Oil consumption
#201
No I did not check it before droping it off. As I asked earlier who else has Acura Care? I have the 8yr 120K miles on my car and was wondering if that was the reason they changed out the short block. Heck they also changed the timing belt, plugs, and tensioner at the same time under warranty.
#202
If they just replaced the short block then they re-used all your accessories, heads, intake, manifolds, etc. The short block is basically just the block, the crank, the pistons, the oil pan and maybe a few pulleys. It's great that they did the belts etc. for you, but they had to work on all that stuff to reassemble your original parts with the new block. I hope you get a better performer this time. Btw, did they advise you about a break in period for the new rings etc.? You can't go ripping around and redlining your new engine for a while...... I assume you know that?
#204
i have 46,964 miles on my 2010 awd a/t . changed the oil in june when it had 44,539 with mobil 1 extended per. yesterday the mid says oil level low checked the dipstick and it was dry. the engine took 2 quarts. so disappointing
#206
#207
So, just to clarify, the MID will indicate when there is a low oil level ??
Is that true?
The 70% or whatever percent indication refers to the quality of the oil.
Does the MID also indicate a seriously low quantity?
Or does the red warning light inform when the oil level is low?
JTL12, did you reset the oil quality percent as instructed in the owner's manual?
Is that true?
The 70% or whatever percent indication refers to the quality of the oil.
Does the MID also indicate a seriously low quantity?
Or does the red warning light inform when the oil level is low?
JTL12, did you reset the oil quality percent as instructed in the owner's manual?
#209
^ that was your problem then. The MID will tell you the estimated life of the oil based on a variety of factors. You need to reset it after changing the oil. It will not tell you if oil is low. Check the dipstick every 1000 miles or so. I believe that an indicator light will come on for low oil, but I wouldn't wait that long if its getting low.
#210
Yes, Camaro194, that's what I thought, but there seems to be some folks who think the MID will tell them when they are low on oil volume. Pretty sure that as you said, you need to check with the dipstick periodically. And if the red warning light is on you are way late and need to add oil asap.
JTL12, if you don't have an owner's manual, you probably should get one. If you bought the car from an Acura dealer they should have provided one, including on a used car.
JTL12, if you don't have an owner's manual, you probably should get one. If you bought the car from an Acura dealer they should have provided one, including on a used car.
#211
So, just to clarify, the MID will indicate when there is a low oil level ??
Is that true?
The 70% or whatever percent indication refers to the quality of the oil.
Does the MID also indicate a seriously low quantity?
Or does the red warning light inform when the oil level is low?
JTL12, did you reset the oil quality percent as instructed in the owner's manual?
Is that true?
The 70% or whatever percent indication refers to the quality of the oil.
Does the MID also indicate a seriously low quantity?
Or does the red warning light inform when the oil level is low?
JTL12, did you reset the oil quality percent as instructed in the owner's manual?
#212
2010 Acura TL SH-AWD
I bought a 2010 TL SH-AWD (Quebec car) about a month ago from a used dealer in TO. I had to get an oil change done about 2500 kms ago and my mechanic suggested that I use a full synthetic by 5W-40 (not the recommended 5W-20).
After 2500 kms, I noticed the oil is very low.
Any updates with any recalls or potential coverage from Acura/Honda?
Is the problem usually an involved engine rebuild?
Thanks for the help!
After 2500 kms, I noticed the oil is very low.
Any updates with any recalls or potential coverage from Acura/Honda?
Is the problem usually an involved engine rebuild?
Thanks for the help!
#213
P.S. Mechanic said that instead of spending $60-70 for a full synthetic oil change if I have to change it every 4-5K kms, I might as well just go for the $20 conventional oil and change the oil every 4-5K kms
Think the dealer may assist? I don't have any extended warranties as the car is 2010 with 123, 000 kms
Think the dealer may assist? I don't have any extended warranties as the car is 2010 with 123, 000 kms
#215
Good I'm not the only one having a concern over oil consumption. I have a 09 awd tl with 88k bought it with 39k . i'm consuming 2 and a quarter quarts over 5k oil change. I was just told this was normal consumption as I did the oil consumption test. So i'm thinking about just changing my own oil for now on and getting better oil. Is 2 quarts normal. I live in stl, mo so its not like i'm in extreme temps. I had a 04 tsx that started to burn oil like a quart then boom goes the engine at 160k.
