emceeR

I received a call from the Sales guy at my dealership. He asked if I was interested in a new Acura Lease? I informed him possibly, and I would call back to set up an appt.

I have 11mo left on my Lease (2008 TSX) and they would have to pay off the vehicle to get me in a new one. The payoff amount is more than the KBB value

Payoff Amount: $21,790.79
KBB (Excellent $20,xxxx

I know they do not use KBB so I can already see this to be a potential issue, I don't want to roll one lease into another. I am not over my miles, I am actually happy with a TSX.

I know they have some pretty good deals on TL's which I want, but not if it's going to cost me an arm and a leg.

I have a feeling they are going to try and put the screws to me.

Would it be fair to negotiate the following?

Take my TSX and pay the entire amt off (without rolling it into another payment).

$0 down no money out of pocket.

I want the car at Invoice, and with the loyalty discount and incentives this should not too much to ask for.

What do you guys think?

bagbklyn

This is very normal, if the deal is right jump on it. They do this so they can make sure they keep you as a customer. Your monthly amount should be the same or $15-$20 higher depending if you stay in the same care or upgrade.

emceeR

Thanks, you make a very good point.

If my lease were to Expire I would probably have a 50/50 chance of remaining an Acura customer as I was looking into an A5, IS350, G37, 3 series BMW.

The great thing is I am perfectly happy with my TSX so it's no biggie if they can't do anything.

Pete2010

I've actually traded in my last 2 leases early (one was 18months early, the other 7 months). In both cases I never took a financial hit, usually was able to upgrade with only a small increase in the $$ per month for much more of a car. In this last scenario I bought the TL SH 6spd, and I wanted to trade my car in early. They tried to make be pay at first MSRP and give them $1500 on the lease (yea right... payoff was 25k and they could easily sell it for 28-30k 2007 TL-S).

Finally told them listen, I'll just leave and come back when my lease runs out, I'm in no rush. Got them down to just a little over invoice and took my old lease off my hands no money out of pocket (which was a good deal in Oct 09).

Good luck! You've got the advantage on your side, if they don't give you the EXACT deal you want, just tell them that you'll just come back when your lease runs out. They won't let you leave, if they do, you know they've gone as low as they can go.

Bearcat94

They're looking to move new cars. Could be an opportunity to "trade up". See what they've got to say on price.

emceeR

Thanks for the info!

Yup and somehow I think I can do better than $440 per mo with the $0 out of pocket they are running on the Base. I'm hoping to get a TL Tech package for around $460 a month $0 down and could be possible with the incentives and getting the car around invoice.

Pete2010

Not knowing anything about the current lease deals, I think that you might be able to pull that off (judging from the lease on my 07 TL-S which was about the same price as the TL w/ Tech). It's worth a try, you hold the power! GL

PetesTL

Pete, no offense but I find it very hard to believe that you got out of a lease 18 months early and not take a financial hit of any kind. (Is this is true, I would loove to get out of my TL right now and into a M3)

dsickles

iTrader: (5)

we traded in our base 2008 TL for a base 2010. only paying about 35 dollars more a month. lease wasn't up for another year or so i think.

2008 TL only had like 25,000 miles though (about 8,xxx a year) which is why they wanted it.

graphicguy

Leases are tough to get out of early. Somewhere, the money that's owed on the rest of an early lease termination has to be paid. That amount is added to the lease or purchase of the new vehicle.

OF course, longer terms or lower mileage restrictions on the new lease will close the gap. As will a hefty downpayment (which you'll never see again) in the form of CAP cost reduction may help that.

I think residuals on the new TLs are pretty high, so that helps. Last I looked residuals were 56% on 36 months and 48% on 48 months (which is a lease length I'd never do). So, those look good.

I don't think money factors have changed much, but could be wrong on that count.

In short, that money is added somewhere into the new lease. You just have to find out where they added it. I'd ask the dealer to show you a breakdown of where they added the extra money to the deal to make up for the "unpaid" lease payments of the old lease.

emceeR

Alrigthy, I went in and test drove the TL Tech package although it was not what I wanted. Spent 1 hr Bs'ing with the Sales guy and I wanted to talk numbers. He told me my expectations were not realistic and I needed to work with him and be flexible and I was like (FU). It went from Cool, to high pressure sales in 10 minutes with the GM and Finance Manager trying to work on me and I told them regardless of what price you throw at me I would have to go home and think about it.

