phee

iTrader: (5)

So i recently purchased a 93 Civic CX shell and it had some body filler around and over the rear 1/4.

Unfortunately, someone backed into the car while the bondo was on the body and it ruined the work (all this happened before i bought the car)

As the project nears completion i am prepping for paint and have discovered that the entire 1/4 panel is wavy and the fender lip is total trash under the 2 inches of bondo.

I have decided to cut the 1/4 panel off and replace it with a panel from fixmyrust.com

have any of you attempted this before? any tips? Terry?

Would any of you advise against it? i have nothing but time and the build is a few hundred bucks under budget

i will post pics when i leave work

charliemike

I would think the welding is the hardest part. If you can do that and not have it look like this:

phee

iTrader: (5)

from what i have been reading, everyone recommends tap welding and using something to fill the seam.

Stapler

If you haven't welded before it a but weld on sheet metal can be a bit frustrating. If I were starting again I would go buy some similar gauge sheet metal and practice until I was out of materials. I jumped into it without enough practice on a car in high school and those welds haunt me today.

I know allot of auto body places use lap joints and epoxy now. You may want to look into that.

dallison

you'll need to spot weld in order to not warp the metal.

Go here for pointers even if you aren't using a welder.


www.millerwelds.com and their welding community should be more helpful.


A 110v migwelder will more than plenty. Use gas shielded wire so there's less warping. You will only need 024 or 030 wire also.

teranfon

Hi phee

Do you have any welding experience? And if so, have you worked with thin gauge before? That being said, even if you haven't, it still sounds like a great project to learn on. Keep in mind, however, that it is not an easy task and will take a tremendous amount of patience.

First off, reproduction panels always work wonderfully. They are of top quality, and fit perfectly. That is of course, if you are prepared to purchase, inspect, return, get another, inspect, return, get another, inspect, return,............ Once you do find one you like, you'll only have to spend a dozen hours getting it to fit properly. Seriously, most are junk. Not saying yours will be, but be prepared for it not to be an exact match.

I'm assuming you're going to use a mig for this procedure. If using one is new to you, spend several days practicing with it. Hell, if this is something you think you will enjoy doing in the future, take a week long night course at a trade school or community college that offers welding courses. This will prove invaluable. And then practice, practice, practice. Getting the right technique is important, as you want to have a good seam and not to burn any holes through the metal. Burning holes is very easy to do with thin gauge, and even harder to fill if you don't have experience. Not to deter you, some aftermarket panels are even designed to use an adhesive to affix them to existing metal. I don't like it, but in some cases they seem to work very well.

If you decide to weld a new panel onto the car, you can either do a lap joint (overlapping one edge with another), or butting the two pieces of metal together. It seems as if lap joints are much more common, simply because it's much easier and less warpage is realized. Me? Butt joints and hand formed panels all the way.

Now lets say you want to continue, and welding is the route you've chosen. Besides getting your welding technique correct, always allow for contraction. When metal cools after welding, it ALWAYS shrinks. It will tighten and pull flat. Most people don't really worry about this, and mask the imperfections will body fill. It's fine I suppose, but to do a proper job you'll want to work the panel after it's in place to bring back the correct contours. This can be done with a hammer and dolly from behind, or with a dent puller from the front it this is the only access. The point here is that welding is only a small part of the process.

So in short, I hope it's something you undertake. First get some experience welding, maybe consider a used panel instead of an aftermarket, and be prepared to work it back correctly. Let me know what you decide and I can try to help you if you like.


Remove the piece you want to replace and clean the edges.


Weld new piece in slowly, first tacking it in place every inch or so.


As you're welding, work the piece so it retains it's correct contour.


Carefully grind the surface once completed. Drink beer.


What I've stated above is overly simplistic, but there is no time like the present to learn. If you undertake it, be prepared for a few blunders, but you will get better. You never stop learning. I'm still learning.

Steel is wonderful though. We made much of this panel from a sheet of 4'x4' eighteen gauge. It's not done much anymore, but it's the way it should be done.





Good luck!

phee

iTrader: (5)

terry, your thread was my inspiration for wanting to remove the body filler

here is the picture i promised.

before


Uploaded with ImageShack.us


Uploaded with ImageShack.us

after



Uploaded with ImageShack.us

phee

iTrader: (5)

what you cant see is the wavy wheel arch lip. im thinking of cutting everything from the lip up to the gas cap and the tail light area.

teranfon

Disgusting.

Looks like a great project though!

Once the fill was removed, how did the metal underneath look?

phee

iTrader: (5)

the metal underneath it was slightly wavy and looked very thin. i will try to get more detailed pictures but im working towards getting the car running first.

phee

iTrader: (5)

So the car runs... It's smoother than my TL. I may start a build thread

BaByBlAcKtYpE-s

iTrader: (2)

nice... i have a 92 hatch cx until i crashed it. I still miss it everytime I see a clean hatch roll by. Any plans for a motor swap?

csmeance

Terry, couldn't he heat up the metal a tad bit to soften it and simply take a flat hammer or even a few peen hammers and a block or iron/metal and hammer it close to flat by hammering from the inside and holding the block on the outside?

teranfon

Heating probably wouldn't work too well, but if the metal doesn't look too bad, and phee has access to both sides, you're absolutely right that a basic body hammer and dolly could do wonders. Often metal at times looks very poor, but it's surprising how much it can be worked over time.

phee

iTrader: (5)

The metal is as thick as the factory panel. I may try heating it before cutting. My only doubt is being able to pull the sharp curve by the tail light.