#216
Restore additive?
I'm topping off my 09' TL AWD Tech 1L at 50% on the minder, then back to the dealer at 5% for an oil change. Minder is giving me around 13K-14K between changes this time of year. Has anyone tried a product like Restore? Think it would help?
#217
I'm having the same issue with my 2011 6sp TL-SH-AWD, oil consumption. I've been battling the with the dealer back on forth from when my can has 65k miles and now I'm at 73k. They keep telling me nothing is wrong, but I keep bringing it back. Now they're performing another consumption test so they can build a case to for Acura to possible change the block. There was many times whereas I check the dip stick and no oil. I'm more concern that my engine my get damage, now on cold start, the engine get very loud for about a minute then it goes away. Seems the car is starving for oil. It's a little low on the dipstick, I can't add any oil, because of the test.
#218
I'm having the same issue with my 2011 6sp TL-SH-AWD, oil consumption. I've been battling the with the dealer back on forth from when my can has 65k miles and now I'm at 73k. They keep telling me nothing is wrong, but I keep bringing it back. Now they're performing another consumption test so they can build a case to for Acura to possible change the block. There was many times whereas I check the dip stick and no oil. I'm more concern that my engine my get damage, now on cold start, the engine get very loud for about a minute then it goes away. Seems the car is starving for oil. It's a little low on the dipstick, I can't add any oil, because of the test.
Now I suspect the oil consumption is getting worse...
#219
Can you clarify the sound you are hearing? I'm also burning oil (currently in the middle of the oil consumption test my dealer wants to perform) but have been hearing a rattling sound on cold starts that goes away after a minute also. Sounds somewhat like a diesel engine, it can be pretty loud or faint. As the engine warms and the RPMs drop, the sound goes away.
#220
Can you clarify the sound you are hearing? I'm also burning oil (currently in the middle of the oil consumption test my dealer wants to perform) but have been hearing a rattling sound on cold starts that goes away after a minute also. Sounds somewhat like a diesel engine, it can be pretty loud or faint. As the engine warms and the RPMs drop, the sound goes away.
#221
BTW, sorry to hear of all the crap you are going through on your oil consumption issue. I think a lot of it has to do with the dealership. In my experience, the dealership has more leverage when going to bat with the manufacturer for you rather than you doing it directly. Assuming your dealership is decent enough to do that though.
#222
Hopefully my dealership doesn't give me that. I recorded a video on my phone that shows a pretty good description of the sound so I can show them. I was thinking it was the timing belt tensioner, but now I wonder if it has anything to do with the oil consumption.
BTW, sorry to hear of all the crap you are going through on your oil consumption issue. I think a lot of it has to do with the dealership. In my experience, the dealership has more leverage when going to bat with the manufacturer for you rather than you doing it directly. Assuming your dealership is decent enough to do that though.
BTW, sorry to hear of all the crap you are going through on your oil consumption issue. I think a lot of it has to do with the dealership. In my experience, the dealership has more leverage when going to bat with the manufacturer for you rather than you doing it directly. Assuming your dealership is decent enough to do that though.
#223
Excessive Oil Consumption on 2010 SH-AWD
This is the third TL we've owned and the 4th Acura overall. Never had a problem with excessive oil consumption on any of the cars until this one. At 70k miles and only 5000 miles since last oil change the engine had burned nearly ALL of it's oil even though the service minder showed life at 15%. Acura told us degradation of vehicle performance was normal if WE allowed it to get that low? WE? Excuse me?!
NOW HERE IS THE IMPORTANT PART: As others have already stated, there is an Acura service bulletin that says burning a quart ever 1000k miles is "normal" however.... what they DON'T TELL YOU IS THAT HONDA JUST SETTLED A CLASS ACTION LAWSUIT for v6 engines for this very reason with other make / model cars! You can read about it here:
http://www.autonews.com/article/2013...-burning-claim
I'm sure it will only be a matter of time until they acknowledge there is a widespread issue with more than just the 1.5 million Honda's already included in the suit. In the mean time, I recommend partnering closely with your local Acura service center to monitor and document the problem (mine was not aware of the lawsuit which was settled in 2013).
