Opinions on E36 M3!!!!!!!!
03-16-2004, 10:17 PM
#1
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Opinions on E36 M3!!!!!!!!
im askin for some opinions on the e36 m3, im lookin to sell the cl-s and get an m3 is it worth it in the long run etc.
Btw this is pretty much a continuation from the previous thread:
I think i might sell the CL-s, need advice
Btw this is pretty much a continuation from the previous thread:
I think i might sell the CL-s, need advice
03-16-2004, 11:12 PM
#3
What year E36 M3? The 1995 with the 3L are really cheap and tend to take mods really well. One thing I hate is the vader seats tend to wear quickly so a used one will probably have beat up leather seats.
The cars pretty reliable for a german car, most likely last well above 100k miles.
I would say if you can find one in really good condition go for it.
My cousin had one for awhile and it was a sweet car.
The cars pretty reliable for a german car, most likely last well above 100k miles.
I would say if you can find one in really good condition go for it.
My cousin had one for awhile and it was a sweet car.
03-17-2004, 12:01 AM
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Are you going to track the car? If not, then why bother? I rarely see an E36 M3 that makes me look twice. They're just so common around these parts...and almost always look stock.
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03-17-2004, 01:11 AM
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Originally posted by darrinb
keep the cl-s
keep the cl-s
there are things you will dislike about the e36. no car is perfect, except the ones that most of us can't afford.
03-17-2004, 02:24 AM
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I have both a cls and m3 e36. For handling I love the BMW, it handles like a dream and go like hell. The cls is much more comfortable ride and has a little more hp and is good in a straight line, but can not corner worth a dime compared to the M3 but the ride is a little more rough.
Just my two cents,
Bill
PS The up keep on the bimmer is a lot more, You take it into a garage and they feel you have money and they cn charge you what ever they want, it seems.
Just my two cents,
Bill
PS The up keep on the bimmer is a lot more, You take it into a garage and they feel you have money and they cn charge you what ever they want, it seems.
03-17-2004, 02:29 AM
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The two cars are completely different in alsmost every way. The CL-S is a big grand tourer, while the e36 M3 is a compact sports car.
I own both...a 2003 CL-S and a 98 M3:
The CL is my day-to-day car, although I am selling it to get a new TSX. The CL is modern comfortable, roomy, big, and nice on the highway.
The M3 is my track car, with only modifications being to the suspension (full track setup that I designed). The M3 is powerful, very quick, small, and handles amazingly well.
The CL never feels like it wants to do anything but be driven in a straight line. It does like big sweepers, but you have to push it through tight corners, transitions, and it doesn't like to use the brakes too much. The M3 loves to dance, and it hates going in straight lines at a constant speed.
So, it's really up to you. You won't be able to find an e36 in the same condition that you would be able to find a used 2002-2003 CL in (did I mention mine's for sale?), but they're THE BEST handling car you will ever find, and they're a blast to drive. Damn shame the new M3 is so bloated.
Oh, and as for the speed of the M3; it can routinely catch 952s, 911s, Z-06s, and a bunch of other cars once it is set up properly. Fast little car.
I own both...a 2003 CL-S and a 98 M3:
The CL is my day-to-day car, although I am selling it to get a new TSX. The CL is modern comfortable, roomy, big, and nice on the highway.
The M3 is my track car, with only modifications being to the suspension (full track setup that I designed). The M3 is powerful, very quick, small, and handles amazingly well.
The CL never feels like it wants to do anything but be driven in a straight line. It does like big sweepers, but you have to push it through tight corners, transitions, and it doesn't like to use the brakes too much. The M3 loves to dance, and it hates going in straight lines at a constant speed.
So, it's really up to you. You won't be able to find an e36 in the same condition that you would be able to find a used 2002-2003 CL in (did I mention mine's for sale?), but they're THE BEST handling car you will ever find, and they're a blast to drive. Damn shame the new M3 is so bloated.
Oh, and as for the speed of the M3; it can routinely catch 952s, 911s, Z-06s, and a bunch of other cars once it is set up properly. Fast little car.
03-17-2004, 06:53 AM
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I will try and give some advice here as best i can.
