Iceman

More powerful than a V8, and twice the gas mileage.

Gebbeth

I still have my doubts about IMA on the new RL. The parameters of a gas efficient model as oppossed to a performance car are too wide to risk having IMA in the RL by next year. Let's say you're taking a curve and shift down entering the turn, then accelerate out of the turn when you just pass the apex, when willl IMA kick in? What are the variables involved in that? Will IMA kick in at certain times and not kick in during others during maneuvering and durign acceleration and what triggers that? The driver may be in for a nasty surprise, and that unpredictability is why I do not think IMA will work in a performance car as of this date or by next year. BMW will also get hit for similar reasons with the active steering system....no one is going to buy that as an option on the new 5 because all the testers who have tried it do not like the unpredictability of that system when driving for performance. Honda cannot make that kind of mistake on the RL.

Given what I've heard, it's going to be a V6 with AWD, probably based on a souped up version of the AWD system on the MDX.

RJC RSX

i'm sure any IMA system would be completely seamless in operation.

swami

There were some pics floating around awhile ago showing a car undergoing track testing. The speculation was that it was the new RL, the car although heavily disguised, did indeed look very TLish.

swami

I forgot to mention it looked BADASS. I don't remember the scar as people refer to it, which is fine by me. I'm not a fan of that anyway.

biker

Actually a lot of folks will buy the Active steering on the new 5 series because it's part of the sport package and many dealer stocked cars will come that way. The average BMW buyer might not even notice the option or care (I've driven it and it's not that big a deal). The real enthusiast will notice but they are like on this board, the minority (and they might buy it anyway because they have to have the rest of the sport package).
As I mentioned it could be IMA simply for no other reason but to beat Lexus to the punch (it could by mere months since the new GS might have it also). I'm sure Toyota is working out the bugs in cars like the Prius and then trasfering the knowledge to the GS. I'm sure Honda has learned a thing or two from the Civic Hybrid and Insight. It could also be that Honda will market the system but will not actually be available until sometime later in the model run. If it has a plain 4WD or AWD drive system most folks will just say "so what?". Virtually none of the other luxury makes have a 4WD or AWD in their top of the line cars.

RJC RSX

well obviously you can't have fwd, and rwd just isn't that practical, so they're left with awd

ElectronFlux

The M45 has some nice ideas.

- pwerful ingine...
- voece activat'd cntrls
- amricn muscle car look
- Spell chckr *(joke)

BbPhaeton

Hope my bad photoshop skills will force Honda to release official pictures/sketch soon.

Feel free to edit if you have more talent than me.

BbPhaeton

Add orig.jpg for bigger image.

BbPhaeton

Man, I feel like talking to myself about the new RL:

Link from VTEC.NET about interview with the new Honda chief.

http://www.vtec.net/news/news-item?news_item_id=176380

RWD RL, huh?

Raheel

I am almost positive they would not make the RL RWD.

G2Ray

Junkster

G2Ray, great post, what mag is that from?

If the mag's guess on the look is somewhat on the mark, I think the styling might be a blessing and a curse.

Blessing, because it seems like they might tame-down the TL/TSX edgy looks to appeal to the older demographic of buyers who don't want things that might seem too flashy for them.

Curse, because the design might be too tame for potential buyers to be lured to the car. The look might be too evolutionary and doesn't break the design mold of the previous RL.

None the less, we now have some clue as to what the design team at Acura is looking for.

Junkster, who just wondered if Honda has ever used a out-of-house design for their car.

Raheel

front reminds me of a udi.

SPUDMTN

Well...it looks like an Audi because I think that's an A8 photo-chop. Check out the head-restraints--pure Audi A8. Besides that, the wide stance and mirrors are a dead give-away.

As for the design. I'm likin the front-end view. The rear end is far too soft for my liking. It's not crisp like the other Acura models and is WAY too rounded. I do realize that these are just guesses, however...but I have a funny feeling that the car we're gonna see is going to look similar to these...

biker

Anyone out there can translate some of what that says about the 4WD system? 300 HP is a nice increase from the current model but it will need it with the increased weight of 4WD. Looks very much like an A8.

G2Ray

I'm not sure which magazine this was scanned from. I too have a feeling the new RL will look somewhat similar to the pics.

BbPhaeton

Based on the spy picture, I don't think we'll see the side indentation like the TL running alongside the door handles. Instead there will be a character line/bulge directly below the side windows and extending to the trunk

Also, the rear lamps will be clear like S2000.

I like the front if it is like the latest p-chop picture.

1SICKLEX

That spy pic looks just like the discontinued Mazda Millenia. Which is not a bad thing, that was a good looking car.

acuraman_RENAMED

Looks like we'll be keeping the wife's RL another six months....: )

tsx-mdxman

That is surely the Japanese market version of the TL, Honda Inspire or whatever, definitely not the new RL. Looks exactly like the TL with a Honda nose. Look closer.

