sergeremi

Okay, recently a minor problem has turned into a major one. To the tune of speakers/sound cutting out permanently.

Previously I tried making sure the connections at the amps, crossovers and speakers themselves were okay, which they seemed to be. Then I thought maybe the connection at the head unit… well, this is what I found (click on the images for larger ones)


Overall wiring. I think they used 2 sets of male 2 male/female RCAs and chopped off one side. Each set feeds into a seperate female to male RCA cable (which plugs into the amps)



set 1 - black(-)?, blue and pink



set 1 - red(+)?, light blue and purple



RCA set 2 - black(-)?, brown and yellow



RCA set 2 - red(+)?, red and green


Then what's interesting is it looks like some speaker level out are connected directly to the amps?

That big blue sleeve contains green/purple and white/black wires that connect to the speaker outs on the 300/4 amp I thought was powers the upfront components...



Now based on the wiring pre amp wiring instructions posted here for the TSX, this would all seem very, very wrong. But I don’t know if this would just be perhaps another way of wiring. But I’m thinking not. Some of the sound quirks I thought was due to the cabin and placement of speakers, may be attributed to with preamp wiring. Like the seeming overly right side bias of the highs, seeming power spikes, phasing issues and the small amount of alternator whine.

I’m lost now and I fear since the OEM wiring harness got thrashed is it even possible to rewire everything? I don’t want to take it back to the original shop who did it because they treated me like I was an idiot for suggesting not using LOCs and when I provided the preamp instructions like were like yeah whatever. The second shop is no longer in business (but I managed to track down the guy who did the subsequent work).

But before I start on trying the correct the problem, I wanted to address this wiring stuff first before starting to back at the amp and speakers.

Anyone have any thoughts on the preamp wiring job pictured?

Eldude, chuckcarstereo, spoon you guys still out there?

Spoon

I can't say I know offhand if the wiring of the RCA's is correct as the wire colors changed each year. Since the outputs are balanced, it actually doesn't matter which wire coming from the radio goes to the shield or the tip of the RCA connector. However, conceivably you could get crossed channels, but if you don't have a balance or fade issue, then it's likely wired correct. Unless of course, you see where the difference is between your wiring and the write-up. If so, post it.

The wires in the blue bundle connect to wires that would have gone to a different plastic connector than the RCAs do, correct? If those are the speaker wires (in the blue bundle) connected to your 300/4, what they did was tap the OEM speaker wiring at the console rather then run new wire to the doors. This should be fine, I do it myself.

I'm not a fan of those crimp caps and I'd be suspicious of the electrical tape. You might very well have a loose connection at any one of the caps or you could experience a cutout if any bare wire touches the chassis. I'd turn the stereo on and gently pull on the wires at each cap, individually, and see if it cuts out - that would be your bad connection obviously. If each checks out, make sure any exposed wire (the shields of the RCA) is covered - short of solder and heat shrink tubing, your only choice is electrical tape, just wrap the shit out of it and hope it doesn't fall off. If you do that and still have problems, you might need to check the wire runs to see if something was pinched and is grounding out the signal - that would suck, hopefully it's just a poor crimp.

sergeremi

Well before everything cut out I don’t think I really had a fading issue. I would fade left then you’d hear more out of the left. I’d fade right, more out of the right. Fade front, then just the highs and mids, fade to the back only would hear the sub. So I guess then maybe that might be okay?

But the left side always seemed like it had less of an output. For instance, it was never as loud if I faded all the way to the left vs fading all the way to the right. And just before everything crapped out, the left side got really muffled and/or attenuated. All you would hear is the right until fading all the way to the left, then you’d hear out of the left but it was really low.

Yeah, the wires in the blue bundle are speaker wires. So if I understand correctly they just connect the output from the amp to the stock wires that go to the speakers? Is the stock wiring good enough to handle the new amped load? I guess within a certain range, speaker wire is speaker wire right? But would it be possible the stock wire runs would get crimped or grounded as opposed to any of the new wiring done?

I checked last night by tugging the inputs and the outputs. Sound come back but it was off. The left side is still muffled and attenuated. The right sounds like it’s missing some midrange. Things sound tin-like. When I disconnect the sub, you can really tell the mid and low end, that the components should handle, are lacking something.

I don’t know, this is all pretty frustrating.

Spoon

I'm very much a proponent of 'wire is wire', so I don't think that would be a problem. As for the stock wiring getting pinched, I guess anything is possible, but I think the probability is much higher that the new wire runs would be damaged. Assuming that any wire is damaged at all.

Have you tried switching L&R channels - both RCAs and speaker wire outputs, to check amp input and output stages?

I don't entirely follow. The was a loose crimp? Is that one problem down or no?

As to range, what's the high pass crossover point for the components?

vidgamer

It's possible to have loose crimps, but I've had good luck with those crimp caps. You do have to twist the wires together and crimp it hard, though. And, any wire that might be moving (even if it's just the vibration of a moving car) could potentially have a loose wire problem over time. So, the "best" thing would be to solder, but that's kind of a PITA.