First the E36 m3's are a great car, No question about it. They have great speed, and handling, and braking capabilities. I have recently driven a lot of m3's on the track, and street and honestly felt that to be a great car for me. However, i ended up with a 2003 cl type s 6 speed.
In a comparison between the two, there are high's and low's on either side of the board. I find the cl type s 6 speed to have identical speed, acceraltion etc. The bmw E46 330ci is technically as fast or faster then the late e36 m3. The m3 has an advantage in the handling department over the cl, the cl weight distrubtion is an unfavorable 60/40 were the m3 is almost 50/50. Now in every day use this is really not a issue to consider, but if you visit a track you will notice that (although you can elevate some of this problem with an addition of a larger rear sway bar only). Basically the CL plows like a draught horse when pushed hard, where the m3 will at the limit wish its tail end to lead the way. Both cars require a very different driver style, with the cl being a bit on the side of get away with stupidity, and live to talk about it. Just depend on your experience i guess.
As for dependability, both score well. The earlier models of the E36 as mention above (the OBDI ) are the most tweakable. The OBDII verison are limited, but this dependant upon your plans. The E36 prior to i believe 97 have a water pump issue (plastic). As well, misshifts are common on the m3, due to the slopply transmission mount and clutch stop. Both are easly cured with mods from AA or UUC.
As well, after market rear sway bars on e36s are a big no no. It wasn't till 1999 that they put enough reinforcement in the rear sub frame to deal with the tearing out of the rear sway bar mounts.
I love the looks of the E36 m3. One dead sexy machine. Well worth the look if you can find a low mileage, good shape one. One this is that these cars are a cult car, therefore the resale value is somewhat high, and really expensive for the age of the vechicle. A lot of the cars have no warranty left, so expect to pay some bigger then normal service bills. THe price of parts are not as expensive as people think.
Anyhow this is longer then expected............
First the E36 m3's are a great car, No question about it. They have great speed, and handling, and braking capabilities. I have recently driven a lot of m3's on the track, and street and honestly felt that to be a great car for me. However, i ended up with a 2003 cl type s 6 speed.
In a comparison between the two, there are high's and low's on either side of the board. I find the cl type s 6 speed to have identical speed, acceraltion etc. The bmw E46 330ci is technically as fast or faster then the late e36 m3. The m3 has an advantage in the handling department over the cl, the cl weight distrubtion is an unfavorable 60/40 were the m3 is almost 50/50. Now in every day use this is really not a issue to consider, but if you visit a track you will notice that (although you can elevate some of this problem with an addition of a larger rear sway bar only). Basically the CL plows like a draught horse when pushed hard, where the m3 will at the limit wish its tail end to lead the way. Both cars require a very different driver style, with the cl being a bit on the side of get away with stupidity, and live to talk about it. Just depend on your experience i guess.
As for dependability, both score well. The earlier models of the E36 as mention above (the OBDI ) are the most tweakable. The OBDII verison are limited, but this dependant upon your plans. The E36 prior to i believe 97 have a water pump issue (plastic). As well, misshifts are common on the m3, due to the slopply transmission mount and clutch stop. Both are easly cured with mods from AA or UUC.
As well, after market rear sway bars on e36s are a big no no. It wasn't till 1999 that they put enough reinforcement in the rear sub frame to deal with the tearing out of the rear sway bar mounts.
I love the looks of the E36 m3. One dead sexy machine. Well worth the look if you can find a low mileage, good shape one. One this is that these cars are a cult car, therefore the resale value is somewhat high, and really expensive for the age of the vechicle. A lot of the cars have no warranty left, so expect to pay some bigger then normal service bills. THe price of parts are not as expensive as people think.
Anyhow this is longer then expected............
03-17-2004, 07:30 AM
#14
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Have you driven a e36 yet ?? If not then you really should. We can discuss the pros and cons forever, but the decision really comes down to what you feel more comfortable in.
You'd be getting into an older car, which isn't a problem for me, as I've always wanted a M2 (E10 with the s14 engine out of the e30)
You'd be getting into an older car, which isn't a problem for me, as I've always wanted a M2 (E10 with the s14 engine out of the e30)
03-17-2004, 11:13 AM
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Originally posted by EvanL
The two cars are completely different in alsmost every way. The CL-S is a big grand tourer, while the e36 M3 is a compact sports car.