Ours has agreed to check and document the oil consumption every 1000k. I'm sure we'll need to pay to top it off if it still burns fast, but at least this will prevent further problems and most importantly PROTECT us, the consumer, in the event further problems do occur.
Make sure your service center documents everything! Customers in the suit were reimbursed for any losses suffered as a result of the issue. This includes parts replacement, etc, and Honda extended the warranty for affected vehicles so even if your warranty already expired you might be ok.
Hope this is helpful to some of you out there....we were just as bewildered as you (and now, frankly disappointed) with what we were hearing from Acura.
NOW HERE IS THE IMPORTANT PART: As others have already stated, there is an Acura service bulletin that says burning a quart ever 1000k miles is "normal" however.... what they DON'T TELL YOU IS THAT HONDA JUST SETTLED A CLASS ACTION LAWSUIT for v6 engines for this very reason with other make / model cars! You can read about it here:
http://www.autonews.com/article/2013...-burning-claim
I'm sure it will only be a matter of time until they acknowledge there is a widespread issue with more than just the 1.5 million Honda's already included in the suit. In the mean time, I recommend partnering closely with your local Acura service center to monitor and document the problem (mine was not aware of the lawsuit which was settled in 2013).
Ours has agreed to check and document the oil consumption every 1000k. I'm sure we'll need to pay to top it off if it still burns fast, but at least this will prevent further problems and most importantly PROTECT us, the consumer, in the event further problems do occur.
Make sure your service center documents everything! Customers in the suit were reimbursed for any losses suffered as a result of the issue. This includes parts replacement, etc, and Honda extended the warranty for affected vehicles so even if your warranty already expired you might be ok.
Hope this is helpful to some of you out there....we were just as bewildered as you (and now, frankly disappointed) with what we were hearing from Acura.
#224
The link in the post above is Honda settling with owners with Honda vehicles that had the VCM (Variable Cylinder Management) in it (V6 models only). Have a 2010 Honda Accord EX-L in the extended family that had it's spark plugs replaced at 7,000 miles or so... Ridiculous, and this Honda V6 engine consumes oil as well.... Maybe there needs to be a new lawsuit by Acura owners of the 3.7L engine to get Honda to accept the faulty design...
#225
#226
The link in the post above is Honda settling with owners with Honda vehicles that had the VCM (Variable Cylinder Management) in it (V6 models only). Have a 2010 Honda Accord EX-L in the extended family that had it's spark plugs replaced at 7,000 miles or so... Ridiculous, and this Honda V6 engine consumes oil as well.... Maybe there needs to be a new lawsuit by Acura owners of the 3.7L engine to get Honda to accept the faulty design...
#228
This article seemed to help explain a lot questions for me. It might help a few others here:
Engine Oil Consumption
Engine Oil Consumption
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Tonyware (01-24-2015)
#229
^ thanks for the article.
I did notice that after my major service of timing belt and valve clearance adjustment the oil consumption has gone down by a lot. At 40% oil now after the timing belt/valve adjustment service and the dip stick is not crazy low, barely covering the tip, as before. Before, at 50% I had to add a quart, now I don't.
So, adjust your valves? Ok, we know the rings on these engines aren't the best quality, based on past posts here, but the valve clearances appear to be a contributing factor as well.
I did notice that after my major service of timing belt and valve clearance adjustment the oil consumption has gone down by a lot. At 40% oil now after the timing belt/valve adjustment service and the dip stick is not crazy low, barely covering the tip, as before. Before, at 50% I had to add a quart, now I don't.
So, adjust your valves? Ok, we know the rings on these engines aren't the best quality, based on past posts here, but the valve clearances appear to be a contributing factor as well.
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jajameson (01-25-2015)
#230
This oil consumption problem is wider spread than just our TLs.
https://autos.yahoo.com/news/consume...140000066.html
https://autos.yahoo.com/news/consume...140000066.html
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Tonyware (01-29-2015)
#231
I just read a story from someone sharing about BMW's experience early on with plated cylinder bores. He stated that BMW cars with plated cylinder bores started using lot of oil because BMW learned the drivers were using either low quality fuel, or the lower octane fuel. Those fuels contain more sulfur in them. More than premium fuel. The sulfur reacted with the plating, causing the wear protection of the plating to be lost, in turn caused lots of oil consumption. That's the story. Does this relate to our cars?
