CL: some nice 12's
04-03-2010, 05:24 PM
#1
some nice 12's
I'm possibly switching up some subs.
I'm thinking of running only a pair of 12's.
I need them to be dual 2 or dual 1 ohms.
I will be running them with 1600w rms each each.
What would be good subs for my power.
Also I don't want to give up anymore than 2.5cu ft. for each.
I want the set up for daily loud music but,I also want to shake anything near when I dump some boost.
(with only a pair of 12's)
I'm thinking of running only a pair of 12's.
I need them to be dual 2 or dual 1 ohms.
I will be running them with 1600w rms each each.
What would be good subs for my power.
Also I don't want to give up anymore than 2.5cu ft. for each.
I want the set up for daily loud music but,I also want to shake anything near when I dump some boost.
(with only a pair of 12's)
04-03-2010, 09:47 PM
#8
Lol, i don't know much about them. The guy who showed me the sub had a red 1, it was a 12 and maaaan. Another option is the higher end Eclipse sub line or Digital Designs. But im sure that the guys who hit up competitions will provide you with more affordable options.
In other words, Matt will let you know lol.
In other words, Matt will let you know lol.
04-03-2010, 11:20 PM
#9
Drifting
Sorry, Richard, I've been at a comp all day... Funny how dykyy knew (even if inadvertently) about it.
I've got a couple questions for you:
1. Is that 2.5 cubes a gross volume or net volume? Because stuffing 2 12s in 5 cubes gross is going to be very difficult, whereas if it's 5 cubes net, you're going to be in a much better position... Just to further this explanation, my current box for my 2 10s is 9.1 cubes if you go by the external dimensions, but the sealed chamber is 1 cube and the ported chamber is ~4.5 cubes or so. That being said, my box is a bandpass which is larger than your standard ported box but still.
2. If your space is 5 cubes gross, you're going to be looking for a pair of 10s, or possibly even 8s. The problem with 8s would be that they will not handle that type of power (well, not in a daily box anyway) and you really only have 2 options: DD 1508 (golden standard by which all other 8s are judged) and the Sundown SA-8 (new dog on the block, but looks very promising. Also dwarfs the 1508 in terms of motor size and strength) but it's really up to you.
That being said, for 1600w per on that budget, I'd be looking into some AudioQue HDC3 copper coils. They'll handle that power easily (ignore the 1kw rating, it's complete bs if your box is even decent) and should sound pretty damn good and get really god damn loud. If you wanted to, you could run 10s and surprise the hell out of everyone that you're local to, especially when you tell them the brand and they think it's some flea market crap, which happens all the time to some buddies of mine in Chicago.
If you don't like the HDC3's, I'd look into DC Audio lvl 4's. Currently, I'm considering both for a possible rebuild for next season. I'm also considering 6 8s, but that's another story altogether...
Oh, and dykyy, you'd be hard pressed to find either of the subs you mentioned for under $500. If you could though, both could be great choices. I'd personally prefer the Eclipse Ti subs over any DD's, but that's just me.
I've got a couple questions for you:
1. Is that 2.5 cubes a gross volume or net volume? Because stuffing 2 12s in 5 cubes gross is going to be very difficult, whereas if it's 5 cubes net, you're going to be in a much better position... Just to further this explanation, my current box for my 2 10s is 9.1 cubes if you go by the external dimensions, but the sealed chamber is 1 cube and the ported chamber is ~4.5 cubes or so. That being said, my box is a bandpass which is larger than your standard ported box but still.
2. If your space is 5 cubes gross, you're going to be looking for a pair of 10s, or possibly even 8s. The problem with 8s would be that they will not handle that type of power (well, not in a daily box anyway) and you really only have 2 options: DD 1508 (golden standard by which all other 8s are judged) and the Sundown SA-8 (new dog on the block, but looks very promising. Also dwarfs the 1508 in terms of motor size and strength) but it's really up to you.
That being said, for 1600w per on that budget, I'd be looking into some AudioQue HDC3 copper coils. They'll handle that power easily (ignore the 1kw rating, it's complete bs if your box is even decent) and should sound pretty damn good and get really god damn loud. If you wanted to, you could run 10s and surprise the hell out of everyone that you're local to, especially when you tell them the brand and they think it's some flea market crap, which happens all the time to some buddies of mine in Chicago.
If you don't like the HDC3's, I'd look into DC Audio lvl 4's. Currently, I'm considering both for a possible rebuild for next season. I'm also considering 6 8s, but that's another story altogether...
Oh, and dykyy, you'd be hard pressed to find either of the subs you mentioned for under $500. If you could though, both could be great choices. I'd personally prefer the Eclipse Ti subs over any DD's, but that's just me.
