IG TSX was the heaviest car for its size & 4cylinder engine for any make when introduced in 2003.
2G TSX is not heavy considering larger tire size, larger body and ACE body structure.

 

The day Acura produces a car capable of competing with BMW, Mercedes-Benz, or Audi is the day they will start to turn things around. And I'm not talking performance wise, Acura had made some absolutely hideous cars to compete with some very nice, modern cars.

I say Honda puts Acura to bed, they've tried, they've failed, move on with their economy cars. Unless they come up with a complete redesign for their major sellers Acura won't be selling anything near what they had. Acura needs to go as do the designers of the cars they've come out with.

 

Except for Audi whose signature leds, styling and nice interiors. there is nothing in MB and BMW design that Acura is not doing better.
MB C,GLK, E, M, ML, R class looks are very plain and daed.
I believe diesel is contributing to MB sales to certain extent.

 

http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/...mparison_tests

They already did, when the 2G RL came out (2005) it was more than capable of competing with MB, Audi, and BMW. Same goes for the M35/45 from Infiniti, it's a better competitor to the German luxury automakers as well.

Problem is the German's responded with improving their engines (remember back then a 3L BMW was rated at 230HP and the Acura was 300HP). Since then Acura has done nothing for it's motors and drivetrain (they just recently went to a 6AT).

Also the Bangle designed 5 series is nothing to rave at styling wise, the 5 is a incredibly well engineered car but exterior styling? Acura truely needs to fix it's current styling but the competition is not exactly stellar there too.

The failure of the RL in the mid-size has more to do with market perception than the actual product. The initial 2G RL styling was OK but Acura turned up the bold styling on the MMC unfortunately.

Although not a car the MDX also competes very well in it's luxury SUV segment.

http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/...mparison_tests

 

It's a bit difficult to find a RWD Audi. You can argue that some of their vehicles are RWD-biased AWD, but the added AWD system still adds weight compared to true RWD.

 

Most of MB sales which is the leader in this segment are E350 which are 268bhp. Nothing to brag about. Admittely they have 7speed auto with better fuel economy. (But this should not be a big consideration in $50k car).

Acura has superior build quality, more standard features and better handling due to Sh-AWD. standard 18 wheels.
MB navigation screen is only 6.5inch. RL has very nicely located 8inch Navigation screen.
MB is rated 4 star for safety. RL is 5 star.
MB has only 4.1inch ground clearance. RL has 5.7inch.
RL has more rear leg room.
It is more about stupid consumer perception rather than reality. as in reality RL has best resale value and MB E class has worst. and baseline BMW 528 is no different which most consumer will buy. and is price similar as Acura RL with base price of $46k. only thing better is 8speed auto.
look at side mirror design of MB E.

 

And on top of that the AWD system is added to a FWD car. Without Quattro all Audis are rear drive other than the R8.

Just like Acura's SH-AWD is rear biased but the vehicles Acura makes are still front drive vehicles.

 

You mean FWD without Quattro?

 

There are MANY more things better about the others than Acura..


And ROFL at look at the side mirror design? REALLY???? Want to play that gam, ok. The 2g TL (99-01) had probably the worst design acura or any one has had. The angle of it likes to project road debris and bugs straight into the drivers head when the window is down.

Until Acura offers better looking cars, better power, more options AS options many people wont look at them again. I for one am one of them. To me right now Ford and GM have more going for them than Acura does.


And this, WHAT the HELL does this have any thing to do with? Do you plan on taking your RL or MB OFF ROAD??????


Hell, every thing Hyundai is building now is better than Acura.

 

1999 time has long past.
Ground clearance is critical important. TSX had 5.9inch ground clearance. i took it on beach road with people and there is too many pot holes.
Acura offers superior build quality, superior residual value based on ALG, it is No 1 in latest Consumer reports for overall reliability, it has lower maintiance cost over long term.
It always beats EPA mileage. and 300bhp is upper limit. anything beyond that is superflous. No one use more than 300bhp in real life.
. Acura is now only brand that give standard 19inch rims on mid size SUV like MDX. and 18inch rims on entry level car like TSX V6.
size of rims, body and side mirrors are all well proportioned.








Hyundai Genesis cannot even outsell VW CC now. It is failed product despite its low price and very poorly designed interior. too plain and dated.

