Zapata

Looks like HOnda/Acura is listening about the suspension/handling etc., HPT apparently means High Performance Tire. Naming is irrelvant....what is important is that you see the 6 different versions of the TL which will be available. There doesn't seem to be a TypeS which would make it appear that Acura is positioning the standard TL against the 5 series.

October 6th is the launch date.

www.vtec.net

Yumcha

*waits for the bitching about lack of AWD and not enough power to begin* Any second now...

gsrblack

So looking forward to some type of AWD for the car....I wonder if the HPT will offer 18's and bigger brakes. Let's hope they have something significant for the high performance enthusiast!

TypeSAddict

As it should. Acura put all that R&D into VTM-4, and they only use it on one model? Why?

Zapata

Agreed, AWD is something that's definitely needed but from discussions with Acura factory reps has been the fuel cost which kept Acura away from it. From the CL/TL tranny fiasco i'm sure honda is going to make sure that the the electric motors will be able to handle 100k-150k of use and abuse as they WON'T be cheap to replace.

mantis23

just some additional info taken from a-tsx for those who don't visit the site often...

Here are official information releases to the dealers from the factory:

TO: All Acura Dealers

With the all-new Acura TSX off to a powerful start it is time to prepare for the next all-new Acura model, the 2004 TL. The 2004 TL will go on sale in October, and we’ve started to lay the groundwork to make this one of the most exciting and successful Acura launches ever.

To help prepare for the launch of the new TL, and to wet your appetite for what’s coming, I am letting you in on a few of the details:

All models of the ‘04 TL will be equipped with an engine that is more powerful than the current TL Type-S
In addition to the 5-speed SportShift automatic, a close ratio 6-speed manual transmission will be available
A High-Performance Tire option for improved acceleration and handling on dry and wet roads in warm weather will be available only on manual transmission models. This will require clear customer communications about diminished ice and snow performance, increased tire wear and road noise
To meet customer expectations the TL will be offered with a total of 20 Interior and exterior color combinations
The TL will set a new benchmark for technology, with class leading standard features including surround sound audio system, wireless link for hands free use of mobile phones and XMä Satellite Radio
We expect the 2004 TL to bring new customers with high expectations to your showrooms. The new technologies will require that your sales associates, service technicians, and delivery specialists completely understand the product characteristics so they can be explained quickly and clearly to potential customers. More importantly, your staff must provide an extremely high level of customer service.

We are sharing this information with you now to help you better prepare for the launch of this important model. To complete your upcoming TL order, please pay careful attention to all of the additional information we will soon be providing.


FROM: Dennis Manns - Asst. VP of Market Operations



RE: SPECIAL ’04 TL MOVE ALLOCATION DETAILS

**************************************************
***************

-

This MOVE allocation will include October arrival of the 2004 TL



-The ’04 TL Color Images will be available in the iN MOVE application. (See model colors under the MOVE Tab)

-A minimum of 3 units coverage will be provided to each dealership by launch date. Coverage will consist of 2 AT and 1 MT model with a minimum of 1 Navi unit.

-KEY POINTS of the ’04 TL:

Please note the following regarding the ’04 TL:

1. The 3.2 designation has been dropped from the TL name.

2. TL will have one engine configuration that is more powerful than the current 3.2TL Type-S.

3. TL will have both 5-speed SportShift Automatic and 6-speed Manual Transmissions

4. Navigation will be available on both automatic and manual transmission models.

5. The manual transmission model will be available with a High Performance Tire option. It will also be available with navigation system. Please read the note below carefully as it may effect your ordering preference.

6. The TL will be offered in 8 exterior colors with up to 4 interior color options to produce 20 interior and exterior color combinations.

7. All models will have standard equipment that included a surround sound audio system, a wireless link for hands free mobile phone use, and XMä Satellite Radio.