Here is Acura's statement from my manual concerning type of fuel to use:
Your vehicle is designed to operate on premium unleaded gasoline with a pump octane of 91 or higher. If this octane grade is unavailable, regular unleaded gasoline with a pump octane of 87 or higher may be used
temporarily. The use of regular unleaded gasoline can cause metallic knocking noises in the engine and will result in decreased engine performance. The long-term use of regular-grade gasoline can lead to engine damage.
Here is Acura's statement from my manual concerning type of fuel to use:
Your vehicle is designed to operate on premium unleaded gasoline with a pump octane of 91 or higher. If this octane grade is unavailable, regular unleaded gasoline with a pump octane of 87 or higher may be used
temporarily. The use of regular unleaded gasoline can cause metallic knocking noises in the engine and will result in decreased engine performance. The long-term use of regular-grade gasoline can lead to engine damage.
#232
Well, I've been using nothing but 91 octane gas since day 1.
But my 3.7L-V6 still burns engine oil, and I can hear occasionally engine knocking once in a while during the first minute of moderate throttle acceleration when the engine is warm.
But my 3.7L-V6 still burns engine oil, and I can hear occasionally engine knocking once in a while during the first minute of moderate throttle acceleration when the engine is warm.
#233
I have to ask, does anyone actually know what kind of gas, and its' quality that we put in our tanks?
Yes, we know the sign of the station is a big name oil corporation, and the pump says "premium", but I have never "taste" tested it before pumping it. How do I know the extremely greedy oil company didn't cut some corners at the refinery to save money with the thought that we would never know the difference? After all, I have never even seen the gas I pay for. I would not put it past the greedy oil companies who up until just recently were charging us $4.00 a gallon, and are now charging us less the $2.00 (for the time being) and still making profits, to try something like this.
I think that I am pumping 93 octane, tier 1, top-shelf gas, and certainly paying for it, but I may never know any different
..............until my car starts to behave poorly, like consuming lots of oil, or making knocking sounds. Only then do I start to have ACTUAL reason to question the quality.
Yes, we know the sign of the station is a big name oil corporation, and the pump says "premium", but I have never "taste" tested it before pumping it. How do I know the extremely greedy oil company didn't cut some corners at the refinery to save money with the thought that we would never know the difference? After all, I have never even seen the gas I pay for. I would not put it past the greedy oil companies who up until just recently were charging us $4.00 a gallon, and are now charging us less the $2.00 (for the time being) and still making profits, to try something like this.
I think that I am pumping 93 octane, tier 1, top-shelf gas, and certainly paying for it, but I may never know any different
..............until my car starts to behave poorly, like consuming lots of oil, or making knocking sounds. Only then do I start to have ACTUAL reason to question the quality.
#234
I just read a story from someone sharing about BMW's experience early on with plated cylinder bores. He stated that BMW cars with plated cylinder bores started using lot of oil because BMW learned the drivers were using either low quality fuel, or the lower octane fuel. Those fuels contain more sulfur in them. More than premium fuel. The sulfur reacted with the plating, causing the wear protection of the plating to be lost, in turn caused lots of oil consumption. That's the story. Does this relate to our cars?
Here is Acura's statement from my manual concerning type of fuel to use:
Your vehicle is designed to operate on premium unleaded gasoline with a pump octane of 91 or higher. If this octane grade is unavailable, regular unleaded gasoline with a pump octane of 87 or higher may be used
temporarily. The use of regular unleaded gasoline can cause metallic knocking noises in the engine and will result in decreased engine performance. The long-term use of regular-grade gasoline can lead to engine damage.
Here is Acura's statement from my manual concerning type of fuel to use:
Your vehicle is designed to operate on premium unleaded gasoline with a pump octane of 91 or higher. If this octane grade is unavailable, regular unleaded gasoline with a pump octane of 87 or higher may be used
temporarily. The use of regular unleaded gasoline can cause metallic knocking noises in the engine and will result in decreased engine performance. The long-term use of regular-grade gasoline can lead to engine damage.
