SeismicGuy

Actually my wife and I were very impressed with the follow-up we received after picking up our TL--both from the dealership (the sales person called the next day to make sure we were enjoying the car and wondering if we needed any help or had questions about the features) and also from Acura directly (we were contacted by someone over the phone and also answered a web survey). The dealership has also followed up since then with emails telling me how happy they were to serve us.

These are little things but they do make an impression.

BEAR-AvHistory

Acura was always the value buy alternative to the first tier brands. The big problem I believe is they became a niche player & never made the transition to tier 1. Now they are being pressed by the Korean brands which are moving upscale into the value alternative very quickly & will be on a par with Acura in another generation or so.

Since the car magazines have started doing comparos of the Koreans vs. the Europeans the handwriting is on the wall.

SeismicGuy

If by value you mean bargain I don't believe that was the case prior to the 2nd-Gen TL. As I recall the TL prior to that was pretty pricey but when the 2nd-Gen was introduced the price was significantly lowered to edge out the Lexus ES. The pricing of the current TL comes right in the same ballpark as the ES, Infiniti (at least the G series), and the Genesis.

What you say about the Koreans though is spot-on. I was sorely tempted to buy a Genesis but wanted to remain loyal to Acura (the Acura is also much more fun to drive and more distinctive looking) but the upcoming Azera looks like a hot ticket. The Kia Optima is also a pretty sharp looking car.

The Koreans will represent the same threat to the upscale Asians as the upscale Asians represented to Mercedes and BMW when they first came out.

types1fan

I have been impressed with my dealer from day one. When I got the car I got the Sergei call the very next day, my salesman called me and asked me how everything was doing twice within a month of me getting my car. I take my care for service and I get a call fro someone in Curry Acura asking how the service went and if im satisfied with my service. They offer coffee, tea, a huge collection of magazines to read and they are pretty friendly. Even though I shafted them twice I still get decent service.

Hamma Tyme

I am positively sure Acura pays attentions to this site. Naturally they will play it down in the dealership, but the main office IS paying attention. A company could spend millions in focus groups to obtain the vast information available on this site.

Personally I would like to see a total redesign of the TL with a weight reduction and shave a little size off her dimensions. Also it's time for a new engine from Honda and a tranny with a few more gears as was already mentioned above my a member.

These cars just keep on growing which makes it difficult to add MPGs.

deuce415

iTrader: (1)

The communication that you get is based on the dealership and not Honda or Acura in general. I get phone calls from the dealership that I bought my TL from. As well as email specials on monthly basis. I'm a ten year car guy, so I won't be looking at swapping into a 5g. Most likely a 6g.

TampaJim

When someone doesn't get a call, letter and survey from Acura after a purchase, there is one simple reason ... the dealership didn't load the data into the system.

Acura will not only write, they will call within a few days of the purchase to verify satisfaction. Quality is VERY important to AHMC and the dealerships actually lose/receive points based on the given answers.

I won't speak on the reasons that might cause data to not be entered, but I can say it doesn't happen at times.

If you would like to convey your sentiments, good or bad, at ANY time ... please call the toll-free customer hotline, it is listed on the Acura corporate website.

BEAR-AvHistory

I had good luck with my Acura dealer Lieth in Cary. That being said I would not go near Lieth BMW in Raleigh except to buy small factory parts I might need right now.

I also got the normal are you happy follow-ups, still get a monthly newsletter & Acura magazine.

pickler

2014 will be a remodel. 2013 will be the same as now. hopefully acura designs a new smaller better looking car (i bet it will).

TampaJim

The TL won't be changing dramatically in the 5G. There is a new small vehicle being released soon, however.

Edward'TLS

The TL will need to shrink in size, in order to set it apart from the upcoming RL sedan. The current 4G TL is absolutely stepping on and killing the RL's sales.

Rocketsfan

This is what I'm kind of hoping for ... either a smaller, more cohesively-designed TL, or another car that is that.

Right now, I'm hoping my 3G can hold together until the 5G is released in the hopes it's the car I want. If I had to buy a car right now, it would be the 4G, but in all honesty, there's no car out there that appeals to me in terms of looks, design, and value. Here's to hoping Acura continues their tradition of that in the future.

BLACKURA_NY

iTrader: (6)

to answer the original question...


aggressive incentives. chances are, i will be buying a 2013 TL.. maybe a 2014 (5G) if i fall in love at first sight

George Knighton

When Honda-Tech was in its heyday, we would sometimes get requests to start threads to ascertain public opinion.

I'm not as sure as you are that Honda watches Web sites, especially since they've become so blatantly commercial and big-money.

But they sure as hell did watch in the old days. :-)

George Knighton

That is kind of a unique situation, though.

The RL is an antique compared to other Acura designs. It just can't cut it with its more modern competition in that price range.

