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I believe TLX numbers aren't good even though some of the competitors are experiencing low numbers as well. The issue is that Infiniti always sold less cars than Acura in NA. This year, Infiniti is beating Acura by pretty big margin. This is alarming and not a good sign at all.
it depends on the incentive level. If what F23A4 said is true, then that's one reason.
Also, Infiniti has gradually broaden its line up. People call Acura the SUV company, but look at Infiniti, they have 5 SUV's as opposed to 2 SUV's for Acura. While Acura has 3 sedans, Infiniti has 2 sedans plus a coupe. SUV's sell well these days.
This isn't to say the TLX is doing fine, because it's not. But I think we need to look at other factors too.
Originally Posted by pyrodan007
What I find even more alarming from Acura is their pure sales tactics. A fellow member, donkiboy, reported that prices have increased mid-cycle and incentives decreased for the 2017 TLX. I don't know about you but if a model is not selling well and will be soon replaced with a MMC, I'd expect discounts to accelerate. Why the bloody hell would somebody pay more for new VS used if nothing changed from 2016 to 2017. The competition is heating up and Acura is slowing down. I see even less ads on TV from them now.
I just noticed the A5 Sportback, beautiful car and well worth a look in my books ... not to mention the MASSIVE amount of new/refreshed sports sedans to be released soon. Acura has no more mojo for people to come in for now, maybe SUVs if some don't know about the new CR-V and Pilot lol.
Usually Honda and Acura offer one of the least incentives in the industry. My guess is that since it's the beginning of the year, they will just start off with not a lot of incentive, and gradually increase it as they see fit based on their sales target and stuff. They have to consider things like 2nd hand market value.
With the MMC coming, soon, may be they just want to save the ad spend on the new MMC instead?
Honestly, the Q50 has had some fairly aggressive incentives over the past year or so. Although nearly a year ago now, my local Infiniti dealer quoted me some numbers on a Q50 AWD (3.7) which was nearly in line with that of the 16 TLX V6 FWD that I ultimately picked up. Acura definitely wasn't giving me similar numbers for the SH-AWD model.
Maybe to get sales booked now at the end of the cycle, the Q50 face lift is the 2018 MY. The 3 series is long in the tooth & will move from the F-3X generation to the G-3X so there will be a number of upgraded cars coming out.
I've posted this before but it does seem the luxury segment is down. If anyone wants to check monthly, the WSJ Car sales page is GREAT and updated monthly and very useful.
Looking at their data:
Looking at the entire forest of auto sales. Cars in general are losing HUGE ground to trucks, SUVs, crossovers.
Luxury cars down 7/8%, midsize cars down whopping 15%!
Large SUVs up an insane 28% and total cross-over up 11%.
Looking at the top 20 models sold for last month of Feb 2017:
Selected observations:
-In the small SUV segment, Honda and NIssan are killing it. Both Rogue and CR-V up 50% and 37%. Toyota is abysmal at essentially almost same with 3% growth with their RAV4. Ford is 3rd place with 12% growth on the Escape, still ahead of RAV4 growth by a good margin. But the larger Highlander had significant growth at 20%.
The bread & butter working class cars: Camry, Accord, Fusion, Civic, Altima, Corolla, Sentra were all down in the red. The Camry/Corolla, Fusion, Sentra all lost 12% or more.
The Honda Accord and Civic lost the least amount in this group: at 7.6 to 7.9%.
The Elantra from Hyundai broke the entire segment by gaining a whopping 30% when everyone else lost in this segment. Testament to the upsurge and improvement of Hyundai/Kia brands.
Looking at brand trends is also interesting.
The first two row of raw numbers are 2017/2016 sales, and the 3rd column is % change. These are Feb 17 vs Feb 16 comparisons
The Honda/Toyota/Nissan includes their luxury sub-brands as well.
^^^Thanks for providing proof to what we all find reasonably true. It's not hard to understand why Honda is steering Acura towards RDX, MDX centric production.
I guess it never occurred to me that every Audi is imported, either.
Audi's new products are really tops. Great looks, great power, terrific value when optioned out, and even superior quality and reliability. Not surprising to find them on the upswing.
When I searched for my new car the TLX didn't make it past the web research phase. Acura has really failed to keep up with the state of the art.
Audi's new products are really tops. Great looks, great power, terrific value when optioned out, and even superior quality and reliability. Not surprising to find them on the upswing.
