iTimmy

You sure don't know your car history. Look into the GT40 and see how it handed ferrari its ass in the late 60's. And yet again they are doing it.

I know I am going to get flamed, but I have driven a 355, 360, 456GTA and a few older 308's, 512TR's and Modial's and honestly they don't do much for me.

Tireguy who doesn't see what the big deal about ferrari's is anyway.

Junkster

hehe... don't worry about flaming, we're a bit more mature then that.

I've driven a testarossa for like five minutes once, so can't say I have that much experience... and I doubt that I'll get to drive a GT anytime soon.

I've read and seen reviews about the GT compared to the Ferrari line (CAR magazine) and the editors are even split on the comparison. The GT is a pure sports car, pure and simple. It was built for racing. The Ferraris, on the other hand, are natural GT cars, with the exceptions of the likes of Enzo and F50. The interior of a Ferrari clearly outclasses a GT, with creature comforts.

And, of course, unless a person knows the history of the GT, the car will just be another Ford in a person's eye, which isn't quite a Ferrari in it's family traits.

Junkster, who wonders how Tireguy drove so many prancing horses

ClutchPerformer

Um.... The GT40 of the late 60s was the "first and last" that Domn was talking about.
Really? Exactly which Ferrari does this new GT40 trump? Which one is it even competing against?
Yeah.
So those Tauruses and Mustangs must be the real deal, huh?

I've sat in the new GT40. It's not that impressive. And I can't see how its performance would change that too much. Sorry.

Junkster

yea, and the new GT hasn't been on LeMans yet against the likes of Porsche and Ferrari, so we can't say that Ford has pulled it off again. Remember, no matter how highly engineered it may be, the GT is still a Ford... with all it's possible faults.

If the GT can win a LeMans again while going against the Porsches and Ferraris, then I'll be impressed.

Junkster, who thinks solid competition is needed for the acclamation of the new GT

ClutchPerformer

Junkster

Yea, clutch, you almost made me eat my own words... what was I thinking... maturity in this forum.

Junkster, who actually likes the new GT

iTimmy

Firstly the new car is not the GT40 its merely the GT. Secondly most people who have driven both the 360 modena and the GT feel it(the GT) out performs the 360 modena and cost about 17k less too. But this is based on actual experience not assumed like yours. I would hope for 3 fold the cost of the GT the enzo has a slight edge. The GT was built to out perform the 360 and many will agree they've succeeded.

I am by no means a Ford fan, however, I have to appreciate what the new GT is capable of doing for a VERY affordable price.

I think these street legal race cars are a joke myself, I am part of a race team and we race P-cars and even a modest p-car will walk over an enzo. Our team currently has a Cosworth-spice 016 and are in the process of rebuilding the 1150 horsepower monster Nissan R88C. Seeing the crap the ferrari guys go through keeping there cars running(not to mention the expense!) I lost a lot of respect for them(Ferrari that is). And maybe there street cars are good performer's just not my cup of tea, I am at a loss why you can't understand that's my opinion from experience behind the wheel and have to throw some foolish comment about tauruses and mustangs into this. But you continue to speculate I have better things to do....

fdl

A modest pace car will not walk all over an enzo. Your talking out of your ass. (no offence)
But regardless of that who cares? Its like these guys who think their stripped down 10 second monster civic is somehow better than any exotic because it can beat them in the 1/4 mile. Its called a one trick pony.

The ferrari will be a heck of alot more reliable than your 1150 hp Nissan.
The ferrari is a work of art compared to your nissan.
The ferrari is a great investment...it can actually appreciate in value.
The ferrari can be enjoyed all the time, on regular streets.
The ferrari will get you the chicks!

... and I could go on.

Dan Martin

P-car == Porsche != pace car



Still, to the rest of what you have to say although I'm pretty sure he wasn't talking about drag racing. There is nothing in Porsche's lineup save the Carrera GT that can challenge an Enzo.

fdl

Ya, i know he wasnt talking about dragging, but i think a 1000 hp nissan track car is just as much of a one trick pony. Its just got a different trick.

iTimmy

One clarification P-car is reffered to as prototype cars. I see no need to continue to argueing about this. Happy motoring!

dom

And isn't that all that matters?

fdl

Dan Martin

http://p-car.com/

P-Car usually means Porsche.

gfxdave99

Honestly i think if you pulled up in a red ford gt you would get just as much female attention... although overall the shape of the ferrari is more 'sexy' :blaze:

dom

I doubt it.

