BEAR-AvHistory

I am sure that any number of people driving a Honda Accord EX-6 think the Acura TL is over priced Accord wrapped in a $5000 Joker Halloween costume. For me the TL would need to be restyled big time, offered in a 2 door with 4 seats (reason I did not buy a Corvette Grand Sport this time) & gain 100+ HP to be on the “to look at list”.

If I needed a 4 door there are just too many attractive performance cars like the M5, MB/AMG series, Audi A6 or Cadillac V series to consider the TL

TRIUMPHT

iTrader: (1)

M5, MB/AMG series, Audi A6 or Cadillac V series. The cheapest car you just mentioned in that line up was the A-6 which is starting at 41K ->Starting<- And you are comparing it to a car that starts at 35K and maxes out close to 50K.

The more and more the venom that's spewed at the TL and comparisons leads me to believe that ACURA/HONDA is doing their job. Comparing the car to cars of that class says alot regardless if it's a negative comparison.

TRIUMPHT

iTrader: (1)

Everybody knows & understands that the TL is an over priced accord. Just as everybody knows that the G series infiniti is an over priced nissan altima with a bigger motor & oh RWD. Also that Your've beloved Audi is nothing more than a VDUB. So what's the point.

I know what i drive i have never had a problem telling someone my car is and over priced accord. To each his own. There will always be some one with something better.

BEAR-AvHistory

^^^^^^^

Hey you should really take a deep breath, its only a car.

I thought the Joker thing was pretty much a standard item here just like BMW's are overpriced & live in the shop is. I just answered the question & commented on the statement that the BMW is overpriced by the fanbois with an example of how the TL can be perceived as over priced. Price is just all about what people are willing to pay for something compared to something else. I used to call my 3G TL “The Honda” so have no problem with that. The joke in the family was the 4 door Accord was so fugly I spent an extra $2500 per door to get the TL. Which is exactly what I did.

I did not compare the TL to the First Tier at all. I said there are too many nice first tier cars available to consider the TL anymore . You might also notice I did not mention regular versions of the MB, Audi ,BMW, Cadillac or even the M3 either. In a 4 door to get the level of performance I have in my 2 Door its necessary to step up to the performance oriented special V-8 packages.

BTW: My ‘04 330Ci is approaching 100K miles & has less shop time then my ‘06 TL did when I sold it at 53K miles.

Mr Marco

Wow. And you'd think in LA you could find a dealer that knew what they were doing...

Mr Marco

But I worked hard to pay for that overpriced Accord and raise my status level.

winstrolvtec

Whether that may or may not be true or perhaps just a matter of perspective, $5k-$6k is a lot easier to justify than $20k+. So if there is a matter of a car being over priced, there is a matter of how much over priced.

In your case (among others), the car is not found to be visually appealing but you are also not really looking (or were looking) for a mid sedan. Often times those things go hand in hand. If the TL represented mostly what you wanted in a car objectively, all of a sudden it might begin to look different even subjectively, and on the other hand, if it was more appealing to you initially, maybe it would have been on the list.

Similarly, a 3 series coupe is the furthest thing from what I and many other TL buyers wanted, it does absolutely nothing for me and overall is not very appealing IMO but I know that is only my perspective. If I was looking for that type of vehicle instead then I am sure it would live up to all of it's hype.

Certainly, there are many other options when it comes to mid size luxury sedans and most of them can easily exceed the TL's price range and therefore features, refinement, and in some instances, performance will as well but the beauty of the TL represents itself when you compare those cars you mentioned and their lesser trims (appropriately) to what they offer for $43-$46k instead.

Not to mention the exclusively available torque vectoring AWD as well as the 6MT + AWD combo in that particular size segment which are a huge selling point for many, sole selling point for some.

SeismicGuy

You should be hired immediately by Honda/Acura! The things you pointed out are exactly what Acura should be shouting in their advertising and marketing.

LawnPro

first time ive ever heard a "joker" reference to a car. why do bmw owners feel the need to come on ACURAZINE - and bad mouth the cars we own, and enjoy? i hope your not surprised if you dont get us to agree with you on your acura bashing.

SeismicGuy

It wasn't just me. We had a 1986 325ES but our best friends had a 528E as did a few other people we knew. ALL of us had nothing but problems with our BMW's. In 2008 I started researching cars to replace my 1995 Corvette. I was attracted to the BWM 335i that had recently come out and test drove one. However after my previous experience I wisely had the good sense to lurk around some of the BMW forums to see if there were any issues with those cars. Sure enough there were myriad stories of overheating (due to lack of an oil cooler), problems due to the turbos being too close to the transmission, problems with fuel pumps, etc. That was enough to sober me up and not make the same mistake again.