I think that Honda knew the RL would be attacked from above by the ZDX, and I think they'd have discontinued the RL if ZDX hadn't turned out to be such a loser in its segment.

It's too bad people aren't more open minded, I guess. The ZDX is an absolutely marvelous vehicle, but non-Honda people will not accept its looks and hard core Honda people will not accept that it is based on the McPherson MDX instead of the double wishbone TL.

Anyway...I am looking forward to *both* the upcoming completely new RL (Legend) and the new TL.

kc1953

Why not put a turbo on the engine? I'm sure they could generate 30-50 more ponies and at the lower end of the RPM band. BMW has gone that route, and their new twin scroll turbo (not to be confused with their twin turbot of their 2008-2010 models that had all the problems) seems to be a great balance between power, torque and gas mileage.

Ant$

maybe if they made some sort of diesel option (in the states, only German cars are available in diesel form)...or a hybrid option...

if the above isn't coming anytime soon, I'd like to see something the other way, meaning a 400 hp version of our beloved TL...seeing the 2012 Hyundai Genesis 5.0 R-Spec being released made me want to consider trading my 2010 TL in.

Ant$

When I do see a ZDX on the street (which is fairly rare...maybe once a month), I have to admit that my mouth does water...

Hamma Tyme

One would figure without a reasonable doubt a company would consistantly refer to blogs regarding a companies product. But then again, some companies may not.

You mentioned the Honda-Tech heyday. Is there something different today VS years back regarding Honda's direction? If I'm not mistaken, V-Tech has been around since the late 80s.

George Knighton

There has been a very definite turn toward safety and reason at the expense of performance...one might even say that they have redefined their idea of what "performance" means.

Safety is much better, and all Honda and Acura models are solidly reliable...and they're solidly reliable while providing "reasonable" performance and "reasonable" luxury. :-)

I'm still buying them, so they're okay by me.

And one might argue that the people who complain the most about the lack of performance are the people who are the least able to pay the price for that performance.

They still listen sometimes. I mean, they did produce the 2006 Accord 6-6 Sedan because a group of enthusiasts kept asking. But...in the end they only sold, what, maybe 2500 of them in 2006 and about the same number in 2007?

Hardly the kind of figures that would make you keep listening to that segment of the community.

Ruby

correction VTEC

TRIUMPHT

iTrader: (1)

Do you know how many times i have stated that in a thread or in an argument outside of the zine.

Companies want to make money that's what they are in the business for. They cater to the people that are actually buying the vehicle. Enough for them to stay in business.

But i guess comparing & asking for something you can't/won't be getting makes for a good debate in the eyes of some.

But to answer the OP question. nothing at this point will make me buy the 2013. Not because of the car itself but because by god i just bought the 11 in 2010 and dumped a bunch of money into it modding & still planning on doing more to it. So i think i am just going to enjoy my current car at least until the warranty is about up on it. If by then there is a newer total make over TL out and i like it i will get it. If not I'll either extend my warranty on my car or see what other companies have to offer.

compewterbleu

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/.../photo_01.html

...I guess I shouldn't be amazed by this auto rags bias. They call this thing making mid-level sedans relevant again, for who, Poppa Smurf..what is this a crashed IS?

Hamma Tyme

Thank you for your contribution to this thread.

Hamma Tyme

From what I've read about Honda, they're not going to switch over to rear wheel drive so if they produce a new engine design with more HP & torque, the entry level FWD will not be able to handle it IMHO. Plus not everyone will pony up the extra $$$ for AWD. I'm pretty sure the FWD out sells the AWD by quite a margin so I doubt more HP is in the FWD TL's future.

The dependabilty and safety of Honda products are excellent, but I really hope they reduce the size of the TL and utilize weight saving materials without reducing safety. This is where Honda can lose some time on the 0-60 performance.

Your comment, " And one might argue that the people who complain the most about the lack of performance are the people who are the least able to pay the price for that performance." is spot on!

George Knighton

Something that I cannot get out of my mind is the fact that the J Motor is nearing the end of its life.

Although some manufacturers would go beyond 3.7 litres with a design of this kind, I do not think that Honda would do that.

I haven't heard very much about the J Motor replacement except that it's a typical Honda design and has direct injection.

I don't know...maybe that motor's going to be available on the next RL/Legend iteration and the next TL/(whatever it's called) iteration. It could change our minds completely about what is possible with the SH-AWD platform, its size and performance.

I agree that we probably want to keep the front drive models to a deliberately limited HP range.