I gave the Sales guy the key to my TSX after I made him promise he would not lose them..lol I brought an extra set just in case.

They agreed to pay off my TSX lease.

They would not toss in the 18 inch wheels, no matter if I paid or not and that was pretty much the silver bullet.
I hate the stock wheels and don't need Navi. Instead they removed destination charge.

They argued with me about ghetting 15k miles a year and I finally gave in and did the 12k per year.

Did not want to pay more than $468 per mo on the base model. They came back with $475 per mo + tax... I walked

I did not like the high pressure sales, didn't get the 18's, didn't get the mileage I wanted, and did not the payment I wanted.

I don't think $475 for a Base TL with 18's and 15k miles per year should be difficult but I am a stubborn person who gets what he wants and if I don't I go somewhere else.

graphicguy

You're kind of in a tough spot. Only excellent rating on KBB ratings would be for a car that has pretty much not left your garage since the day you bought it.

Good is probably the rating to shoot for. Then, you have your negative equity you have to roll from your old lease into the new lease.

I doubtful they're going to sell you anything at invoice where they have to roll in the negative equity. Don't know what your current payment is, but let's be liberal and say it's only $300/mo. You're already $3,300 upside down before you even walk into the dealer's showroom. They have to add that amount (probably more) to any deal you negotiate on new car.

Maybe if you agreed to the sticker with no discount on the new TL, it could be workable.

But, I'd suggest you stick with your current lease until it ends and start fresh on a new car (whether it be a TL or something else).

Good luck!

jvette

I have had leases turned a couple of months early but never a year or more early. They could do a deal very easy without giving you the dealer cash on the car. Isn't it like $2200 and many dealers will get a bonus if they sell so many TL's. Being 18 months out is almost impossible to do no matter what. This dealer just wanted you in the door to try to up sell you into a new car. Many people get caught up in the moment and get taken on the deal. You did good by walking away.

graphicguy

Just doing some quick calculations....for super preferred tier one credit, the money factor is about .00201. Residual for a 36 month lease on a TL w/tech is 57% (which is really good) for 10K miles/year.

Figure rough dollars....$34K for a '10 TL w/tech. Add in $2,000 of negative equity (which I'm being generous, it will probably be more), you're at $36K.

You can do the calculations, but add in the lease fees, and your taxes, and you should get a pretty good estimate of what your payments are. The key here is the amount they're giving you on your car. You're going to be upside down no matter what. The amount you're upside down is what will affect the monthly payment on your end.

At first blush, it sounds like the dealer's offer of $475/mo looks really good. Are they asking for any out of pocket? Is your credit rating 800 or above (need that for their super preferred rate)? How about lease inception and bank fees?

SpicyMikey

KBB is not realistic. Your numbers are off if you work from KBB. Use NADA for more realistic numbers. Better yet, use Black Book. Based on what the OP mentioned in the original post, this is not a lease that can be terminated early without a serious financial hit. That's just the cold hard ugly facts.

By the way, the mf on a TL lease this month is not .00201. It's .0017 Sometimes that varies by area, especially if you're in the midwest. But if you're on the east or west coast. Calculate your target price based on that mf plus 57% on 12k miles per year. That's what I just got quoted last week when I bought a TL.

Good luck

SpicyMikey

Pete, I agree. Seems hard to believe, but it happens sometmes. The number of months doesn't necessarily matter. Of course, what really matters is the current wholesale price relative to the payoff. Obviously, the further along you are in the lease, the better chance you have of being above water on the payoff. However, if you're not underwater, a dealer will be more than happy to take the car in for a trade regardless of how long you've had it. It depends on how well the car has held it's value. My brother traded in a Lexus GS after 12 months for another car. It was in 2006 and for some reason the wholesale number was higher than the lease payoff. The dealer couldn't believe it either but that was the case and the dealer gladly bought it from him to get him in a new car. Like I said, it doesn't happen very often but it can happen.

emceeR

The dealer's offer was on a Base model and not a tech, wish it was. They told me $475 per mo + tax (Dealer said they removed the dest charge), came out to $490 per mo. 1st payment, tax, tags 12k per year 36 mo. They did not share the numbers with me to show how they got to this payment.

