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I got two offers:
2012 TL FWD - 48000 miles, for about 19,000 USD OBO Black on Black.
2012 TL SH-AWD - 43000 miles, for firm 25,000 USD, Black on Black. Brand new tires (all look same style), less than 1000 miles and oil change 1500 miles ago.
The only difference I can see is drive train, I'm a contractor, developer and may have to move to a different part of USA (my preference will be no snow or less snow like North Carolina). But I never know, where I'll end up.
Please advise me on which one to choose..!
Should I spend the 6k-7k difference for Drivetrain?
I already own a motorcycle and I love it, if it is not raining or snowing, I prefer motorcycle, but I need to tow the motorcycle sometimes for track days. Sometimes, 2 motorcycles, mine and my friend's.
So, ~160 lbs X 2 = 320 lbs
Bikes ~425 lbs each = 850 lbs
Trailer hitch/tongue = ~200 lbs
Trailer =~ 400lbs
Track suit and other luggage ~100 lbs
My friends own a Lexus (300+), FWD and he is happy towing his bike with above similar stats. He suggests me to go with FWD, due to price difference. I came here to check with you guys.
Either of these cars, what should I get checked after purchase?
Tires, brakes, fluids, oil and filter, anything else?
I requested both the owners whether they can take it to ~108 point check from Acura, pre-purchase check. They both agreed, so, once I decide which car, I'll send that car to dealer. It'll cost me around 135$.
AWD has 7k miles or April 2016, remaining factory warranty, not sure about FWD yet.
Is the extended warranty worth spending my money on it?
Based on all of the oil consumption issues I've been seeing with the J37, I'd be inclined to go with the FWD. I know it sucks because the AWD is fun as hell, but the extra headaches may not be worth it. Just look around this forum and you'll see a lot of info on either type.
Based on all of the oil consumption issues I've been seeing with the J37, I'd be inclined to go with the FWD. I know it sucks because the AWD is fun as hell, but the extra headaches may not be worth it. Just look around this forum and you'll see a lot of info on either type.
Test drive both and I think you will answer your question.
Test drive both and I think you will answer your question.
I test drove AWD yesterday, it was good.
I didn't see the FWD in person yet.
I know how the power is, I'm asking about the reliability and spending 7000$ in my situation is worth it?
Based on all of the oil consumption issues I've been seeing with the J37, I'd be inclined to go with the FWD. I know it sucks because the AWD is fun as hell, but the extra headaches may not be worth it. Just look around this forum and you'll see a lot of info on either type.
Both these cars are automatic, and the problem addressed in this forum, mentioned about Manual tranny right?
Both these cars are automatic, and the problem addressed in this forum, mentioned about Manual tranny right?
Actually the stick has the lesser issue. I have the AWD 6-Speed myself. I want to tell you get the AWD. But what is your driving style? Do you sprit drive? Are you into modding your car or just point A to B. If you just point a to b and ride your bike then maybe the fwd. If your into sprit driving and don't mind footing it every now and then... The AWD. I saw on here towing capacity is around 1000lbs. You might want to see if it's the and or fwd. Have you look at the RDX?
Actually the stick has the lesser issue. I have the AWD 6-Speed myself. I want to tell you get the AWD. But what is your driving style? Do you sprit drive? Are you into modding your car or just point A to B. If you just point a to b and ride your bike then maybe the fwd. If your into sprit driving and don't mind footing it every now and then... The AWD. I saw on here towing capacity is around 1000lbs. You might want to see if it's the and or fwd. Have you look at the RDX?
Thanks for the reply, Yes, I occasionally twist the throttle or floor her. I may end up taking her to some twisties roads like Tail of The Dragon, only if I end up buying the AWD. So, it is not a requirement, that I have to take her and enjoy, I'll do it, if I have it.
I will not mod the vehicle, except for some plastidip those wheels to black or gray as in Lexus wheels, to match the Black/Black and may be the grill, while I'm there with the wheels.
Currently, I'm 26 years old, single, so, not into SUV's yet.
My roommate owns an RDX (2015), I don't like the interior options.
For EX: Air Vents for back seat is not available until 2016. It is like, Acura forces people to get MDX for some reason (until last year).
So, a big no.
I don't like the wobble feel I get into corners, which are often with an SUV.
I feel Sedans stick to the roads and handle better, I could be wrong. I've driven ML350 and hated because of the above mentioned reason.
Just checked with the AWD guy, he said, oil is at the same level. 1500 miles ago, he changed the oil with Mobil 1 and Phram filter.
He puts mixed miles, around 70 per day.
Just checked with the AWD guy, he said, oil is at the same level. 1500 miles ago, he changed the oil with Mobil 1 and Phram filter.