Junkster

Look closely at the bottom picture (large photochop). Now look at the 'RL' quoted within the Japanese text.

I wonder if the JDM name is also being changed from Legend?

Junkster, who reads fine prints.

biker

I just noticed that also. The RL name is only used in NA and only with the Acura badge. Everywhere else it's a Honda Legend. And what the heck is S-VTEC? And the smallest picture there doesn't look like an engine bay or an engine. Maybe that's the picture of the IMA system.
We need someone to translate that.

tsx-mdxman

Maybe the article was about the new RL but the photo is of a badly mangled/photoshopped TL. The pictured car shares far too many styling cues with the new TL to be a RL - the "cut" line down the side is exactly the same, contour around front of rear wheel opening, c pillar, etc. Everythings been stretched to look bigger, the photos are just "bad scoop." There is no way in hell that is not a TL. The photoshopped picture near the beginning of this thread is more likely what the car will look like. I'll bet you a six pack, Junkster!

Junkster

Good lord man, I never said it wasn't a photoshop of another car (hence, photochop). Yea, it's the TL. It sounded like you were say the car pictured was actually a TL, and not what they were predicting was the RL. My post was saying that IF the guesses were correct. READ man, READ!!!

J/k, dude, I know you're good for it.

Now, about that six pack... I don't know, that other photochop looks pretty butchered as well, with just a TL grill stuck on to the car, instead of trying to predict what the body details were going to be. I would have to say that the RL won't be as aggressively styled as the TL, so I guess I would have to take your bet. Let's make it a six of guiness!!!

Junkster, who loves arguing with tsx-mdx, because he doesn't call people 'moron'.

tsx-mdxman

Yes - Pub Draft only.

Junkster

Good Man!!!

Funny story, a couple of days ago, some college buddies and I went out for dinner, and one of them order a pint of guiness. Then he finished his pint before his burger came out. Two bites and he was done. Yes, beware the power of guiness!!! It's a meal in a pint, I tell ya.

Junkster, who had a pint in England once, but was too drunk to remember the experience. (have photos though... bad photos)

Junkster

If they change the non-NA name to the RL, I'll lose alot of respect I had for the Acura badge. That name is a legend (pun intended) in automotive history. S-vtec,... hmmm, can't even take a stab at that one. Might be something missed in the Tokyo Auto Show reports. The little thing has to be the AWD IMA system right?
No use... need translation...

Junkster, who watched anime since 6 years old, and yet can't understand Japanese.

iNteGraz92

that engine pic is NOT IMA. it is an engine bay picture of the HSC concept.

BuddySol

My Japanese isn't the greatest...Kanji killed me when taking Japanese 4 in college. So reading it, all I can read is...

"something something LEGEND (of/belonging to) AMERICA something something ACURA RL (of/belonging to) SIZE something something something something...." That's literal...

Prolly, is trying to say, "In America, the Legend is called the Acura RL, which is sized..."

Precision Crafted

I've been thinking somewhat about the next RL compaired to the current TL. I'd agree that the ELS system in the RL will be more powerfull with maybe two more speakers for a total of 10. I would guess that the custom memory settings could include the ability to adjust when the lights come on compaired to the preprogramed setting. It would be nice if the pass seat offered at least 8 way pwr w/ memory for the seat and the dual climate settings.

I also agree that a pwr adjustable back seat is in order along with heating. However it needs to be set up to turn off when the engine is off. What I mean is if I turn the seat heater on in my TL it will come on everytime I start the car. By having it go off and stay off it will prevent the battery drain Acura tells you about. A rear window sun shade is needed. I also think the rear HVAC system from the MDX is in order. And the card key system is a MUST HAVE!

As for the styling I would guess that the RL was being penned after the TL's look was set in stone. After all the TSX was designed after the TL. Most people complain that the RL lost it's way when the name was chaged from Legend. Well the name change had nothing to do w/ it as did the "I can be like Lexus". The "first" RL was too soft and Acura has been making up for it ever since (compaired to the TL the RL is two generations old now). I say Acura needs to bring performance back to the RL. Forget being cushy. That is what the Town Car is for.

Anyway as for IMA, who can say for how long they've been developing that. Just because they have only been talking about it for a while doesn't mean that it still has a lot of bugs. Also while I am aware of the mention of not having a RWD set up I would say that at some point in time Honda has developed that set up but their determination not to produce one as well as wanting to build as many cars as they can off of two basic platforms is an effort to save money. If the new RL is not a knock out in it's market segment, then it is doomed and the TL might as well become the new flagship sedan. Oh, and while they are at it I would like to see a coupe again

phile

I would like to see the RL with a powerful V6 and IMA. The president of Honda basically stated that the RL is either AWD or RWD. I think AWD with RWD bias will give the RL the best of both worlds...performance and traction in bad weather. And an RL coupe...what a concept! And a backup camera with the nav system, a la MDX.