Stew4HD

That is exactly what I'd like to know too. It's been asked many times and all I ever hear back is.. "why are you Acura owners so defensive?" and "It's just a car, chill" or "What, you can't stand other's opinions?"... yep,

LawnPro

acurazine should be for the car owners who appreciate all cars, i get that. but shouldnt acura be at the top of that list, if your on a forum for acura lovers?

TRIUMPHT

iTrader: (1)

I don't take anything personal in this forum anymore just chime in once in a while. As far as your 06 TL i traded mines in to to get the 11 because it was having to many issues as well i was just approaching 50K when i finally traded it in.

I wasnt initially going for another TL i was looking at other companies and knew one thing 1: i wanted a brand new car 2: it had to be roomy 3: reiable 4: i had a 36K limit which included my trade in.
The TL just happened to fit the bill not to mention all the assholes at the other company dealers that not only tried to jerk me on trade in but thougt i wasnt serious about buying a brand new car straight out along with my trade in.

The only thing i can say and constantly stress is the fact that my 11 TL doesnt have push to start that really pisses me off.

Hamma Tyme

I knew it would be only a matter of time before someone would start throwing bombs. A conversation regarding Honda/Acura and their future vision turning into war once again. What is going on guys???

Why do these threads get ugly once someone feels their Acura, BMW, Infiniti or whatever is being attacked? We are all here because we are fans of Acura or once were a fan.

Why don't we try to get back on topic!

BEAR-AvHistory

You should get out more...its a reference to the straight on view of the pre-mod grill & the Joker smile in the Batman movie that was out at the time. I saw a photo shop overlay all over the net & it was a pretty good fit.

As for my comments they were a response to Stew4HD when he asked former TL owners who now had BMW'S ""I have a question for you BMW contributors. Now that you've moved into that realm, is there anything Acura could do to bring you back , assuming you guys were previous Acura TL owners, or do you feel that once you move into that level of car, there is no going "backwards"?"""

If you review the thread I said nothing negative about the TL till the "BMW is always" in the shop comment. Y'all are getting pretty thin skinned if you can't take a little payback.

Why would I expect people here to agree with me? Its a TL forum populated by a very few regulars who's feelings toward anything but Acura are well known by those who have moved on but still enjoy the postings here.

Shoot2Thrill

On a happy note, sold my 7 series today. Last BMW I foresee buying. I love the fact that a lot of Acura parts say Honda. In the end it is all about reliability and Honda is the best there is. Perfect no, but the best yes.

Stew4HD

Ask your fellow BMW bretheren about that... and I would not say it got ugly.. sadly, common sense doesn't pervade the internet.. coming onto a fansite and bashing the object of that fansite and not expecting a push back baffles my mind.

compewterbleu

LMFAO at that Cub-avhysterectomy, dude...let him be he's got nothing better to do then come here and get Acura folks worked up.

Hamma Tyme

I don't think anyone is bashing Acura on this thread. This thread was all about what many would like to see changed on the next generation TL to either make them come back to Acura or trade their current Acuras.

BEAR-AvHistory

And it does not take all that much does it?

BEAR-AvHistory

Did you ever think that the lack of tolerance for other opinions might be what has reduced this forum to a dozen or so defenders of the faith & not many viewers?

I would think the site owners are thrilled to still have the 2 & 3G forums keeping the lights on. The 4G forum does not seem to have a whole lot more traffic then the 1G does, 34 to 17 when I looked just now.

Stew4HD

So, that is your opinion of this place yet you come here anyway?!? Oh well.... thanks for helping to reduce the numbers.. feel free to hang out in the 2 & 3G area and stir them up or you can use you common sense and realize that the those forums are more popular because there are far more of those cars on the streets and are in the price range of a larger population vs the 4G. *shrug*

Shoot2Thrill

I just don't take anything I see on the internet too seriously. The older I get the more validation of that things are not what they appear but there always is a logical reason. (True insanity excluded) For example, maybe somebody wanted a 4g and Acura would not extend credit and BMW would so now it is time to bash. Just saying... there always is a reason. That's why I don't think Acura pays too much attention to these forums.

