goredcar

Recently got the A spec wheels for the TL-S and went with the Toyo T1-R. The stock 17s balanced up perfectly, but I have had a hell of a time with this 18" wheel / tire combination. They have been balanced by the tire shop 3 times and I was still not happy with it. They then took it out to another shop and had them “road force” balanced, and it is better, but I still have a vibration at the 50 – 55MPH range. They tell me that this is torque converted lock up shudder, but I think this is BS. I never had this with my stock wheels.

I know that with performance tires you will feel every road imperfection… but it should not have a resonance at a particular speed. I tested the TQ lockup excuse by shifting to sport mode and dropped to 4th then 3rd… the vibration was still there at 50 – 55. My daily driver (CL-S) has stiff suspension and ES-100s and I have no balance problems at all. Are 18” wheels harder to balance?

The wheels look really great, but the balance problem makes me wonder if they were worth the trouble. Has anyone else had a problem with the A spec 18’s or the Toyo T1-R?

Ramrod

I just got the same rims and I have Riken Raptor tires... I noticed that there is a slight vibration but I know what you mean as far as a noticible difference between the stocks and the 18'' aspec's. I like the 17 stocks better for that reason but I guess it's a aesthetic preference if you like the 18's and willing to give up a little on smoothness... 17's still look great and have a little smoother ride, also consider you give up a little tire moving to a bigger rim obviously which gives it a little rougher ride but shouldn't cause vibration... I guess I'm not much help but I'm just sayin' I notice it too. You're not delusional... haha!

rondog

iTrader: (1)

check the inner lip of the wheel, the part facing the suspension, to see if it's bent. Does it increase once you pass 55 mph or doies it go away?
Steering wheel vibration or floor / seat?

01tl4tl

Have the tire shop check if the heavy point on the tire is aligned or offset- properly with the valve stem.
Each maker has its own way- but high performance tires are usually spun and marked at the factory during quality control
Put it on wrong and even the RoadForce balance cant help
Thats the cool balancer- it measures for rim runout and balances the assembly to run straight
Have you tried the front to back rotation?

goredcar

Hi Guys... thanks for the replies.

The vibration goes away after 55… and is smoother at 70-80, which is where I normally drive. It is just irritating to have it vibrating at lower speeds. I inspected the wheels when I got them and they were perfect… no bends / warps. I also asked to see them being spun and there was no sideways movement.

Apparently the Roadforce can also tell if the time mounting (on the rim) is not optimal. i.e. the wheel is slightly out. Apparently the wheels are perfect and no tire rotation (on the rim) is necessary to optimize balance.

Front to back rotation is a good idea… thanks, I will try that. I was also thinking if I had time this weekend to swap the wheels and put them on my CL to see how they run. Trouble is that I might like the look on my CL

I certainly can’t complain about the look of the wheel… and the TR-1s stick like glue to the road.

Thanks for the comments guys!

BG74

I had the same problem on my old BMW after installing new rims and tires. I had them balanced like 4 times, including the Roadforce machine. Finally, the dealer figured out that one tire was defective from the factory and the internal belts had come apart after only a few hundred miles. They replaced that tire, and all was well.

goredcar

BG74 - This is exactly what I am afraid of... how do I eliminate this as a possibility? BTW... love the color of your car. It was my first choice but we can't get that color in Canada.

Jesstzn

I had a tire do this too ... Changed tires .. problem gone.

SSM-TL

I recentl purchased A-SPEC rims and wrapped them with Michelin Pilot Sports PS/2, vibration occurs above 70 mph. It is felt throughout the floor, also feels floaty at times.

goredcar

Those A spec wheels are supposed to high end. They are not cheap. I would be really pissed if mine vibrated at 70mph and up as that is where I am normally cruising.

BG74

I have A-Spec rims also and not a single vibration at any speed (Pirelli P-Zero Nero tires).

I think the only way to tell if the belts have shifted is to remove each tire from the rim and physically inspect the inner surfaces. I might be mistaken, but I think that's what the BMW told me they did.

SSM-TL

Rims came straight out of the box and mount on 9/29/07. The moment I drove off I noticed this. When I arrived at home I immediately checked the tire pressure and added pressure to 39 front and 36 rear. Took it out for a spin and still felt the vibration but less. Drove car back to Costco had them rebalance and problem is still there. You think belts would come right off after mounting?

BG74

This may sound silly, but is it relatively cold where you are? I find that all low-profile, high-performance tires tend to wobble a bit before they warm up. I think some sort of mild flat spot occurs after sitting a while which takes a few miles to straighten out, especially when cold.

As for the belt issue, I'm not an expert by any means, but my understanding is that a tire's internal steel belts can be misaligned or shifted during the manufacturing process, leading to a "defective" tire.

Maybe you could try swapping your spare onto each of the 4 corners and then you might see which tire is the culprit.

goredcar

Actually this time of year is pretty cool... daytime highs in the 50s F, so I don't think that the cool temp deformation is all that silly. The last thing that I did was to swap out the TLS A specs and put them on my CLS. I know the CL very well and there is no automatic to hide or cushion vibration. The A specs not only looked great on my CL, but also performed flawlessly - NO vibration. Unfortunately I was not able to test my CLS wheels on the TLS as they would not fit over the Brembos.

So... in my mind, that pretty much points to a drive line issue in the TLS, or some form of incompatibility with the tire wheel combination. Next week I have an appointment with the dealer to get the TLS checked out.

goredcar

OK so here is the latest. The dealer says it is the tires, that one or more of them are bad and that I should go back to the tire shop. And... they also said that there is an incompatibility between Toyo tires and the TL. Has anyone heard anything about the incompatibility?

I also notice that it is getting worse... sometimes vibrates like mad at 60K / 40 MPH. I also now have a tire drone at 120K/70MPH. Nothing noticable (for noise) above or below this speed.

I had heard that Toyo was not recommended for Odyssey vans, but the TL think is news to me.

Turbonut

iTrader: (1)

Hard to believe it's an incompatibility issue and also one of the tires being bad. Sounds as if they don't have a definitive answer, but at least it's a start.
I have Toyo T1-S on one of my cars, not the TL, and they are noisy as can be on the road.

Immediately after one tire is balanced, have the operator loosen the cone and turn the wheel, retighten, and the do a rebalance to see if it is still correct and no weight needed.

goredcar

Essentially you are suggesting a kind of calibration of the balancer... worth a try I guess. So far the tires have been balanced 3 times on a Snap on machine and then on a Road Force.

I am totally fed up... we now have snow so the A specs are off the car and my winter wheels (stock) are on with snow tires. I am going to have the T1Rs dismounted and drop them off at the shop and they can do whatever with them.

I have had really good luck with ES 100s on my CLS-6... thought that I would go with a "better" (more expensive) tire for the new TLS.... what a mistake!

BG74

Is there any vibration with your winter set up on? If not, you know the A-spec wheels are not the culprit since they were fine on the CL, and the car itself is not responsible.

I don't know much about tires, but I think I've heard mostly negative things about Toyos. I wonder if there's some way you can return them or at least get prorated credit for them. I'd have to bet that some defect in those tires is the problem.

I've got Pirelli P-Zero Neros ($160 each) on my A-Spec wheels, and no vibrations whatsoever. Highly recommended.

goredcar

The winter tires are great... no problems. I know that the A spec wheels are perfect, so the problem has to be with the tires... I am going to take them back. Wish me luck!

Thanks for the recommendation of the P-Zeros!