 

Yes. All that FWD/AWD/RWD talk made me type backwards.

 

I swear I know who the stupidest person on AZ is.

 

 

Now, now, one can always find one better or in this case dumber.

 

Have you taken the MODs advice and put him on ignore? I did weeks ago and I have been at peace finally on these boards!

 

If you need 5.9 inches of ground clearance to drive on roads, you arent driving on roads any more and are hopping curbs (which are lower than 5.9)

I use all of my 300hp every day. I want it, and i want more. Something that honda doesnt offer and is part of the reason i will not look at them for my own personal car.

And i have to disagree with you. My father has a Genesis sedan and it is every bit as good and better than any Acura out there. The Leather is far better, fit and finish is better. (That is my opinion, you have yours) There is nothing you can post or say that will make Acura a worthy car in my opinion. 18s and 19s are irrelevant as well. Especially when it is something i would most likely replace with a better looking wheel any way.

 

Genesis is 33k-42k Hyundai. duh. and it's RWD with no AWD option.

but Genesis sells 6-7 times more than RL.

 

and why even bring up CC? CC and genesis doesn't compete each other. Genesis is a large RWD highway cruiser. if Genesis had AWD option, it would've done better. RWD isn't ideal for colder states. i rarely see genesis in chicago, but i see plenty in Georgia & florida.

and seriously your wet dream RL is screwed when Equus arrives. it held its own against 7 and beat ls460 in every stats including 70mile highway cruise dBA rating. when it comes here it will be the quietest car on the road under 100k.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=22O5QnSLdeE

 

Yes but when people quote him I still have to scroll over it. Yuck.

But it is indeed much more peaceful because now only on occasion to my eyes come across stuff. And you know it's bad when I'm reminded of why he is on ignore based on the FIRST senetence I read of his in weeks. "Ground clearance is critical important." WTF does that even mean?!

 

Genesis is moving over 1000 units a month isn't? Not bad for a vehicle in the 33-43 thou range with a Hyundai badge. People are going with that over a much more established, prestigious badge in decent numbers.

 

i give him mad props for being the last man standing.

 

Ground clearnce is critical important or exit and entrance to home. you know drivways in bayarea are much higher than the roads. with high ground clearance you can drive around a park car sides.



No expert will agree with you about fit and finish. It is below the established mark for Genesis. It is so bargain but no one want to buy it. Acura wheels are lighter weight and still shiny after two years of rough use.

 

No kidding. I've had a chance to drink in the new Equus. What a fantastic car. I'd rather have more of a sport luxury sedan but damn that thing is still fabulous.

If you want that level of luxury you have to step up to the Lexus and Mercedes types.

 

RL is such a bargain compared to E and 5, but no one is buying. 535i is 70k when optioned like RL, you know?

and if RL had 385 horses, it would've sold more than 150 per month.

 

Acura RL is Honda legend in rest of the world. and it sells with Honda badge. but that beside the point. Honda dont make V8 for SUVs. so there i moot point of creating V8 sedan.
why would i waste money on Equus. when i get 0.26cd sedan around $75K. class leading fuel economy matching V6 sedan, AWD torque vectoring, drive select adoptive air suspension and MMI that is generation ahead of anything including hand writing input. due to large Volume of VW group. Audi prices will be the most competitive in market.

 

Equus is 55k. lol kinda like why would I waste my money on RL when i can simply by base E or 5?

 

That's the sad part - no, it would have not.

 

Base E and 5 has only 270bhp to maximum. No navigaiton and rear view camera and certianly not premium sound system. RL is pretty solid car in its price range with excellent built and resale value. there wont be Sh-AWD in base E/5. you will need harsh ride of sport suspension to match RL handling. and those smallish 17inch rims look so out of place on E & 5 series.
dont worry. BMW 740 3.0 starts at $70K.
Audi can do 3.0T A8 around $65k once it arrives next year. and no one cares about $10 price difference in that range.
It is hope less for Hyundai at that price.