04-04-2010, 04:56 PM
#10
^Yea man, thats what i said initially. The subs that i have mentioned all come with a nice price tag on them, which does not really mean that they will be any better than the cheaper alternative brands that you have mentioned. Ill be honest, i have never even heard of them. Lol, but thats why ur here.
04-04-2010, 05:14 PM
#11
Drifting
dykyy, I do what I can, and help where I have more experience than people, and try to keep my mouth shut when I don't know the answer.
The Eclipse Ti is a very nice driver, similar to a TC Sounds/AudioPulse. They're great for SQ and the higher end models to handle gobs of power, but they're not going to win you any SPL comps or keep your bank account happy. That being said, given the chance to run them, I wouldn't hesitate if I had the money and found one in good condition.
DD has the 9500 series, which would easily take the 1600w that Richard's trying to run per sub, but I'm not a huge fan of the way they sound. These also come with quite the price tag. The 3500 series is more budget friendly, but would be maxed out on Richard's power, if they'd even take it. The AudioQue with a copper coil is between the 3500 and 9500 in terms of power handling, although I like the AQ's sq a lot better. With the aluminum coil, the AQ will take very similar power to the 9500 DD.
Another option that would be a less budget friendly, although more SQ oriented Sundown Z v2. I used the Z15 with the prototype dual 2 ohm coil and was very impressed not only with the build quality, but also the sound quality and SPL. It was a very nice versatile driver, but again, it's going to cost more. The 12" version has a price tag of $425 each, but is supposed to be a significant improvement over the V1 in terms of SQ, and has major improvements in terms of cooling and power handling. Jacob was burping the prototype 15s on 9kws of clamped power (2 Sundown 4500D prototypes on 16v) and they were working just fine. This is of course burps only, and in his Jeep, which is very well set up for SPL competition.
Those are my thoughts/suggestions, and if you've got any more questions, feel free to ask...
The Eclipse Ti is a very nice driver, similar to a TC Sounds/AudioPulse. They're great for SQ and the higher end models to handle gobs of power, but they're not going to win you any SPL comps or keep your bank account happy. That being said, given the chance to run them, I wouldn't hesitate if I had the money and found one in good condition.
DD has the 9500 series, which would easily take the 1600w that Richard's trying to run per sub, but I'm not a huge fan of the way they sound. These also come with quite the price tag. The 3500 series is more budget friendly, but would be maxed out on Richard's power, if they'd even take it. The AudioQue with a copper coil is between the 3500 and 9500 in terms of power handling, although I like the AQ's sq a lot better. With the aluminum coil, the AQ will take very similar power to the 9500 DD.
Another option that would be a less budget friendly, although more SQ oriented Sundown Z v2. I used the Z15 with the prototype dual 2 ohm coil and was very impressed not only with the build quality, but also the sound quality and SPL. It was a very nice versatile driver, but again, it's going to cost more. The 12" version has a price tag of $425 each, but is supposed to be a significant improvement over the V1 in terms of SQ, and has major improvements in terms of cooling and power handling. Jacob was burping the prototype 15s on 9kws of clamped power (2 Sundown 4500D prototypes on 16v) and they were working just fine. This is of course burps only, and in his Jeep, which is very well set up for SPL competition.
Those are my thoughts/suggestions, and if you've got any more questions, feel free to ask...
04-04-2010, 08:25 PM
#12
[QUOTE=mattastick;11889314]dykyy, I do what I can, and help where I have more experience than people, and try to keep my mouth shut when I don't know the answer.
^ I have never asserted that this is the stuff to get or that he should get whatever, because its the best. Not at all. I just told him what i know and what i heard, or seen or read about. I was voicing my opinion, and whether it was constructive or not, I don't know. So man I don't know why you would get so annoyed with that.
^ I have never asserted that this is the stuff to get or that he should get whatever, because its the best. Not at all. I just told him what i know and what i heard, or seen or read about. I was voicing my opinion, and whether it was constructive or not, I don't know. So man I don't know why you would get so annoyed with that.
04-04-2010, 08:40 PM
#13
Drifting
I'm not annoyed, I was just commenting on the whole "but that's why ur here" part. I greatly appreciate all opinions, trust me. And having someone else that actually knows internet companies is very nice.
04-04-2010, 08:59 PM
#14
Never meant it in a negative way. On the contrary, i meant the fact that, you always fill us in with info on different brands, products, ratings,. etc. Which is good because it widens the horizons of mine and other ppl's hobby.
Well, lol this won't be the first internet miscommunication.
Well, lol this won't be the first internet miscommunication.
04-05-2010, 12:59 AM
#18
Instructor
04-05-2010, 01:03 AM
#19
Instructor
I'm possibly switching up some subs.
I'm thinking of running only a pair of 12's.
I need them to be dual 2 or dual 1 ohms.
I will be running them with 1600w rms each each.
