked for my experience and saw where I was coming from before just dismissing what I'm saying. But since we're here playing e-peen, I had a set of 360° Forged 3 piece wheels for the 911 that cracked. Those wheels were $6,500 (MSRP, I didn't get them for that).

I've also had a set of HREs. Those are another mid-high end wheel and those cracked. Plus both the 360 and HRE wheels had the most ridiculous valve stem setup that made it difficult to check pressure and air up.

My friend's Vossens on his Audi R8 cracked. I also had another friend with ADV1 wheels on his 458 Italia that cracked.

A 5Zigen wheel on my CL was bent and had to be fixed.

Plus if it is a newer car, you either have to put up with the TPMS light, or find a set of compatible wheels.

I'm not denying that aftermarket wheels look better. But at this point, I have better things to worry about than to deal with aftermarkets. And if they're budget aftermarkets, it is definitely not worth the hassle and risk.

cu2wagon

wackjum... what are you doing to those poor, poor wheels?

You are a wheel murderer.

But sort of serious; how hard are you driving those wheels and do you think that OEM would hold up given the conditions? Seems like you might be a bit more "aggressive" than most of us grocery store hard parkers.

wackjum

The CL is the daily. I think the wheel was bent going on Westpark Dr, Harwin, or Bellaire Blvd (I know you are from Houston so you'll know where I mean). It is 18" so a fairly conservative size. If it was 19s+ it probably would have cracked.

For the HRE and 360, the spokes cracked near the hub. I don't do burnouts or anything like that, but I do drive the cars hard and use their power. 500+ lb/ft of torque breaks wheels I guess. My friend with a GTR cracked the wheels he had from his G37. For the R8 and 458 that my friends had, the cracks were on the wheel portion, which usually means hitting a curb or pothole.

AZuser

Only their forged line that they make at their Florida factory meets TUV (according to Vossen website). This is a CV7 rep. Their low pressure cast CV line isn't TUV, but may be VIA and JWL certified, and manufacturing is outsourced. . . . maybe to Hong Chi Alloy Industry Co. Ltd ?



Real CV7's vs these. I wouldn't be surprised if they came from the same factory which means they'd be manufactured to the exact same specs (minus Vossen logo) and would be the same quality.

For example, Shandong Vesteon Automotive Parts(Group) Co.,Ltd is a contract manufacturer. They're TUV and VIA certified.


You can contract with them to design and manufacture wheels for you. If Vossen has contracted with them, then they'd still have the design and manufacturing plans. This would explain why you can buy CVT reps from them for cheap. Or the plans were "$hared" with this manufacturer by the original contract manufacturer.

https://www.alibaba.com/product-deta...857.0.0.zjsnvx

usdmJON

Let it be known i stuck up for vossen. Tell mike chan im not the ome hating anymore! Lol lol maybe you didmt see that incident but i asked Mike to prove to us if vossens are tuv certified or not. After making a comment her perceived as a threat he took actiom and supplied pics showing at least the TUV markings on some vossens at his dealer before the percision line was released.

Im not saying your wrong or im right. I dont know shit about vossen aside from i think they are ugly and over priced. Lol

usdmJON

While you are correct it's not that big of a deal. My wheel face design doesnt have any less meat than a TL waffle and I'm 100% sure it is stronger.

IMO good wheels are 100% worth the hassle. A good wheel can make or break a car both in looks and performance. I get what you were doing and definite kudos for that. But you told OP flat out not to buy aftermarket parts because they wont have as long of a life or be as durable as an OEM part. That simply can not be any further than the truth. Sure buy shit parts they have a shit life span. But buy good quality parts and they will exceed OEM parts in both life-time and performance.

Wheels, tires, bushings, bolts, everything on these god damn Acuras can easily be replaced with a better more quality part. This is Acura/Honda we are talking about. Point at any part and I'll google search a better replacement for it that is either stronger, lighter, more durable, or a combination of the 3.

Your friend is a moron for putting Vossens on an Audi anything let alone an R8 and should have his license taken from him.

Even companies like ADV1 have cast options so I mean if your buddy was dumb enough to throw Vossens on an R8 and he obviously has cash to throw away sure fuck it he may have thrown cast ADV1s on his Italia. Again. Your 5 instances of nice wheels don't speak for all quality wheels and may just speak of your own experiences.

5Zigen has forged options but most people dont spend that kind of money on 5zigen wheels. Maybe you did for all I know. But frankly all the wheels you mentioned have cast options and I have seen way too many times someone brag about their AG wheels saying AG makes high end shit but they went and bought cast AGs. So frankly for all I know those could have been all cast wheels. Or not. But your personally experience on 5 wheels goes against what the rest of the community and industry say.