He puts mixed miles, around 70 per day.
Ask him where the oil level is after 3000 miles in the OCI.
Overall I would say it is not worth the price difference since both cars, for all intents and purposes, are essentially FWD as the AWD system in the TL is FWD-biased in all driving scenarios except hard cornering. From what I've read anyway. If you desire better handling and have need for good snow traction, go for the AWD. Otherwise get the FWD and use that extra money to make it look nicer.
Overall I would say it is not worth the price difference since both cars, for all intents and purposes, are essentially FWD as the AWD system in the TL is FWD-biased in all driving scenarios except hard cornering. From what I've read anyway. If you desire better handling and have need for good snow traction, go for the AWD. Otherwise get the FWD and use that extra money to make it look nicer.
That's not a good argument against the SH-AWD. I can give you others (the 3.7L motor for one). Anyone whose driven a SH-AWD would never dismiss it as a FWD biased except for hard cornering car. It's just not that kind of animal. Power shifts to the rear under heavy straight line throttle inputs (up to 70%). It's the rear diff that shifts power left or right during cornering that makes this car special.
That's not a good argument against the SH-AWD. I can give you others (the 3.7L motor for one). Anyone whose driven a SH-AWD would never dismiss it as a FWD biased except for hard cornering car. It's just not that kind of animal. Power shifts to the rear under heavy straight line throttle inputs (up to 70%). It's the rear diff that shifts power left or right during cornering that makes this car special.
I hear where you’re coming from. To me a $6-7k difference wouldn’t be worth it for the SH unless the rear wheels got more power more often, but that’s my opinion as I like a more neutral setup. I’ve driven my brother-in-law’s 2011 TL SH, and the handling was great of course but there was still that sense of “FWD-ness” for me. Maybe something changed for 2012? I agree about the 3.7L motor though, to me that is the bigger incentive. And I agree the torque vectoring that puts 100% of that 70 to one outside wheel is cool tech. I just wish that didn't only occur in hard cornering.
As for straight line acceleration, even full throttle, only 40% of the power goes to the rear axle. Again, from what I’ve read.
I hear where you’re coming from. To me a $6-7k difference wouldn’t be worth it for the SH unless the rear wheels got more power more often, but that’s my opinion as I like a more neutral setup. I’ve driven my brother-in-law’s 2011 TL SH, and the handling was great of course but there was still that sense of “FWD-ness” for me. Maybe something changed for 2012? I agree about the 3.7L motor though, to me that is the bigger incentive. And I agree the torque vectoring that puts 100% of that 70 to one outside wheel is cool tech. I just wish that didn't only occur in hard cornering.
As for straight line acceleration, even full throttle, only 40% of the power goes to the rear axle. Again, from what I’ve read.
I hear you. I personally feel this car is balanced in the corners. Every time I've pushed it a little hard it feels like it breaks loose all four tires or the rear tires first. I can only compare it to one other AWD system (2005 WRX) and that thing understeered bad. There is almost no situation where my car has understeered when I apply throttle mid corner. The're just too much torque going to the rear outside tire. I do have a 6MT so it might feel a little different than the AT.
As for torque split, 70% can be pushed to the rear and from that up to 100% can be delivered to the outside rear wheel.
Originally Posted by News Release
SH-AWD® operating parameters include:
Up to 90-percent of available torque can be transferred to the front wheels during normal cruising. In hard cornering and under acceleration, up to 70-percent of available torque can be directed to the rear wheels to enhance vehicle dynamics.
Up to 100-percent of the torque sent to the rear axle can be applied to either rear wheel, depending on conditions.
^The way that reads, it sounds like hard cornering is not the only scenario where more torque goes to the rear, and that it also happens under acceleration in straight line driving...which is better. I wonder how much throttle it takes to actuate that.
The article I read said (I'll have to find the link again):
"During straight-line cruising and moderate cornering below half throttle, SH-AWD delivers up to 70-percent of engine torque to the front wheels. In full-throttle straight line acceleration, up to 40-percent of the power is sent to the rear axle. In hard cornering, up to 70-percent of available torque goes to the rear wheels for enhanced chassis balance. Up to 100-percent of this torque can be applied to the outside rear wheel."
The way that read made it sound like the only time the rear wheels get the majority of power is in hard cornering.
Anyway, sorry for the threadjack raja777. I think it will make the most sense for you to just drive both cars.
@ABDomega and @RedRider:
I understand both of you. In case I'm going for a brand new, the difference would be fairly less.
But here in my case, both are same looking, except for the badge and two more spinning wheels (don't get me wrong, AWD is super), but at the price point, that 19k vehicle is a very good deal I guess.