The current Acura Special is $440 per mo + tax , 10k miles, 36 mo, 1st pay, tax, tags due at inception.

This does not factor in the supposed $1500 acura loyalty discount and I don't think the previous dealer I went to factored that either.

Dealer I went to would also not upgrade to an 18 inch wheel package and tack it on my payment.

I contacted another dealer through internet sales.

emceeR

Can't edit my previous post my highest credit score is currently 748. Supposedly right now I am at Tier One with Acura finance on my TSX.

graphicguy

Mikey....I'm just doing money factors and residuals in my area (SW OH). You're right....both might change depending on locale.

emceeR

I contacted a competitor through Internet Sales and he laughed and guessed the name of the GM I was dealing with and informed me the GM is a jerk and he worked with him once before. Would be more than happy to take biz away from the 1st dealer I went to.

The original dealership did not inform me that the payoff amount I was seeing is different then the dealer payoff which added an extra $1000 to my purchase price that they probably snuck the $1000 in there. The 1st dealership also told me I get no Loyalty discount as it only applied to previous TL owners and not TSX owners which is BS as well (loyalty to the brand not to the model). So already I am looking at about $2,000 + knocked of the deal which should more than cover the cost of the wheels I want added on.

I'm expecting an offer in the range of $470-$480 tax incl for 12k miles, and first payment down for a Base with 18 inch wheels.

Keeping my fingers crossed, hopefully have an answer soon with concrete #'s instead of a price quote.

emceeR

I took owenership of a 2010 GMG Base TL last night with Ebony Interior.

I ended up paying $35,xxx including tax, and the 18 inch wheel upgrade so I got the car pretty much at Invoice.

Only thing that agitates me is they said they have to order the wheels and I amk hoping they do not come back with some funny business.

I was doing 100mph on the highway and didn't even know it..lol Car rides smooth.

2 things I did notice:

My 2008 TSX seems to be nicer inside, everything seems more tighter and sportier in my old TSX

The Base TL has fake leather.

Why did they put wood grain in the car? This was the first base I drove in, all others were the Tech and the SH version I test drove.

I am pretty happy overall but bumed I did not get the wheels and wont be satisfied with the car until I get them.

Glad to be part of the TL community now!

Oswald Vater

I've traded in my last 2 leased TL's 3 months prior to expiration and the dealership has always picked up the final months. Last time around I traded an 04 base for an 08/Navi and walked out the door at the very same monthly payment with zero down. It helps that I am usually way under mileage (22.5k on the 04) and take decent care of my cars. I'd keep working with them till you get what you want. Keep trying dealers until you find one who is desperate enough to meet your demands.

emceeR

PS. I couln't get them to eat the entire lease of my TSX. They gave me $19,500 and the dealer payoff was $20,500. My payment came out to $489 per month lease w/12 k miles, Base with 18 inch wheel upgrade. $0 down

The current lease deal is $440 per month, 10k miles, $0 down + tax so I think I did well.

SpicyMikey

Congrats on the new TL. I found the car does indeed handle a bit better on the 18" low profile wheel set. Good choice. By the way, the leather is not fake in the TL. It's real. However, I'm sure the wood is fake. I didn't even know there was a fake wood option for the TL. Everyone I ever saw had the aluminum accents. No wood to be found.

bagbklyn

The fake wood comes in the base model. The Aluminum is for the tech and yeah unless you but the pieces from the parts department there's no way to get the wood trim in Tech from the factory.

Congrats on your new TL, I went from 17's to 19's and it was a huge difference handling. I'm sure when you go to 18's you will feel the difference. As long as the wheels are in writing on your contract you should be fine with getting the wheels.

emceeR

Thanks guys, the 18 inch wheels make a world of difference. I think the 17 inch wheels on the Base make the car look like an expensive rental car (personal opinion). It went from blending in traffic to turning heads with the 18's.

