bnilhome

It looks like the RLX Sports Hybrid is finally out, with pricing and specs now up on Acura.com. The RLX Sports Hybrid has an $11,500 premium (starting point) over the non-hybrid RLX. I personally think that is too much variance especially given the RLX is not selling well now.

Which leads to my question about the approach Acura should take if/when they launch a TLX hybrid. First, I think they should offer two hybrids...one a more traditional hybrid that would model the Accord Hybrid and maximizes the city MPG factor. I would price this very competitively with the non-hybrid models (I think Lincoln's MKZ hybrid is the same as the non-hybrid model).

Then, the TLX should also have a sports-hybrid for those wanting more performance from their hybrid. I would hope Acura would have this hybrid marked up only a few thousand over the non-hybrid version of the SH-AWD.

neuronbob

Well, actually, the RLX hybrid is NOT at dealers yet, but given the appearance on Acura's website, the moment is almost at hand. None are in dealer inventories yet. Much to my annoyance. Trust me, we who are interested have been waiting for 18 months and are reading any little sign that they are on the ground.

I don't expect to see a TLX hybrid for at least a model year or two as it will take at least that long for early adopters/"beta testers" to tease out the smaller problems that always crop up in the RLX hybrid, being that it's such a new system. Once done, I expect that Acura will put a hybrid system in its moneymaker sedan, the TLX.

iutodd

The Sport Hybrid is a Tech model. It's $5500 more than FWD tech model which, considering the jump in performance, isn't too bad. Using that same pricing logic a Sport Hybrid TLX Tech could be priced right at $44,750 with the Advance at around $50K.

blacktsxwagon

The gas only engines are getting so efficient in Honda 4cyls, I am starting to question the point of a hybrid at all. It is not like you will ever recoup the cost of the hybrid in the time you own the car, and the net environmental impact of a hybrid remains questionable.

Stew4HD

That is the reason why I haven't jumped on the bandwagon.

ATLPatrick

I agree, Honda does make some very efficient 4 cylinder engines. However if they could make a hybrid with slightly better than 4 cylinder MPG, and v6 or better performance, it would be worth my time to check it out!

Rocketsfan

I would hope Acura would go for performance with their TLX hybrid should they decide to go for it (a la the Q50 hybrid). With 29/36 mileage and 0-60 in around 4.9 seconds, and technology galore, damn ...
I don't know if the real world mileage or acceleration matches the paper specs, but it sure did look sweet enough for me to consider it.

neuronbob

You miss the point of the hybrid system in the RLX. The point is a) low-end torque, b) it's part of the SH-AWD system. Fuel efficiency is simply an added bonus as the city mileage increases from 21 to 28 mpg. Whether you recoup the cost of the hybrid is irrelevant at this price level.

Folks who can afford an RLX, I assure you, are not thinking of fuel economy first, they are thinking of performance. I know I sure am. Those who are concerned about fuel economy as a primary matter are the ones buying Priuses

Folks buying a TLX hybrid will more likely be concerned with the added cost of the hybrid system and not recouping the cost during ownership. Like the RLX, there has to be a performance benefit above a regular TLX to get people to pony up the money to purchase one....or it will flop, like the ILX hybrid

boe_d

The Lexus ES hybrid 300h is only about $2000 more than the standard Lexus ES. It accounts for about 25% of all ES sales. Acura will have to make their hybrid a much more reasonable premium if they want to compete in this segment.

RosieQ

I would be very interested in a Hybrid TLX. The new engines get great mileage on the highway, but in mainly stop and go city traffic there is still a fair amount to be gained from a hybrid system, going from low 20s MPG to about 50 (hybrid Accord/Prius for example). Add in a bit of low end torque with the system and stick with the standard 4 cylinder engine for a 250HP total output could be a fabulous combination.

boe_d

The accord hybrid is getting some rave reviews from a lot of professional critics however Honda can't seem to hook up with a battery supplier that can keep up with their demand. As a result many Honda dealerships can't get their hands on a Accord hybrid.

bnilhome

You are spot on about the Accord Hybrid. I do 95% of my driving in the city, and I wish more carmakers had hybrids focused on the city MPG factor, and not just the highway MPG rating. Acura could really make a statement by offering a class-leading TLX hybrid based upon the Accord hybrid, AND a sports-hybrid following along what is going into the RLX.