I own both...a 2003 CL-S and a 98 M3:
The CL is my day-to-day car, although I am selling it to get a new TSX. The CL is modern comfortable, roomy, big, and nice on the highway.
The M3 is my track car, with only modifications being to the suspension (full track setup that I designed). The M3 is powerful, very quick, small, and handles amazingly well.
The CL never feels like it wants to do anything but be driven in a straight line. It does like big sweepers, but you have to push it through tight corners, transitions, and it doesn't like to use the brakes too much. The M3 loves to dance, and it hates going in straight lines at a constant speed.
So, it's really up to you. You won't be able to find an e36 in the same condition that you would be able to find a used 2002-2003 CL in (did I mention mine's for sale?), but they're THE BEST handling car you will ever find, and they're a blast to drive. Damn shame the new M3 is so bloated.
Oh, and as for the speed of the M3; it can routinely catch 952s, 911s, Z-06s, and a bunch of other cars once it is set up properly. Fast little car.
The two cars are completely different in alsmost every way. The CL-S is a big grand tourer, while the e36 M3 is a compact sports car.
I own both...a 2003 CL-S and a 98 M3:
The CL is my day-to-day car, although I am selling it to get a new TSX. The CL is modern comfortable, roomy, big, and nice on the highway.
The M3 is my track car, with only modifications being to the suspension (full track setup that I designed). The M3 is powerful, very quick, small, and handles amazingly well.
The CL never feels like it wants to do anything but be driven in a straight line. It does like big sweepers, but you have to push it through tight corners, transitions, and it doesn't like to use the brakes too much. The M3 loves to dance, and it hates going in straight lines at a constant speed.
So, it's really up to you. You won't be able to find an e36 in the same condition that you would be able to find a used 2002-2003 CL in (did I mention mine's for sale?), but they're THE BEST handling car you will ever find, and they're a blast to drive. Damn shame the new M3 is so bloated.
Oh, and as for the speed of the M3; it can routinely catch 952s, 911s, Z-06s, and a bunch of other cars once it is set up properly. Fast little car.
03-17-2004, 11:38 AM
#16
Suzuka Master
Originally posted by stu mccrea
I will try and give some advice here as best i can.
In a comparison between the two, there are high's and low's on either side of the board. I find the cl type s 6 speed to have identical speed, acceraltion etc. The bmw E46 330ci is technically as fast or faster then the late e36 m3. The m3 has an advantage in the handling department over the cl, the cl weight distrubtion is an unfavorable 60/40 were the m3 is almost 50/50. Now in every day use this is really not a issue to consider, but if you visit a track you will notice that (although you can elevate some of this problem with an addition of a larger rear sway bar only). Basically the CL plows like a draught horse when pushed hard, where the m3 will at the limit wish its tail end to lead the way. Both cars require a very different driver style, with the cl being a bit on the side of get away with stupidity, and live to talk about it. Just depend on your experience i guess.
As for dependability, both score well. The earlier models of the E36 as mention above (the OBDI ) are the most tweakable. The OBDII verison are limited, but this dependant upon your plans. The E36 prior to i believe 97 have a water pump issue (plastic). As well, misshifts are common on the m3, due to the slopply transmission mount and clutch stop. Both are easly cured with mods from AA or UUC.
As well, after market rear sway bars on e36s are a big no no. It wasn't till 1999 that they put enough reinforcement in the rear sub frame to deal with the tearing out of the rear sway bar mounts.
I love the looks of the E36 m3. One dead sexy machine. Well worth the look if you can find a low mileage, good shape one. One this is that these cars are a cult car, therefore the resale value is somewhat high, and really expensive for the age of the vechicle. A lot of the cars have no warranty left, so expect to pay some bigger then normal service bills. THe price of parts are not as expensive as people think.
Anyhow this is longer then expected............
I will try and give some advice here as best i can.