The wood I can live with. The leather I thought was fake but I guess it's a lower quality than what I had in my TSX which is surprising.

SpicyMikey

The wheels do look nicer, that's a given. The improved ride I'm sure has a lot to do with the lower profile michelin's on there rather than the high profile bridgestones.

Regarding the leather; of course, it's only the seat surfaces that are real leather. Everything else is vinyl (or as BMW likes to call it - leatherette). If you think the TL leather feels cheap, don't get an MDX. That Canadian leather is the most inferior leather I've ever seen on any Acura. I found the TL leather to actually be pretty good.

KB1Spec

iTrader: (4)

I have an 08 RL and my lease is up next year on July and like to see if I can trade in my RL and lease a 2010 TL SH-AWD since it is almost end of the year and the deals are great. Wonder if anyone can chime in on this.

SpicyMikey

Just call Acura Finance and they will tell you what the payout is. No mysteries. it's a contract and you are obligated to fulfill the contract based on your preagreed schedule. Then compare it to the wholesale book value to see how far off you are. That difference is going to be your problem that must be overcome.

Getting out a year early will cost you money almost certainly. Getting out a few months early can sometimes be doable if the car has retained its value better than expected and you are willing to let the dealer "make it up" with the the new car deal. In other words, willingly take a bad deal on the new car to justify them taking a hit on your early termination. In that instance you can probably convince the dealer to buy out the lease for you and he'll put it on his lot and sell it as a CPO.

Bottom line, there's no free lunch. This kind of deal kind of throws a wet blanket on your leverage to negotiate a good deal for the new car. If you really want out, and will buy another car from them, they will accomodate you. But you will pay for it somewhere.

KB1Spec

iTrader: (4)

Actually I'm NOT really want to opt out on my lease. But since they are having deals on TLs, so just want to give it a shot. I will do that or I will call my friend who is a Manager at one of the Acura Dealership in my area. Actually I emailed him and he said to call him back.

I leased a 06 TL before and then Acura sent me a promo where they give me 3 month on early lease termination with no penality if I lease another Acura. So I ended up leasing a 08 RL back then. But I'll call up my friend at the dealer and see what he will say.

Thanks

SpicyMikey

Yea that promotion you mentioned is typical. I've gotten them too. They start a few months before the lease is up and start trying to entice you to get a new one. But remember its a shell game most of the times so stay alert.

Regardless, if you are still a year+ out on this 08 lease it's gonna cost you one way or the other.

KB1Spec

iTrader: (4)

OK I just called my friend and said if I were to trade in my RL now I would lose money. But if I were to put down let say...$1500 on a (2010 White TL SH-AWD with black interior - Luckily my prefer choice), my monthly should be around $5XX. But he said IF I were to turn in my RL next year, I would be seeing payment on a TL SH-AWD around $4XX. But I didnt ask him 0 down on that.

So what you guys think?

SpicyMikey

The numbers are what they are. Only you can decide whether you want a new car bad enough to pay the "penalty".

However, keep in mind a TL refresh is due in early spring with a 6AT and some other subtle changes with the interior and exterior styling. Do you really want out of your nice RL that bad to pay a premium for a pre-refresh TL?

KB1Spec

iTrader: (4)

Im in no hurry for turning in my car early. I still enjoy driving my RL. Just want to see what other think. Anyways, I'll wait til next year when my lease is up and see what other killer deals they have til then.

Again thanks for your input!

Oswald Vater

I would wait until closer to lease end. The best deals won't happen until only 3 months or less are left. By then the MMC will be out and you'll have a choice between it or a leftover 2011.

KB1Spec

iTrader: (4)

Yes, my friend at the dealer was doing some numbers and said my upside down will be under $3000. Value of my RL if the dealer take in would be $24K. So I will wait I'm in no hurry. But I drove the TL last night at my friend's dealership and Man, is it me or the paddle shifter clicks better than my RL. For some reason, I have quicker response on the paddle shifter on the TL than the RL. I was told if I wanted the White with Umber interior, it would be special order. But last night I test drove the only 2010 WDP with black interior, SH-AWD. Just love it! Again, I'll wait next year! THanks!