8. A total of 6 models will appear on your MOVE order all with unique model codes.

- TL (UA6624JW)

- TL with Navigation (UA6624KW)

- TL with Manual Trans (UA6554JW)

- TL with Manual Trans and Navigation (UA6624KW)

- TL with Manual Trans and Performance Tires (UA6564JW)

- TL with Manual Trans, Performance Tires, and Navigation (UA6564KW)



Special Note Regarding the High Performance Tire Option:

The available High Performance Tires for 2004 TL models equipped on specific manual transmission models will be identified by unique model codes when placing orders. The TL High Performance Tires provide enhanced performance in dry and wet conditions. However, this performance has trade-offs. These trade-offs include greatly reduced ice and snow performance, as well as faster wear and the possibility of increased road noise compared to the all-season tires on TL. Ice and snow driving is NOT recommended when using the High Performance tires, and this must be communicated clearly to customers. The High Performance Tires for the 2004 TL will provide some customers with even more exhilarating performance, but these customers will not be pleased with their Acura ownership experience unless you explain all of the important information about these tires to them.

jimcol711

hmmm, that 2nd bit of info makes no mention of the brembo upgrade or suspension upgrade.....time will tell!!! lets keep the fingers crossed!

TypeSAddict

They had to create a HPT option just because they are going to put Starfire tires on the base TL. HPT includes: 17 x 7 Michelin MXM4's.

JRock

Yup, that's exactly the article the GM read at the Monday morning sales meeting, lol.

cusdaddy

What I don't get is the HPT option.

Acura as well as many of you here tout FWD as a necessity due to snow, yet these tires make any advantages of FWD null.

I guess I wish it had AWD or RWD which a good set of snow tires could save - If I was to get the HPT TL, I'd still need snow tires, so I'd rather have the advantages of RWD for the rest of the year

heyitsme

seems like a waste to have a summer tire package.

Sarlacc

if the 6MT is fun to drive and handles really well I'll definately want on with Navi

Zapata

you people are f'n insane......i just don't get it. This is NO different then somebody purchasing a BMW w/RWD and purchasing a SNOW TIRE SETUP FOR THE WINTER! What is SO hard to understand?

heyitsme

the difference is you now have performance tires on shitty acura rims. i'd rather use the stock wheels for snow tires and then buy a nice set of rims to go with the summer tires.

cusdaddy

I'd rather have a FWD car that performs better in the snow. If I wanted a car I couldn't drive in the snow stock, I'd rather have a RWD car.

But I am disappointed Acura didn't go with AWD

knv8

all that extra stuff is just gonna make it more expensive

Nashua_Night_Hawk

What happend to the claim that HPT is a VTM-4 variant. The guy was pretty reliable. What happened?

Tom2

If the HPT model turns out to be just the inclusion of "high-performace tires" and nothing else, then I'd agree that it's a useless option/model.

If it includes different suspension tuning and perhaps better brakes, then it will probably be worth it. Otherwise, just go with a non-HPT model and buy a set of nice wheels wrapped in some Pilot Sports or something.....

As others have already said-- you can save the stock rims for the winter tires.

power3dfx

its probably more than just the wheels. after all, we can get all 4 tires/rim changed within an hour at a local tire shop. do you think they would set up an entirely new code for a car when it will only have one small difference. its like taking the current TL and creating a second version which has a oem body kit. just doesnt make sense. we will just have to wait.
last point i want to make is that the 02 TL-S was released early 2001, and information about it came out relatively early as well. why are they so tight-lipped on the new TL?

1SICKLEX

OMG, HPT is the LAMEST performance upgrade of all time. "Hey, I got that HPT model".

ANYONE can get ANY HPT on ANY CAR buy going to the TIRE RACK and buying some MICHELIN PILOT SPORTS!!

That is so lame. And your dreaming if you think it's trying to take the 5. ANY year 5.

The TL will remain a nice car, but not a serious sports sedan.

jimcol711

im going to have to withhold my judgement till i find out EXACTLY what HPT entails...if it is just tires, then yeah, its a waste and a joke, but if its a decent package like 18's with summer tires, brembos and sport suspension, NOW THATS a performance package worth getting

AcuraFan

Yep. The TL is going upscale to compete with the A6 and 5 series. I've heard it will be around $35 - $37.