In a comparison between the two, there are high's and low's on either side of the board. I find the cl type s 6 speed to have identical speed, acceraltion etc. The bmw E46 330ci is technically as fast or faster then the late e36 m3. The m3 has an advantage in the handling department over the cl, the cl weight distrubtion is an unfavorable 60/40 were the m3 is almost 50/50. Now in every day use this is really not a issue to consider, but if you visit a track you will notice that (although you can elevate some of this problem with an addition of a larger rear sway bar only). Basically the CL plows like a draught horse when pushed hard, where the m3 will at the limit wish its tail end to lead the way. Both cars require a very different driver style, with the cl being a bit on the side of get away with stupidity, and live to talk about it. Just depend on your experience i guess.
As for dependability, both score well. The earlier models of the E36 as mention above (the OBDI ) are the most tweakable. The OBDII verison are limited, but this dependant upon your plans. The E36 prior to i believe 97 have a water pump issue (plastic). As well, misshifts are common on the m3, due to the slopply transmission mount and clutch stop. Both are easly cured with mods from AA or UUC.
As well, after market rear sway bars on e36s are a big no no. It wasn't till 1999 that they put enough reinforcement in the rear sub frame to deal with the tearing out of the rear sway bar mounts.
I love the looks of the E36 m3. One dead sexy machine. Well worth the look if you can find a low mileage, good shape one. One this is that these cars are a cult car, therefore the resale value is somewhat high, and really expensive for the age of the vechicle. A lot of the cars have no warranty left, so expect to pay some bigger then normal service bills. THe price of parts are not as expensive as people think.
Anyhow this is longer then expected............
03-17-2004, 04:11 PM
#17
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which one has more appeal in the looks department,
E36 with drop, angel eyes, lighting, front splitter exhaust, tint
or cl type-s - exhaust, rims, mesh grill, and tint
E36 with drop, angel eyes, lighting, front splitter exhaust, tint
or cl type-s - exhaust, rims, mesh grill, and tint
03-17-2004, 04:13 PM
#18
Senior Moderator
Originally posted by mclarenf3387
I don't think the Type S 6 speed is that close in performance. Also the new 330 is not close in performance to the e36 m3 as they are heavier and have less horespower. Its a tough decision to chose between the two. THe CL is more of a tourer where the M3 is a car you can drive to the track, kick ass, and drive home in comfort.
I don't think the Type S 6 speed is that close in performance. Also the new 330 is not close in performance to the e36 m3 as they are heavier and have less horespower. Its a tough decision to chose between the two. THe CL is more of a tourer where the M3 is a car you can drive to the track, kick ass, and drive home in comfort.
But the M3 is still faster but the 330 can hang.
03-17-2004, 04:31 PM
#20
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i own a 2001 cl type-s with navi satin silver, with intake, and ct springs
but im planning to get a 97-99 m3 with 50k mileage, my cl has 46k right now
but im planning to get a 97-99 m3 with 50k mileage, my cl has 46k right now
03-17-2004, 04:58 PM
#24
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Well i couldnt find any m3s in good shape for that price when i was shopping. Guess it helps that you are in cali and they are everywhere.
I still say get the M3 if you can.
Oh and you should get about 18k for your CLS. Also dont forget you need to pay tax on the m3
I still say get the M3 if you can.
Oh and you should get about 18k for your CLS. Also dont forget you need to pay tax on the m3
03-17-2004, 05:38 PM
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only 18k thats horrible, i dont think my parents would approve, it has to be cheaper then the m3 and i have no money to shell out.
but i do see many cl's with around the same mileage go in the 20's around here
but i do see many cl's with around the same mileage go in the 20's around here
03-18-2004, 11:00 AM
#28
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Originally posted by Maximized
What do you have done to your suspension? My brother has a M3 with ground control/konis and it handles really great.
What do you have done to your suspension? My brother has a M3 with ground control/konis and it handles really great.
I've gotten many compliments from people on how well it handles, and it'll catch a whole lot of cars in the twisties.
Also, if I were getting a new suspension for an M3, I'd definately just get everything through GC...a whole lot less hassle.