When I searched for my new car the TLX didn't make it past the web research phase. Acura has really failed to keep up with the state of the art.
Yea, it also helps a lot when the company launches several new core, bread and butter models in a short period of time, in particular for Audi - Q5, Q7, A4, A5.
The TLX, along with pretty much all Acura models bar the NSX, are long in the tooth with new generation coming in 1-2 years. And it's made worse when the sedans were average at best at launch a few years ago.
Honestly, the Q50 has had some fairly aggressive incentives over the past year or so. Although nearly a year ago now, my local Infiniti dealer quoted me some numbers on a Q50 AWD (3.7) which was nearly in line with that of the 16 TLX V6 FWD that I ultimately picked up. Acura definitely wasn't giving me similar numbers for the SH-AWD model.
100% agreed! I think Infiniti is offering a lot of incentives in the past year and their marketing on TV and Radio is very aggressive as well.
I have two solid examples:
1. When I drive to work each morning I hear at least 5 times Infiniti's promo on the radio in my 30 min commute.
2. My colleague is leasing a 2016 QX50 premium package for $465CDN.
Clearly, Infiniti has a different strategy than Acura.
100% agreed! I think Infiniti is offering a lot of incentives in the past year and their marketing on TV and Radio is very aggressive as well.
I have two solid examples:
1. When I drive to work each morning I hear at least 5 times Infiniti's promo on the radio in my 30 min commute.
2. My colleague is leasing a 2016 QX50 premium package for $465CDN.
Clearly, Infiniti has a different strategy than Acura.
Wow, good deal! See Acura, it pays to think and do things once and a while. Even though Infiniti is about to release a refreshed Q50, they added turbos to their engines BEFORE refresh. The TLX hasn't received any love in the past 3 years. People that are coming out of their 2 year lease have zero reason to stay with the TLX, even less so if it's one with the shitty ZF. God only knows the indifferent / never my fault customer service from Acura is not the one reason to stay.
Now with having less discounts, well people are just being directed to look elsewhere. Same for Acura's SUVs since design is for sure not helping, at least not to me. Even worse with Honda eating its own family for sales. What you have here are the conditions to a perfect storm for sales to implode unless something big happens to get people's attention back. With the current management, sadly I don't see it happening any time soon
Not to digress further but Infiniti has this for the remainder of March here in NJ:2017 Q50 Red Sport 400 AWD
$449/MONTH LEASE FOR 39 MONTHS $4,099 INITIAL PAYMENT
To me, this is a fairly aggressive lease campaign. So the temptation to go the Infiniti route it totally logical, especially for enthusiasts.
Not to digress further but Infiniti has this for the remainder of March here in NJ:2017 Q50 Red Sport 400 AWD
$449/MONTH LEASE FOR 39 MONTHS $4,099 INITIAL PAYMENT
To me, this is a fairly aggressive lease campaign. So the temptation to go the Infiniti route it totally logical, especially for enthusiasts.
BMW leases a 2017 340Xi $509/MONTH LEASE FOR 36 MONTHS $3,000 INITIAL PAYMENT.
Barely 7% more overall and maintenance is included.
Wow, good deal! See Acura, it pays to think and do things once and a while. Even though Infiniti is about to release a refreshed Q50, they added turbos to their engines BEFORE refresh. The TLX hasn't received any love in the past 3 years. People that are coming out of their 2 year lease have zero reason to stay with the TLX, even less so if it's one with the shitty ZF. God only knows the indifferent / never my fault customer service from Acura is not the one reason to stay.
Now with having less discounts, well people are just being directed to look elsewhere. Same for Acura's SUVs since design is for sure not helping, at least not to me. Even worse with Honda eating its own family for sales. What you have here are the conditions to a perfect storm for sales to implode unless something big happens to get people's attention back. With the current management, sadly I don't see it happening any time soon
Infiniti tends to do minor changes every year to its models, similar to some of the Germans. Honda, basically changes fascia and maybe does a Type-S, this means it is harder to compete in later years of a model run.
BMW leases a 2017 340Xi $509/MONTH LEASE FOR 36 MONTHS $3,000 INITIAL PAYMENT.
Barely 7% more overall and maintenance is included.
Something tells me the BMW is boner and even if the Infiniti is, I bet it has more features, just saying the Infiniti may be a better value while the BMW is well a BMW.
03-08-2017, 01:48 PM