 

Sorry, but you dont need that much in cali. Come out here where 10" snow storms are normal, where our roads are actually rough and where i drive off paved roads for work on a daily basis (and my car is lowered) you DONT need 5.9" of ground clearance for driveways near as much as i need it for off roading and i dont have a isue with my ground clearance.

below the established mark for what? Do yourself a favor, actually go sit in some of these cars you knock down every time you speak from your internet paper racing speeches. You will see that your all mighty Acura isnt all that all mighty.

And for your info my 18s with 235/40 tires on them come in 2lbs lighter than my STOCK Acura 16s and are still shiny after 100k miles of use (something my stock wheels are not)

 

No, what it will be is hopeless for Acura at the price points that Hyundai is coming in at. Why would someone buy a RL when they could get a far better car (the Equus) with more options and MUCH larger for the same price?

 

It is hopeless for Hyundai sell sell 100 or 200 Equuses (Equui?) a month but it's good that only 150 RLs get moved each month because luxury is exclusive.

Also, that is not hypocritical.

 

Your forgetting Sh-AWD part in RL that make it unique. without sport suspension no car can match RL handling. None of Acuras had 6speed auto yet with 6speed auto. Acura is going to get best performance and economic.


here is story of University professor
If Genesis failed and it is bargain. so whats the point of even introducing even bigger car. remember TL is based on Accord. so any sales are plus.

 

of course people will buy big germans over Equus.. duh. but i would rather buy an Equus over RL.

Equus might be pointless, but at least it's not worthless.

 

obviously the point of Equus isn't trying to sell in volume. hyundai only expects 2000-3000 a year. it's Hyundai's halo car. it's hyundai saying 'look what we are capable of'. hyundai is just testing the water with Equus and see how it stacks up against big boys. what's Acura doing? for 15 years, they have failed to do it right when it comes to their flagship. no flagship = no tier 1 status.

 

You know what's ironic? If Hyundai's luxury cars don't sell well it's a negative thing and they're failures.

But if the RL doesn't sell well it's good because it's a luxury car and it needs to be exclusive.

I wonder how the shit smells in his other hand.

 

It is not halo car. It uses same transmission and engine of Genesis which is failed product. Equs wont have resale values like RL. that is called exclusivity and desirablity. If some thing was wrong with RL. it wouldnt be on top resale value. The car is limited to dealer supplies. just look at lease rate on RL.

Acura created two flagships. Acura MDX and ZDX. both have 6speed Auto and in case of ZDX adjustable magnetic fluid suspension. even the engines in MDX/ZDX has torque lowered at 4500rpm vs 5000rpm for RL.
RL dont even have 6speed auto, upgraded engine, HDD navigation, standard 19inch rims and all around monitors like ZDX/MDX.
RL is just Honda legend. it is not flagship for Acura anymore. Acura is tier-1 due to its SUV lineup. just like RR.
Acura is not going to waste time on V8 flagship unless there is big SUV for world markets like Nissan Patrol & Toyota landcruiser. For the same reason Honda didnot create V6 and V8 diesel as there is no World SUV like Toyota and Nissan. and since there was no V6/V8 diesel the sale of Honda legend didnot went up in Europe. There is no Honda Pilot diesel and like Land Cruiser Prado.
I just saw JD survey for UK. Both Euro Accord and CRV on top in there respective segment. When Honda want to do it. it can do better than anyone else. as it has the money of past decades.
It is different philoshpy.

 

By your logic:

The NSX wasnt a halo car because it used the same engine series as the Legend.

And....

The ZDX/MDX can't possibly be a halo car because it shares the same motor as the Accord, Pilot, and Odyssey.

Logic fail.

 

And his first love the RL uses the engine from a TL and MDX.

Same engine family as ....the Accord. L M A O

Besides the ZF tranny is found even in a Rolls-Royce so I guess that isn't a halo car either.

 

Guess not.

 

There is nothing special about NSX. Its Cd was even higher than TSX. its low sales led to its discontinuation. it was Halo car in 1990 but not in 2000.

ZDX/MDX has new transmissions and engine rpm tweaked. suspension & interior upgraded and new features added along with lighter 19inch standard rims. there is no implementation of SH-AWD in Honda products. Every thing is exclusive to Acura.
Equas is just a big boat with underpowered & coarse engine for its class and load it with cheap electronics..

I will not consider this interior as of Halo Car. there is no design flavor


ZDX has concave dash design. very futuristic simplistic.