As well wtf about the TPMS sensor? Seriously man. ANY wheel can have a TPMS band wrapped around it. My wheels were discontinued in early 2000. They were never fitted for TPMS sensors. All you have to do is wrap a sensor band around the barrel and you are 100.



I can say though without a doubt that OEM cast wheels would have cracked under the same situation as the above wheels. If not then there was obviously an issue with all of the wheels mentioned above. Wheels dont just crack. Forged wheels even less. That's why the fucking make forged wheels. lol

wackjum

I'm not going to argue. You seem hellbent on proving me wrong and even expanded my comments to all aftermarket parts. Really? Have you seen my vehicles? Most are chock full of aftermarket parts. My personal experience is what led me to say I'm done with aftermarket wheels, and I was sharing my personal experience.

Somehow all of my personal experience and first hand observations mean nothing, but your single good experience outweighs everything? Get a car with real horsepower. Actually take it out and open it up. Drive on the crappy roads we have out here.

thoiboi

Usdumbdumb has been #triggered...

D's Up

Who cares if the wheel's real or not? In real life scenarios, I much prefer a rep or cheaper wheel over a more expensive brand. I'd be infuriated if I curbed the more expensive wheel, even moreso if I bent it. In my opinion, as long as the wheel design looks good and you can fit some decent rubber on there then you're good. Meaty tire > hellamadflushOffsetzYO!

Brock70

They were trying to sell them off as real vossens which is why I was wondering. I'm debating if I still want them, or if I should just go for some HFP accord wheels.

Thanks to everyone for their input, this forum is waay more active than any honda forums I'm on..

VR1

^I would go HFP over reps. If you're talking about the 19" HFP 10 spoke wheels I have seen those in person and they are very nice.

As for OEM wheels those are not manufactured by the manufacturer of the car anyways. The wheels on my Acura are made by Enkei, the E92 M3 wheels are BBS/Fuchs etc..

D's Up

If you can swing the HFP wheels, I'd pick those. But I don't think it would be all bad if you got the faux-senns either. All depends on your budget. Good luck.

usdmJON

It's just a debate. We have two opposing experiences so it's natural you and I both want to prove our experience is going to be more common. If you don't want to argue then frankly maybe you shouldn't be in a forum making claims like:

That is not true. Not even half the time. Your claim makes it sound like my aftermarket wheels aren't as strong as the OEM wheels they replaced. This is completely wrong. You are telling OP that no matter what aftermarket wheel he buys they wont last as long as his OEM ones. Again, that is completely wrong. So pardon me for trying to correct misinformation. Apologies for making your argument out to be about more than just wheels but IMO all parts at the same. You have shitty companies that make bad parts or replica parts that fail in comparison and you have great companies that make great highly durable parts to replace your OEM parts with. Wheels, exhaust, bushings, electronics, all come down to if you dont do enough research you can spend more money on a shitty part or spend sometimes a comparable amount for a far better part. It takes research and knowledge. IMO that is worlds better advice than "dont buy aftermarket because it wont last."

Your personal experience does mean something but frankly, I can list off all the wheels my friends have owned that have never cracked and my list would be 8 times as long as yours. So I mean, I'm trying to argue here personal experience aside because frankly I dont know all the factors your friends were involved with when their wheel cracked. Hell like I said they could all have been cast wheels by the companies youve mentioned so a crack wouldnt be entirely unheard of there. Again, I'm not trying to devalue your and your buddies personal experience but what I do know is my own experience opposes yours and I know all the factors in my experience so Im left questioning your own.

So let me get this straight.... you have good experience with aftermarket parts except for aftermarket wheels? I've personally only owned 3 sets of wheels in my life that werent OEM. Two cast monoblocks, 1 forged 3 piece set. None have ever cracked.

usdmJON

Do you wear fake Jordans? Do you buy your girl fake jewelry? Some of us take pride in owning something that is either authentic, well crafted, high end, or a combo of the three. IMO if you cant afford a high end wheel no issue going mid range and picking up something from TSW, Konig, and even Vossen. Though many will say those are even too expensive brand new which would then make me say well you cant afford wheels then. There is obviously a lower range and IMO you deal with scary wheels then. A company like TSW, Konig, Vossen, ETC at least stand by their name and if you are using them properly and they damage your car you can fight that. Jump on some DRAG or ROTA wheels cant fat chances getting in contact with the "company" if anything goes wrong.

IMO having a more expensive brand wheel in no way infuriates me more when I curb it. As you have said, as long as you like the design you are good. So the cost of the damaged wheel doesnt matter. In the end you still have visibly damaged wheels. Car still looks just as jank with the curbed wheels, the expense of the wheel doesnt matter.