SeismicGuy

It is sad that even conservative Toyota (Lexus) is surpassing Honda/Acura in attention with more exciting/dramatic models like the IS and the aggressively designed GS remodel. I don't understand why Honda/Acura has been so timid in the areas of performance and marketing. The more I drive our new TL the more impressed I am (the advertised 280hp seems understated compared with how it actually feels) but their timidness in marketing and advertising results in the TL being the best kept secret in the industry. Meanwhile Hyundai keeps coming out with decent styling and truly inspired performance (their V6 touts 330hp) and same for Infiniti. In the meantime Acura just keeps meandering along--"don't mind me, nothing to see here"

jjsC5

The cost of pulling another 25 or so more hp out of the 3.7 would be very little, and it's really just the cost of keeping up with competition. The SH-AWD is the performance model, and it can damn sure handle 25 more ponies with no problem.

I agree that the base car doesn't really need more power - most folks are probably happy with it - although I come from the school that however much power I have, 10% more is always what I want.

There is always a market in sports cars, sports coupes and sports sedans for people who absolutely will pay for more power. I had a perfectly good 436 hp Corvette that was 13 months old when I traded it for a 505 hp Corvette. While I admit I'm not normal, there are others out there like me.

Hamma Tyme

True, but one thing about Honda. They release no information about design changes in engineering or new body styles. Everything seems top secret as if they invented a car that runs on tap water and a body design that would make Aston Martin rip up there designs and start over. We never hear or see anything till the day the new design rolls out in an auto show. No renderings to see how people react before rolling into full production. Why Honda does this totally baffles me.

BEAR-AvHistory

Honda’s bread & butter is Honda. As long as it shares the underbody with the Accord its going to be an after thought in Hondas game plan. Any decision about Acura will always be tempered with will it screw up the Accord platform.

Hamma Tyme

Which is true! Nothing happens to the TL till the Honda Accord is redesigned and out for a year. By the way, was the Accord redesigned lately?

Stew4HD

I have a question for you BMW contributors. Now that you've moved into that realm, is there anything Acura could do to bring you back , assuming you guys were previous Acura TL owners, or do you feel that once you move into that level of car, there is no going "backwards"?

SeismicGuy

Having owned a BMW (1986 to 1995) I can say that they really do drive like nothing else (although my wife and I keep thinking that our new TL feels the most BMW-like compared with various other cars we have owned or driven). Still, the grief and expense of ownership that we experienced keep us from reconsidering another BMW.

But have you noticed that the only Asian marque that consistently aims at BMW is Infiniti? I love their series of TV commercials with the guy in the Infiniti G Sedan versus the guy in the BMW Sedan coming down a snowy mountain. These series of ads started out fairly subtle but have gotten much more aggressive lately in terms of poking fun at the BMW.

Mr Marco

I don't think you can bring a BMW owner back to an Acura. A properly equipped BMW is a superior vehicle. I would own one myself if it wasn't for two things:

1. Dated styling.
2. Overpriced.

Once you've bought in to something better, you usually don't step down. Ya, my MazdaSpeed 6 was a nice car, but it was not even close to as sweet as our TL.

n-spring

https://acurazine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=840167

Oswald Vater

If Honda can get its new engine line ready in time for the 2013 model year, it might be an additional incentive to pull the trigger. However, I'm thinking more like it won't be ready till the 5th gen in 2014. Details are in this link:

http://www.leftlanenews.com/tokyo-ne...rformance.html

SeismicGuy

The main problem I had was a third thing--unusually expensive and incompetent servicing! The car was at the dealer several times for the same things. Transmission was replaced twice, took four or five times to properly fix the air conditioning, etc. In addition to not fixing what needed fixing, the dealer would invariably break something else in the process. It got no better when I started using independents rather than the BMW dealer. I would have heart palpitations whenever I was getting ready to bring the car in even for something basic like an oil change since they would always find several $hundred of other things that needed to be done. The Ultimate Driving Machine was really the Ultimate Driving-Me-Broke Machine.

Hamma Tyme

Stew, I actually would consider a new TL. But as I mentioned before, when my 02 TL hit 150k miles I was waiting to see the redesign of 2009 and you already know how I felt about it and moved to BMW.

The 2014 TL most likely will be a redesign being the next generation Accord will be unvailed for 2013 and the TL redesign will follow the next year.

But I will say, leaving BMW a second time will be difficult and Acura would have to create a design that knocks me on my ass to leave this time around.

I hope they do!

Ant$

Besides my 2010 TL, I also have a 2011 X5 (diesel version) and i hate iDrive. I actually find Acura's system more intiutive than iDrive. The only thing is that iDrive doesn't take 5 hours to list all the songs in your iPod/iPhone like Acura does.

and as much as I've played with the GPS settings, iDrive takes these odd routes to my destinations...

BMWs are overpriced, but damn, I love that car...LOL

zalmanking

I would like they can do any nice for the back of the car....its not pretty nor aggressive like 3 G TL...