03-18-2004, 11:16 AM
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Originally posted by pimpscls
but i do see many cl's with around the same mileage go in the 20's around here
but i do see many cl's with around the same mileage go in the 20's around here
03-18-2004, 12:51 PM
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Originally posted by pimpscls
only 18k thats horrible, i dont think my parents would approve, it has to be cheaper then the m3 and i have no money to shell out.
but i do see many cl's with around the same mileage go in the 20's around here
only 18k thats horrible, i dont think my parents would approve, it has to be cheaper then the m3 and i have no money to shell out.
but i do see many cl's with around the same mileage go in the 20's around here
03-18-2004, 07:41 PM
#33
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Originally posted by Crazy Sellout
navi wont bring the pirce up by much.. maybe $700
navi wont bring the pirce up by much.. maybe $700
Once a car is used, the extra stuff like navi really doesn't count as much on resale. Figure about 1/3 of what it cost when new. 700 is probably a dead on figure.
03-18-2004, 09:41 PM
#34
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yea it says 18350 doallars which is pretty bad. and my mods would make no diff right like ct drop and aem cai , better to sell em seperately
03-18-2004, 10:56 PM
#35
hail to the victors
Originally posted by pimpscls
which one has more appeal in the looks department,
E36 with drop, angel eyes, lighting, front splitter exhaust, tint
or cl type-s - exhaust, rims, mesh grill, and tint
which one has more appeal in the looks department,
E36 with drop, angel eyes, lighting, front splitter exhaust, tint
or cl type-s - exhaust, rims, mesh grill, and tint
neither. e36 no longer a head-turner IMO. it is too old and too many, and cls is not a good looking car IMO.
03-18-2004, 11:47 PM
#36
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yea i dont think te cl-s is that nice looking either, but it does have a classy look and looks good from the back
I think the e36 looks great, but it isnt a head turner but i rather have an old beemer then the new shit, im a guy of conservative and masculine looks
I think the e36 looks great, but it isnt a head turner but i rather have an old beemer then the new shit, im a guy of conservative and masculine looks
03-19-2004, 04:00 PM
#37
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I used to have a 2000 TL below...
now I have a 1998 E36 M3...
The two does not compare in performance categories, night and day difference...The Acura was much more of a cruiser...The M3 is so easy to work on it's not even funny, but you have to have basic wrenching skills...parts are relatively cheap since it's an older car...and 70% of the car can be taken apart using a 10 mm metric wrench...well almost...and the E36 M3 is faster than the E46 330...just think about it, the 330 weighs about 450lbs. heavier than the E36 M3 which is (3175lbs.) the M3 has a closer ratio ZF tranny that pulls with the short gearing...and has 15 more horses plus more torque...this all adds up, and is a good full second faster to 60mph than the 330...it also has a better steering rack which is really responsive...yes the 330 has more luxury but if you are talking about the raw performance and the driving feel, 330 won't come close...
Den
now I have a 1998 E36 M3...
The two does not compare in performance categories, night and day difference...The Acura was much more of a cruiser...The M3 is so easy to work on it's not even funny, but you have to have basic wrenching skills...parts are relatively cheap since it's an older car...and 70% of the car can be taken apart using a 10 mm metric wrench...well almost...and the E36 M3 is faster than the E46 330...just think about it, the 330 weighs about 450lbs. heavier than the E36 M3 which is (3175lbs.) the M3 has a closer ratio ZF tranny that pulls with the short gearing...and has 15 more horses plus more torque...this all adds up, and is a good full second faster to 60mph than the 330...it also has a better steering rack which is really responsive...yes the 330 has more luxury but if you are talking about the raw performance and the driving feel, 330 won't come close...
Den
03-21-2004, 07:19 AM
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Originally posted by mclarenf3387
I don't think the Type S 6 speed is that close in performance. Also the new 330 is not close in performance to the e36 m3 as they are heavier and have less horespower. Its a tough decision to chose between the two. THe CL is more of a tourer where the M3 is a car you can drive to the track, kick ass, and drive home in comfort.
I don't think the Type S 6 speed is that close in performance. Also the new 330 is not close in performance to the e36 m3 as they are heavier and have less horespower. Its a tough decision to chose between the two. THe CL is more of a tourer where the M3 is a car you can drive to the track, kick ass, and drive home in comfort.
2) am a bmw driving school instructor here in canada and have drivin both e36 m3's, e46 m3's, and 330's and the 330 and e36 are pretty dam close. THe 330 has more torque, and torque = accerlation.