Raheel

Ya, All those stupid little things like Back Up Camera and all those goodies they left out that needed to be on TL, Like side mirror indicators, and iVtec and stuff, will probably come out on the New RL...

It seems odd the TL doesn't have bottom fog lights and stuff, I know they are built in, but I would rather have a option or BOTH

I think all the things missing will be in the NEW RL, and everyone will be happy, But along will come a pricetag, What do you people think it will cost?

biker

The MSRP probably won't go up much but like all new models the real price might since you won't be getting any discounts.

Considering the RL will be competing pricewise for the upper middle market of the luxury class and everyone else has or will have a pretty good vehicle in this class (new 5 series, E-class, Infiniti M45 and Lexus GS due next year) it will be a tough market to take away market share. From the sounds of it the RL might be compared with the next GS since they will both probably be RWD/AWD with IMA. It's going to be some though competition but that means better cars for us.

1SICKLEX

I agree. I am eargerly anticipating the next GS to be sold in fall 04 as an 05 model. I know it will be reliable, I know it will be feature laden, I know it will be well built and I know the interior will be incredible. I am SO SCARED of how it will look and will I like it.

biker

Exactly. We already know what the next M35 will look like and I like it but I'm still not sure about getting a Nissan (rebadged as an Infiniti). I think a GS330 (assuming they stick the 3.3L V6 out of the ES and RX) with 6 sp MT for less than $40 K will be a very desirable car IF the looks are there.

Now if the RL price doesn't jump too much, it's RWD and available with an MT then it could also be a desireable car. We can probably surmise that it will have the institutional Acura look (like TSX and TL).

phile

Why is theo2709 telling him to watch his back?! Did he actually leak something that's correct?

biker

Of course knowing Honda that makes the most sense although not what I would have guessed after the head of Honda said the RL won't be FWD. All of Honda's main line cars are FWD (even the Pilot/MDX bias towards FWD when not in 4WD mode - unlike most SUV which bias to RWD).

Actually Honda seems to be keeping the lid on this fairly well. They might pull a Lexus GS type launch, where everyone knows it's coming very soon (2 weeks in the case of the GS) but have no idea what it looks like or any other detail of the car.

BbPhaeton

A little update from vtec:

http://www.vtec.net/news/news-item?news_item_id=208337

Copy and paste here:

'05 Acura RL - As you probably know by now, a prototype of the production '05 RL is set to be unveiled at next month's New York International Auto Show. As usual, the Temple of VTEC will be in attendance, delivering full coverage. Just recently we've heard some information from several diverse sources and the info seems to be fairly solid. Some of the stuff has already been "confirmed" (by logical interpretation of public statements), but some of it is new. In the first category is the drivetrain - we can say with virtually 100% certainty that it will be a V6 with AWD. The AWD system will almost certainly be based upon the Pilot/MDX's VTM system. One source (in our own forums) goes a step further and reports that the standard torque biasing will be 70/30 front to rear. Current horsepower estimates peg the car at around 300hp. We've heard a number of figures on displacement ranging from 3.4 to 3.8L, but our best guess is that it will use a 3.5L variant of the TL's motor. IMA does not seem to be a part of the equation at the time of launch. Other interesting tidbits: the RL will feature fairly extensive use of aluminum body panels: roof, hood, and trunklid. The car will also continue to build upon Acura's renewed emphasis on performance. The car is said to perform as well or better than the hot '04 TL (recall the TL 6MT's very impressive skidpad and slalom figures). Based upon our sources, it seems the car will be positioned lower than where earlier rumors had it pegged (those rumors indicated it would be a true 7-series, S-class or Lexus LS competitor). While the TL is positioned against the 5-series (yet priced like a 3-series), the RL will very likely fall somewhere in between the 5-series and 7-series in size. Pricing will probably not deviate too far from the current RL's pricing, and the content level will build upon the TL's segment-blasting features. We've heard a few reports that luxury items such as power adjusted rear seats will appear on the RL. It's our understanding that the car's audio system was not developed with ELS. I will personally be surprised if it surpasses the TL's superb ELS system. As in past Legend/RL models, the car's development was carried out almost entirely in Japan and it will be built there as well. update 06.mar: one other item that was rumored to be in the car is "paddle shifters". If true, in all likelihood this means the car has switches mounted on the steering wheel to control the Sportshift function of the automatic transmission - the source of this partiicular rumor did not know anything beyond "paddle shifters".