On the other hand, CruzanTLSH-AWD's words are motivating, as I want to keep this vehicle until the wheels fell off.
I called the AWD guy and he said 24,500 is the final price.
But the FWD OFFER is great.
The rest of the people are selling similar (more miles) vehicle for 22k, this FWD still has a few mile warranty and few thousands of powertrain warranty, he can still go lower, as he said OBO.
Even used car shopping is killing me.
When I bought my '14 SH-AWD, I only thought about how the car would drive, on a day to day basis. I never even thought about inclement weather. You see, I live in Phoenix, so, snow, yeah, not so much. Rain? Yeah, we get that. When it rains here, oh my!
Anyway, I hate the way that FWD vehicles torque-steer. But, my SH-AWD drives wonderfully - and the vehicle feels fairly neutral, as it applies power to the wheels.
If you're really not into the way a car drives, I don't see any reason to get the AWD. Why burden yourself with the extra expense?
Of the two that you're looking at, I would go for the SH-AWD.
To me, the SH-AWD's a masterpiece (loosely speaking). The other car? Well, it's just a car. lol
I drive a lot so the SH-AWD's gas penalty wasn't ok with me. With that said, my next acura will probably have SH-AWD, it is way too fun not to have. I love driving in my MDX though the twisties and even during everyday driving. So much so that my 3G TL gets neglected sometimes when I want to have a fun drive.
I'd honestly say SH-AWD is a notch below having a 6MT as far as fun goes. If finances are an issue, go with the FWD TL and you can always trade into a SH-AWD later on. The prices will continue to fall for the SH-AWD due to the oil consumption issues where the FWD will be pretty typical for an Acura with depreciation.
24,500 on the SHAWD is about 1500 higher than what a dealer would sell the car for in extra clean condition. If the maintenance on it is done right and you can get him to 23,150 I'd do it. Show him the info chart too.
With regards to my previous post, it was meant to be entertaining.
How do I really feel about the 4G TL FWD? I think it's a great car - it's not just a car, like I said, in my other post, but I had to tease those that have the FWD 4G - I couldn't resist.
While the AWD is the one that I'd want, over the FWD - to me, it's really about the wallet. If you can, go for the AWD. If you can't, bet everything on black.
I drive a lot so the SH-AWD's gas penalty wasn't ok with me. With that said, my next acura will probably have SH-AWD, it is way too fun not to have. I love driving in my MDX though the twisties and even during everyday driving. So much so that my 3G TL gets neglected sometimes when I want to have a fun drive.
I'd honestly say SH-AWD is a notch below having a 6MT as far as fun goes. If finances are an issue, go with the FWD TL and you can always trade into a SH-AWD later on. The prices will continue to fall for the SH-AWD due to the oil consumption issues where the FWD will be pretty typical for an Acura with depreciation.
24,500 on the SHAWD is about 1500 higher than what a dealer would sell the car for in extra clean condition. If the maintenance on it is done right and you can get him to 23,150 I'd do it. Show him the info chart too.
Well, I showed him the pictures above and mentioned it is 1500$ more than market price.
He sent me this, even after I said my loan is approved and needed registration copy, intent to sell form, for DCU.
Please don't take this the wrong way, but you need to read it carefully. Show up with the money, or move on. Price is $25,000.
It got bumped from 24.5 to 25k, which makes me go away again.
He has the right to sell his car for whatever he wants even if the price is out of line. He may never sell it but that's his call. You want to buy it more than he wants to sell it so you either pay his price or move on. The FWD is still available and it sounds like you like the price better on that one anyways. I love my AWD and highly recommend it but if you don't think you need or really want it the AWD, the FWD is an excellent car.
He has the right to sell his car for whatever he wants even if the price is out of line. He may never sell it but that's his call. You want to buy it more than he wants to sell it so you either pay his price or move on. The FWD is still available and it sounds like you like the price better on that one anyways. I love my AWD and highly recommend it but if you don't think you need or really want it the AWD, the FWD is an excellent car.
Sure, thanks, moving on for a different car, i.e probably FWD.
Get something with a V6 at least. However, keep looking for a TL SH-AWD. You might find a good deal out there. Best bang for the buck in terms of size, power and amenities.
Get something with a V6 at least. However, keep looking for a TL SH-AWD. You might find a good deal out there. Best bang for the buck in terms of size, power and amenities.
I agree, I really liked the AWD.
BTW, when is the next major maintenance for Acura TL? Is that 60k, which has the transmission fluids flush, timing belt etc.
According to that, I'll look for less mileage ones.