I know that our 3.7 Acura engines have Nikasil plating as well. Nikasil can handle high temperatures. My opinion is that the piston rings used in the 3.7 Engine are not the best match for the Nikasil lining and because of this compatibility issue oil consumption occurs. In this case the piston rings worn faster than normal.
Nikasil cyclinders have a higher Rockwell hardness rating than cast iron and by design are oleophilic (Having a strong affinity for oil). Both of these factors contribute significantly to engine life and wear issues.
Analyzing the problem, replacing the short block might not resolve the problem if the same Nikasil lining is used or piston rings alloy is not matched.
Conclusion: Acura is dragging their feet for a long time, because this is hard to fix!!
Last edited by mylove4cars; 02-01-2015 at 08:13 PM.
#236
I experienced oil burning issues with my 10' TL SH-AWD. (3.7)
I encountered the issue around 50k.
The dealer had ran an oil consumption test, as required by Acura/Honda.
My TL would burn anywhere from 1qt/ 500 miles and if I was lucky, only 1 qt/ 1000 miles.
In my case, it was certainly on the extreme side.
My dealer had no issue with replacing the engine.
The entire short block was replaced, as well as the starter, timing belt, and tensioner.
I would definitely press your service adviser to replace the short block.
It is especially easy if you have a strong "bond" with your dealership.
I did all my service there, so they didn't mind making good on the repair.
My dealer believes the issue lies with defective or unseated piston rings.
Also, the nikasil lined cylinder walls may play a part in the issue.
For what it's worth, I have ceased using synthetic oil since Acura replaced my motor.
I have found no oil burning issue/loss since using standard Acura motor oil.
It may be coincidental, who knows! My two cents.
I encountered the issue around 50k.
The dealer had ran an oil consumption test, as required by Acura/Honda.
My TL would burn anywhere from 1qt/ 500 miles and if I was lucky, only 1 qt/ 1000 miles.
In my case, it was certainly on the extreme side.
My dealer had no issue with replacing the engine.
The entire short block was replaced, as well as the starter, timing belt, and tensioner.
I would definitely press your service adviser to replace the short block.
It is especially easy if you have a strong "bond" with your dealership.
I did all my service there, so they didn't mind making good on the repair.
My dealer believes the issue lies with defective or unseated piston rings.
Also, the nikasil lined cylinder walls may play a part in the issue.
For what it's worth, I have ceased using synthetic oil since Acura replaced my motor.
I have found no oil burning issue/loss since using standard Acura motor oil.
It may be coincidental, who knows! My two cents.
#238
I finally got enough miles on my car to check consumption. Looks like ~1qt/3k. Confirmed with the previous owner and he was adding 1qt in between 5k mile oil changes with 80% highway. Acura told him that that's normal.
I'm a 3k mile oil change guy and don't drive a whole lot so it doesn't really affect me too much... But it is something to pay attention to. A new engine would be great but I doubt I'll get it with this rate.
I'm a 3k mile oil change guy and don't drive a whole lot so it doesn't really affect me too much... But it is something to pay attention to. A new engine would be great but I doubt I'll get it with this rate.
#239
could be worse - ck out this review w/ a BMW M4:
2015 BMW M3 Long-Term Update 3 -Motor Trend
"Regarding the addition of oil, the service manager wrote: "Operating as designed[.] Checked for leaks, none found. Due to increased engine power, all Motorsport engines can consume up to 2.5 quarts of engine oil per 1,000 miles at any time." As fudge factors go, up to 2.5 quarts per 1,000 miles is as rich and chocolately as I've ever heard, even for high-performance M vehicles. That being said, we accumulated substantial mileage just after the oil change and haven't had to add any since."
2015 BMW M3 Review - Long-Term Update 3
2015 BMW M3 Long-Term Update 3 -Motor Trend
"Regarding the addition of oil, the service manager wrote: "Operating as designed[.] Checked for leaks, none found. Due to increased engine power, all Motorsport engines can consume up to 2.5 quarts of engine oil per 1,000 miles at any time." As fudge factors go, up to 2.5 quarts per 1,000 miles is as rich and chocolately as I've ever heard, even for high-performance M vehicles. That being said, we accumulated substantial mileage just after the oil change and haven't had to add any since."
2015 BMW M3 Review - Long-Term Update 3