fsttyms1

Well then Acura will have a real issue trying to market the upcoming NSX as a sports/hybrid with emphasis on the hybrid for mpg then. Part of what we have heard from them and others is that its a supercar that gets 30+. Like you and others have now stated, those looking for a 500+hp super car arent looking or thinking of fuel economy, they are looking at status and performance.

fsttyms1

But if you are comparing this premium to the RLX you are comparing 2 different systems. The system on the RLX makes it AWD, and is more for performance than MPG, added MPG is a side effect of the systems ability.

fsttyms1

Most hybrids have the far superior city rating, and are what they are designed for. The better HWY rating with them is mostly due to the better CD, and the ability to utilize the tech at hwy speeds. I dont know of any hybrid that was designed for the hwy rating over the city rating

Mr Hyde

A little confused by thais as all Hybrids are focused more on city mpg vs Highway. Even the ones that were setup more for power than mpg always had a bump in city MPG. Stop, and go at low speeds is where hybrids shine, not on highways at speed.


I'm with fsttyms. This car is being marketed as a sporty sedan. If a hybrid system goes the prius route with this vehicle instead of increasing the sporty factor via power, and handling (AWD), then are sending out conflicting messages on what this car was supposed to be IMHO.

FredS

As someone mentioned the price difference will have to be narowed tremendously to make it worth it strictly on gas savings. Here are the assumptions for the RLX hybrid and gas: annual mileage 12,000 and gas at $3.60 a gallon. The RLX with a combined 24 mpg's will cost you $1,800 a year in gas. The hybrid at a combined 30 mpg's will cost you $1,440 a year in gas. With the savings of $360 a year, it will take over 15 years to pay the difference in price.

bnilhome

Maybe I wasn't clear initially. I'm talking about the bottom line MPG rating. Over the past year or two, you've seen more hybrids out where the city MPG rating is higher than the highway rating (Accord, Camry, Avalon, etc..). But has not been the norm, and if you look at many hybrids still out now, the highway MPG rating is higher, and in some cases, by 5 or 6 MGP (Sonata/Optima, Infiniti Q50, Infiniti Q70, Lexus GS, Honda Insight, Lexus GS). Thus, my original point being that I'd like to see one TLX hybrid modeled after the Accord approach with a really high city rating, and a second sports hybrid focused on a good blend of performance and class-leading fuel economy.

boe_d

I just drove about 370 miles today in my old acura. I topped off the gas first thing in the morning and I was dry by the time I finished my trip. I really don't enjoy wasting time at the gas station so a gas efficient hybrid would be wonderful.

boe_d

They RLX isn't terribly efficient. In addition to the gas savings, if you get an efficient vehicle, some states have incentives you get just for buying a more fuel efficient car. The Lexus is only $2000 more so they can pay off much more quickly - particularly since gas is at a "low" right now.

Rocketsfan

I was just thinking about this and remembered : didn't someone from Acura or some article indicate that Acura had ruled out a hybrid for the TLX? Or at least they had no intentions of creating a hybrid TLX. I need to hunt for that blurb on the Internet.

boe_d

If that is true I sincerely hope they change their mind. Some idiot may look at the non selling RLX and then look at just the number of hybrid RLX sold (a portion of an already insignificant number) and decide people don't want a hybrid car instead of looking at the big picture and realizing people don't want an RLX - standard engine or hybrid.

neuronbob

Acura hasn't said much about mileage for the NSX IIRC. They've mentioned the drivetrain. My belief is that the NSX is chasing after the same people who would be interested in a Porsche 918 or BMW i8.

fsttyms1

The HWY rating WILL be better for the simple fact of there not being stop and go with constant acceleration/deceleration like in the city. Same as with standard gas engines. They dont design the Hybrid for good citympg over hwy, you cant really focus on one over the other like you want. If you get great city, inevitably you will still get great hwy.

boe_d

Unless in the city, it does the bulk of the driving off the electric and doesn't engage the gas engine much.

boe_d

I got a hankering to buy a new car today - if only there was a TLX hybrid available. The good thing is it gives them another year to work out the body issues should the new TLX get some tweaks and a hybrid engine by next year.