Yes, definitely V6 and 3.0+, considering towing and also, my driving style, 2.5 or less doesn't live under my foot anymore. And also, for some reason, I don't like turbo powered engines, like they have 2.0L with turbo (off topic, but worth it I guess), I feel they take lot of burden and won't live life like 200-300k miles (Acura, Honda, Lexus, Nissan)'s straight V6 engines. Am I wrong?
You won't have to worry about any major service maintenance until 100K. Dealers will charge around $800 to $1500 give or take. Then you won't have to worry about it until another 100k lol.
And generally speaking, NA engines are historically more reliable than FI engines. But we are living in the FI era for cars, where manufacturers are trying to get better fuel consumption with more power. So only time will tell how FI engines of today hold up. And as it should be expected, it will be higher maintenance due to the extra components and that's never good news for your wallet lol.
Well, I showed him the pictures above and mentioned it is 1500$ more than market price.
He sent me this, even after I said my loan is approved and needed registration copy, intent to sell form, for DCU.
It got bumped from 24.5 to 25k, which makes me go away again.
Sounds like this guy doesn't want to negotiate with firm numbers and wants KBB vales rather than the real values.
You'll find the right one, just remember that $1500 is close to 5 months of car payments! And that these cars are depreciating and getting sold everyday. With the 3.7L oil issues, the price is going to drop more as more miles get put on and the issue becomes more well known.
Sounds like this guy doesn't want to negotiate with firm numbers and wants KBB vales rather than the real values.
You'll find the right one, just remember that $1500 is close to 5 months of car payments! And that these cars are depreciating and getting sold everyday. With the 3.7L oil issues, the price is going to drop more as more miles get put on and the issue becomes more well known.
Found one more, 2012 SH-AWD, Silver, with Nav, 49.5k miles, for 24k OBO.
Called Acura, the current owner had a prepaid maintenance until 75k miles (45$ off of each maintenance, every 5k miles) and 100k miles Powertrain warranty, as it is was purchased as a CPO, beginning of this year.
Maintenance:
New battery - January, 2015
Some fix - October, 2015
Transmission issue, fixed - November 2015
The wheels are not upgraded, but has navigation, which package is the vehicle or the wheels are upgraded separately?
I wasn't able to find the black book retail, like you did for the other two cars.
Can you please share the URL for me.
Sounds like this guy doesn't want to negotiate with firm numbers and wants KBB vales rather than the real values.
You'll find the right one, just remember that $1500 is close to 5 months of car payments! And that these cars are depreciating and getting sold everyday. With the 3.7L oil issues, the price is going to drop more as more miles get put on and the issue becomes more well known.
October maintenance is some whistle sound from the shaft, and it is fixed/replaced under warranty
November is some transmission fix, but the owner doesn't know what the problem is, but got it fixed under warranty.
Tires are from January, 2015, when he purchased as a CPO.
Car doesn't have scratches, except for one of the wheel, due to parking curb.
BTW, Manufacturer warranty is until 62k miles or 2017.
Powertrain is until 100k or 7 years(I guess).
for the sole reason that the seller is an asshole, I would go with the FWD, and have less oil consumption problems and $7k in my pocket.
to be clear, his asking price doesnt make him an asshole, its his car, his price. But his attitude is just annoying. A seller like that is just going to be more and more annoying as the sales process moves forward. You want someone whose honest, and willing to work with you within reasonable means.
for the sole reason that the seller is an asshole, I would go with the FWD, and have less oil consumption problems and $7k in my pocket.
to be clear, his asking price doesnt make him an asshole, its his car, his price. But his attitude is just annoying. A seller like that is just going to be more and more annoying as the sales process moves forward. You want someone whose honest, and willing to work with you within reasonable means.
Thanks for the reply, Guanaman.
I hope you're talking about the Black SH-SWD firm price guy., and not the 2nd, graphite SH-AWD guy.
Anyway, even though the 3rd one comes with 100k miles Powertrain warranty, I need to call the dealer in order to find out what the fix was and will it come back again.
I read somewhere in this forum:
"If you have FWD, you'll think about AWD.
If you have AWD, you will never think about FWD"
Or something similar
Keeping in mind, I will be having a trailer and 2 motorcycles, I may need better handling. Other than that, I don't have any partiality on the AWD.
But
Update: 2012 Silver SH-AWD, 49.5k miles, 100k PT warranty.
In October, Propeller shaft has been replaced, sounds major to me.
In November, ECM (I asked her whether ECU, she said no, ECM) update with 'running change' is done, which doesn't make any sense to me. Is that DRLs, but she mentioned, transmission.
Is this car worth 22k?
11-29-2015, 07:43 AM