Where the expense of the wheel matters is when you really damage it.
Typically you take a light impact and a cast wheel needs to be bent back if possible. Forged you know can be bent back under minor impact.
Take a heavier impact and a cast wheel will fracture much much sooner. Resulting in possible loss of air leaving your car on the ground.
Under circumstances where a cast wheel must be replaced you can just bend a forged wheel back. If you truly can not bend it back you can just replace whatever lip was bent often costing half or even less than what a brand new wheel costs. Also keep in mind if you refinish your wheels the reps now wont match while just replacing a polished lip doesnt matter will. And if its an inner then it doesnt matter. Much cheaper.

I get some people don't want to spend a lot on wheels.That is fine. At that point I would consider how much OP wants to spend. If 1000$ is too much then Id argee with Wackjum and say stay with OEM as any brand new wheel you buy for less than $1000 is going to be cheap and probably not as strong as the OEM wheel. If OP wants to spend around $1000 I would say dont buy brand new and instead look for used wheels like I did with my Work VSMX. You can get a set of wheels worth over 3G brand new for only 1G. If OP needs brand new then you want to save upwards of $1200 and look at brands like TSW, Konig, Vossen, AG, etc etc and buy a cast wheel. Those then will fall in like with what Wackjum said, depending on design could be stronger or weaker. You take that risk.

In the end though I only spent 1000$ before refurbishment for my wheels. They didnt need to be refurbished but I wanted a brand new color and go with gunmetal over gold. They are discontinued right now so there is no brand new price. They are nearly identical to Work VSXX. Same material, same forged quality, same company. Difference is the MX have a hexbolt/lug cover to cover the lug nuts with a more OG style hex nut and the spoke design goes over the hardware around the side verse ending before it like the XX do. So price wise they are exact matches. They go for 3G brand new easy.

IMO if you can check out a private seller's wheels check for any recent refurbishment and ask about it. If they are original color then you can check if there are any fractures. You can easily roll the fender on some carpet or a smooth floor to check for bends. This route can net you some expensive wheels for cheap.

My run down

-1000= cant afford wheels unless you find a great used sale
1000= look for used wheels
+1200= look at mid range companies or used wheels

Persoally Id never really suggest brand new wheels like Work or Volk unless you want to spend 1g per wheel. Go used though and you can get a wheel that costs 1G per for less than half.

usdmJON

I like to talk about wheels.

cu2wagon

I fuxxing love this place!

usdmJON

thoiboi

You're just predictable is all. I saw this and thought, "Jon is coming..."

usdmJON

Oh I bet. When I saw the thread my initial reaction was "Where has this been all my life?!" But hey I didnt start with vossen hate which Im sure most people expected. A month from now Im sure I'll say something about Vossen and someone else will comment how Im just a Vossen hater.

thoiboi

Nah, just the most vocal here

usdmJON

I like to hear myself talk... er type.

Mr Marco

70% of people don't even know how to check the tread depth on thier tires, let alone spot a fake wheel. Wonder how many people buy these POS Chinese knock-off's. Idiots!

Eh-um, now that I think about it, I once bought a "Rolex" for $200.

UA6

I wouldn't waste my time with Vossens. They're cheap cast wheels to begin with and plus since they're low priced, a lot of people will have them. I had some back in the day and regretted ever buying them.

csmeance

FYI, you can crack and bend any sort of rim on any car, it just takes a hard enough impact.

All of these wheel designs go though computer stress testing to find where weak points may be and so on. That info is NEVER really passed onto the consumer and we just take companies at their word. One wheel maker (SEVAS) had rims that were shattering on folk's cars while driving and it killed a few folks. Most people believe what they got would be perfect to hold up their heavy SUV but sadly it wasn't. Blame goes to the wheel maker here.

Friend of mine bent one of his monoblock forged wheels in miami a month ago after hitting a serious pothole and blowing out his tire. I'm not sure if it was repairable but had it been a cheap quality wheel it would have cracked into pieces. Blame goes to him for not avoiding the pothole.

Rick_TL-S

I definitely get your side of the argument. However, I think a lot of this does come down to the manufacturers.

Companies like ADV1, Vossen, etc. are definitely more situated for looks then heavy duty use. But, I wouldn't write off the entire aftermarket world due to some unfortunate experiences. I think companies like BBS, Volk, & Enkei definitely build an aftermarket wheel on par with any OEM wheel which would explain why a lot of manufacturers source them to build their wheels. The wheels on the GS-F/RC-Fs at work for example, are outsourced to BBS (which is why they're $3,000 in-house to replace a set). And I think Enkei has had their hands in all sorts of manufacturer wheels.

Then you have a rare selection of smaller, exotic manufacturers like Mosler (along with a couple Superbike teams) that used Dymag-built wheels on their vehicles.