4G vs TLX
01-28-2015, 04:39 PM
#81
"Glammed up Honda" LOL
01-28-2015, 07:19 PM
#82
Let me be more clear. The 4G norm to sport is a quick pull back on the gearshift. Leave it in auto or paddle shift. Click the gearshift back up and your in normal again. I use my sport for passing on the fly. The TLX push button and scroll to the sport or sport plus takes to long for my liking. Then if you are in manual mode you have to scroll back through to jump back to auto. The TL sport mode system is just more to my impatient liking.
02-07-2015, 09:25 PM
#83
Instructor
I haven't driven the TLX yet, but I feel as though Acura has sold out on their mid sized luxury sedan class. Combining the TL and TSX in my opinion is equivalent to BMW throwing the M badge on every model line they have diminishing the M divisions mystique (not to mention how the M Power engines aren't even special anymore just beefed up internals and more boost on mass produced motors).
If I spent $45,000 on a loaded TLX (only way to go with Acuras IMO) and I'm at a stop light next to a guy that bought a 4 cylinder base TLX for 15 thousand dollars less, it makes my purchase seem less appealing. They made the spectrum too wide for my liking.
If I spent $45,000 on a loaded TLX (only way to go with Acuras IMO) and I'm at a stop light next to a guy that bought a 4 cylinder base TLX for 15 thousand dollars less, it makes my purchase seem less appealing. They made the spectrum too wide for my liking.
02-09-2015, 06:58 AM
#84
I haven't driven the TLX yet, but I feel as though Acura has sold out on their mid sized luxury sedan class. Combining the TL and TSX in my opinion is equivalent to BMW throwing the M badge on every model line they have diminishing the M divisions mystique (not to mention how the M Power engines aren't even special anymore just beefed up internals and more boost on mass produced motors).
If I spent $45,000 on a loaded TLX (only way to go with Acuras IMO) and I'm at a stop light next to a guy that bought a 4 cylinder base TLX for 15 thousand dollars less, it makes my purchase seem less appealing. They made the spectrum too wide for my liking.
If I spent $45,000 on a loaded TLX (only way to go with Acuras IMO) and I'm at a stop light next to a guy that bought a 4 cylinder base TLX for 15 thousand dollars less, it makes my purchase seem less appealing. They made the spectrum too wide for my liking.
02-09-2015, 08:18 AM
#86
I haven't driven the TLX yet, but I feel as though Acura has sold out on their mid sized luxury sedan class. Combining the TL and TSX in my opinion is equivalent to BMW throwing the M badge on every model line they have diminishing the M divisions mystique (not to mention how the M Power engines aren't even special anymore just beefed up internals and more boost on mass produced motors).
If I spent $45,000 on a loaded TLX (only way to go with Acuras IMO) and I'm at a stop light next to a guy that bought a 4 cylinder base TLX for 15 thousand dollars less, it makes my purchase seem less appealing. They made the spectrum too wide for my liking.
If I spent $45,000 on a loaded TLX (only way to go with Acuras IMO) and I'm at a stop light next to a guy that bought a 4 cylinder base TLX for 15 thousand dollars less, it makes my purchase seem less appealing. They made the spectrum too wide for my liking.
02-09-2015, 01:39 PM
#87
I'd be more concerned that after paying 45k for a vehicle that the styling blends in so much with every other vehicle on the road that I'd have to roll down the window and try to explain to the person in the next lane that I'm actually driving an Acura.
The distinctive styling of the 4G TL leaves no mistake that I drive an Acura, whereas the styling of TLX seems so similar to so many other cars on the road.
02-09-2015, 06:16 PM
#88
I believe you're correct. The base model (when brand new) of the 4G FWD TL was close to 35k, whereas the top of the line SH-AWD with the advance package was slightly below 46K.
I'd be more concerned that after paying 45k for a vehicle that the styling blends in so much with every other vehicle on the road that I'd have to roll down the window and try to explain to the person in the next lane that I'm actually driving an Acura.
The distinctive styling of the 4G TL leaves no mistake that I drive an Acura, whereas the styling of TLX seems so similar to so many other cars on the road.
I'd be more concerned that after paying 45k for a vehicle that the styling blends in so much with every other vehicle on the road that I'd have to roll down the window and try to explain to the person in the next lane that I'm actually driving an Acura.
The distinctive styling of the 4G TL leaves no mistake that I drive an Acura, whereas the styling of TLX seems so similar to so many other cars on the road.