Leave it to Sick to be critical of something he knows nothing about.

Here's the deal, Acura tried making good cars with over the top HP. It didn't quite work. So now they're are trying slightly better HP than the competition but making exceptionally well built cars. The TSX is only slightly more powerful than the competition but because of size, handling and build quality, it's just as good as the competition and is selling very well. The new TL may only be 270hp, but the build quality will put it right up there with the competition. It's not going to unseat the 5 series as the über-sports sedan, but it will be a successful alternative...it's going to actually be competition.

DISRUPTV

awd will be coming for the TL

HOWEVER, expect it approx 2 years after the new Rl is introduced...The RL will have awd 1st since its the flagship...thus, expect a AWD tl in model year 2007

Zoot

it's not a fucking model! It is an option. People won't go around calling it the HPT version or whatever you think. Look at your beloved Lexus. Do you notice that there are packages where the only thing in it that is new is a fucking cargo net? Lexus even has a package for summer tires on the GS (and probably other models.

Zapata

lol please aside from the 540 the rest of the 5 series is seriously over priced for what you get. You don't see that many 540s on the road. New TL will wipe the floor with 525s and 530s.

1SICKLEX

If I recall LEXUS called the GS 400 the HPS (HIGH PERFORMANCE SEDAN) back in 1997 on the car show circuit.

Now here comes Acura with HPT (HIGH PERFORMANCE TIRE) which is lame.

Acurafan, I know your a fan, but jeez, a hooked up Accord will never battle ANY 5-series. That is like me saying an ES 300 or an I-35 is an E-class or A-6 alternative. No way Jose.Acura can't sell NSXs at 60k let alone 90k.
Acura could not sell Legends when they were 40-45k
Acura can't sell RL's with 5k discounts at 40k
Acura could not sell 30k CLs
A 35-37k TL would make is sell slow as molasses.

Acura CAN sell 40k MDXs
Acura CAN sell anything with an Acura badge under 30k

Acura is cool, hella better than many other cars but these are facts.

While Lexus first went to RWD, then Lincoln, then Caddy, Jaguar (well AWD, they REFUSED to sell their FWD X-type b/c they felt no one would buy a FWD Jag here) now Infiniti (for entry level sedans), Acura basically REFUSES too join in.

So it will remain a good car but not a true sports sedan.

Zapata

welp.....call it a sports sedan or call it whatever.....fact remains.....it'll be much better than anything in the price range. Everbody was/is doubting the TSX.....they are all over the place now. Please, Acura has it's faults but it has hit two right out of the park with the TSX and TL. Of course i'm basing all of this on an assumption that the TL will mirror the TSX interior fit and finish Should be interesting....

cusdaddy

I think the new TL will be built in the US right? If so, I have my doubts about the build quality. Look at the US Accord vs the TSX. My 03 Accord isn't built badly, but the windows rattle like crazy and overall it creaks sorta like my CL.

I'll reserve judgement until I see the new TL, but if it's anything like the US Accord, I have my doubts it will be built as well as the TSX let alone the 5 series, A6, E Class

AcuraFan

Like Zap was saying, the TSX is a hit. And if Acura can reproduce the same quality in the TL then it will also be a hit. The ES is decent competition for the 5 series and A6 I suppose but it doesn't have the driving excitment. The I35 doesn't have the interior quality and refinement (IMHO). The TL will most likely have both. If it's a mid-sized translation of the TSX (like I'm hoping it is) it will have buckets of refinement and fun-to-drive performance...and all for much less than a 5 series. I think it's going to compete well.

In your mind a TL will always be a "hooked up Accord". Therefore, that's how you see it. And that's all you'll ever see. You need an open mind or you will prejudge everything. You're never going to truely like what Acura puts out if you immediately put it down before knowing anything about it...before driving it. And that begs the question...Why are you even here? I'm sure there's a 5 series board somewhere that would love to have you around.