SeismicGuy

Obviously we are drifting off topic here but I have to say that when you are an owner of Brand xxx and go to a forum devoted to Brand xxx you do not want to see a bunch of criticism and discussion from owners of Brand yyy. That is unless a thread is created that is titled Brand xxx versus Brand yyy--then all bets are off.

But I also have to say that the surliest most unhappy bunch of grumps I came across was when I lurked around a couple of BMW forums while considering buying another one. I made a point of not instigating anything and did not even post much but just browsed posts by other members looking for discussions about reliability, maintenance, problems, etc. Not only did those guys generally dismiss all other cars but they even dismissed other BMW owners. There was some ongoing thread where an owner of a 3-series convertible was being attacked by owners of 3-series coupes!

BEAR-AvHistory

Obviously we are drifting off topic here but I have to say that when you are an owner of Brand xxx and go to a forum devoted to Brand xxx you do not want to see a bunch of criticism and discussion from owners of Brand yyy. That is unless a thread is created that is titled Brand xxx versus Brand yyy--then all bets are off.![/QUOTE]

Hey, I could care less about the criticism as you say its to be expected on a fan site.....on the other hand a fanboi like Stew should not ask a question he does not want to here the answer to then get his knickers in a knot when somebody makes a reply not in line with his world view. Had he not asked the question I would have not posted a response.

[QUOTE=SeismicGuy;13399231]But I also have to say that the surliest most unhappy bunch of grumps I came across was when I lurked around a couple of BMW forums while considering buying another one. I made a point of not instigating anything and did not even post much but just browsed posts by other members looking for discussions about reliability, maintenance, problems, etc. Not only did those guys generally dismiss all other cars but they even dismissed other BMW owners. There was some ongoing thread where an owner of a 3-series convertible was being attacked by owners of 3-series coupes. [/OUOTE]

Agree 100% on this, the E90Post forum makes this one look like a group hug even when I post.

Both Bimmerfest & N54tech seem to be a lot more civil & more like Acurzine.

winstrolvtec

Are you suggesting that you in no way have a hand in this or that you always excersize the same tolerance yourself? I know I am guilty of this myself and I agree but I also think there is a little more to it.

If I am not mistaken it was your response and defense of BMW, which was more of an attack on the TL really, that sparked this recent discussion, and the over priced comment actually came from a BMW owner, not that it makes much of a difference because a difference in opinion is still a difference in opinion but it's worth something.

It appears it wasn't a blatant attack on BMW IMO, and it was mildly substantiated coming from an actual owner, but largely an opinion nontheless. That's the real issue here IMO, not what is said only how it is said. It's the context and if it is appropriate or not. Not trying to pick on you as we have all had our moments but basically someone said (in short) "(my) BMW is over priced IMO but I love it". You said, "the TL is a joker faced, over priced Accord" in response. Notice the difference. I think your point was good but you didn't need to get after the TL as much to make it.

Again, not trying to pick on you, only what you said but you had a 3G and are no longer an Acura owner, it's understandable why you may frequent the site but why the 4G section if it's such an issue or if it's been relegated to only the few faithful? It's actually very good here, things are actually thought out and discussed as opposed to only commented on and it is quite civil and respectful.

What I see as part of the issue is we have a dedicated representative for almost every competing vehicle. One for the S4, for the 3 series, the 5, the G37, etc, which in itself is fine but there is never a dull moment when these few chime in about how there car is better or the TL is not as good, in whatever language they chose to express this or attempt to disguise it at times.

It's true that us 4G owners can be defensive but most owners of any car or brand are, you may see a lot of it here because it is the 4G TL section of Acurazine afterall, and if there is one place where the constant praise and defensivness is warranted, it's here. That should be expected at any fan dedicated site.

Different vehicle and brand owners are going to have different ideas about what is better (especially on the interent) because we have different priorities in vehicles and therefore our perspectives of them will also be different. So what we are really combating is our preferences and whose are better and perhaps not even to ourselves, maybe to other people.

It's all very foolish when you break it down but I think if we can keep it in the frame of personal basis and also why we got there, so we all better understand each other, not take it as a shot or total dislike for another product, without disregarding what all of the cars in discussion still objectively do well, we will be ok.

SeismicGuy

Anyway--getting back to the original question. What it will take for the general car-buying population really is better advertising and marketing. Some TV commercials like you see for other cars like BMW, Mercedes, Jaguar, Infiniti, etc. where the cars are whipping down some windy road or skidding around some slalom and leaving donuts are what is needed. The only TL ads that come to mind are a shot or two of the car sitting absolutely still.