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FoxTL (02-20-2015)
02-09-2015, 08:10 PM
#89
Instructor
So I compared both cars with the spoiler and spare tire as the only added options and this is the price discrepancy.
4G TL('12) $35,705-$45,185
5G TLX('15) $31,445-$46,486
4G- $9,480
5G- $15,041
Shows the difference from the TL being an independent model line to the TSX being combined.
4G TL('12) $35,705-$45,185
5G TLX('15) $31,445-$46,486
4G- $9,480
5G- $15,041
Shows the difference from the TL being an independent model line to the TSX being combined.
02-09-2015, 09:03 PM
#90
Senior Moderator
So I compared both cars with the spoiler and spare tire as the only added options and this is the price discrepancy.
4G TL('12) $35,705-$45,185
5G TLX('15) $31,445-$46,486
4G- $9,480
5G- $15,041
Shows the difference from the TL being an independent model line to the TSX being combined.
4G TL('12) $35,705-$45,185
5G TLX('15) $31,445-$46,486
4G- $9,480
5G- $15,041
Shows the difference from the TL being an independent model line to the TSX being combined.
Plus the new SH-AWD system is more expensive because it is lighter to help improve fuel consumption. As well I've heard its be reworked to deliver much less drive-train losses compared to before. (30% with the 2005 RL, hopefully around 15-20% now)
Also this logic of a difference in the top vs lowest price paid doesn't make sense.
You can spend 33K on a 3-Series or spend upto 60+K on a 3-series fully optioned out. The 5-series is no different, starts at 50K and can be optioned to well over 100K.
The biggest issue here is that the TLX has never been viewed from the right perspective. Acura is doing the same thing BMW is, same body/chassis for a particular model however different engine options. Acura doesn't offer as much as BMW but it's a start in the right direction. I'd bet soon there will be a hybrid TLX too!
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FoxTL (02-20-2015)
02-09-2015, 11:22 PM
#91
Instructor
You also have to remember that the jump in prices reflects a huge jump in tech additions. The Lane Keeping Assist, Blind Spot Monitoring, etc aren't going to be cheap features, and to boot you can't find the LKAS on a BMW yet the stupid steering just vibrates on a 100K car!
Plus the new SH-AWD system is more expensive because it is lighter to help improve fuel consumption. As well I've heard its be reworked to deliver much less drive-train losses compared to before. (30% with the 2005 RL, hopefully around 15-20% now)
Also this logic of a difference in the top vs lowest price paid doesn't make sense.
You can spend 33K on a 3-Series or spend upto 60+K on a 3-series fully optioned out. The 5-series is no different, starts at 50K and can be optioned to well over 100K.
The biggest issue here is that the TLX has never been viewed from the right perspective. Acura is doing the same thing BMW is, same body/chassis for a particular model however different engine options. Acura doesn't offer as much as BMW but it's a start in the right direction. I'd bet soon there will be a hybrid TLX too!
Plus the new SH-AWD system is more expensive because it is lighter to help improve fuel consumption. As well I've heard its be reworked to deliver much less drive-train losses compared to before. (30% with the 2005 RL, hopefully around 15-20% now)
Also this logic of a difference in the top vs lowest price paid doesn't make sense.
You can spend 33K on a 3-Series or spend upto 60+K on a 3-series fully optioned out. The 5-series is no different, starts at 50K and can be optioned to well over 100K.
The biggest issue here is that the TLX has never been viewed from the right perspective. Acura is doing the same thing BMW is, same body/chassis for a particular model however different engine options. Acura doesn't offer as much as BMW but it's a start in the right direction. I'd bet soon there will be a hybrid TLX too!
The 3 series (best base to use as an example) now has, between diesel and petrol, around 5 different engine options in the US. The 3 series BMWs starting price is literally an engine frame and steering wheel. The 3 series doesn't even come with real leather, that is a package. The car doesn't come with xenon's, that is a package, The car doesn't come with satellite radio, that is a package etc etc etc. Any 3 series you've ever seen on a dealership lot NEVER reflects the starting price because nobody would ever purchase the bare bones base models. Go to an Acura dealership youre guaranteed to find a base model of probably any model line. You pay for the premium brands just like at a high end restaurant for the a la cart menu they offer (which IMO is ridiculous because packages just include everything you want at a much discounted price for the obvious reasons) These premium brands have been this way for a long time and their prices have always varied to extremes.
While Acura is combining two model lines BMW, Audi and Mercedes are extending their model line. BMW went from just having a 3 series, 5 series, 7 series, and an X5 to a 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,x1,x3,x4,x5,x6,i3,i8 and several other I'm sure I'm missing.