Any time I see connections with black electrical tape, that's a real red flag. The wires will just jiggle apart, and the tape isn't going to hold them tightly like a crimp cap. If you have anything like this, I'd just redo the connections myself with crimp caps and save myself some irritation down the road (and it might fix some of your immediate problems). You can always go back later and solder if nothing else works....


Another thing to consider is if the + and - connections are reversed. You can get a "thin" sound out of the overall system, but if you fade to each speaker, it'll sound fine. Unfortunately, since you sit off-center in the car, you'll get this to some extent regardless. Still, try each speaker "both ways" and see what you like best. :-) Also, try reversing the polarity of the sub.

Spoon

This is a good point, wish it had occurred to me. I would definitely check that the polarity of the left and right channels are the same - assuming you are running a woofer/tweeter setup, as opposed to woofer/mid/tweeter (my understanding this is a bit different, or at the very least allows for more flexibility). It's possible that your perception is due to frequency cancellation.

sergeremi

You know, I did that before actually. At one point the cutting out did switch from the right side to the left when I switched the RCA inputs, but then after awhile both sides went out. So that led me to believe that the issue was coming before the amp, which meant at the connection between the HU and RCA splice.

Yeah, the loose crimp was one issue. The attenuated muted sound on the left side was another.


Well I had the chance to take it to the guy that did the wiring last time, this weekend. He had moved onto another shop, but since he did much of the wiring (not the initial wiring of the HU) I though maybe he might have a better insight into the problem. He did manage to make the cutting out stop. When asked what the problem was, he said he didn't know. He took a look at the wiring and said that everything still seemed connected. He said the original wiring WAS soldered, then capped then bound by tape? But if that was the case, is it still possible for connections to become lose when you solder? Anyway, he did hear the cutting out and said all he did was retape some things and "clean" some things up. So I don't know.


I guess for now at least the cutting out is gone. Drove around all weekend over whatever rough road I could find, lots of shifting (things cut out a lot when just shifting not going over rought or bumpy road, like starting from a stop light or down shifting to pass), sharp turns, etc, basically all the things that caused it to cut out before. So that's good news, but I'm not going to be sure until I go a few months and I guess that's not to say it won't start to happen again... so fingers crossed on that.

Now, I've got the issue where the sound seems to come mainly out of the rights side of the car. Having driven around in various loaner TSXes, I've paid particular attention to the stock sound system, mainly the imaging. All of them have had a right side bias for the most part. I guess that's a function of my seat location, height and factory speaker locations. I can understand that which is why I bought the components I did to try to fight that. Knowing that I'm sitting off center and all that I can't expect to get perfect imaging like I can at home, but at least bring the soundstage a little more in line with my expectations. But then again, the newer stuff was installed in the factory locations so... but see the weird thing is that for the most part everything sounds balanced except for the highs (particularly main vocals). Background vocals, midrange and stuff like cymbals seem to playback as recorded (right side if it was right, left side or surround/both), but just the main vocals and some other "center" highs/midrange are decidedly coming out of the right side.

It's just weird. Last time I kinda corrected the issue by switching the polarities of one pair of speaker wires (done at the amp out). It pushed the vocals more towards the center, but the midrange got pushed more to the right, so things kinda sounded disjointed, but better than everything coming out of the right-side. I guess after awhile I got used to it, enough so that I could actually enjoy it. And at time it was really nice sounding.

I guess just with this last round of issues my perception could be a little overly sensitive. Man, I don't think I'm gonna bother with this custom sound stuff anymore. I should just except the stock system and save quality listening to the home audio system. It's just too much for too many imperfections and problems. Of course I could just be saying that now cause I'm in a foul mood and feel like I wasted way too much money for too much dissatisfaction.

I'll try reversing the polarities again this time to see if I can get it back to at least the way I had it before all the stuff happened. I hope that's the last of this stuff I'll have to deal with for awhile.

And curse car manufacturers for being so stingy about their audio setups! These all integrated NAV/Premium sound systems are making it harder and harder to keep the stock HU and build from there.

It's almost better to not get all that crap just so you can upgrade your system without hassle.

elduderino

Glad to see the intermittency is at least intermittently gone.

What the speaker wires were for was undoubtedly to use the OEM wires from the OEM amp location to the OEM speaker locations.

I do run my balance a hair to the L in the TSX when by myself and I think this is what you are referring to about the right side.

It is indeed possible to have a solder go bad... a good crimp is better than a cold solder, is my approach.

sergeremi

Well the problem is back. So a wasted weekend and $70 I'm right back to the problems. I'm beyond pissed right now.

I've tried calling the shop that "fixed" the problem but they never call me back. I don't know wtf that's all about. But I don't think they're too interested in my business.

Right now my only option seems to be having the entire system rewired and testing the amps and HU for any problems. So I guess in finding a shop that will do this what should I ask? I guess I mean like what equipment should I verify they have to correctly test the HU, amps and wiring?