What would be good subs for my power.
Also I don't want to give up anymore than 2.5cu ft. for each.
I want the set up for daily loud music but,I also want to shake anything near when I dump some boost.
(with only a pair of 12's)
I'm thinking of running only a pair of 12's.
I need them to be dual 2 or dual 1 ohms.
I will be running them with 1600w rms each each.
What would be good subs for my power.
Also I don't want to give up anymore than 2.5cu ft. for each.
I want the set up for daily loud music but,I also want to shake anything near when I dump some boost.
(with only a pair of 12's)
04-05-2010, 01:36 AM
#20
Three Wheelin'
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Mooresville NC
Age: 39
Posts: 1,942
Likes: 0
Received 11 Likes
on
10 Posts
You sir are a moron. I love when ppl think a w7 is the too of line. I'll put my omega against a w7 anyday. Do you even know anything about cascade or Orion stuff
04-05-2010, 05:47 AM
#21
Drifting
As for cost determining quality, not a good way to judge that there buddy... You can get roughly the same SQ and more SPL for about half the cost from any of a handful of companies...
There's only a couple of ways a W7 could get louder than 2 omegas or HCCA's, and both result from either: 1. poor install (terrible box for the omegas or HCCA's) or 2. not enough power to properly push the subs. The Omegas are rated at 2kws rms and the old HCCA's (only ones really worth anything) are known to have taken up to 7-8kwrms. The problem with the HCCA's is that they like a very large enclosure, similar to the SoundStream XXX-15's (and now the 18s as well). That being said, if I had anything over 1kw rated rms (and knew I was going to get it) I would not be wasting any money on any of the mainstream brands. The only mainstream subs rated for 1kw (that I remember off the top of my head) are the JL W7, Alpine Type X and the RF T2. 2 of those 3 have retail prices over $700, with the 3rd retailing for $450. For $450, I could get a Sundown Z V2 (choice of sizes) that would rival the W7 in terms of SQ and would "pound harder" than the W7 all day and all night, while taking anywhere from 1-2kws or so. Then I could hook up an extra amp to it and run up to 9kws for a 5 second burp... Let's see the W7 do that...
Really? Here you were talking up the W7, then you go and include the mtx 9500 in this discussion? Now there's a sub that's completely out-classed...
04-06-2010, 01:47 AM
#23
Instructor
Yeah, you're wrong there... Hate to tell you buddy... The W7 may sound better than the other 2, but in the right enclosure, both the Omegas and the HCCA's can sound damn good. Plus the W7 would not do well on 1600w. There's a reason they're rated at 1kw...
As for cost determining quality, not a good way to judge that there buddy... You can get roughly the same SQ and more SPL for about half the cost from any of a handful of companies...
There's only a couple of ways a W7 could get louder than 2 omegas or HCCA's, and both result from either: 1. poor install (terrible box for the omegas or HCCA's) or 2. not enough power to properly push the subs. The Omegas are rated at 2kws rms and the old HCCA's (only ones really worth anything) are known to have taken up to 7-8kwrms. The problem with the HCCA's is that they like a very large enclosure, similar to the SoundStream XXX-15's (and now the 18s as well). That being said, if I had anything over 1kw rated rms (and knew I was going to get it) I would not be wasting any money on any of the mainstream brands. The only mainstream subs rated for 1kw (that I remember off the top of my head) are the JL W7, Alpine Type X and the RF T2. 2 of those 3 have retail prices over $700, with the 3rd retailing for $450. For $450, I could get a Sundown Z V2 (choice of sizes) that would rival the W7 in terms of SQ and would "pound harder" than the W7 all day and all night, while taking anywhere from 1-2kws or so. Then I could hook up an extra amp to it and run up to 9kws for a 5 second burp... Let's see the W7 do that...
Really? Here you were talking up the W7, then you go and include the mtx 9500 in this discussion? Now there's a sub that's completely out-classed...
As for cost determining quality, not a good way to judge that there buddy... You can get roughly the same SQ and more SPL for about half the cost from any of a handful of companies...
There's only a couple of ways a W7 could get louder than 2 omegas or HCCA's, and both result from either: 1. poor install (terrible box for the omegas or HCCA's) or 2. not enough power to properly push the subs. The Omegas are rated at 2kws rms and the old HCCA's (only ones really worth anything) are known to have taken up to 7-8kwrms. The problem with the HCCA's is that they like a very large enclosure, similar to the SoundStream XXX-15's (and now the 18s as well). That being said, if I had anything over 1kw rated rms (and knew I was going to get it) I would not be wasting any money on any of the mainstream brands. The only mainstream subs rated for 1kw (that I remember off the top of my head) are the JL W7, Alpine Type X and the RF T2. 2 of those 3 have retail prices over $700, with the 3rd retailing for $450. For $450, I could get a Sundown Z V2 (choice of sizes) that would rival the W7 in terms of SQ and would "pound harder" than the W7 all day and all night, while taking anywhere from 1-2kws or so. Then I could hook up an extra amp to it and run up to 9kws for a 5 second burp... Let's see the W7 do that...