The right direction for Acura would have been to extend the model lines and now they have literally gone backwards by dropping one.
02-11-2015, 11:54 AM
#92
The difference in pricing works when your perspective is from just comparing the TL to the TLX. Comparing it to a German premium brand is ridiculous because Acura is doing nothing like BMW. That is just comparing apples to oranges. BMWs and every other premium European brand range in price so drastically because of the a la cart optioning and the vast amount of customization you have to choose from, right from the factory. It is a good thing that their cars fluctuate in price so much, because you can make a lightly equipped $40,000 3 series look like a piece of garbage next to a decked out $58,000 335i and I guess my point with the TLX is it is just impossible to do the same from lack of optioning.
The 3 series (best base to use as an example) now has, between diesel and petrol, around 5 different engine options in the US. The 3 series BMWs starting price is literally an engine frame and steering wheel. The 3 series doesn't even come with real leather, that is a package. The car doesn't come with xenon's, that is a package, The car doesn't come with satellite radio, that is a package etc etc etc. Any 3 series you've ever seen on a dealership lot NEVER reflects the starting price because nobody would ever purchase the bare bones base models. Go to an Acura dealership youre guaranteed to find a base model of probably any model line. You pay for the premium brands just like at a high end restaurant for the a la cart menu they offer (which IMO is ridiculous because packages just include everything you want at a much discounted price for the obvious reasons) These premium brands have been this way for a long time and their prices have always varied to extremes.
While Acura is combining two model lines BMW, Audi and Mercedes are extending their model line. BMW went from just having a 3 series, 5 series, 7 series, and an X5 to a 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,x1,x3,x4,x5,x6,i3,i8 and several other I'm sure I'm missing.
The right direction for Acura would have been to extend the model lines and now they have literally gone backwards by dropping one.
The 3 series (best base to use as an example) now has, between diesel and petrol, around 5 different engine options in the US. The 3 series BMWs starting price is literally an engine frame and steering wheel. The 3 series doesn't even come with real leather, that is a package. The car doesn't come with xenon's, that is a package, The car doesn't come with satellite radio, that is a package etc etc etc. Any 3 series you've ever seen on a dealership lot NEVER reflects the starting price because nobody would ever purchase the bare bones base models. Go to an Acura dealership youre guaranteed to find a base model of probably any model line. You pay for the premium brands just like at a high end restaurant for the a la cart menu they offer (which IMO is ridiculous because packages just include everything you want at a much discounted price for the obvious reasons) These premium brands have been this way for a long time and their prices have always varied to extremes.
While Acura is combining two model lines BMW, Audi and Mercedes are extending their model line. BMW went from just having a 3 series, 5 series, 7 series, and an X5 to a 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,x1,x3,x4,x5,x6,i3,i8 and several other I'm sure I'm missing.
The right direction for Acura would have been to extend the model lines and now they have literally gone backwards by dropping one.
Well said
02-11-2015, 01:40 PM
#93
All of the nonsense with options that other car manufacturers "offer" is why I always chose Honda/Acura to begin with. I knew if I was getting a Tech package, I was pretty much getting everything they offered at a decent price. I hate that you have to get like 3 or 4 different "packages" to get other cars equipped up to a tech TL.
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MisterZDX (02-11-2015)
02-11-2015, 08:30 PM
#95
Totally agree. When I owned a 4G TL it felt more like a full size luxury sedan than the TLX, which seems more like an entry level premium sedan. Hell, if I were in the market for a sedan right now, I would probably choose the Accord Touring over a TLX. I wouldn't have even dared cross shopped the last generation Accord when I was shopping for my 4G TL.
02-12-2015, 08:25 AM
#96
Senior Moderator
iTrader: (1)
The Accord has been cross shopped with the TL and now the TLX for years. Don't fool yourself. It's not a recent phenomenon.
There are aspects of the TL that the TLX didn't retain but then there are other improvements, namely tech features, that the TLX has that the TL did not. Not even gonna discuss looks...
There are aspects of the TL that the TLX didn't retain but then there are other improvements, namely tech features, that the TLX has that the TL did not. Not even gonna discuss looks...
Last edited by ggesq; 02-12-2015 at 08:28 AM.
02-12-2015, 03:42 PM
#97
The Accord has been cross shopped with the TL and now the TLX for years. Don't fool yourself. It's not a recent phenomenon.
There are aspects of the TL that the TLX didn't retain but then there are other improvements, namely tech features, that the TLX has that the TL did not. Not even gonna discuss looks...