BTW: The TL uses a larger version of the Accord Chassis, as far as I know, that's where the similarities stop. How can this new luxury car be considered a "hooked up Accord"?

I think you're right. Everyone was hating on the TSX. Interestingly enough, the only other car that gets reviews like the TSX is getting is the 3 series...I'd say that's pretty good competition. If I were in the market for an entry level sports sedan, I'd buy a TSX and pocket the difference. And if the TL is equally good for it's bracket, I'll buy a TL over a 5 series and pocket that difference.

heyitsme

i don't think acura hit the tsx out of the park, its selling but its nothing new and it hasn't set any records. as far as being built in the us vs the tsx in japan, doesn't sound like you've gotten round to the tsx boards lol rattle boxes.

AcuraFan

lol. Of course the TSX will have better build quality that the Accord. The Accord is an economy family car. The TSX is a luxury sports sedan from a luxury nameplate. Just because they're from the same parent company doesn't mean they're built with the same philosophy. I'll admit, I'd rather see the new TL come from Japan but you can't have everything. Acura is taking these new cars very seriously. They don't want to mess this up. I'm going to give them the benefit of the doubt for the time being.

AcuraFan

Very few cars are homers. As far as sales go, the 3 and 5 series are no home run hitters themselves (quality is a different story). The TSX is selling better than expected and the with the quality of car, I think it has real staying power.

To do any better than the TSX is doing you'd need a $25K sedan with an interior like a Maybach and an engine like a NSX. That practically seems to be what you guys thought you were going to get. And then started calling for Acura's head when you didn't get it. I don't understand what you guys think is missing from the TSX. It does everything very well and competes very well in its class. It's like you need something to complain about. My grandma always said "You'd complain if you were hung with a new rope".

As for TSX forums...I do read them...daily. I've seen very few complaints. Most TSX owners love their cars and praise their quality relentlessly.

cusdaddy

The TSX is the European/Japanese Accord. It has the same build quality as that car. Honda's from Japan are better built than Honda's from the US. We'll see about the new TL, but I have my doubts.

The current TL/CL are from a luxury nameplate. They are built in the US. My CL actually was worse than my Accord with rattles. I doubt just because it's an Acura, it will magically be more more solid than the Accord (which it's based on)

civic4982

glad I didn't wait for the new TL... I wouldn't be able to afford it.

1SICKLEX

Dude, my first Lex was an ES 300. I got 3 close friends with a CL-S,TL and a TL-S. The build quality of Camry/Accord based luxury cars are no where near platform specific 5 series etc cars, that is my point. Even the new ES, it has a beautiful interior but is just not as solid as more expensive cars.

I think a 37k TL is as nuts as a 37K G35 or a 37K ES 300.

AcuraFan

I guess we're both fortunate that you don't have to buy one then.

Ok, my hands smell like dill...that's my cue to go to bed.

mattg

nice of the non acura owners to stop by and talk a load of shit.

kthxbye.

heyitsme

opinions vary, just cause your think its a great car doesn't mean everyone has to agree with you. why you're posting the tsx will have/does have better build quality than an accord cause the accord rattles is beyond me when the tsx is having the same problems, guess acura isn't that serious yet?

AcuraFan

Yep, you're right. Opinions vary. I like it. You don't. No big whoop. Reviews and sales seem to indicate that I'm not the only one.

As far as Acura being serious...IMO, the TSX has the best interior Acura/Honda has this side of the RL. Noticably better than the Accord. I test drove them back to back a couple months ago so I could get an idea of the difference (a loaded Accord V6 vs. an auto TSX).

But I digress, this a TL thread.

heyitsme

i think its a fine car, the price is a little steep imo and i only hope that acura hasn't done away with the typeS versions which i think is a great idea, unless of course they dump the S for R's. not sure how i feel about the base tl having ~270 until i see the mpg estimates.