Also, I just wrapped up the gs-r swap. I am currently making a header out of parts I have.

teranfon

Hi phee

Don't heat up the panel. Do you have a decent body hammer and dolly? Can you access behind the panel?

phee

iTrader: (5)

I can get them. And I can reach behind the panel. I will post pics of the interior view of the panel once I find this fuel leak I smell

csmeance

welding plus fumes/smell of gasoline = Bad...

phee

iTrader: (5)

Exactly, I haven't started the body work because of this

phee

iTrader: (5)

Update: gas leak was from the fuel pump gasket. It had basically dried out and was letting fumes in the cabin.

FiftyFive

So this is why you haven't been on Reach, lol jk. Good work. I had a couple hatches in my day, very fun project cars to work on and the outcome will make you very proud.

phee

iTrader: (5)

I haven't been on reach for a few months now. Going to school full time and working full time during the week kills my free time. I've dedicated every free hour of my life to this car for about a month now.

Driving it is a dream and the suspension setup I have is a dream. Worth every penny

teranfon

Sounds like a really cool build!

phee

iTrader: (5)

Thanks! Just working out the little kinks mechanically and reading a-lot about body work

fsttyms1

Agree. Dont heat it. I would take my time with a body hammer and dolly set. If any heating is to be done its to shrink the metal afterwards or if you get any oil caning after attempting to stretch the metal back out.

phee

iTrader: (5)

got a body hammer today and got some of the dents out. looks pretty good. now what? a little fiber glass work?

fsttyms1

Did you get the dollies? You need them. You should be able to work the dents out and shape with enough time taken. The body hammer should be used on the out side of the panel with the dolly on the inside to shrink and shape the dents.

Picture a crater (like from a asteroid) There is the impact crater, and around it is a high spot. The dolly needs to be placed on the back side at the low spot of the crater and the hammer needs to work around the crater on the high spot. It will shrink the metal back down and bring the dent out. It takes time. Keep at it.

phee

iTrader: (5)

ahh. thanks guys!

teranfon

As Ftty mentioned, you are working the metal when using a hammer and dolly. Don't think of it of pounding a dent out, but instead reforming it. Each time you strike your hammer against the steel with the dolly pressed from the other side, you're actually stretching the metal. Think of the metal as anything that flattens and pushes out when compressed. The steel is doing the same thing.

I wouldn't use a fiberglas resin. Instead use a product called Quantum. It's basically an epoxy. It also completely waterproof and very easy to sand.

phee

iTrader: (5)

ill buy some quantum this afternoon.

phee

iTrader: (5)

going to get started on the entire car this weekend. i plan to fully sand it and get the body straight.

edit: is this the stuff Terry?

http://www.evercoat.com/productCategory.aspx?cat=47

phee

iTrader: (5)

Guess I'll make this my build thread. Been driving the car and it felt great but I felt like I didn't have vtec. (I have never had a Honda) my suspicion was right, the solenoid had failed and now the car rips!

I also replaced my CeL bulb (it was out)

ANC297

iTrader: (2)

Im going to follow this build...What motor?

phee

iTrader: (5)

Gsr stock motor. It's quite a handful as is. I can't imagine a b20vtec in this thing. I bought this shell for 400 bucks.

myron

iTrader: (4)

he said gs-r

ANC297

iTrader: (2)

Sweet!
I helped build my buddies' back home. Its a built gsr on boost in a 95 EG hatch. They are fun cars for sure.

If you need help with anything, feel free to hit me up. I've learned a lot about this motor, and car through the build.

Sly Raskal

iTrader: (1)

Save yourself a lot of headache and get the GS-R motor and keep it simple with a nice set of headers, intake, exhaust and intake manifold (however, some intake manifolds will yield a drop in tq in the low rpms but an increase in hp at the higher rpms). The weight of the EG with the power of the GSR motor and mods will be sufficient, and with all these mods, if you drive it moderately, you'll also see a boost in fuel efficiency.

Oh and a nice set of light wheels, like some Enkei RPF1's, 15 or 16" will be great too and they are currently on sale on tirerack.

phee

iTrader: (5)

The engine has been in and it's running great. First tank I got 23 mpg but that was with some 2 year old unleaded. 2 tanks later and I made 31mpg mixed.

Gsr engine, Gsr trans, full a/c install, no power steering (more work than it's worth to install). Modifications are a short ram that came with the engine, a type-r 4-1 header, straight pipe exhaust with a magnaflow resonator. The exhaust came with the car and will need some tweaking to reduce rasp.

Overall the car is a riot. The interior is in great shape for a 20 year old car

Sly Raskal

iTrader: (1)

There's a lot more room for more mpg. The best I've had in my GS-R is 33mpg and you've got a much lighter car with the same motor. :jelly:

phee

iTrader: (5)

I must be doing something wrong. But you look light weight yourself. I weigh almost 200 lbs