There are aspects of the TL that the TLX didn't retain but then there are other improvements, namely tech features, that the TLX has that the TL did not. Not even gonna discuss looks...
02-13-2015, 03:30 PM
#98
KBB Good condition
2005 Acura TL Auto Navi 120,000 - $6,968
2005 Accord EX-L 3.0 Auto Navi 120,000 - $7,169
With a 6 speed, Brembos and LSD the TL would hands down more fun to drive car even though it may not have held it value in a cross shopping exercise.
2005 Acura TL Auto Navi 120,000 - $6,968
2005 Accord EX-L 3.0 Auto Navi 120,000 - $7,169
With a 6 speed, Brembos and LSD the TL would hands down more fun to drive car even though it may not have held it value in a cross shopping exercise.
02-13-2015, 06:16 PM
#99
The Accord has been cross shopped with the TL and now the TLX for years. Don't fool yourself. It's not a recent phenomenon.
There are aspects of the TL that the TLX didn't retain but then there are other improvements, namely tech features, that the TLX has that the TL did not. Not even gonna discuss looks...
There are aspects of the TL that the TLX didn't retain but then there are other improvements, namely tech features, that the TLX has that the TL did not. Not even gonna discuss looks...
As far as looks, no doubt the TLX is a sharp looking car on the exterior. Definitely more appealing than the 4G to many, for me though its the interior and drive I feel where it comes up short. Just my biased 4G owner opinion
02-13-2015, 07:17 PM
#100
Senior Moderator
iTrader: (1)
That's fair. Although I will say the difference between the Accord(which has really taken a step up recently) and the TLX is much less than what it was with the 3G and 4G TL's. As far as looks, no doubt the TLX is a sharp looking car on the exterior. Definitely more appealing than the 4G to many, for me though its the interior and drive I feel where it comes up short. Just my biased 4G owner opinion
Last edited by ggesq; 02-13-2015 at 07:50 PM.
02-16-2015, 08:04 PM
#101
I agree when comparing past generations, but for the average person shopping today with a 32k budget, the Accord Touring sure would make a better buy than a base TLX. Past generations there was a bigger price gap between the top of the line Accord and base TL. And I know what you're thinking, why compare the top of the line Accord with a bast TL/TLX, but that's how some shoppers think. Some people would rather have the loaded Honda, whereas others would rather have less features but the Acura badge, still within the same price point.
02-17-2015, 08:22 AM
#102
Senior Moderator
iTrader: (1)
Any data to back up that claim or are you just giving your opinion?
Top of the line Accord in 2012 maxed out right at 32k and a base TL same year started at 35k.
Top of the line Accord in 2012 maxed out right at 32k and a base TL same year started at 35k.
Last edited by ggesq; 02-17-2015 at 08:24 AM.
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MisterZDX (02-17-2015)
02-17-2015, 08:37 AM
#104
Senior Moderator
iTrader: (1)
It's just an extra box (V6) that is checked in the Accord column. Yet you guys forget all the other boxes checked in the Acura column....
Last edited by ggesq; 02-17-2015 at 08:42 AM.
02-17-2015, 12:14 PM
#105
And back to the topic....4G vs TLX, not Accord
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MisterZDX (02-17-2015)
02-17-2015, 03:25 PM
#107
Senior Moderator
iTrader: (1)
Waiter? Can I have more Kool-Aid here please?
Last edited by ggesq; 02-17-2015 at 03:29 PM.
02-17-2015, 07:34 PM
#109
There is no comparison between the TLX and the 4G SH-AWD. The 4G is the superior car if you enjoy driving. Did everyone not see the motor trend car of the year segment on the TLX? Here's the link for your reading pleasure:
2015 Motor Trend Car of the Year Contenders, Finalists - Motor Trend Page 9
Here's a quick quote that pretty much sums up what most of us 4G'ers feel:
The TLX also struggled in Performance of Intended Function. Judges found a bit too much Honda DNA in the car and not enough uniquely Acura design and engineering. The words "glammed-up Honda" were uttered. Plus, the sporty sedan's handling is a letdown. While both models turn in sharply, both quickly give up to heavy understeer mid-corner. The front-drive four-cylinder is a bit more nimble, and the all-wheel-drive V-6 could be forced around a corner by flooring the gas, but neither is as fun to drive as either of the cars the TLX replaces.