How about some advertising and marketing that is as inspired as the actual vehicle?

Stew4HD

Hey, I could care less about the criticism as you say its to be expected on a fan site.....on the other hand a fanboi like Stew should not ask a question he does not want to here the answer to then get his knickers in a knot when somebody makes a reply not in line with his world view. Had he not asked the question I would have not posted a response.

I have your fanboi hanging by the shorthairs. You have proved, once again, that you are merely a troll. What have you added to the conversation? You don't like the 4G and have stated as such many times.. yet here you are...

When you bring your wise-ass remarks, such as saying the car looks like a joker, here and tell you you are a douche, you have it coming... Oh, taking offense to that is a fanboi.. TFB, I hae every right to be a fanboi (stupid troll-ish word) if I want to be.

Please grow up and act your age. It's people like you that make this place worse and worse.

Hamma Tyme

OoooooooooooooooK, so what would you all like to see changed on the next generation TL?

sarge_in

1) Better space management would be very welcome. Big as the car is, it would be nice to add an inch or two of space in the rear seats and the trunk without changing the overall dimensions.
2) Lose the weight a bit.
3) ALL Acuras/Hondas can benefit from further noise reduction. Lexus and Toyota are great at that.

Edward'TLS

Let's all put aside the hatred and get back on topic (= no more Audi, BMW, Infiniti, Lexus, MB),

Shall We ?

BEAR-AvHistory

Thank you for your eloquent contribution to the site. If the truth be know your are extremity entertaining & do make this a fun place to visit on occasion.

compewterbleu

...seems like some folks either didn't get enough hugs as a child or they didn't the shit knocked out of them enough when they acted a fool, take your pick.

BEAR-AvHistory

WOW, Another quality post, did you make it up all by yourself or is a cut & paste job?

Stew4HD

^ Just another troll post from a non-Acura owner. It's good to see the true colors shine through.

compewterbleu

...a hit dog will holler.

So, my question about an updated TL is basically the size. I hear folks commenting on the size, which for me was a step up moving from a 2001 CL. Anyone think it will shrink...a little?

Stew4HD

Personally, I like the size change of the 4G over the 3G. I find it just right for a sedan and have plenty of passengers say the same thing.. Making it smaller is not a good ideal, IMO. They already have the TSX for that.

TRIUMPHT

iTrader: (1)

It depends on the direction they go with the next TL. But my personal preference i hope not.

+1. They have a Tsx which is pretty much the 3G Tl's size with the option for a 4cyl & V6. So there is no real reason for them to shrink the TL. Now the complaint some have as far as then where does that leave the RL? Well Acura has been known to make car models appear then disappear ex (U.S legend , Vigor, NSX,RSX &INTEGRA). So seeing the RL disappear wouldn't be a shocker.

blackbr

3x Acura owner here (2G/3G TL, 1G CL).

I have an MB C-300 AWD that will come off lease next summer. What will I replace it with?

I like the 4G TL very much, but not enough to cough up the money. The SH-AWD is a lot of fun, one of the most fun cars I've ever driven, but the firm ride and road noise would eventually wear on me a bit. Even the sport suspension on my MB wears thin on beat up winter roads.

My wife just bought a new Chrysler 300 (fantastic car!) and rather than have two big car payments I've agreed to downscale for my next three-year lease, and then get a better car when I turn that one in.

Leading candidate thus far is the TSX. VW CC is another candidate, I really like the way that drives, but there are some sweet lease deals on the TSX.

So my wish list for the TL would be:

- Downsize to the 3G size (The RL should be upsided and renamed the Legend)
- Get serious about reducing road noise
- Improve MPG (why weren't the engine improvements from the FWD brought to the AWD model?)
- Quit being so stingy with the color options, keep the umber interior and let FWD buyers buy that color, would like to see a red leather option as well
- Improve the quality and durability of the leather (believe it or not I PREFER the leatherette in my MB... looks the same as day 1 and feels as good!)
- Our Chrysler has adaptive cruise. It's a miracle feature, bring it to the TL.

andvari

The size is why I am buying a 2012 TL. Alternatives like the 3 series and the G37 don't work as well for my road trips.

Things that I'd like to see as improvements -

Engine tech. Toyota V6s are now chain drive (no timing belts) 10K oil changes better mileage and regular gas for the same HP.

Fix up the shape of the trunk.