Junkster

I don't know where this guy was getting his facts from.

The Modena review vs the new GT was featured in CAR magazine from last month's issue (Aug). They had Damon Hill driving both. Hill assessed that the GT drove better for track, while two other reviewers from the magazine indicated their favor for the Modena. It was pretty much a split decision, especially when you consider that the GT sent to Britain was a preproduction model (is this what he was trying to say?).

Anyhoot, let me go back and see what I can read on that article again.

Junkster, who thinks we're discussing, hence looking for facts

dom

But the 360 is a 5 or 6 year old design.

We'll see how the GT stacks up against the new 483HP F430 (360 replacement)

fdl

Was the 360 a CS? Because that would be the proper comparison.

gfxdave99

http://www.caranddriver.com/article....&page_number=1

C&D drive head to head a porche and the ferrari challange stradale (which is a 360 race prepped basically)

And they picked the GT commenting

"Rocketing the GT to 60 mph in 3.3 seconds and to 150 in 16.9 (that's an incredible seven seconds quicker than the Porsche and the Ferrari) was a cinch. Unlike some other supercars that have hair-trigger clutches with monstrously heavy pedal efforts, the GT's clutch was as easy to operate as a Honda Accord's."

Read the whole article, i read it when it first came out in the mag (subscriber) but it will give you some good insight on comparing those cars.. And while the GT3 is no Carrera GT it is similar in thought.

dom

7 seconds quicker to 150?

Naturally, is has 125HP more HP than the 360CS and 167 more than the GT3. And I'm willing to bet that any advantages the GT has in lap times were also due to that HP and not its suspension. Not to mention its Supercharged HP.

ClutchPerformer

Did you guys know that the SC is almost as big displacement-wise as a TSX engine? (2.3L) So of COURSE it makes gobs of power and torque.

ClutchPerformer

....Until they ask you what it is and you have to tell them it's a Ford....

majormojo

"Ferrari should beware the fury of an aroused Ford Executive." (apologies to Eisenhower)

Thanks for the background, Junkster. I'd never heard that story before, very interesting.

Junkster

I read it in CAR magazine, as well as a Ferrari history site, about a year ago. It was pretty neat that Ferrari NEARLY became a subsidary of Ford... just imagine that for a second.

Junkster, who shivers at the thought

dom

Is it any better being a subsidary of Fiat which in turn is a subsidary of GM?

domn, who heard that Ferrari will not be a part of the deal when GM takes over controlling interest in Fiat.

iTimmy

Now you've brought up a good point that I thought about during the day today. Ford better have something up there sleeves if they want to stay in the game. The only thing the ford would have at that point(assuming the new ferrari is as good as it sounds) would be price and in that market it doesn't matter much!

To settle some of the confusion, here's a picture of the cosworth spice 016 http://www.hudsonhistorics.com/image...sworth_016.jpg just to get an idea of what kind of cars I was reffering to as "p-cars" sorry for the confusion.

ClutchPerformer

So were comparing street cars to this thing? Great.

We need an "apples-to-oranges" smiley...

Dan Martin

Wasn't lambo a division of chrysler for a while?

dom

Yes.

Junkster

okay, I've done my research and I'm back... to put this to rest...

And don't you peeps start saying "well, how do you know? You never drove it"... That's right, I didn't, but neither has 99% of the population on this earth. Plus, if you say that you have driven more than two exotics, I would like pictures of yourself and the two cars, plus pics of youself while your were driving (or equivalent)... there, that's settled then.

I've read four full reviews of the GT compared to other exotics (some free time at Barnes and Nobles, plus a large coffee). I read through CAR magazine, Top Gear, EVO, and Motor Trend.

CAR magazine's pic
They were essentially split, but the editors loved the GT more. My previous post was totally off, I got the facts backwards. Damon Hill (and if you don't know who this is, you don't have a right to comment on sports cars to begin with) test drove both the GT and the Challenge Stradale, and stated that the GT was most driver-friendly, like anyone could get behind the wheels and feel somewhat comfortable. Essentially, the GT was a road-friendly supercar. The Stradale, Hill said, is more of a racing GT in it's manners. The Ferrari is built more for the tracks then real-life roads. The editors preferred the GT for it's amazing power (almost double the torque of the Ferrari). Hill also commented that the GT felt a bit 'loose' at times due to the excess power, and said that it would be a doozy to handle in the wet. Hill's biggest complaint about the Ferrari was that the paddle shifters did not move with the steering wheel, thus not allowing for gear change at full lock.