2015 Motor Trend Car of the Year Contenders, Finalists - Motor Trend Page 9
Here's a quick quote that pretty much sums up what most of us 4G'ers feel:
The TLX also struggled in Performance of Intended Function. Judges found a bit too much Honda DNA in the car and not enough uniquely Acura design and engineering. The words "glammed-up Honda" were uttered. Plus, the sporty sedan's handling is a letdown. While both models turn in sharply, both quickly give up to heavy understeer mid-corner. The front-drive four-cylinder is a bit more nimble, and the all-wheel-drive V-6 could be forced around a corner by flooring the gas, but neither is as fun to drive as either of the cars the TLX replaces.
didn't they cut costs on the tires w/ the TLX?
02-20-2015, 07:26 PM
#110
Senior Moderator
iTrader: (1)
^ yes.
02-21-2015, 12:56 AM
#111
10th Gear
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Test drove a fully loaded TLX SH-AWD 6. There were 3 things that bothered me about it. The first was the engine shutoff at lights, reminded me that I never really want to own a hybrid of any sort. It seemed kind of annoying given the minor increase in gas mileage it provides.
Number 2 was the lack of shifter, with my previous TL I got in the habit of dropping into sport mode when 'needed' to get some extra power.
Last thing was the size, I don't know if I was imagining things or not but it certainly seemed like cabin space was much smaller than the 4G, which didn't end up being what I was looking for.
All in all other than those things it was an OK car, there were some definite highlights, such as the transmission did feel very smooth, but it was easily forgettable.
Number 2 was the lack of shifter, with my previous TL I got in the habit of dropping into sport mode when 'needed' to get some extra power.
Last thing was the size, I don't know if I was imagining things or not but it certainly seemed like cabin space was much smaller than the 4G, which didn't end up being what I was looking for.
All in all other than those things it was an OK car, there were some definite highlights, such as the transmission did feel very smooth, but it was easily forgettable.
02-21-2015, 03:16 PM
#112
Intermediate
I can only comment on the design which I don't really like. The 4G is aggressive - kind of in your face trying peck your eyes out with its beak. I like that. This new tlx with its hidden exhaust pipes...oh man what were they thinking?!. Why hide them pipes, people who have fear of exhausts can just f... right off and buy a prius. No wait, even the prius has a visible exhaust!
I agree though the tips are a nice garnish.
02-21-2015, 03:21 PM
#113
Intermediate
I mostly agree. I had my TL in for service, got a V6 TLX. I LOVE the headlights by far, my favorite thing. But as a TL replacement, no way. As a TSX replacement, maybe. I also love how the down shifting in Sport+, revs it for you, the car will get out of its own way well..
To me though, it felt softer sprung, and the stereo sucked compared to the 4G ELS. I personally didn't like the interior dual display, wasn't for me.
I was perfectly happy getting into my 4G at the end of the day. something about the 4G feels more tight and energetic. Not sure if that makes any sense.
For $45k or more, nah. I'm not swayed.
To me though, it felt softer sprung, and the stereo sucked compared to the 4G ELS. I personally didn't like the interior dual display, wasn't for me.
I was perfectly happy getting into my 4G at the end of the day. something about the 4G feels more tight and energetic. Not sure if that makes any sense.
For $45k or more, nah. I'm not swayed.
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MisterZDX (02-21-2015)
02-23-2015, 02:09 PM
#114
Burning Brakes
I just got a loaner since my car is at the dealer for a possible propeller shaft issue. And they put me in an i4 tech. My first impression is it's noticable more quieter and a very solid ride. I like the infotainment system a lot. There's a little learning curve but nothing out of the ordinary. Engine is very responsive for an i4; especially in Sport+ mode. I like the brake hold feature as well. Things I dislike are the seats are not as comfortable or more like supportive as the 4G. Also it seems like it has more plastic than the 4G. And the steering wheel is not as thick as the 4G SH-AWD; however I don't know if that's the case on the SH-AWD model. It feels just as big on the interior side but a lot more smaller than the 4G on the exterior. And I dislike the fact that the exhaust is hidden. Overall, I'm enjoying it and think they did a good job. I wouldn't trade it in though unless they release a performance model.
03-07-2015, 10:48 AM
#115
Instructor
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Quirky things I didn't like:
1. No shift in center console
2. Controls felt awkward to me
3. Inability to program navi by my passenger while driving, causing need to stop on side of highway to do so (I'm aware most other car mfgrs have done this too, not just Acura)
4. Seems to lag when accelerating. IDK, my 4G seems more responsive or "sportier" than the TLX I tested
5. Dual exhaust pipes are gone
I was close to looking for another brand when I decided that I wouldn't find a reasonable alternative to my '12, so I decided to keep it for a few more years and decide again whenever the 6G comes out.
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