Really? Here you were talking up the W7, then you go and include the mtx 9500 in this discussion? Now there's a sub that's completely out-classed...
04-06-2010, 05:26 AM
#24
Drifting
well all the omegas and orion i have seen were not that impressive, they seemed cheap or low buget, maybe they were not installed right idk but i have have seen many JL set-up that would stop your heart lol...plus i think those 9500s are very impressive as well with a good amp. from what i have seen and heard orion is not quality stuff...you may have seen more than me and thats why im wrong just going on what i know...
My buddy has 2 Omega 18s on 5250w (clamped power during a burp) and they're sick. Absolutely nuts. So any that you heard were probably not set up correctly, in a bad box, or not being fed enough power.
Another buddy is running 2 MTX 9500 15s in his mustang (older 5.0L hatch) and is doing mid 140 dbs (145.2, IIRC this weekend) on 2400w. They're not too bad, but just swapping to some AudioQue HDC3's would probably gain him 2db... He's working on saving up for them I know, since he built his new box to HDC3 specs.
The older Orion HCCA's were absolutely sick. The new stuff is junk, you're right. The old red basket HCCA's are like the old Soundstream XXX-15s, where you can feed them damn near 10kws rms daily and they'll be just fine. The newer HCCA's are alright at best, but don't live up to the HCCA name. Hell, none of the new HCCA line of equipment lives up to the name after the original HCCA gear was gone. Although I did get to see a crazy nice OS collection that a buddy of mine up in Chicago has. I almost beat him over the head with a sub motor (or whatever else I could find) and grabbed all his stuff and left, but he's bigger than me...
04-06-2010, 09:37 AM
#25
Senior Moderator
Regional Coordinator
(Mid-Atlantic)
Regional Coordinator
(Mid-Atlantic)
iTrader: (6)
2.5 cubic feet isn't going to work very well with that much wattage, you will most likely need more airspace than that 
04-07-2010, 12:01 AM
#26
Intermediate
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Redondo Beach
Posts: 38
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I have a pair of 12'' Kicker CVRS in my truck to a 1000 watt amp and it hits hard. My trunk rattles a little the way i listen to it but if you turn it up the whole trunk rattles. LOL
04-07-2010, 05:19 AM
#27
Drifting
Yet another sub that can't hold a candle to the ones mentioned in this thread. Let alone handle the 1600w per sub that OP has on tap...
04-07-2010, 07:31 AM
#28
Drifting
Another option I just thought of would be something that's out of your price range by about $100, but would save you both space and wiring headaches: Bravox EDX D4. You could strap your amps at 2 ohms, showing each a 1 ohm load to get full power out of them. The price is $599 on those. Bravox is a sick company. I run their EXS6's (6.5" "subs") as midbass in my CL and they're underrated as no other. Rated at 100w rms, I'm powering them with 225w and they take it all day and all night. They have a rated fs of 90hz, but they easily play the bassline in songs like Juicebox and Air Forces (high 30hz-mid 40hz range). They're absolutely amazing, and I look forward to running more Bravox gear in the future...
04-07-2010, 11:36 AM
#29
Senior Moderator
Regional Coordinator
(Mid-Atlantic)
Regional Coordinator
(Mid-Atlantic)
iTrader: (6)
04-07-2010, 07:20 PM
#33
Drifting
04-07-2010, 09:54 PM
#34
Three Wheelin'
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Mooresville NC
Age: 39
Posts: 1,942
Likes: 0
Received 11 Likes
on
10 Posts
Best to just do the research yourself. As you can tell some like some subs some like others. in my cl I've had a kicker l7 15 a l7 12 2 dc audio lvl 3's a dd audio 9515 a nightshade 18 and my cacade omega 12. The 18 was the loudest but for space concerns I'm happiest with my omega. maybe try some dc subs out they sound pretty nice. but just get what u want.
04-07-2010, 10:05 PM
#35
Drifting
Problem with that Brian, is that most people don't have access to setups using internet based company's gear. If you have guys local to you running the equipment, then absolutely. But I doubt most people would be able to find any of the subs, let alone half of the ones mentioned in this thread.
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
MrHeeltoe
1G TSX Tires, Wheels, & Suspension
20
02-23-2023 01:54 PM
MrHeeltoe
2G TSX Tires, Wheels & Suspension
3
09-29-2015 10:43 PM
MrHeeltoe
3G TL Tires, Wheels & Suspension
0
09-28-2015 05:43 PM