Top Gear's pic
These guys did a 24 hour testdrive in the GT, the Stradale and the Lambo Gallardo. They also stated how road-friendly the GT was compared to the others. The Ferrari was stated as being more involved in driving, while the Gallardo was good, but not quite in the class of the others in terms of performance, styling and quality, whatever that's suppose to mean. They liked the GT's styling much more, with J May saying that they didn't want to stray too far from the original GT40. They also mentioned that the GT40 name wasn't used for this new model because the GT40 name was actually patented by some replica car company (how stupid is Ford Marketing that they forget to protect one of their greatest names?)... yea, Ford is lame. But the GT's American muscle with it's gobs of torque was a big hit, although Top Gear preferred the Ferrari driving mystique and feel.

EVO's pic
These guys not only took a GT and Stradale, but also a 911 GT. Kinda weird, how the 911 fits in there. But they also agreed that te GT is a softer car, made more for everyday driving. They noted how comfy the seats were, but also noted that the signal column for the GT was exactly the same one used in the Ford Mondeo in Europe (sharing parts with a family sedan, way to go Ford... sheesh). The reviewers did like the retro feel of the interior, although some said that the plastic quality was way too low to compare with the likes of Ferrari or 911. But they state that this is a driving car to be driven, not to win beauty contests, and they consider the GT a success no matter what, since the 40 GT's going to Great Britain are all spoken for. The 911 wasn't even a contender in the comparison.

Motor Trend's pic:
Crap, now I can't remember if it was Motor Trend or Road and Track... doesn't matter, the US magazines all sound alike... These idiots compared the GT to... surprise, an Enzo of all things!!! Like these two are even comparable. I was so distraught at this that I did not read the rest of the article. What's the point? They are reviewers stupid enough to review apples to oranges, Pam Anderson to Jennifer Love Hewitt, boxers to briefs.... totally different things. Makes me sick that these guys are paid to do these horrendous reviews... disgusting.

The Car and Driver review linked in above post is disturbing as well. Damon Hill, a vetran F1 driver, is contradicted by the reviewers of Car and Driver... who to believe, a F1 legend or some old journalist whose never raced full speed... am I crazy to say the F1 legend? Hill says that the Ferrari is more of a track car, while Car and Driver says that the Ferrari was the easier to drive. Hill says that the seats of the GT were surprisingly comfortable for a supercar (as did EVO), while the Car and Driver reviewer didn't like the flat seats of the GT. For my conscience, I'm taking Damon Hill's opinion over these guys.

So, there you have it, all that the Junkster could dig up on the comparisons in a weekend... in which he had to work regular hours... hope everyone's long weekend was better then mind.

Junkster, who did finish another book while at work though

bowersan

Hey guys!!

Just as a quick comment- Im in Hong Kong for the year, and I've been busy running around town seeing the sights- and yesterday, when i was walking past the old Tai Kak Airport, I passed by the Ferrari dealership and service department. Guess what was in the service bay? Thats right, an Enzo.

Freaking unbelivable car. Too bad I cant stand the looks. To each his own though!

J.

fdl

wow bowersan, a flash from the past. You shoudl stop by more often

fdl

R&T - Enzo vs Carerra GT vs SLR

sorry if its a repost.

bowersan

Nice to see you again fdl! Dont you worry, im here every once in a while.. whenever I get a chance to get online i come here to see whats up.

Hope things are good. Enzo is rediculous. Wish I could trade in my TSX for a Aston Martin DB9. Sigh.

J.

DEVO

He should have said he wouldn't get one because they are fugly.

Yumcha

Anyhoo...just wanted to share a link with oodles of pics of his garage. I don't think these pics are reposts...

http://www.ls1gto.com/forums/showthread.php?t=91065



Holy farking fark, what a garage!

stangg172004

CLpower

i may be going to see it the end of the month



btw, I can't believe I just read this thread. I also can't believe the complete retards we have on this board.




It should also be noted, like many true ferrari fans Leno isn't a fan of the new cars, he enjoys and owns the good stuff (the old GTO's etc). He also frequently comments/ridicules the bureaucracy it takes to buy one.

If Leno ever wanted an enzo, he would have one.

SeCsTaC

What bike is this?